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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Xires View Post
    "a dozen hours" and people are finished with the content. Now...you get to keep PAYING for a content drought for what USED to be around 5 months or so per patch (until the final patch which is 9-14 months long). SL's is even worse. Longer waits with less content and BAD content at that.
    If people are waiting around for 10.0 to change anything for this game...get ready to be disappointed. Just like you were in BFA and just like you are in SL's.

    WoW is on life support. And it isn't going to get off. Also blizzard employee's attacking paying customers shows that they don't deserve our money anyway.

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    Yeah, I liked BfA better then SL's. Know how I know? As much problems as BfA had...I didn't quit. SL's got me to quit, to include the people I brought back to the game during legion.
    BfA was factor 5 better than SL. for 3 simple reasons:

    - story was not even half that shit. mostly because of all the better small side stories, like Talanjis or Jainas.
    - BfA had everything SL had (that shitty „systems“ etc) but at least they had Mechagon isle and Nazjatar too.
    - Even when it was shitty implemented, BfA had islands and warfronts. While also had same good or better raids&dungs.

    in short: quantity wise BfA was waaaaaay more huge than SL. while quality wise it was also better, even when not by that margin as quantity wise. i would say: an xpac that had way more content and a good bit more quality will definetely outdo an xpac like SL. at least imo.
    Last edited by Niwes; 2021-12-18 at 01:22 PM.

  2. #262
    Quote Originally Posted by Niwes View Post

    - BfA had everything SL had (that shitty „systems“ etc) but at least they had Mechagon isle and Nazjatar too.
    That's just dishonest from you.

    Mechagon and Nazjatar were 8.2 patch, and we'll get 9.2 in SL in a couple of months (you'll be able to compare it then with Zereth Mortis or whatever its called). You're literally comparing what cannot be compared, but hey, who cares about being honest on the internet, 'uh?

    And as for your third point, Islands and particularly Warfronts, were the worst features\content ever implemented in WoW. EVER. Well, after the SELFIE patch that was 6.1, but still.
    Last edited by hulkgor; 2021-12-18 at 01:26 PM.

  3. #263
    It's important to remember that quantity isn't everything. The QUALITY of the content also matters.

    ...so SL failed on TWO fronts, not just one

  4. #264
    Yeah as it stands, currently logging on, killing Tara > KT and selling Slyv mount and logging off for another week. Fun times

  5. #265
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    That's just dishonest from you.

    Mechagon and Nazjatar were 8.2 patch, and we'll get 9.2 in SL in a couple of months (you'll be able to compare it then with Zereth Mortis or whatever its called). You're literally comparing what cannot be compared, but hey, who cares about being honest on the internet, 'uh?

    And as for your third point, Islands and particularly Warfronts, were the worst features\content ever implemented in WoW. EVER. Well, after the SELFIE patch that was 6.1, but still.
    ok, shouldnt sound like i compare apples and oranges. so, lets compare:

    BfA patches:
    Darkshore warfront 8.1
    Battle of Dazar'alor raid 8.1
    Crucible of Storms raid 8.1
    Faction Assaults 8.1
    Nazjatar zone 8.2
    The Eternal Palace raid 8.2
    Mechagon Island zone 8.2
    Mechagon megadungeon 8.2
    Assaults 8.3
    Horrific Visions 8.3
    Ny'alotha, the Waking City raid 8.3

    SL patches:
    SoD raid 9.1
    Korthia zone 9.1
    Tazavesh megadungeon 9.1
    Maw assaults 9.1
    Sepulcher raid 9.2
    Zereth Mortis zone 9.2

    Hmm… idk. And i wasnt even comparing the .0 patches/games, where BfA quantity wise had way more. if SL not had even less quality, i wouldnt even talk about quantity.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    It's important to remember that quantity isn't everything. The QUALITY of the content also matters.

