Sepulcher of the First Ones World Race

[rogoth]

The silence is definitely a bug. I can't remember bosses ever being affected by Silence. Sooo many bosses would be completely cheesable if you could silence their mechanics to keep them from happening.

Mortal Strike... I dunno really. I think it's dumb and they should instead just have the Jailer heal for less but be immune to it. But maybe Blizz was just being cheeky, much like they were with M Sylvanas losing at 45% instead of 50%.

you must be new to the game then, so many old bosses could have a silence effect applied to them, some were designed around the idea of them being silenced, especially after the change made to how mage counterspell and other 'mage style' ranged interupts worked having a silence effect baked into the interupt itself if you hit the interupt successfully.

[Xath]

They aren't using the MS debuff even though they just have to swap one warrior to apply it. That makes the p4 significantly harder. And they know the use of the MS debuff has been somewhat validated by Blizzard. I see absolutely zero rational reason not to use it. It's not about using a different strat, it's about playing suboptimally on purpose.

Last time something was validated by blizz ie guilds not banned Limit gave in did it and got a six month ban I can see why they are wary to do it again.

[rogoth]

Yes it was the question as i said it was bugged and was told it cant be bugged because debuff interactions is super easy to test so its on purpose

just so i'm clear, can you answer a few questions:

does the boss HP increase happen as a heal effect over time, or as an instant chunk of health back?

does the boss HP increase happen during a forced transition where players can't move or interact with the boss?

does the boss HP increase happen as a normal part of the encounter where players can freely move around and still interact with the boss?

do you know the exact health value in numbers when the health transition is supposed to start and where it is supposed to end without any interventions?

can you link a direct word for word translation of the tooltip for mortal strike?

because depending on the outcome of the responses, it's easy enough to 'prove' whether it's intended or not and to finally put this bullshit arguement to rest.

[Ingweh]

Last time something was validated by blizz ie guilds not banned Limit gave in did it and got a six month ban I can see why they are wary to do it again.

didnt Limit get banned for real money trading?

- - - Updated - - -

Wait no excuse?

there it is lol...now hes coming out with all the denials about dread lords

[bobhenk]

The sheer hatred/amount of energy some of people spend on Max/Liquid is eerily reminiscent of the absolute human refuse on kiwifarms and the like, and I say that as someone who thinks Max is fairly annoying and prefers watching other people play. Seriously go touch grass, talk to a human in real life.

[xul]

I put my life savings on NA winning and my wife left me. Fuck.

[Ingweh]

First time I have heard Max talking. Watching his stream, I can see most of the things people say about him. And the FF14 thing....theres definitely a history there of those kinds of behaviours (lying, making excuses etc....). Wont be watching him again.

[Jastall]

you must be new to the game then, so many old bosses could have a silence effect applied to them, some were designed around the idea of them being silenced, especially after the change made to how mage counterspell and other 'mage style' ranged interupts worked having a silence effect baked into the interupt itself if you hit the interupt successfully.

You seem to be describing an interrupt spell lockout far more than a genuine silence. What raid boss are you referring to anyway?

[BrioWoW]

The excuses and lies rolling in LOL. Boss he said was mathematically impossible during raid he just now said he never said it was impossible. FFS.

[Unforgivenn]

I didn't know about max before this race but I have to admit the timing is suspicious that his mic breaks or whatever when they give up on the world first, and then as soon as they kill the boss it starts working, not even a day of difference in either case?

https://twitter.com/maximum/status/1...9jdxVsCTg&s=19

https://twitter.com/maximum/status/1...CXzJ6_XNA&s=19

[Jdance]

The excuses and lies rolling in LOL. Boss he said was mathematically impossible during raid he just now said he never said it was impossible. FFS.

you need a hobby dude

[Asheskell]

The excuses and lies rolling in LOL. Boss he said was mathematically impossible during raid he just now said he never said it was impossible. FFS.

He said it was mathematically impossible to kill it before enrage. Which he confirmed in his stream. Which he confirms he messaged Blizzard about. Which, to be fair, the boss wasn't killed before enrage. It's not a big deal.

[BrioWoW]

you need a hobby dude

Yeah, one of them is check out the race and then forget about WoW for months.

