[Megathread] Star Citizen

[Gorsameth]

Sure thing those solutions work for those engines and cases but Star Citizen uses a custom engine so it needs it's own custom solution.

If they have the time and money it makes sense to develop instead of trying to bend whatever exists to their needs.

If you listen to the dev's talk they mention specifically about those needs. Performance, scalability and versatility/ease of use.

Oh so they moved off of a modified Lumberyard into something else now?

No, they didn't?

Then your spouting bullshit, shocking...

[- Zephox -]

I don't think you understand how it works then. UI (or even everything in 3d games) is just FLAT IMAGES. The way you render them is entirely up to you. Makes no difference if you slap it on viewbox or mesh in 3D screen.

From 2:50 (surface does not have to be flat, can be multimesh).




Its ultra mega super cringe when people who have no idea how 3D rendering works try to correct an actual dev who worked with 3D engines and even done rendering CEF onto game itself.

So again, any kind of UI is inherently 2D image. To project it you need a dynamic texture (actually almost any kind of texture work but dynamic has optimization for Swapping RGBA tex).

Then you render that texture somewhere, it doesn't have to be a flat viewbox, it can be object on screen, sphere or you can even render google hompage onto 3d human model.

Such solutions (free) existed since 2014

I kinda don't know why you are wasting your time trying to explain to him how things work.

Being in the industry myself anyone could actually not just embarrass both him and Kenn on a few of their comments both on 3D and other aspects but makes you think whether or not we should do something like bannmebaby did just for the giggles and for people to have as entertainment.

The only real sad thing is that anyone can explain correctly how things work but they will always spin it to fit a narrative.

See Clown specimen 1(Kenn). Does he even know that WoW used for some UI stuff the coherent labs 1.0, before actually requesting their input for Legion on UI elements and implementation on their own unique engine?

Does he even know that GW2 literally everything is coherent labs in terms of UI plus one extra custom implementation requested from their stuff?

[ldev]

No.

B-b-b-b-but... Like, all new AAA games have that. How come?

Will they implement custom AI powered scaling that will exceed DLSS in quality and speed for their custom high tech engine? LMAO.

[Wilian]

Star Citizen NFT's when

I am pretty sure NFT was inspired by Star Citizen

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B-b-b-b-but... Like, all new AAA games have that. How come?

Will they implement custom AI powered scaling that will exceed DLSS in quality and speed for their custom high tech engine? LMAO.

Maybe after they introduce proper toilet splash physics that dynamically works with various poop sizes and pee pressures as they make surface contact. Not sure I can be immersed in this space game without those.

[MrAnderson]

No. No it isn't. Why lie about something so easily searchable?

Are you not aware that they've used Cryengine and heavily modified it into a completely new engine by now that they internally called Star Engine?

https://starcitizen.tools/Star_Engine

They moved to Lumberyeard (that was a fork of Cryengine) to host their servers on AWS but their engine is still using proprietary tech custom made exactly to enable the features needed for their games.

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Oh so they moved off of a modified Lumberyard into something else now?

No, they didn't?

Then your spouting bullshit, shocking...

See above.

And here's a 2 min summary of the UI needs for StarCitizen/Squadron42:



The full video :

[Edge-]

Are you not aware that they've used Cryengine and heavily modified it into a completely new engine by now that they internally called Star Engine?

Yes, so a modified CryEngine, complete with all the limitations CryEngine has that they're still trying to find a way to get around (hence the herculean efforts being put into server meshing). "Custom" implies it was made for the game/them. They got the base tech and tweak from there, just as a ton of developers have done with their licensed engines.

You don't "heavily modify an existing engine into a new one", you have a heavily modified licensed engine. Hence why the legal battle that Crytek started resulted in CIG having a perpetual license to use CryEngine. Because that's still the foundation they're building on.

It says nothing and doesn't detract from the extensive work they're doing to customize the engine to their needs and try to circumvent its limitations (dynamic server meshing to get over the apparent fact that CryEngine does not play well with multiplayer at all, hence the 50 player cap and insanely ambitious dynamic server meshing project).

This is basic game industry stuff.

[kaminaris]

Are you not aware that they've used Cryengine and heavily modified it into a completely new engine by now that they internally called Star Engine?

https://starcitizen.tools/Star_Engine

They moved to Lumberyeard (that was a fork of Cryengine) to host their servers on AWS but their engine is still using proprietary tech custom made exactly to enable the features needed for their games.

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See above.