    ...so SL failed on TWO fronts, not just one
    thats what i just tried to say a few posts above. BfA i.e. had just a bit better quality and way more quantity. SL had nothing of both. i would have way less problems with SL content drought, if at least the quality had been super high. but the exact oposite is the case.

    when you have low amount of content. and that bit of content, you have, is shit. well, … then the things happen, that are happening at the moment.
    Last edited by Niwes; 2021-12-18 at 02:00 PM.

  6. #266
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsyplenk View Post
    Shouldn't really have to remind you considering they brought out TBC and will bring out Wrath, I think that's testament to what a blinding success classic servers have been. Empty servers? Won't even bother addressing the blatant delusion considering it's doing far better than retail where servers were connected and had CRZ implemented years ago.
    Well I wont try to argue with some one who shuts his eyes and just lalalala while probably neither playing retail or classic.

    If you enjoy your delusions, Iam glad for you

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    Quote Originally Posted by Niwes View Post
    ok, shouldnt sound like i compare apples and oranges. so, lets compare:

    BfA patches:
    Darkshore warfront 8.1
    Battle of Dazar'alor raid 8.1
    Crucible of Storms raid 8.1
    Faction Assaults 8.1
    Nazjatar zone 8.2
    The Eternal Palace raid 8.2
    Mechagon Island zone 8.2
    Mechagon megadungeon 8.2
    Assaults 8.3
    Horrific Visions 8.3
    Ny'alotha, the Waking City raid 8.3

    SL patches:
    SoD raid 9.1
    Korthia zone 9.1
    Tazavesh megadungeon 9.1
    Maw assaults 9.1
    Sepulcher raid 9.2
    Zereth Mortis zone 9.2

    Hmm… idk. And i wasnt even comparing the .0 patches/games, where BfA quantity wise had way more. if SL not had even less quality, i wouldnt even talk about quantity.

    - - - Updated - - -



    thats what i just tried to say a few posts above. BfA had a bit better quality and way more quantity. SL had nothing of both. i would have way less problems with SL content drought, if at least the quality had been super high. but the exact oposite is the case.
    Now also the X.1 X.2 of other expansions

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by ArenaDk View Post
    Well I wont try to argue with some one who shuts his eyes and just lalalala while probably neither playing retail or classic.

    If you enjoy your delusions, Iam glad for you

    - - - Updated - - -



    Now also the X.1 X.2 of other expansions
    nah, way to lazy for that. why i should do ppls work? that discussion, or having arguments (i cant even answer „arguments for what?“ since i am not even sure what my opinion here is) is not that important to me. sorry. you can read that on your own here:

    https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Patch

    edit:

    after thinking a bit about it, i came to the conclusion, that i just answered above quy, because logically wise it sounded weird to me, that SL was „better“ (quantity wise, since quality wise is a bit subjective). so i just quickly answered the quantity comparison. but i am, for sure, not deep in that discussion here.

    my brain tells me, that WoD had same or less content as SL. MoP, Legion, Wotlk and TBC had way more. Cata not sure. after thinking about for 10-20s. i play since 16 years without interruption. i am not sure if i remember everything correctly.
    Last edited by Niwes; 2021-12-18 at 02:20 PM.

  8. #268
    Quote Originally Posted by Niwes View Post
    snip
    Again, being dishonest in regards to the listing of features, missing some from SL (ie Torghast or Covenants), and adding .3 stuff from BFA. Why even bother.

    I'm not defending Shadowlands as it has a lot of flaws, but i don't understand why anyone would feel the need to be dishonest in regards of this discussion.

    That said, as a patch for patch comparison (.0 and .1 as of yet), i prefer Shadowlands over BFA. BFA only really got to a polished state with most of those features on 8.2 and even more so at 8.3. Launch content for BFA was a mess (Islands sucked, Warfronts sucked even harder, so more is not always better, i guess). I'll reserve judgement of the .2 comparison or -end of expansion state- when we're actually at that point. Why would i even assume to make a judgement on 9.2 and further when we haven't played it yet, right?

    edit - guess u're just asking for fights, as you're already arguing nonsensically with several users. have at it

  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by kaminaris View Post
    Both.

