[SPOILER]Khadgar, Wrathion and Tyrande will be important characters in Dragonflight.

[Jastall]

Relatable.

As for why Tyrande, while she's appeared for a lot of the expansions I can't really feel she's overexposed because she keeps getting dicked in every single appearance, so maybe eventually she'll hit gold and have a decent portrayal. Presumably she's there because of that datamined new seed that the Winter Queen gives her.

I'm not optimistic. When was the last time Blizzard turned around an obviously overused character by exposing them even more? She needs a break from the story, and Malfurion is both a less annoying character and just as strongly linked to the Green Flight as she is anyway, if not moreso. Khadgar is a good example, he was there for two expansions, put in the freezer for two, now people are mostly glad he's back.


As for the Horde, Reliquary is an easy opportunity to feature a BE or two. I'd also like Dragonmaw Orcs stirring up trouble if there were any of them that weren't literal whos are this point. Forsaken are likely to see little to no screentime at all unless undead dragons are involved, which come to think of it might not be the worst idea for a patch or at least zone/dungeon for this expansion given that the Scourge recently started running amok again.

[Ogren]

There were a few other playable races peppered throughout Kul Tiras, but yes, it was predominantly Kul Tiran humans given that the region was basically their capitol and homeland. It pretty much echoes Zandalar, with its population being 98% Zandalari trolls, and having a smattering of other races here and there.

I think Zandalar could have done with a bit more Darkspear, although Rokhan's role felt like it mirrors Genn where he's sort of a diplomatic bridge, though it'd be cool to maybe see Darkspear Druids learn the dino forms and ditto for Gilnean Druids to learn the wicker forms.

[CrittenMitten]

May the Horde rest in peace.


https://www.wowhead.com/news/dragonf...-mythic-326780

This is terrible. I was hoping they would leave the ̶n̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ cringe warrior and her bullshit story in shadowlands along with Sylvanas.

[Super Dickmann]

I'm not optimistic. When was the last time Blizzard turned around an obviously overused character by exposing them even more? She needs a break from the story, and Malfurion is both a less annoying character and just as strongly linked to the Green Flight as she is anyway, if not moreso. Khadgar is a good example, he was there for two expansions, put in the freezer for two, now people are mostly glad he's back.

Neither am I, but Tyrande isn't even that overexposed. Overexposure requires you to do anything and it's only in Shadowlands that Tyrande has had a (dumb) arc. It's akin to how I can't take seriously say, Sylvanas having been overexposed in BFA when she was a frowny plank that barely featured on-screen past the intro and 8.2.5's cinematic. Tyrande has the extra benefit of actually having distinguishable lines in each of these expansions, which I can't say for Malf who I can easily slot into the Bland Gang, since that's what he did in Cata when he was handing out neutral quests while the Horde was invading his home five minutes away.

As for the Horde, Reliquary is an easy opportunity to feature a BE or two. I'd also like Dragonmaw Orcs stirring up trouble if there were any of them that weren't literal whos are this point. Forsaken are likely to see little to no screentime at all unless undead dragons are involved, which come to think of it might not be the worst idea for a patch or at least zone/dungeon for this expansion given that the Scourge recently started running amok again.

The Dragonmaw are the best pick orc-wise, but lack characters. They do still have the Demon Chain and Alex is a main character though, so there's plenty of room for them to feature and narrative hooks to use. I'd prefer them being quest givers, but I'd settle for them as a dragon-catching fleet in a dungeon if it means they feature. We've already seen the Reliquary confirmed, so Salandria seems guaranteed to play a part, going off of the Children's Week content and the dragons' prediction that she'd be responsible for some calamity. If she weren't such a valley girl stereotype in 9.2.5 I'd even figure she was slotted to be a baddie, given she says she wants to 'own' a dragon, but it seems more likely that she'll just get to be a dragon rider and be our Taelia until said major fuck-up. Forsaken got nothing to do even in the afterlife expansion and since 9.2.5 will formalize their transition into the nu-undead that started in BTS, the best thing to happen to them is to disappear for all time.

[Reinhart11]

I think with the Dragonmaw divided, part of the Clan following Zaela and allying with the Iron Horde, while Gorfax Angerfang leads the Dragonmaw who remained with the Horde, that could be a good approach.

This way you can have Dragonmaw who use the Dragon Chain to enslave drakes. Meanwhile Gorfax and Koak could approach Alexstrasza, offering help to fight the other Dragonmaw and the Primalist Incarnates. In return they search for proto drakes, using a more tame approach to turn the drakes into companions, instead of slaves. Their approach could combine some of their old, less extreme methods in combination with Koaks approach he learned in Pandaria.

