Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Sondrelk]

Most of the survey’s only get questions leaked when people can use them to put wow in a bad light like when they put out one asking what games people were interested in which included things like mind craft and people just post the part with FFXIV to make it seem like blizzard was worried.

It’s likely people weren’t able to make them jump from player housing to game dead so they just passed over the opportunity.

You are really underestimating the community's ability to make Blizzard look bad.
Asking players if they want player housing should make it easy honestly. Blizzard is desperate and willing to do anything to salvage their failing userbase. Then you mention how player housing is only done by successful MMOs, casually omitting things like Wildstar or other failing/failed MMOs with housing, and suddenly you have a "solid" argument for why player housing=WoW bad.


If I were to guess why noone has mentioned it, I would assume it's because the player housing thing didn't register, possibly by being buried among other questions for what would work in WoW or however the question was phrased.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

You are really underestimating the community's ability to make Blizzard look bad.
Asking players if they want player housing should make it easy honestly. Blizzard is desperate and willing to do anything to salvage their failing userbase. Then you mention how player housing is only done by successful MMOs, casually omitting things like Wildstar or other failing/failed MMOs with housing, and suddenly you have a "solid" argument for why player housing=WoW bad.


If I were to guess why noone has mentioned it, I would assume it's because the player housing thing didn't register, possibly by being buried among other questions for what would work in WoW or however the question was phrased.

I wouldn't call Blizzard desperate and well player housing is not a bad idea but its not the end of the world if it isn't there. But if Blizzard wants to do their take on player housing they have to decouple it with any sense of power and if the cipher system is the way it is that I hear, doing it like that is key.

[Varodoc]

The Visions don't take place in Nyalotha.

N'zoth was underwhelming because he was the weakest Old God that was only known for manipulating stronger people into doing what he wants. He was just as whelming as any other Old God.

After Ra-den is captured, it is directly stated by Magni that he was taken to Ny'alotha, to "N'Zoth's vision made real". Thus, it is confirmed that Ny'alotha = Visions of N'Zoth. N'Zoth himself, when he unveils Ny'alotha shortly before this fact, mentions how it is his "Eternal vision made real".

Thus, Ny'alotha and the Visions of Stormwind/Orgrimmar are one and the same. Ny'alotha is N'Zoth's vision of a reborn Black Empire made manifest, and thereby the Visions of Stormwind/Orgrimmar show a future in which the Black Empire is reborn and N'Zoth is ascendant.

And yet, Alleria Windrunner, Magister Umbric, and Thrall (among others) dying in the "Visions of N'Zoth" had no reflection on the physical realm of Azeroth. So why should N'Zoth "dying" in the "Vision of N'Zoth" known as "Ny'alotha", the "Eternal vision made real", have an impact on the physical realm of Azeroth?

To top it all off, Danuser stated the following in an interview before Shadowlands was released:

I feel that N'Zoth seems to go down without too much of a fight, given that him and the dark city of Nyalotha have been built up since Cataclysm several years ago. Are there more to his plans? Could he return in the future? Some of his in-game whispers are pretty foreboding....

The tendrils of N'Zoth have been constricting around Azeroth since the time of his imprisonment. From hints in the Puzzle Box of Yogg-Saron, to the machinations of Deathwing and the Twilight's Hammer, to whispers seeded by Il'gynoth in the Emerald Nightmare, until his liberation in the battle against Azshara. Our Visions of N'Zoth update shows a world on the cusp of being transformed into his idealized future of the Black Empire reborn. Every dream made real.

While the Light can only conceive of one true path, the Void sees endless possibilities. Strategically, the Old Gods always have plans within plans, waiting for one door to close so another can open. To believe there can only be a single outcome to the struggle against N'Zoth would be to ignore the lessons he was trying to teach us.

"All eyes shall be opened." Do not allow yours to be closed.

1) Danuser describes the Visions of N'Zoth as "Azeroth about to be transformed into his idealized future of the Black Empire reborn", which was exactly how Ny'alotha is described as "N'Zoth's vision made real".

2) He's literally telling the fans to not just dismiss the Old God N'Zoth as "dead", because the Old Gods are beings of extreme cunning and intelligence, able to devise countless networks of plans and contingencies (N'Zoth more so than the other since he is the most cunning of all the Old Gods), he explicitly mentions how they wait for "one door to close" so that "another can open" (which fits with what Xal'atath said about N'Zoth in Legion, how he is so cunning that defeat always works in his favour), and that believing there can only be a "single outcome" against the Old God is foolish.

Perhaps N'Zoth was indeed waiting for "one door to open". A massive door in the sky, perhaps? A door leading to the realm of the dead, which would conveniently force all the heroes of Azeroth out of their world? Perhaps this was the "door" N'Zoth was waiting to "be opened"?