    Instead of introducing mind numbingly grinds that takes forever to finish they should introduce medium length, fun to play content because quality > quantity.
    Pair that up with not making content obsolete in another patch and people will have their long term goals to aspire.

    Good example was chromie scenario. Add couple more of these, make it achievement to "finish all 5" and boom, long term goal that isn't boring af.

    Bad example is trying to collect transmogs from rares that spawn on long timer and have rng attached to it so realistically it takes forever and boring AF.
    Everything you said is subjective.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    I mean yeah you're right but the current argument is that WoD had far less to do than SL. which is undeniably true. Literally everything you listed SL has but it also has more of those things. Then it has stuff on top of that which WoD simply did not have
    I know it has less. I'm just arguing about the hyperbolitive untruth that haters like to spread that it had nothing outside of garrisons and raiding.

    Though I can argue WoD had a few things SL doesn't. None of the world bosses have a mount, so if you don't care about anima and don't need their loot they become more optional, whereas you always wanted to do Rukhmar weekly. Also there was only one rep to actually grind for the goodies you got from the vendor at higher reps, that being the Avowed. The rest came passively from world quests. In WoD all the factions were ones you just grinded if you wanted to, take that as a positive or negative if you like. I've heard it go some ways. Some liked factions having just optional stuff after dailycraft and important things locked behind two reps to revered like in MoP, other didn't like how reps became optional.
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  10. #270
    Objectively incorrect. Any expansion before Mythic+ has less by volume potential.
    It might have less content you enjoy, but unless you want to start adding up number of quests or something, Shadowlands has done nothing wrong in terms of content delivery (outside of the delays)
    The issue is the systems and how they potentially limit your play in that content.
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  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by Niwes View Post
    Hmm… idk. And i wasnt even comparing the .0 patches/games, where BfA quantity wise had way more. if SL not had even less quality, i wouldnt even talk about quantity.
    Are you sure about that sentence? 9.0 had lots of content, including stuff that in other expansions would've come in patches.
    Looking past the "expected, normal" features like levelling quests, dungeons, worldquests, there were:
    • More rares&treasures, making outdoor SL feel more like a patch zone already in that regard
    • 4 long Covenant Campains that each rival Suramar and the War Campaign (I don't presume to claim the individual ones are as long as those earlier storylines, but together they were definitely longer)
    • Lots of side content in each Covenant. E.g. I only now really got around to do the Ember Court, and while the scenario itself is a bit boring after a few runs, the accompanying (one-time) quests to unlock more amenities and such (which in turn unlock new events during the scenario) are quite fun, to be honest.
    • Torghast is basically something completely new. Yes, tied to player power, but only for a few weeks until you had enough Soul Ash for one or two Legendaries, then it became an optional romp for achievements and cosmetics.
    Much of this is grindy and optional, but it is stuff you could do if you were looking for stuff to do.

    Now, obviously you'd have been kinda locked into one Covenant until 9.1.5 on your main if you were progress raiding or pushing keys, but even with that there was enough downtime to swap Covenants for some weeks, and obviously alts would be easy ways to experience other Covenant features.
    But your duty to Azeroth is not yet complete. More is demanded of you... a price the living cannot pay.

  12. #272
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Are you sure about that sentence? 9.0 had lots of content, including stuff that in other expansions would've come in patches.
    Looking past the "expected, normal" features like levelling quests, dungeons, worldquests, there were:
    • More rares&treasures, making outdoor SL feel more like a patch zone already in that regard
    • 4 long Covenant Campains that each rival Suramar and the War Campaign (I don't presume to claim the individual ones are as long as those earlier storylines, but together they were definitely longer)
    • Lots of side content in each Covenant. E.g. I only now really got around to do the Ember Court, and while the scenario itself is a bit boring after a few runs, the accompanying (one-time) quests to unlock more amenities and such (which in turn unlock new events during the scenario) are quite fun, to be honest.
    • Torghast is basically something completely new. Yes, tied to player power, but only for a few weeks until you had enough Soul Ash for one or two Legendaries, then it became an optional romp for achievements and cosmetics.
    Much of this is grindy and optional, but it is stuff you could do if you were looking for stuff to do.