I still think the opportunity to introduce a Blackrock maghar connected to the Black Dragons would be awesome. The Maghar desperately need some more names next to Geyarah. Preferably non Frostwolf/Warsong. A son of AU Blackhand for the Blackrocks and a daughter of AU Nerzhul for the Shadowmoon would be great. I want to characters from these and other Clans who are not villains.

In regards to the new centaur, i only see the problem that the Titans weren't aware of them in Chronicles. But these centaur could exist. If Zaetar and Theradras can birth them, you can easily come up with a story from 10k years ago, where a powerful stone elemental and a great dryad like Lunara brought them into existence. Something like that would also allow for these centaurs to look somewhat different, have some other innate abilities and such. So its not something introduced that can't be connected to the already existing story in a proper way.

[Alanar]

They don't? I thought she was super popular - oh wait, the lack of any main roles from 1.0 to 9.0 might be the reason. Maybe she'll get lucky in 10.0

Does a character need a main role to be interesting? No not really. 10.0 isnt gonna make her super populair.

I can honestly name 10+ side character that are more interesting. I keep thinking about the line Nathanos made before he got beheaded.

" Oo Tyrande!!. High priestes, Night warrior.. so powerless.
The sarcastic tone kinda sums up exactly how useless she is.

[Feanoro]

Does a character need a main role to be interesting? No not really. 10.0 isnt gonna make her super populair.

I can honestly name 10+ side character that are more interesting. I keep thinking about the line Nathanos made before he got beheaded.

" Oo Tyrande!!. High priestes, Night warrior.. so powerless.
The sarcastic tone kinda sums up exactly how useless she is.

Kinda what happens when the Horde has planet sized plot armor, and the writers have openly stated they hate writing Alliance.

[Alanar]

Kinda what happens when the Horde has planet sized plot armor, and the writers have openly stated they hate writing Alliance.

Lol, we are talking about a single character and besides the horde had many misses as well with characters.

Little bit dramatic dont you think or do you mean anduin plot armor?

[Feanoro]

Lol, we are talking about a single character and besides the horde had many misses as well with characters.

Little bit dramatic dont you think or do you mean anduin plot armor?

No, I don't think it's dramatic to state that Alliance simply is not allowed to have proactive or successful characters. Consider that we're told the Night Warrior (ugh) is supposed to be able to 1v1 Old Gods, yet couldn't handle a zombie with a bow. Why? Because this NW was an Alliance character facing a writer self-insert. The sarcastic comment is writer spite at being forced (likely by the suits recognizing Alliance players were quitting in droves) to throw a bone to the Alliance.

[Dch48]

I'm okay with it. I like seeing Tyrande and am happy she'll be involved. The expanded role for Wrathion is also welcome. I hope we see Thrall too.

[Reinhart11]

No, I don't think it's dramatic to state that Alliance simply is not allowed to have proactive or successful characters. Consider that we're told the Night Warrior (ugh) is supposed to be able to 1v1 Old Gods, yet couldn't handle a zombie with a bow. Why? Because this NW was an Alliance character facing a writer self-insert. The sarcastic comment is writer spite at being forced (likely by the suits recognizing Alliance players were quitting in droves) to throw a bone to the Alliance.

At least Alliance characters aren't turned into loot pinata left and right and killed off. With no characters of worth or note in sight to replace the dead ones.

[Feanoro]

At least Alliance characters aren't turned into loot pinata left and right and killed off. With no characters of worth or note in sight to replace the dead ones.

Unless you want to include the Old Horde via WoD, there's only Garrosh for loot pinata and killed.

If you mean just killed, ala Vol'jin, I'd agree. The difference I'm pointing out is while Horde characters may die, they don't become lobotomized idiots like Alliance. Alliance characters are dead without falling over, they cheer for and defend the Horde and throw their people and allies under the bus with absurd "If you defend yourself, or demand justice for the Horde's latest atrocity, you're just as bad!" lines. The normal people of the Alliance should have long since executed Anduin for treason, for example.

[Rhlor]

Horde has no business in a neutral expansion. Blizzard made that clear. Without faction conflict the Horde is dead.

the reliquary will be present in all the islands

[vilememory]

Hold up a moment with the Dragon Maw orcs, didn't Blizzard say they got wiped out when the Legion first invaded? Along with the dwarf clan in that same zone they are in. I'm not positive but I thought I saw a tweet stating that, but then again this is Blizzard and they are very quick to change that. Oh yeah, so some survived and made a huge breeding plan and ha ha ha you don't need to know the details just go with it.

