Manchin skeptical of billionaire tax proposal as Democrats push for deal

[Ivanstone]

No, it was union members and young people staying home, and rust-belters and independents jumping over to the GOP, specifically due to those things. The GOP simply had a better narrative, and have long had the ability to appeal to the 'visceral" aspects of people.

Yes the better narrative of 6 years of planning to win the 2010 elections to control state governments. Scaremongering over having a black president helped but they would've been just as happy with scaremongering over a female president. The GOP is almost as misogynistic as they are racist. Even if McCain won, the plan would've still been the same. The Tea Party was never, ever a grass roots movement. Its always been astroturf.

[masterhorus8]

Of course he's skeptical, if he says yes his donors won't bribe him anymore and his daughter will be taxed more. Just a blatantly corrupt politician doing corrupt things.

At this point, I honestly wonder... Have these companies lobbying to keep taxes from being increased on them paid more than what they would've have in taxes at this point?

[Deianeira]

Too bad theres realistically nothing to be done against Manchin, i know people want to scream at the DNC and yell at Biden, but nobody else colored blue is gona take that seat lol. Manchin knows that, everyone but the clowns on twitter know that, when ever Manchin loses, his seat turns red. Sucks to suck, need to elect more democrat somewhere else. Then you make Manchin as irrelevant as he should be.

I mean if Biden wanted he could do townhalls in manchins homestate and talk about his plans with he residents. He could even invite manchin to them himself. And call him out on his bs. The one i more see as an obstacle is Sinema.

[Dontrike]

Yes, because libertarianism is totes winning...

Libertarian? Oh.....you mean Republican with a different name.

[Sunseeker]

The mystifying thing is exactly what endgame all these rich shitheads think they're pushing for.

Like, do they just not know about what happened in Paris in 1789 or....

It's like those who forget stuff, do some things or junk they did before I guess.

[Draco-Onis]

Of course they will, because it's all about narratives.

If nobody is going to shed a tear, then this would be a done deal. You and I both know it's not.

I will say it again public opinion doesn't drive policy in the US. It is entirely driven by special interest for example how many people do you think want to pay more for prescription drugs? Pro lead pipes? Pro slave wages for the disabled? I can go on you have zero data to back up your so called populist outrage over protecting billionaires.

- - - Updated - - -

The libertarians are as usual aligned with Trump; Trump bashes Democrats' new billionaire-tax plan and suggests he might flee the US, but he'll 'stick it out'

Libertarianism goes hand and hand with right wing ideology.

[Machismo]

Yes the better narrative of 6 years of planning to win the 2010 elections to control state governments. Scaremongering over having a black president helped but they would've been just as happy with scaremongering over a female president. The GOP is almost as misogynistic as they are racist. Even if McCain won, the plan would've still been the same. The Tea Party was never, ever a grass roots movement. Its always been astroturf.

Oh, I agree, the Tea party wasn't grass roots, nor was it genuine in any way. The issue is the narrative that swayed millions of voters, and caused a massive election loss. The focal point of that narrative was the ACA, and it's gigantic increase in the size and scope of government.

- - - Updated - - -

Libertarian? Oh.....you mean Republican with a different name.

No, that's the problem... they are not the same thing. Don't make the same mistake that Republicans do, and misuse what it means.

- - - Updated - - -

I will say it again public opinion doesn't drive policy in the US. It is entirely driven by special interest for example how many people do you think want to pay more for prescription drugs? Pro lead pipes? Pro slave wages for the disabled? I can go on you have zero data to back up your so called populist outrage over protecting billionaires.

- - - Updated - - -



Libertarianism goes hand and hand with right wing ideology.

You are literally fucking agreeing with me, that's why I'm wondering why you seem so adamant in arguing over it. It's not about popularity, it's about political capital... and the Dems don't have enough to pull this off.

Jesus people, actually read what I type, instead of just jumping to fucking conclusions in order to argue with me.

The issue is that the narrative can be sold that this is a direct attempt at government overreach, and that narrative will beat the "fair share" argument pushed by progressives every fucking time. Pushing this legislation will crush the Dems in 2022.

[D3thray]

I believe support for some gun control measures was at about 86% after Sandy Hook.

Nothing happened.

Considering that was popular support for gun control measures that were already on the books but non-gun owners weren’t aware of, of course nothing happened.

[Machismo]

Considering that was popular support for gun control measures that were already on the books but non-gun owners weren’t aware of, of course nothing happened.

