1. #561
    Stood in the Fire
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    Just watched ep1. Better then expected, gonna start ep2 later but I enjoyed the first one(eventhough a few changes was less enjoyable)

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    Ep2 seen aswell, Mat/Perrin , the actors are doing their roles really well.


    Show is alot better then I would have guessed from comments/reviews

  2. #562
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    It's a big deal because of Min's prophecies. Also they apparently didn't have Gitra's foretelling to tell Moraine the dragon is a he since apparently the one power is not separated into halves by gender anymore or some stupidity.
    Once again, just focusing on the fact that they made changes.

  3. #563
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Wasn't Balthamel reborn as a woman after he died?

    But in any event, the fundamentally different nature of saidin and saidar makes the gender of the Dragon Reborn TREMENDOUSLY important. It's a fundamental plot point of the entire series. Changing that is akin to adding a 10th human ring of power to LotR or whatever. This is just a terrible, terrible idea.
    Yeah, but wasn't it a huge deal that in the female body the Forsaken still channeled saidin? So the soul was still male and taps the male source even though it was crammed into a female body by the Dark One.

  4. #564
    Bloodsail Admiral Konteil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Well, hopefully this leads to other book series becoming shows (better quality than this one seems to be otherwise don't bother..

    serpentwar saga


    or this series


    What other book series should become a show??
    i would love to see the black company novels from glen cook become a tv show. but after seeing what has happened to wheel of time so far im not holding out much hope.

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    so last night i watch the first ep. i started reading the books in the 90s and they are a favorite. the things that i like are that they made moiraine strong and confident as one would expect of an aes sedai raised in carhienin. lan is even decent and i like the dynamic that they have. things that i am not ok with so far. They have completely missed the mark on mat. and what they did with abel cauthon is bordering on criminal. he was an honorable man and hell of a horse trader. they made him worse than a tarren ferry scumbag. and poor mat. he was a troublemaker yes. youthful pranks and wahtnot. not a damn hardened criminal. and where the hell is his wry humor. boyish charm....etc. mat is not mat in this iteration. im hoping that it corrects as teh show goes on and maybe the new guy will do a better job of it. And perrin.....my gods man where to start. his whole back story is different. and did they have to do him like that? make him married.. ok thats odd but i can roll with it. they are combining him and his wife with haral and alsibet luhan....who are important to the story later so we will see what they do with that. but then to have him have that "accident" come on. that was not needed at all. i mean they had to clear the way for faile after making that decision but shit. there were other ways to do it. maybe not have him married to begin with so his story could flow correctly. ima keep watching it to see what happens but those things are not good so far. cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    It's a big deal because of Min's prophecies. Also they apparently didn't have Gitra's foretelling to tell Moraine the dragon is a he since apparently the one power is not separated into halves by gender anymore or some stupidity.
    having soe issues with teh way they are handling the one power as well. and tehy way the did the prophecy was a bit off as well but i can roll with it.
    “Listen, three eyes,” he said, “don’t you try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal.”

  5. #565
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Even in old world settings...teenagers fucked. They fucked a lot.

    Honestly, in an old world setting...both of them should already be married. Virgins at 20? nah bruh
    In the book, Nynaeve made two people get hitched for fooling around in a barn. Things can not be a direct adaptations, but things have to make sense for the setting. People don’t do dowry’s anymore but this little village wouldn’t turn a blind eye to this, especially if she was meant to be a Wisdom

  6. #566
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Once again, just focusing on the fact that they made changes.
    Making the dragon be not tied to gender is a huge freaking deal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantique View Post
    Yeah, but wasn't it a huge deal that in the female body the Forsaken still channeled saidin? So the soul was still male and taps the male source even though it was crammed into a female body by the Dark One.
    Yes and it was specifically called out as evil because it was tampering with the pattern. People are reborn into the bodies that match their souls and their souls are gendered which is tied to the whole one power split just a bit important.

  7. #567
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    Making the dragon be not tied to gender is a huge freaking deal
    Really only matters if Rand isn't the Dragon Reborn.
    Last edited by Egomaniac; 2021-11-20 at 08:05 PM.

  8. #568
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Really only matters if Rand isn't the Dragon Reborn.
    Not true at all. The reason the coming of the chosen one who will save the world is dreaded is because He Will Go Mad. If there is a 50/50 shot that oh they might be a girl and not go mad it heavily reduces the stakes. It also means the instant that a man was seen who could channel they would be killed not gentled to make sure the dragon could only be a girl.

  9. #569
    Well, it's not "the next GoT" obviously.

    But it seems like something dumb, one can watch once per week and maybe after the season is over, I can go check out if I like the books much better.

    Sorry for everyone who wanted this to be great because they loved the books.
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    A sure sign of someone who wears his underpants on his head."

  10. #570
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Really only matters if Rand isn't the Dragon Reborn.
    And if it turns out they didn't change that, it's EVEN WORSE.

    Imagine adding something ostensibly for the reason of better gender equity and then going "yeah but real talk now, this was never ACTUALLY going to happen". How insultingly bad would that be?

  11. #571
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    And if it turns out they didn't change that, it's EVEN WORSE.

    Imagine adding something ostensibly for the reason of better gender equity and then going "yeah but real talk now, this was never ACTUALLY going to happen". How insultingly bad would that be?
    If they were worried about equality, they would not have made Egwene Ta’Veren. In the books, only her and Nynaeve had any personal agency as it was their choice to leave the Two Rivers with Rand, Mat and Perrin. In making her Ta’Veren she no longer has any agency as the Wheel is going to push in the direction of fate and prophecy.

  12. #572
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    And if it turns out they didn't change that, it's EVEN WORSE.