[Aucald]

Hold up a moment with the Dragon Maw orcs, didn't Blizzard say they got wiped out when the Legion first invaded? Along with the dwarf clan in that same zone they are in. I'm not positive but I thought I saw a tweet stating that, but then again this is Blizzard and they are very quick to change that. Oh yeah, so some survived and made a huge breeding plan and ha ha ha you don't need to know the details just go with it.

The Dragonmaw are still extant on Azeroth in the Twilight Highlands, and many of them have joined and remain in the Horde as active members to this day. Gorfax Angerfang, the current active chieftain of the clan, appears in the Undercity during Legion for a PvP-related prestige ceremony, denoted as leader of the Dragonmaw.

[RadasNoir]

Even as someone who doesn't have the same level of boiling vitriol that most people in here seem to have for her, I'm kind of confused as to why Tyrande is going to be taking the spotlight again. It felt like she already just finished a major character arc in Shadowlands. It was an awful and pointless character arc, mind, and existed solely to prop up Danuser's waifu, but it existed and had an ending.

If they wanted a Night Elf representative to bridge the gap with the Emerald Dragonflight, wouldn't Malfurion have made more sense? He spent way more time with them within the Emerald Dream, than Tyrande ever did.

[Reinhart11]

Unless you want to include the Old Horde via WoD, there's only Garrosh for loot pinata and killed.

If you mean just killed, ala Vol'jin, I'd agree. The difference I'm pointing out is while Horde characters may die, they don't become lobotomized idiots like Alliance. Alliance characters are dead without falling over, they cheer for and defend the Horde and throw their people and allies under the bus with absurd "If you defend yourself, or demand justice for the Horde's latest atrocity, you're just as bad!" lines. The normal people of the Alliance should have long since executed Anduin for treason, for example.

I agree with your percention of the Alliance characters. The Horde have these kind of characters as well. Like Baine and Thrall come to my mind.

In my opinion the portrayal of War in this game has few major issues.

The stakes are too high. Complete genocide/eradication of the opponent, the whole faction with its population is down right retarded. That doesn't happen in other Fantasy universes for a good reason, even in the once like insane as Warhammer Fantasy/the Old World, but also more tame ones like LotR or Game of Thrones. Its also not practical in the World itself and it shouldn't be so easy to project Military power over such vast distances like in WoW.

Another Problem are the Factions themselves.With these major factions, every playable race is dragged in any conflict, even if it shouldn't even be in their interests or important for their geopolitics.

The next problem is, that major characters are killed or used as villains far too quickly.This includes characters outside the two playable factions as well. Like Arthas and his Scourge should still be present in Icecrown, rebuilding their powerbase. Same for Deathwing and his forces. This creates more and interesting balances of power. Not to mention that it can open up epic battles, stories and duels. Who wouldn't have loved another Duel between Illidan and Arthas. Or Arthas facing Kiljaeden and the Legion. Or Archimonde pulverizing an army of the Old Gods, before getting smacked in the face by Deathwing. Characters shouldn't die because some of their war plans fail. This kind of throwing away major characters does not happen in any other fantasy universe i know.

Connected to this is the existence of World ending threats. I despise this kind of story telling, because its pure cancer for the development of the involved characters and factions. Arthas, Deathwing, the Legion and the Old Gods are all misshandled in that way and Blizzard learns nothing from it. Even though Blizzard showed with the Jaina in Battle of Dazar Alor and the Arthas fight in Halls of Reflection, that they can do concepts for Boss fights, where the characters aren't wasted. These cosmic world ending battles on Azeroth itself are the worst. Let those happen in different dimensions, if Blizzard needs these so much.

And my last major point is, that the World of Azeroth should be larger, have more room for war, battle and sieges. This way there could be a proper back and forth between opponents, where both sides win and lose in those wars. Wars and battles for regions, or settlements(like Astranaar, Crossroads, Menethil Harbor etc.) should be more important. But they aren't because the regions and settlements seem way too small for that. Which is very counterproductve for the war setting in this game.

I hope someday Blizzard will have developers and writers and producers who realize such point and use the potential this fantasy world has in that aspect.

[Mace]

Does a character need a main role to be interesting? No not really. 10.0 isnt gonna make her super populair.

I can honestly name 10+ side character that are more interesting. I keep thinking about the line Nathanos made before he got beheaded.