Other than one comment I made in a post about the Liquid announcement, my last post here was in July rofl.

[voidillusion]

He'll be streaming in a few hours with a post mortem. Make sure to tune in. :^)

Mixer working already?

[Relapses]

Since I know a lot of people won't be watching the stream, here's the highlights from Max's post-mortem --

• Jailer bug is kind of bullshit but they decided to use it when it became clear it was the fastest way to kill the boss.
• The decision to quit was mostly a team one. Max made the final decision but it had more to do with the race having already being lost and staying longer at the venue to solidify a World 2nd would not have been beneficial for team morale.
• Echo played better than Liquid on The Jailer, full stop. Max feels Echo's pull strategy was a lot more beneficial for their guild, where analyzing heavily between pulls helped immensely with progression. Obviously Echo simply playing better was the bigger factor in their L.
• RE: Max's tweet about LoD where Echo initially pulled ahead: He stands by what he said, though he does acknowledge he made have the decision to move onto Rygelon may have been premature and also may have cost them some progression.
• A bit annoyed by the Anduin stars bug because they spent a bunch of time formulating a strategy around avoiding it only to find out all guilds after them would be able to plant and kill it. Also major tilt from Gingi's outburst.
• Overall much more difficult raid tier. Probably the best designed WoW encounters of all time.
• Tuning for the last three bosses was tight, tough bosses requiring a God pull to kill is okay.
• Loot RNG bad but didn't have a huge impact on the race due to the length of the race. He doesn't feel that ML is necessary to come back because Blizzard shouldn't change loot for everybody because of the RWF. Splits get worse with ML. Please shut the fuck up and stop asking him about it because there isn't a way to fix split raiding. He views big guilds paying huge lump sums to helpers for loot as charitable.
• If the race continues to go this long it's less likely that they'll come together like they did this time.
• Liquid's vibe is to have bits in between pulls. It doesn't mean they're not focused, it's just how they roll. They were memeing excessively once they pulled out of the race because they gave no fucks.

That's it for now.

[Skandulous]

It’s hard to say. Yes obviously a lot going on behind the scenes but I get the sense that Echo is more communal with more people having input.

And absolutely, no one arguing that Liquid’s resume matches up to Echo’s. Just that they won a few times. Echo/Method is by far the most accomplished guild in wow’s history.

Paragon wiped the floor with them in their primes of raiding.

[exochaft]

Yes it was the question as i said it was bugged and was told it cant be bugged because debuff interactions is super easy to test so its on purpose

I figure the reason this bug is getting a pass from Blizz (whether it's a bug or intended) is because Blizz wants the rest of the WF race to be over as soon as possible. Wouldn't be surprised if Blizz came out and says something like "Yeah, that bug... we're going to make it a feature now since we've had a bunch of kills with the boss bugged." Again, I highly doubt it would be for that actual reason, more that Blizz just wants to wrap things up and end the race.

Still of the opinion that this WF race has been damaging on many levels to the participants and everyone behind them in progression. I wouldn't be surprised if the participation and completion of the mythic raid is very low, if not the lowest in WoW's history when it comes to mythic raiding.

[Relapses]

Paragon wiped the floor with them in their primes of raiding.

I'll second this. To this day I think Paragon's 10M Heroic Gary is one of the most impressive feats ever accomplished by a guild in this game.

[BrioWoW]

Whelp, this has run its course and enjoyed seeing Max being an excuse making Andy as usual. See you guys in a year and half for the next raid!

[Skandulous]

Paragon's prime was very short. First win was TOGC, then ICC, then won the first two tiers of Cata, then done. Came back and got WF Highmaul later but that was it. In contrast, Method got virtually every world first starting from MOP through now, with the exception of Highmaul and the two Limit wins (and if you count Blood Legion getting end boss in HoF).

I'm a huge Paragon fan (likely why I tend to root against Method) and many view them as having an incredibly high peak, but they just don't have the longevity Method/Echo has.

How many original people are still in Method? Method is a brand that just grabs top raiders to refill. Paragon ran with Finnish speaking ppl only and when they where done they where done. When Paragon was in the game they where the best hands down. Also once Paragon quit lets face it Method had zero competition.