"Catering to 5% of your player base will leave you with 5% of your player base"

[Sorrior]

WTF does that comment have to do with my post you quoted? Seriously, point out where I made any reference to “best gear.”

Honestly, my kids have better reading comprehension….

I've noticed many here mistake decent as well as how things feel to do with best and optimized ways to do things.

[potis]

In earlier iterations of the game, casuals could buy the second best gear in the game with badges or valor points. It took months, at which point the raiders had already had their fun with that gear and gotten bored of it. The important part of that system is that it gave casuals something to work towards over a long period of time, something that didn't feel like scraps but actual quality gear. It didn't matter that the gear was irrelevant when they eventually got it, it was the journey that mattered.

You do realize this has been sped up by miles and you could never buy "Second best gear" but overall a few pieces, unless you min/maxed between PvP and some Valor gear, right, and even then in terms of ilvL, you would still end up exactly as it is now, right, while doing the same irrelevant content that has no reason to be done after the first month of the expansion, right?

Instead of taking 9 months to get the gear, you can get it in 2 months by doing anything, my main gets 252 gear handed to him for existing in the game from a system that isnt even tied to character power, its fucking Pocopoc , add the HC weekly chests and legendaries, i would have a character around 260 without even entering any raid or M+, so drop the bullshit.

What changed with the game is the entitlement of players and these mechanics, you literally have people screaming dear murder that they arent handed Mythic gear the first week, so they can unsub after the first month, you literally have people complaining the game is asking them to play, instead of realizing they are the ones with the problem and they should simply move on with their lives, people have reached such spoilt levels, that instead of accepting they dont want to play the game as much as they think they want, they rather complain to be handed things so they be done so they dont pay 15$.

[Norskygrrl]

I'm very disappointed with whole announcement. No single world about casual and solo players.
Imo Ion again will focus on raiders and make ppl quit fast.

Leaving Ion in charge is so short-sighted. "Dragon riding" is just another way to keep real flying away from players. He is wasting resources on this? Instead of game-play for casual players? He doesn't have a clue about designing an MMO.

[Aydinx2]

But it seems you’re dead set on blasting me over Teir sets, which they’ve only recently brought back, while ignoring every other aspect of my messages. Selective quoting at its best.

Never going to do Normal? First of all, says who? Secondly, have you even read my posts beyond the few sentences you’ve decided to poke holes at? Clearly not.

My entire message was about how rewards from Solo Queue content have been watered down over the years making the content less rewarding for those who play it. Removal of Tier sets from LFR was but one example I mentioned.

Removal of Tier sets is literally the only example you mentioned. You can't gaslight people in a forum where we can read your messages back dude. If you want me to address something else, write something else.

[Glorious Leader]

I think the problem is power progression is all that really interests most players till they cap it if we peel back the curtains.

Look at WoD the expansion I would argue added more features for casual players then any other. World treasures, rare mobs dropping toys,mounts,transmogs and more scattered around the world. Garrison invasions and extremely powerful rewards via apexsis crystals.

The problem is you see the casual as a normal person looking to play a game to relax and hang out with friends.

All hot garbage. WoD offered them nothing and they left. Like do you honestly think people are stupid? The entire game from lvl 1 to max is about grinding more power and then at end game in WoD it suddenly stopped unless you decided to play nice with assholes. It's so easy to shit on other players who more or less want the same thing. I have an idea, no gear, no power progression purely horizontal. I don't think this would be satisfying to anybody. Or better yet. All the time and energy and money they put into raids could be put into other content and the raids could award PURELY cosmetic items.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

They would never announce anything for solo play in an MMORPG's expansion announcement. This was only for major features. Of course there will be a lot more to consider, but I doubt anything as big as the Mage Tower will be since in the opening patch. Luckily that's all evergreen content, so you should have an enormous amount of stuff you can explore at your own pace.
That's kind of why its not a feature of the announcements. Because you have so much stuff that CAN be solo content, it would be pointless to list it all.

[Dakara]

Removal of Tier sets is literally the only example you mentioned. You can't gaslight people in a forum where we can read your messages back dude. If you want me to address something else, write something else.

Try reading back again.

MMO stands for Massively Multiplayer Online (to state the obvious).
It’s does not stand for “Must be in pre-made group and Discord at all times.”

Playing “Solo” could refer to simply doing WQ’s or Queueing solo via a matchmaking system, and everything in between.
Personally, I throughly enjoyed playing both Cata and MOP “Solo” yet still did plenty of group content. It was just mostly via LFD/LFR and the odd PUG. LFD had nice welfare gear for Alts and LFR still had Tier sets. I didn’t care about my Ilvl or how I compared to Top Raiders, I just had fun.

