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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    How is it "reasonable" to assume that the only people buy the token is to get boosted? You've yet to substantiate this claim with anything other than, "I'm in a boosting community and my boosting community sells a lot of boosts." There are other ways to get gold in WoW; the token isn't the only way. And there are other ways to buy boosts, too. The fact that you can't account for either of these very real possibilities in your argument makes your presumption anything but "reasonable." If you want to make an evidence-based claim like, "WoW is P2W because the token is used to buy boosts," the onus of proof is not on the people arguing against you.

    You only get one boost per class. You don't get that hard cap for tokens.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    You only get one boost per class. You don't get that hard cap for tokens.
    Is there anything stopping people from creating multiple accounts/licenses to the game to feed their addiction to getting boosted? I mean, these are whales we're talking about. Money doesn't mean anything to them, right?

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Is there anything stopping people from creating multiple accounts/licenses to the game to feed their addiction to getting boosted? I mean, these are whales we're talking about. Money doesn't mean anything to them, right?
    So, at this point, we are comparing purchasing the token with creating multiple characters, purchasing a ton of boosts (which are way more inneficient than the token, money wise). Funneling that cash to one character. And then going underground to find the carry party, since carry parties are forbidden by the ToS. All while praying that the GMs don't consider all those operations some variant of RMT or adjacent activity (which are, again, forbidden by the ToS).

    And somehow, this is the same.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    So, at this point, we are comparing purchasing the token with creating multiple characters, purchasing a ton of boosts (which are way more inneficient than the token, money wise). Funneling that cash to one character. And then going underground to find the carry party, since carry parties are forbidden by the ToS. All while praying that the GMs don't consider all those operations some variant of RMT or adjacent activity (which are, again, forbidden by the ToS).

    And somehow, this is the same.
    Why would you have to go underground to get boosted in FF? It's not against the rules if it's not being advertised.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Why would you have to go underground to get boosted in FF? It's not against the rules if it's not being advertised.
    And the carry party will pop out of thin air.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    Wow has been micro transaction free you say?


    Hahahahahaha sure whatever you say
    To be fair there is nothing micro about wow's transactions.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Why would you have to go underground to get boosted in FF? It's not against the rules if it's not being advertised.
    At some point you have to stop right?

    You are reaching so absurdly far that you are comparing spending thousands of dollars and risking being banned to paying 25$ and hopping into any spammed carry party in wow.

    I have seen people admit to faults in religions they have followed their entire lives faster then you are to admitting wow has gone p2w

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    And the carry party will pop out of thin air.
    You said the party itself was against the ToS which isn't true.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Sucralose View Post
    At some point you have to stop right?

    You are reaching so absurdly far that you are comparing spending thousands of dollars and risking being banned to paying 25$ and hopping into any spammed carry party in wow.

    I have seen people admit to faults in religions they have followed their entire lives faster then you are to admitting wow has gone p2w
    Because it isn't P2W and shitty arguments from people irrationally upset about the token's existence won't change that.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    You said the party itself was against the ToS which isn't true.


    https://support.na.square-enix.com/f...la=1&kid=68216

    "RMT refers to an act of directly or indirectly transferring, assigning, lending, borrowing, or delegating in-game data or in-game activity for compensation (which include currency, goods, property, currency available outside of our services, character(s), item(s), point(s), data, information, etc.) or assisting in this type of behavior. If RMT activity is verified, a penalty will be issued.

    Examples of RMT include offering or receiving compensation for the following:

    - Accounts
    - Characters
    - In-game currency (gil)
    - In-game services
    - In-game items
    - In-game activities (such as selling clears)

    Got anything else to say?

  10. #110
    Blizz added the cash shop in WoW back in 2013. Nine years ago now.

    The basis of this entire thread is false. Take care.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    https://support.na.square-enix.com/f...la=1&kid=68216

    "RMT refers to an act of directly or indirectly transferring, assigning, lending, borrowing, or delegating in-game data or in-game activity for compensation (which include currency, goods, property, currency available outside of our services, character(s), item(s), point(s), data, information, etc.) or assisting in this type of behavior. If RMT activity is verified, a penalty will be issued.

    Examples of RMT include offering or receiving compensation for the following:

    - Accounts
    - Characters
    - In-game currency (gil)
    - In-game services
    - In-game items
    - In-game activities (such as selling clears)

    Got anything else to say?
    I never disputed RMT but buying boosts with Gil obtained from services sold on Square's store would reasonably be exempt, correct?

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    I never disputed RMT but buying boosts with Gil obtained from services sold on Square's store would reasonably be exempt, correct?
    Right. Read the posted segment again. Once you understand what it's telling you, come back.