Don't close your eyes MMO-Champion, just listen to Danuser

N'zoth was underwhelming because he was the weakest Old God that was only known for manipulating stronger people into doing what he wants. He was just as whelming as any other Old God.

I truly appreciate villains who rely on brains and not brawns most of the time. Sure, a villain like Archimonde might be badass because of how uber strong and "in your face" he is, but I find villains like N'Zoth much more interesting. It is interesting how they make up their lack of strength with exceptional manipulation skills and extraordinary deceit capabilities.

The way you describe it, as a being that "manipulates stronger people into doing what he wants", does justice to N'Zoth and makes him sound pretty badass actually...

[Varodoc]

The Old Gods have always been the greatest nemesis of the Dragons, even more than the Legion.

- It was the Old God N'Zoth who corrupted Deathwing and turned him against his kin, when he unleashed the power of the Dragon Soul on them.
- N'Zoth kept messing with Deathwing and his family, turning Nefarian and Onyxia into pawns too.
- The entire Black dragonflight became minions of N'Zoth, and they used their powers to create new corrupted dragonflights bound to N'Zoth: 1) the Chromatic dragonflight (created by Nefarian); 2) the Twilight dragonflight (created by Sintharia); 2) the Nightmare dragonflight (dragons corrupted by Xavius/Emerald Nightmare, which N'Zoth controls).
- I don't know (or can't remember) who created the Infinite Dragonflight, but they too are a corrupted brood that served N'Zoth and helped create a timeline where the Hour of Twilight comes to pass.
- A new kind of Void-twisted dragon, Vexiona, is revealed in BfA.

So when you think about it, the Old Gods (mostly N'Zoth) are behind pretty much every tragedy that has affected the dragons in history. Really, I can't think of a more fitting villain.

If they make an expansion about the Dragon Isles, the villain is either an Old God or they're pulling something out their ass because I can't think of any other force that would be interested in the Dragon Isles. N'Zoth has been messing with dragons since forever and it just makes sense to have him there.

And if they reintroduce an Old God (whoever that is), they better give the Ren'dorei some well-deserved spotlight.

[Gaidax]

Then Danuser has succeeded in tricking you. You were tricked by Danuser Read this post and you'll realize you've been tricked by Danuser:

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...underestimated

I will admit that I expected a more refined reply, but oh well.

Man, you're copium-ing hard on this do ya.

Nope, Nzoth is dead and done. We will have Void expansion sometime next 5 years, but that chapter is all done and closed, except for maybe some sort of remnant or some nonsense like that popping up as some minor side-thing.

[MCMLXXXII]

I thought there would be a world revamp because Ion was basically saying it in the interviews.

But now after the Kalimdor novel there is no way.

What Ion said is that they go back to stories on Azeroth, what landmasses are left on Azeroth? The Dragon Isles, the banana island (lol), and?

Really it just kind of makes sense to have an expansion set in the Dragon Isles, although I'm not sure what to expect from it since they only appeared in that one barely-finished map from Vanilla with a giant Old God-looking temple...

- - - Updated - - -

Oh right, the giant Old God-looking temple from the Dragon Isles:



How convenient, that this largely unexplored landmass was meant to have an Old God-looking temple (octopus-looking temple to be exact), it sure would be the perfect way to reintroduce N'Zoth

That temple was already used in Stormsong Valley. You know, in the expansion where N'Zoth and the void elves(as allied race) were relevant.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

Then Danuser has succeeded in tricking you. You were tricked by Danuser Read this post and you'll realize you've been tricked by Danuser:

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...underestimated

I will admit that I expected a more refined reply, but oh well.

Tell me, why all of a sudden are you try-harding so much in shoehorning not only this thread you made almost a year ago but also incessantly attempting to derail conversation with subjects of Void Elves, N'Zoth and your hate for Danuser in every thread you are posting in since your last ban?

[Varodoc]

That temple was already used in Stormsong Valley. You know, in the expansion where N'Zoth and the void elves(as allied race) were relevant.

No reason why it can't be used again since N'Zoth isn't dead and thereby the Ren'dorei aren't even close to reaching their peak relevance.

[MCMLXXXII]

No reason why it can't be used again since N'Zoth isn't dead and thereby the Ren'dorei aren't even close to reaching their peak relevance.

Yes they have. They're just an allied race like the vulpera. In a game where some core races still need more attention they can join the queue.

[Varodoc]

Yes they have. They're just an allied race like the vulpera. In a game where some core races still need more attention they can join the queue.

I don't see why one would be led to believe that core races have some kind of "priority" over allied races when it comes to who gets the spotlight.