" Oo Tyrande!!. High priestes, Night warrior.. so powerless.
The sarcastic tone kinda sums up exactly how useless she is.

A main character without main roles isn't good. She was extremely popular in WC3, as her race was, - and we know how they got treated.

Question remains whether blizzard turn it around - a lot of missed opportunities with her - specific areas where she was a key candidate or should have been.

I think her state is because those running the show didn't like her. They ditched a perfectly good character and race for no reason, don't be surprised if it seems awful when you only show them in bit part roles.

It might be a different scenario though with proper writing, stronger focus, and well, seeing that Naz'jatar, Azshara, Ruins of Zin'Azshari, Suramar, The broken shore and the Cathedral of Eternal Night are all still there, she could have what was missing eventually revisited.

I think they have some new writers and are exploring new areas and other characters like her who'd been mostly side-lined, could be good.

[Tanaria]

Does a character need a main role to be interesting? No not really. 10.0 isnt gonna make her super populair.

I can honestly name 10+ side character that are more interesting. I keep thinking about the line Nathanos made before he got beheaded.

" Oo Tyrande!!. High priestes, Night warrior.. so powerless.
The sarcastic tone kinda sums up exactly how useless she is.

For a "Night Elf" / "Nightborne" based presence, we've got so many who are more interesting.

Arcanist Valtrois is a great character.
Drelanim Whisperwind is a great character (The Warden from the VoTW.)

Two characters who could drive the expansion.

The worst thing is - they are now pinning the Night Elf race on Tyrande. This is the same as the Forsaken with Sylvanas. Soon, night elf fans will deem it impossible for their race to have any lore development without Tyrande.
You don't need the racial leader for a race to be involved.

The Nightborne aren't reliant on Thalyssra to get lore. Valtrois was part of the Horde force in Zuldazar - she even watched Derek Proudmoore get raised. Oculeth helped the Horde out with getting to AU Draenor to recruit the Mag'har.

[Feanoro]

I agree with your percention of the Alliance characters. The Horde have these kind of characters as well. Like Baine and Thrall come to my mind.

In my opinion the portrayal of War in this game has few major issues.

The stakes are too high. Complete genocide/eradication of the opponent, the whole faction with its population is down right retarded. That doesn't happen in other Fantasy universes for a good reason, even in the once like insane as Warhammer Fantasy/the Old World, but also more tame ones like LotR or Game of Thrones. Its also not practical in the World itself and it shouldn't be so easy to project Military power over such vast distances like in WoW.

Another Problem are the Factions themselves.With these major factions, every playable race is dragged in any conflict, even if it shouldn't even be in their interests or important for their geopolitics.

The next problem is, that major characters are killed or used as villains far too quickly.This includes characters outside the two playable factions as well. Like Arthas and his Scourge should still be present in Icecrown, rebuilding their powerbase. Same for Deathwing and his forces. This creates more and interesting balances of power. Not to mention that it can open up epic battles, stories and duels. Who wouldn't have loved another Duel between Illidan and Arthas. Or Arthas facing Kiljaeden and the Legion. Or Archimonde pulverizing an army of the Old Gods, before getting smacked in the face by Deathwing. Characters shouldn't die because some of their war plans fail. This kind of throwing away major characters does not happen in any other fantasy universe i know.

Connected to this is the existence of World ending threats. I despise this kind of story telling, because its pure cancer for the development of the involved characters and factions. Arthas, Deathwing, the Legion and the Old Gods are all misshandled in that way and Blizzard learns nothing from it. Even though Blizzard showed with the Jaina in Battle of Dazar Alor and the Arthas fight in Halls of Reflection, that they can do concepts for Boss fights, where the characters aren't wasted. These cosmic world ending battles on Azeroth itself are the worst. Let those happen in different dimensions, if Blizzard needs these so much.

And my last major point is, that the World of Azeroth should be larger, have more room for war, battle and sieges. This way there could be a proper back and forth between opponents, where both sides win and lose in those wars. Wars and battles for regions, or settlements(like Astranaar, Crossroads, Menethil Harbor etc.) should be more important. But they aren't because the regions and settlements seem way too small for that. Which is very counterproductve for the war setting in this game.

I hope someday Blizzard will have developers and writers and producers who realize such point and use the potential this fantasy world has in that aspect.

Bravo, I agree with everything here. DBZ level writing and constant escalation of threats and power have long since passed the point of absurdity. It's why you see such a disconnect between the "what happened to fighting bandits" group and the "I want to be a demigod" group.