  13. #113
    Microtransactions don't hurt the game. The systems, drip feeding content gating, more systems, even more systems, and it's farmville like degradation, where you have to keep playing to even play. Take a month off and you're way behind. I have a feeling most people just want to play and have fun, and sure you can still have long milestones, and farming ect, but the game is like in a monetary prison. The art team is amazing, that's why each expansion people get hyped this may be the one! but it's the same story as of late, that the actual gameplay is from the ground up created to hyper extend the same gameplay over and over. If there's a natural lul in an expansion, then so be it, but to force players to stay to experience the same 2 month content over a year, that's crummy, and nobody really wants to do that.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    Right. Read the posted segment again. Once you understand what it's telling you, come back.
    It's not RMT if the Gil comes from a service Square sells on their store.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    It's not RMT if the Gil comes from a service Square sells on their store.
    That's not what the text is telling you. Let me summarize the text: it's banned to sell carries in exchange for gil. Doesn't matter where the gil comes from. You could actually get paid in items and it would still be against ToS. It's the act of selling the clear that is against ToS.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    That's not what the text is telling you. Let me summarize the text: it's banned to sell carries in exchange for gil. Doesn't matter where the gil comes from. It's the act of selling the clear that is against ToS.
    Correct me if I'm wrong but that only pertains to RMT. From the article Square released when they prohibited the advertisement of boosts --

    It is not a violation to ask for help or to offer a reward when asking for help, as in the following examples that do not violate our policy. However, in the examples that do violate the policy, the person offering help is advertising their services, which is prohibited.

    Examples of violations:
    - Selling [duty] clear for 1 million gil.
    - Selling [duty] clear and/or offering the associated rewards from [content]. Join for more info/details.

    Examples of non-violation:
    - I'm new, can anyone help me clear [duty]?
    - Help me clear [duty] and I'll pay you 1 million gil!
    - I'd like to get some items from [duty]. will pay 1 million gil if I can get it.

    If I'm misunderstanding something, please let me know.

  17. #117
    The 1st option means you don't need to pay. that means the gold boosting shenanigans are effectively useless in order to achieve the desired objective.
    The 2nd and 3rd mean you'll be getting run of the mill folks that are, at best, average fellas and just want to try out for the lulz. Meaning, it's your average pug. Chances are quite high you're not getting that carry unless you put some effort.
    Last edited by Lord Kragan; 2022-01-19 at 08:14 PM.

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong but that only pertains to RMT. From the article Square released when they prohibited the advertisement of boosts --

    It is not a violation to ask for help or to offer a reward when asking for help, as in the following examples that do not violate our policy. However, in the examples that do violate the policy, the person offering help is advertising their services, which is prohibited.

    Examples of violations:
    - Selling [duty] clear for 1 million gil.
    - Selling [duty] clear and/or offering the associated rewards from [content]. Join for more info/details.

    Examples of non-violation:
    - I'm new, can anyone help me clear [duty]?
    - Help me clear [duty] and I'll pay you 1 million gil!
    - I'd like to get some items from [duty]. will pay 1 million gil if I can get it.

    If I'm misunderstanding something, please let me know.
    You are not misunderstanding anything.
    It is forbidden to advertise boosting, because that causes mental anguish, just look at WoW.
    But you are allowed to "ask for help" and "compensate for helping".
    So in the end the result is the same: Plenty of boosting, but it for some very dense persons it seems that boosting is gone in FFXIV.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by T-34 View Post
    You are not misunderstanding anything.
    It is forbidden to advertise boosting, because that causes mental anguish, just look at WoW.
    But you are allowed to "ask for help" and "compensate for helping".
    So in the end the result is the same: Plenty of boosting, but it for some very dense persons it seems that boosting is gone in FFXIV.

    Oh, there's still boosting. But before you could see pretty often in the duty finder, which was the most visible tool. Right now? the european DCs have not a single advert. It still exists, that will never go away, but it's clearly much diminished from before because, whenever you add extra steps, some fall on each of those.

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    I can spend $60 on wow tokens and gain access to literally any challenge this game has to offer via carry and boost lol. In what simp universe is that not p2w?
    I play wow. I raid. I enjoy the game. None of that doesn't mean this game ain't p2w though sorry. Maybe Microsoft will take it to the next level so even you can't continue to deny reality :P[COLOR="#417394"][SIZE=1]
    WoW isn't P2W.
    You can in no way pay the way to become the best/first.
    Those that boost people through mythic raids have completed the raid themselves without buying anything.
    Those that boost people through M+ have completed the same keys a long time ago.

    People that buy a boost in WoW are paying to be mediocre. And that makes people that buy boosts in WoW more pathetic and stupid than people that pay their way through true P2W games.

    You can't pay your way in WoW to be at the top. You can pay your way to complete content that far better people than you have completed themselves without any help..
    The only thing in WoW that remotely could be considered P2W are BOEs, because they could give an advantage in the race to world 1st.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Kragan View Post
    Oh, there's still boosting. But before you could see pretty often in the duty finder, which was the most visible tool. Right now? the european DCs have not a single advert. It still exists, that will never go away, but it's clearly much diminished from before because, whenever you add extra steps, some fall on each of those.
    Yes, it is less visible in-game, and that make some people think that it has become less prevalent...
    You or I have no idea if this has made boosting less prevalent, you or I have no idea if this has shifted some of the boosting for in-game currency over to RMT, brokered through external sites.

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