[huth]

Man, you're copium-ing hard on this do ya.

Nope, Nzoth is dead and done. We will have Void expansion sometime next 5 years, but that chapter is all done and closed, except for maybe some sort of remnant or some nonsense like that popping up as some minor side-thing.

Even if he is dead, all that means is that he returned to the Void. There's also the weirdness with the dagger.

They can easily throw him back at us if they want to.

[MCMLXXXII]

Seems the void-elf troll got banned again. But back on topic again. The only way I see the Ren'Dorei back relevant again is in a Light vs Void expansion. A civil war in the Alliance. A war between two lovers of sorts. Blizzard would never do another cosmic stuff expac STRAIGHT (edited) after this huge success called Shadowlands.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Seems the void-elf troll got banned again. But back on topic again. The only way I see the Ren'Dorei back relevant again is in a Light vs Void expansion. A civil war in the Alliance. A war between two lovers of sorts. Blizzard would never do another cosmic stuff expac after this huge success called Shadowlands.

We'll get another cosmic expansion, assuming Virus of doom doesn't destroy the world. Besides, the theme isn't the problem, people seem to not like player powered systems, I suppose.

[Zelk]

Seems the void-elf troll got banned again. But back on topic again. The only way I see the Ren'Dorei back relevant again is in a Light vs Void expansion. A civil war in the Alliance. A war between two lovers of sorts. Blizzard would never do another cosmic stuff expac after this huge success called Shadowlands.

I think the most likely future plan is to move between expansions on azeroth and expansions based on the cosmic powers. An order established by Legion-BFA-Shadowlands-maybe dragons who knows. Maybe they'll learn to better connect the storyline so the more cosmic stuff still feels tied to Azeroth and the overarching plot. Thinking they'll abandon the cosmic war stuff they're so keen on is wishful thinking.

[MCMLXXXII]

We'll get another cosmic expansion, assuming Virus of doom doesn't destroy the world. Besides, the theme isn't the problem, people seem to not like player powered systems, I suppose.

I think the most likely future plan is to move between expansions on azeroth and expansions based on the cosmic powers. An order established by Legion-BFA-Shadowlands-maybe dragons who knows. Maybe they'll learn to better connect the storyline so the more cosmic stuff still feels tied to Azeroth and the overarching plot. Thinking they'll abandon the cosmic war stuff they're so keen on is wishful thinking.

Yeah I should've said straight after this expac, that's what I meant.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Seems the void-elf troll got banned again. But back on topic again. The only way I see the Ren'Dorei back relevant again is in a Light vs Void expansion. A civil war in the Alliance. A war between two lovers of sorts. Blizzard would never do another cosmic stuff expac after this huge success called Shadowlands.

You underestimate the ignorance of Blizzard. It just takes a couple of years and then they'll have forgotten all about it again. Like with all the previous lessons they've already learned once before.

[Revamp Man]

Ok where’s the rumors of galakrond returning coming from??? Because I’m about to sue

[Gaidax]

Blizzard would never do another cosmic stuff expac after this huge success called Shadowlands.

Blizzard will do 5 another cosmic expansions. You can count on it, because ultimately that's where the story is going.

Shadowlands "success" has nothing to do with cosmic expansion or not - its a product of launch patch overstaying few months AND 9.1 being dogshit and also lasting longer than it ever should have.

Next expansion they will chill a bit with cosmic forces, but one after that - you can bet it will be there again. Void/Light expansion is a given really and it won't be about Goldshire.

[Sondrelk]

You underestimate the ignorance of Blizzard. It just takes a couple of years and then they'll have forgotten all about it again. Like with all the previous lessons they've already learned once before.

I doubt they forget them. Rather I think they keep going back and forth on what lessons to apply to the game.
It isnt really possible to apply the lessons of "Reclearing raids should be worth something", while also applying the lesson of "You should be able to feel done with a tier". One or the other has to take the hit, and therefore feel like Blizzard is regressing.
For every RNG mechanic meant to add longevity to a tier, there is an equally valid option to make gearing as straightforward as possible to give players a feeling that they have become as good as they can during said tier.
There isnt a solution that appeases both camps in this case.

- - - Updated - - -

Ok where’s the rumors of galakrond returning coming from??? Because I’m about to sue

The rumours of Galakrond returning has been constant since halfway through BfA, hasnt it?
It's a plotline that is important to both Dragons, and to a lesser degree to Death. The possibility of combining the Death stuff with future Dragon stuff or vice versa has been a topic for ages now.

[therumblings]

I don't think Galakrond is anything other than speculation right now, since he is Death + Dragon, and Death and Dragons are current speculation topics.