    Now, obviously you'd have been kinda locked into one Covenant until 9.1.5 on your main if you were progress raiding or pushing keys, but even with that there was enough downtime to swap Covenants for some weeks, and obviously alts would be easy ways to experience other Covenant features.
    for me 9.0 not felt that special or that full. covenant campaign is just a long questline and differs not much from the BfA warcampaign, the MoP „black prince“ campaign, the WoD „ring or cape (?)“ campaign, the Legion campaign, etc. at least imo. Since MoP all the xpacs had them. and tbh i always find them more boring and annoying than great. because they are just a million stupid quests, telling some story. nice in the first run. super annoying for every alt that follows.

    Torghast was 1 element on SLs 9.0 feature list, yes. same like islands and warfronts in BfA, Garrison in WoD, Order Halls or maybe m+ introduction in Legion, or Proving grounds in MoP etc. I am too lazy to remember and list all the xpac .0 features, but Torghast was for sure not an outstanding addition here. Nonetheless its subjective anyway how the quality itself is felt by the players. for me personally Torghast was as same cheap shit as islands or warfronts, where warfronts had a nicer feeling and had a higher potential, if Blizz had done them right. all in all warfronts, islands or Torghast is all the same shit. at least imo.

    So, in the end of the day its mostly taste. i am sure there are ppls out there liking SL more than other xpacs and find arguments why. but for me and many ppls (obviously) this is just not the case and in a 1:1 comparisson for „us“ SL dont shine.
    Last edited by Niwes; 2021-12-19 at 11:32 AM.

  13. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by cparle87 View Post
    Hyperbole is dangerous, though. People go around saying stuff like "WoD had nothing to do." You and I know it's not true, the guy saying it knows it's not true. But some guy who didn't play the expansion hears it, takes it at face value, and joins the WoD or even all of WoW hate bandwagon based on this hyperbole. How many people do you think you see on the forums complaining about WoD actually played it, and how many didn't but are repeating the echo chamber.

    - - - Updated - - -



    So you don't even address most of my post cause you have no counter for it. Then dismiss a good chunk of the rest of it for somehow being lesser content for being garrison related as if that helps your argument. Then write off the rest because other expansions had them too. By your logic the only content Shadowlands has is Torghast because raids, dailies, rares, dungeons, and world quests existed in previous ones. See how ridiculous that sounds?
    Not as ridiculous as claiming WoD had a lot of content.

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  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Again, being dishonest in regards to the listing of features, missing some from SL (ie Torghast or Covenants), and adding .3 stuff from BFA. Why even bother.

    I'm not defending Shadowlands as it has a lot of flaws, but i don't understand why anyone would feel the need to be dishonest in regards of this discussion.

    That said, as a patch for patch comparison (.0 and .1 as of yet), i prefer Shadowlands over BFA. BFA only really got to a polished state with most of those features on 8.2 and even more so at 8.3. Launch content for BFA was a mess (Islands sucked, Warfronts sucked even harder, so more is not always better, i guess). I'll reserve judgement of the .2 comparison or -end of expansion state- when we're actually at that point. Why would i even assume to make a judgement on 9.2 and further when we haven't played it yet, right?

    edit - guess u're just asking for fights, as you're already arguing nonsensically with several users. have at it
    what ?

    if you wanna compare Torghast or Covenant campaign, you can add Warfronts, Islands and Warcampaign to the list above too. all of them are .0 features and NONE is on my comparison above. wether for BfA nor for SL. so, WTF are you talking here ?

    maybe i dont get what you talk, but it seems like you starting comparing apples with oranges to fit SL arguments ? at least you bring in Torghast .0 stuff and ignoring that no .0 stuff from BfA is in the list above.

    or in short: WTF ?

    the only dishonest person here is you, tbh. and then you have the nerve to say „i don't understand why anyone would feel the need to be dishonest in regards of this discussion.“ W T F ? ? ?
    Last edited by Niwes; 2021-12-19 at 11:55 AM.