Not all of them were on the books. There were calls to deal with gun shows... and we're not talking about my biceps.

[D3thray]

You seem to be talking against yourself.

I have demonstrated that popularity doesn't necessarily translate to legislation and political success.

I have supported plenty of progressive policies, like legalizing gay marriage, marijuana decriminalization, and prison reform to name but a few.

I mean those are all completely in-line with libertarian principles. Gotta love the freedom only when it’s convenient progressives (and ‘Pubs and Dems)

[Dontrike]

No, that's the problem... they are not the same thing. Don't make the same mistake that Republicans do, and misuse what it means.

In a venn diagram of Republicans and Libertarians there is only one circle.

[Draco-Onis]

You are literally fucking agreeing with me, that's why I'm wondering why you seem so adamant in arguing over it. It's not about popularity, it's about political capital... and the Dems don't have enough to pull this off.

Jesus people, actually read what I type, instead of just jumping to fucking conclusions in order to argue with me.

The issue is that the narrative can be sold that this is a direct attempt at government overreach, and that narrative will beat the "fair share" argument pushed by progressives every fucking time. Pushing this legislation will crush the Dems in 2022.

Political capital is tied to popular support it has nothing to do with lobbying and special interests that corrupt the system. Let me boil it down your argument you are under the delusion that people feel the same way about guns as they do as Zuckerberg paying taxes. You should stick to your usual stick about taxes being theft and libertarian values not this people are going to be so angry that Bezos is going to be less rich it's laughable. Even Mitch McConnell is not going with your line the billionaire tax may not pass but it's not going to be because of popular backlash there is no way to turn this into a bad thing.

- - - Updated - - -

No, that's the problem... they are not the same thing. Don't make the same mistake that Republicans do, and misuse what it means.

All the libertarians icons vote and run on the republican ticket, they have been tied to it since forever I am not sure what your argument is here. Libertarianism is the republican party.

[Machismo]

In a venn diagram of Republicans and Libertarians there is only one circle.

Am I on that circle?

[JohnBrown1917]

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021...llionaires-tax


Ofcourse the richest man on earth, Musk, would throw a shit fit. Barely pay any taxes at all because would would he actually do something that helps people?

[Machismo]

Political capital is tied to popular support it has nothing to do with lobbying and special interests that corrupt the system. Let me boil it down your argument you are under the delusion that people feel the same way about guns as they do as Zuckerberg paying taxes. You should stick to your usual stick about taxes being theft and libertarian values not this people are going to be so angry that Bezos is going to be less rich it's laughable. Even Mitch McConnell is not going with your line the billionaire tax may not pass but it's not going to be because of popular backlash there is no way to turn this into a bad thing.

- - - Updated - - -



All the libertarians icons vote and run on the republican ticket, they have been tied to it since forever I am not sure what your argument is here. Libertarianism is the republican party.

Nope, there is even a Libertarian Party.

Political capital has plenty to do with fundraising, special interests, and the system itself. It's what the term means. It's about power and leverage, not simply popular support.

I get that you guys want to turn this into a libertarian bashing thread, but this has nothing to do with libertarianism.

[Draco-Onis]

Nope, there is even a Libertarian Party.

Political capital has plenty to do with fundraising, special interests, and the system itself. It's what the term means. It's about power and leverage, not simply popular support.

I get that you guys want to turn this into a libertarian bashing thread, but this has nothing to do with libertarianism.

Special interest and fundraising have nothing to do with political capital those focus entirely on people on both sides that have enough power to enact what they want. You are really changing the definition of it to suit your needs but lobbyist don't care how popular a person is just what committee they sit on.

[Machismo]

Special interest and fundraising have nothing to do with political capital those focus entirely on people on both sides that have enough power to enact what they want. You are really changing the definition of it to suit your needs but lobbyist don't care how popular a person is just what committee they sit on.

What do you think political capital is?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_capital

It's weird that you guys are trying so hard to argue against me, when you keep agreeing with what I said.

[Draco-Onis]

What do you think political capital is?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_capital

Did you read that? How many will mobilize for billionaires?

[Machismo]

Did you read that? How many will mobilize for billionaires?

Enough to make sure that no new billionaire wealth tax happens. The Dems simply lack the political capital to make it happen.

We have yet to even see the bill, and the momentum is already muted. The best thing the Dems in charge could do, is to try and change the subject to something else.

[JohnBrown1917]

At least our billionare friends are good at working together, we gotta give them that.