And here's a 2 min summary of the UI needs for StarCitizen/Squadron42:



The full video :

It doesn't matter what kind of engine game uses. You could even write a brand new 3d engine from scratch without using DX/Vulkan/OpenGL but baremetal and you would STILL be able to integrate any kind of flat image renderer as your UI.

Its not bound to engine but how graphic card works.

The way I do it is to create a dynamic 2D texture with B8G8R8A8 format that has CPU access flags. Then whenever i need update i simply copy CEF buffer into it.

If they really wanted to do something custom, they might as well integrate CEF as renderer.

[kenn9530]

I've posted a screenshot while ago. It's literally scuffed version of chromium inspector without 90% of its features.

Nothing you post proves the tool coherant labs has developed is superior that the tool that CiG have developed, i have seen what both tools have done in games and the coherant lab tools one looks severaly lacking compared to the star citizen tool, just by seeing what games have done with thier tools star citizen is far superior.

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I love how you never disprove anything with evidence of your own. You're asserting the SC toolkit is superior so you should be able to debunk him with your own evidence.

Unless you're just talking bull, which is most likely the case.


By the way, I take ownership of kenn9530 using the word ignorant. He must've never used the word or even know it's meaning still since I called him one.

I have seen what the star citizen toolkit can do and i have seen what the coherant labs tool can do, so far the star citizen one has been proven superior. We have the proof from the execution of both toolkits and star citizen isnt even using its toolkit to its potential yet.

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I kinda don't know why you are wasting your time trying to explain to him how things work.

Being in the industry myself anyone could actually not just embarrass both him and Kenn on a few of their comments both on 3D and other aspects but makes you think whether or not we should do something like bannmebaby did just for the giggles and for people to have as entertainment.

The only real sad thing is that anyone can explain correctly how things work but they will always spin it to fit a narrative.

See Clown specimen 1(Kenn). Does he even know that WoW used for some UI stuff the coherent labs 1.0, before actually requesting their input for Legion on UI elements and implementation on their own unique engine?

Does he even know that GW2 literally everything is coherent labs in terms of UI plus one extra custom implementation requested from their stuff?

You are currently unable to embarass anyone with any knowledge you posses since you are unable to stay away from petty insults because you are simply not able to prove your own point.

[MrAnderson]

Yes, so a modified CryEngine, complete with all the limitations CryEngine has that they're still trying to find a way to get around (hence the herculean efforts being put into server meshing). "Custom" implies it was made for the game/them. They got the base tech and tweak from there, just as a ton of developers have done with their licensed engines.

You don't "heavily modify an existing engine into a new one", you have a heavily modified licensed engine. Hence why the legal battle that Crytek started resulted in CIG having a perpetual license to use CryEngine. Because that's still the foundation they're building on.

It says nothing and doesn't detract from the extensive work they're doing to customize the engine to their needs and try to circumvent its limitations (dynamic server meshing to get over the apparent fact that CryEngine does not play well with multiplayer at all, hence the 50 player cap and insanely ambitious dynamic server meshing project).

This is basic game industry stuff.

Yes a heavily modified game engine can be considered a custom new engine when the modifications are significant enough.

Which they are in StarEngine.

Like many engines came from forks of other engines.

In fact, it's not the first time a fork of Cryengine spawned a new engine. Dunia Engine (FarCry, Assassins Creed) originated from CryEngine.

So, Since Star Citizem is a game of specially large scope, scale and fidelity without loading screens it requires custom solutions to great part of the engine.

As shown here: https://starcitizen.tools/Star_Engine

Whatever engine they would choose it would always have limitations and they would need to custom build their own solutions anyway.

Fortunately they choose one in which the main dev's were up for hire so they got the main developers that built that engine in the first place expanding and working on their baby exclusively for CIG games.

[Edge-]

Yes a heavily modified game engine can be considered a custom new engine when the modifications are significant enough.

*sigh*

I keep forgetting y'all just redefine words and standard industry terminology to suit the needs of whatever you want at the moment.

[kaminaris]

Nothing you post proves the tool coherant labs has developed is superior that the tool that CiG have developed, i have seen what both tools have done in games and the coherant lab tools one looks severaly lacking compared to the star citizen tool, just by seeing what games have done with thier tools star citizen is far superior.

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I have seen what the star citizen toolkit can do and i have seen what the coherant labs tool can do, so far the star citizen one has been proven superior. We have the proof from the execution of both toolkits and star citizen isnt even using its toolkit to its potential yet.

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You are currently unable to embarass anyone with any knowledge you posses since you are unable to stay away from petty insults because you are simply not able to prove your own point.