  15. #275
    Quote Originally Posted by Niwes View Post
    snip
    Which you did! Adding Assaults and the likes of it. Wow, besides dishonest, you're incoherent. Bubye.

  16. #276
    Over 9000! Gimlix's Avatar
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    WoW didnt really had any proper content to do for last 4 expansions now. Why is this new?
    Quote Originally Posted by Shekora View Post
    Goddamn it, Gimlix, why do you keep making these threads?
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam the Wiser View Post
    Goddamn it, Gimlix, why do you keep making these threads?

  17. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShiyoKozuki View Post
    This expac had and still has zero content besides raid logging.
    What kind of content were you hoping for? There is still Mythic Dungeons to push every season (and for december that also means mythic timewalking). There are lots of rare mounts to farm for every day. Mage Tower challenges to do on as many characters as you care to. Since 9.1.5 I've found there is plenty of new stuff to keep me busy maxing out the other 3 covenants to collect all the cosmetics from them. It should be plenty enough to keep me playing until 9.2 launch.

  18. #278
    Quote Originally Posted by hulkgor View Post
    Which you did! Adding Assaults and the likes of it. Wow, besides dishonest, you're incoherent. Bubye.
    whatever. talking to you is like talking to an complete idiot. wasted time. and that shit is way to unimportant to waste time with. time for an ignore list entry. merry xmas.

  19. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Are you sure about that sentence? 9.0 had lots of content, including stuff that in other expansions would've come in patches.
    Looking past the "expected, normal" features like levelling quests, dungeons, worldquests, there were:
    • More rares&treasures, making outdoor SL feel more like a patch zone already in that regard
    • 4 long Covenant Campains that each rival Suramar and the War Campaign (I don't presume to claim the individual ones are as long as those earlier storylines, but together they were definitely longer)
    • Lots of side content in each Covenant. E.g. I only now really got around to do the Ember Court, and while the scenario itself is a bit boring after a few runs, the accompanying (one-time) quests to unlock more amenities and such (which in turn unlock new events during the scenario) are quite fun, to be honest.
    • Torghast is basically something completely new. Yes, tied to player power, but only for a few weeks until you had enough Soul Ash for one or two Legendaries, then it became an optional romp for achievements and cosmetics.
    Much of this is grindy and optional, but it is stuff you could do if you were looking for stuff to do.

    Now, obviously you'd have been kinda locked into one Covenant until 9.1.5 on your main if you were progress raiding or pushing keys, but even with that there was enough downtime to swap Covenants for some weeks, and obviously alts would be easy ways to experience other Covenant features.
    Have you consider fact that most people do not consider new difficutly as new conten as its literaly same thing but just harder. And also consider fact that everything what isnt called mythic is 1 giant faceroll without it with barealy any gameplay. You cant blame people complaining about lack of content becouse most things you listed is not new content. Doy ou know what is new content? Finishing T4 then do T5 than do T6. Finish T4 on normal, then T4 on heroic is not new content.

    Maybe Blizzard should go back and focus on longetivity of content trough actual difficulty and rpg aspects like attuments and not force everyone into endlessly replaying same content over and over with just bigger numbers. WoW is supostu be MMORPG not looter shootes where players endlessly farm things over and over.

  20. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venziir View Post
    No. WoD had no content besides raids and apexis dailies - which no one liked. Sure, at the start you could do Ashran, which no one liked either. And I suppose you could do garrision invasions too - which no one liked.
    I liked Garrison invasions
    Ashran however was annoying
    still WoD quality is still high, just quantity isn't, which is the topic here
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