Modern WOW has stripped away that fun over the years as it slowly eroded the rewards from queueable content, including PVP. Naturally, I went back to organised raiding, probably as Blizzard intended, but as is often the case, people quit, guilds collapse and I’m fed up of paying for server/faction transfers to join new guilds, and without the same fallback to Solo as I enjoyed in past expansions I simply quit.

As have many, many others.

Sure, Tier sets are back in LFR now and I missed it while being un-subbed. But “Literally the only example I mentioned”? C’mon.

[WinningOne]

Grinding for higher tiered gear just for the sake of having better gear is dumb. It's a hamster wheel method of game design which caters to stupid people. The fun is in completing challenging encounters and being rewarded with gear as a side effect of solving a very difficult problem. If you strip everything away that's all encounters are. Mathematical equations in which Blizzard tries to get as close to balancing it out while leaving enough room for the players to have a statistically reasonable chance at things ending up in their favor. That means there are going to be encounters which have a margin of error too narrow for some players to overcome. Blizzard should definitely include encounters which are so difficult only the highest skilled players are capable of completing it. If you happen to be one of the majority of players who don't play at that level it doesn't mean Blizzard hates you.

[azshanna]

I wonder why people expect an mmo be focused on solo content! If you don't like playing in group then this genre is not for you mates.
There are 4 different difficulties for raids and 3 different difficulties for dungeons without considering various levels of m+. Any pve player can enjoy the game to some extend.

There are multiple ranked and unranked pvp stuff in game.

There are plenty of open world stuff such as treasure hunting, collecting toys/mounts, main and side quests, reputation farming, achievements, and other stuff. If you enjoy open world content and you dont have so many achievement points (specially loremaster) then you cant whine about lack of open world/solo content.

If you dont enjoy any mentioned activities then this game is not suitable and enjoyable for you and its better to find another one.

[Luck4]

Sub numbers = quality? I don't agree

Sub numbers = fun. If people are having fun they'll not quit, and their enjoyment will draw even more people to the game.

WoW is in the opposite spectrum, "not fun", and the constant unhappy people quitting make new audiences avoid the game.

[Elias1337]

Leaving Ion in charge is so short-sighted. "Dragon riding" is just another way to keep real flying away from players. He is wasting resources on this? Instead of game-play for casual players? He doesn't have a clue about designing an MMO.

Dragonflight is gameplay. Current flying isnt.

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WTF does that comment have to do with my post you quoted? Seriously, point out where I made any reference to “best gear.”

Honestly, my kids have better reading comprehension….

Context of your complains is pretty clear you dont have to say anything. When you say casual content you dont actual mean casual content. What you mean is getting highest possible gear rewards for casuals doing casual content. This is what people mean when they say there ia no casual content. Its pure entiltement nothing els.

[Yriel]

I wonder why people expect an mmo be focused on solo content! If you don't like playing in group then this genre is not for you mates.
There are 4 different difficulties for raids and 3 different difficulties for dungeons without considering various levels of m+. Any pve player can enjoy the game to some extend.

This definition argument is so lame.
Hey this is a RPG! If you don't like to roleplay the genre is not for you mate.
If you want to kill bosses in instances better play Monster Hunter instead.

There are plenty of open world stuff such as treasure hunting, collecting toys/mounts, main and side quests, reputation farming, achievements, and other stuff. If you enjoy open world content and you dont have so many achievement points (specially loremaster) then you cant whine about lack of open world/solo content.

Oh wow what a novel Idea. There are quests in the game? I didn't know that.
Ever thought that people finished all that stuff in the first month of the expansion? Yes maybe not every stupid 5th recolored version of a mount no one uses in the first place but everything people are interested in.

[LordVargK]

This definition argument is so lame.
Hey this is a RPG! If you don't like to roleplay the genre is not for you mate.
If you want to kill bosses in instances better play Monster Hunter instead.


Oh wow what a novel Idea. There are quests in the game? I didn't know that.
Ever thought that people finished all that stuff in the first month of the expansion? Yes maybe not every stupid 5th recolored version of a mount no one uses in the first place but everything people are interested in.

So why exactly are you playing WoW instead of any other single player RPG?

[acinos]

As a solo player, and someone who just came back to the game. Honestly I don't care for the most part what content comes in the new xpacks. There's so much for me to still in now old content. My goal in shadowlands is the same as every xpack before it. Get max level, work on professions on my main and alts, get enough gear to where I'm happy. Honestly just lfr current tier is fine by me. I just want gear for soloing old raids to get the tmogs I want and mounts.

The only content I would be super excited for at this point would be actual player or guild housing, and for them to add a solo dungeon mode. Maybe like solo time walking dungeons for old content. Give me more reasons to do old content. Solo current dungeons could just be cosmetic or lower than normal gear for drops personaly idc. I just want to see the story at my pace. Most of my friends have moved on and those that do play are on sporadically at best. I just want to enjoy the world.