Anyone who knows how chrome inspector work will tell you that. And anyone who knows CSS will tell you its simply superior to anything else.

star citizen uitoolkit cannot do even 1% of what pure css can.

[kenn9530]

Anyone who knows how chrome inspector work will tell you that. And anyone who knows CSS will tell you its simply superior to anything else.

star citizen uitoolkit cannot do even 1% of what pure css can.

You dont have any idea of what star citizens tool is capable of so all you are doing is showing a clear lack of knowledge on the subject, CiGs tool has been shown to be superior to the coherant labs tool, you are unable to prove which one is superior.

[Calfredd]

you are unable to prove which one is superior.

Shouldn't be talking then because neither can you.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I wish SC had superior music. I've played the game for coming up on 7 years and the only track I can remember is... maybe the Port Olisar intro theme? And that's it.

[Koriani]

I love how you never disprove anything with evidence of your own. You're asserting the SC toolkit is superior so you should be able to debunk him with your own evidence.

Unless you're just talking bull, which is most likely the case.


By the way, I take ownership of kenn9530 using the word ignorant. He must've never used the word or even know it's meaning still since I called him one.

The only 'evidence' Kenn ever has, uses, or feels he needs is the default "They are using it so it must be the best."

He has this defacto belief that if a CiG dev has made a decision then, because they are a dev and its their game, it is apparently the only/best/most logical reason to do it that way - or the CiG dev would know that and would have changed it accordingly. CiG devs are clearly infallible and perfect in their decision making and are so far above the rest of us humans that they would absolutely change their solution/tech if /they/ felt there was a better solution. But since they haven't chosen any other solution - then this must be the best one.

"Why is this better?" - "Because CiG are using it so it must be so." Perfect proof! What more justification could anyone need - right?

[- Zephox -]

I wish SC had superior music. I've played the game for coming up on 7 years and the only track I can remember is... maybe the Port Olisar intro theme? And that's it.

Love you and your posts in terms of gaming even if I don't always agree but I will try to imitate a user here so please take it as a comedy not face value.

Star Citizen has chosen this music because it's the correct music done for the game and nobody has done this ever before and it's far superior than any other game existing from a point of production value.

You have no clue what you are talking about and it's only up to you to prove that the music is forgettable as I know it's superior superior superiority superior emperor super super superiority than anything out there and you just can't say the opposite unless you have proven facts. As well everything has been custom created behind the scenes with superior people working on it that transcend industry knowledge and are second coming and I know best because I know. Simple as.

Prove me wrong because if you don't you are simply just trolling and adding goal posts!!

Let me know if I got a perfect score.

On a more serious note, fair play I sat down and heard some of the soundtrack while working. Expected more for a game that apparently is released (or not released and still in alpha , or released but alpha so expectations should be measured etc etc ,depending when any of the 2 posters have the Jekyll and Hyde different personalities and opinions changing to fit narratives) and has millions and millions in backing crowdfunders . Not great not bad either. A solid 6/10.

In before I get blamed again yada yada, game not released yet even if pages before I said the opposite by any of the two posters and the usual story..

[banmebaby]

CiGs tool has been shown to be superior to the coherant labs tool, you are unable to prove which one is superior.

Roflmao!

you are unable to stay away from petty insults because you are simply not able to prove your own point.

My dude… half of your posts just consist on accusing people of being ignorant, the other half it’s just you contradicting yourself, so what are you on about?

[Kyanion]

Star Citizen has chosen this music because it's the correct music done for the game and nobody has done this ever before and it's far superior than any other game existing from a point of production value.

It is not often I get a smirk on my face and actually almost laugh out loud when reading something, but well done.

[- Zephox -]

It is not often I get a smirk on my face and actually almost laugh out loud when reading something, but well done.

I hope you read the full post to get context :P. Glad I put a smile on your face

[Ausr]

Nothing you post proves the tool coherant labs has developed is superior that the tool that CiG have developed, i have seen what both tools have done in games and the coherant lab tools one looks severaly lacking compared to the star citizen tool, just by seeing what games have done with thier tools star citizen is far superior.

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I have seen what the star citizen toolkit can do and i have seen what the coherant labs tool can do, so far the star citizen one has been proven superior. We have the proof from the execution of both toolkits and star citizen isnt even using its toolkit to its potential yet.

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You are currently unable to embarass anyone with any knowledge you posses since you are unable to stay away from petty insults because you are simply not able to prove your own point.

So that's a no. You can't actually provide proof on how it's superior at all and you're talking out of your ass. All you have is your feelings.