    Imagine adding something ostensibly for the reason of better gender equity and then going "yeah but real talk now, this was never ACTUALLY going to happen". How insultingly bad would that be?
    Seems like you're just determined to be angry no matter how they do it.

    If they go one way...you're mad because they changed something.
    If they go the other...you're mad because they didn't go all the way with the change.

    If you want a story that plays out exactly like the books...then just stick to the books. An adaptation isn't automatically bad just because it makes a few changes fromt he source material.

  13. #573
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Seems like you're just determined to be angry no matter how they do it.
    No, I'm angry because these are both two bad options. You're portraying it as though those were the ONLY options, which is at best disingenuous.

    Imagine you getting a sandwich at a restaurant and it's moldy, then sending it back and getting a rotten one instead - and the waiter goes "well I guess you were just going to be angry no matter what we do". That's not how it works, so don't portray it like that, please.

  14. #574
    Quote Originally Posted by Theangryone View Post
    If they were worried about equality, they would not have made Egwene Ta’Veren. In the books, only her and Nynaeve had any personal agency as it was their choice to leave the Two Rivers with Rand, Mat and Perrin. In making her Ta’Veren she no longer has any agency as the Wheel is going to push in the direction of fate and prophecy.
    Alternatively, having all four of them be Ta'Verren just makes sense with the approach they are taking... and it keeps the potential mystery of who the Dragon Reborn is alive for people that haven't read the books. Which is the majority of the audience.

    That's what a lot of people don't seem to grasp. The TV series is meant to appeal to a broader demographic base.

    As for Agency...that goes both ways. Yes, Ta'verren are destined for great things and you could see that as "losing agency"...but they aren't really forced any particular way. And the people around them get caught up in that as well...so they too lose agency. Was it really their choice to leave the Two Rivers...or were they just pulled along?

    So, either Egwene loses agency because she's spent her entire life in the pull of 3 Ta'Verren...or she loses agency because she's one herself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    No, I'm angry because these are both two bad options. You're portraying it as though those were the ONLY options, which is at best disingenuous.

    Imagine you getting a sandwich at a restaurant and it's moldy, then sending it back and getting a rotten one instead - and the waiter goes "well I guess you were just going to be angry no matter what we do". That's not how it works, so don't portray it like that, please.
    I think the only one pretending there's only one option is you. Either they follow the books exactly or it sucks.

  15. #575
    The Unstoppable Force Bakis's Avatar
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    I will see if I can give it a chance in the upcoming days. What I can say is that it was painful to watch the 12,5 mins that I watched (before I couldnt put up with it anymore).
    The acting was as stiff as rigor mortis and for the first time in many years I was baffled about the results of a sound team. The sound was just FLAT with no sense of room or immersion whatsoever. They could have recorded it in a restroom at McDonalds for all I could tell.

    But, I will give it a try and watch at least 1,5-2 eps since I love the genre and that ~15 mins isnt really giving it a shot.
    I dont have high hopes though, my school plays in 5th grade had better acting.
    But soon after Mr Xi secured a third term, Apple released a new version of the feature in China, limiting its scope. Now Chinese users of iPhones and other Apple devices are restricted to a 10-minute window when receiving files from people who are not listed as a contact. After 10 minutes, users can only receive files from contacts.
    Apple did not explain why the update was first introduced in China, but over the years, the tech giant has been criticised for appeasing Beijing.

  16. #576
    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    I think the only one pretending there's only one option is you. Either they follow the books exactly or it sucks.
    Sorry, but that's YOUR dichotomy. I'm not saying "books or gtfo", you are - I'm fine with changes that make sense, and there's any number of them that don't follow the book yet I have no problem with. But just because there's two options that are both bad and both don't follow the book doesn't mean I'm in a binary mind about it, and claiming that I am is a pretty clumsy attempt at strawmanning.

  17. #577
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Egomaniac View Post
    Alternatively, having all four of them be Ta'Verren just makes sense with the approach they are taking... and it keeps the potential mystery of who the Dragon Reborn is alive for people that haven't read the books. Which is the majority of the audience.
    It is the entire audience. They are changing core things about the characters and their motivations so you can't assume anything about the show and the direction they are going. I'm about part way through the first episode and I really hate the changes they have made to the characters story. I get things have to change for the TV show and to adapt the story to that but so far it doesn't feel like they had to make those changes.

    It likely won't matter to those who haven't read the books but it seems a really bad choice when trying to appeal to fans of the books. It is a decent show but not a decent Wheel of Time. Though it is at least better then the horrible production the company that owns the rights did in the past. But that was just the bare minimum needed to keep the rights.
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  18. #578
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    I already know that he is wiping his butt with RJ's concept of souls being reborn the same as they were and likely with the one power split.
    YOu guys realise that the "one of your four is the Dragon" is because of pople that has NOT read the books. Too keep them hooked on the "who is the Dragon?"

    Also i cannot see the Dragon being any other then Rand. And also if the Dragon had been women, does that mean they would channel Saidin?

  19. #579
    We will see if the two sides of the one power makes it to the show. Reds are angry but the “this power was only meant for women” line doesn’t inspire confidence along with the “we don’t know know man or woman”. I suspect we will get a better idea in ep 4.

  20. #580
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Sorry, but that's YOUR dichotomy. I'm not saying "books or gtfo", you are - I'm fine with changes that make sense, and there's any number of them that don't follow the book yet I have no problem with. But just because there's two options that are both bad and both don't follow the book doesn't mean I'm in a binary mind about it, and claiming that I am is a pretty clumsy attempt at strawmanning.
    You haven't given any reason as to why they are bad choices.

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