[Qnubi]

The statement itself isn't true, there will be a significant number of people that keep playing because they believe in change for the better and that the Devs will listen to them one day. I would say the majority of people aren't even aware that the game isn't designed for them and just go with it because it's the game they have always played.

[Dakara]

Context of your complains is pretty clear you dont have to say anything. When you say casual content you dont actual mean casual content. What you mean is getting highest possible gear rewards for casuals doing casual content. This is what people mean when they say there ia no casual content. Its pure entiltement nothing els.

Yea, don't tell me "what I meant" just so you can come up with a fictional argument to counter it.

[azshanna]

This definition argument is so lame.
Hey this is a RPG! If you don't like to roleplay the genre is not for you mate.
If you want to kill bosses in instances better play Monster Hunter instead.


Oh wow what a novel Idea. There are quests in the game? I didn't know that.
Ever thought that people finished all that stuff in the first month of the expansion? Yes maybe not every stupid 5th recolored version of a mount no one uses in the first place but everything people are interested in.

This is a mmorpg and if you want to enjoy the rpg part at max potential you need to have friends and a group of people to play with. I enjoy killing bosses on mythic difficulty, casual pvp, doing open world stuff, and also played on rpg realms. If you cant find a rpg group to enjoy the roleplaying with other people its not the designer failure. Maybe you need to start making friends or maybe the community and most of people no longer enjoy the roleplaying.

I know many mount collectors with +600 mounts and they always ride on the same mount so recoloured or freshly designed mounts are quite similar for them. Regarding quests im not talking about new zone quests, my point is about all expansions and ppl could do older quests to see the story of zones/characters. If someone has already done that im pretty sure they invested so much time in it and its an accomplishment for a game when players invest such a long time in it.

Also it is naive and selfish to generalise our preferences and call something stupid or another thing what people are interested in. There are numerous people in this game with a variety of demands and farming a stupid 5th recoloured version of a mount might be fun for many people.

You cant go to an asian restaurant and order a burger! you pick whatever is on the menu and if you dont like it you move to a place you can enjoy your meal.

[Soikona]

Dragonflight is gameplay. Current flying isnt.

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Context of your complains is pretty clear you dont have to say anything. When you say casual content you dont actual mean casual content. What you mean is getting highest possible gear rewards for casuals doing casual content. This is what people mean when they say there ia no casual content. Its pure entiltement nothing els.

I disagree with the flying part. Editing on phone is horrible.

Dragon riding seems more punishing than rewarding. Feel bad for missing, not good for hitting the wind streams.

I love flying, and it is content I love. I like to look around the scenery, with my roflcopter and just enjoying what the art team has made. Not some fan made spyro shit. Those flying levels were horrid.

[Yriel]

So why exactly are you playing WoW instead of any other single player RPG?

I've always played WoW and single player RPGs. You can play more than one game, you know.

This is a mmorpg and if you want to enjoy the rpg part at max potential you need to have friends and a group of people to play with. I enjoy killing bosses on mythic difficulty, casual pvp, doing open world stuff, and also played on rpg realms. If you cant find a rpg group to enjoy the roleplaying with other people its not the designer failure. Maybe you need to start making friends or maybe the community and most of people no longer enjoy the roleplaying.

I thought i made it clear but apparently not. Just because there is a "M" in the acronym doen't automatically mean the game is primarily supposed to be an instanced boss kill game just as the RP doesn't mean you have to roleplay 90% of the time. MMORPGs traditionally describe a whole range of games with all kinds of activities. WoW was quite casual friendly too at times. It's not right now though.

I know many mount collectors with +600 mounts and they always ride on the same mount so recoloured or freshly designed mounts are quite similar for them. Regarding quests im not talking about new zone quests, my point is about all expansions and ppl could do older quests to see the story of zones/characters. If someone has already done that im pretty sure they invested so much time in it and its an accomplishment for a game when players invest such a long time in it.

The people demanding more casual or solo content have done all those things. Thats why they ask for more content. Is that so difficult to grasp?
I only added that recolored line because at this point usually someone says something stupid akin to "Have you really collected every singe pet possible and done every single achievement?" and that was to prevent that.

[Johnjohn]

For me Ion just has to go. I could almost tell you when he took over, that is how much the game changed imo based on this one person. He is the antithesis of what I want out of a game designer.


I would say though my opinion is from my perspective, not for the current health of the game. People like me have been neglected for so long it would be a risk at this point to just change everything.

I look at the average WoW fan now and I can barely relate to them. Catering to the old-school mmo player would alienate all the get gud esports min/maxers, and there is no guarantee us old farts would even come back emasse no matter what they did.