Blizzard are not stupid, they are malicious.

[VladlTutushkin]

Or at least more malicious than stupid.

Lately thanks to some forum posters (local and official) i noticed some rather… “interesting” plot developments.

Since i no longer play myself, i have to rely on youtube and forums for lore info, and forsaken fans (Benedikt from US forums and others) were actually optimistic about Lordaeron plot. Calia’s involvement was toned down and played in such a way that she appeared to be one begging for acceptance while basically being schooled by “older” forsaken, distrusted and having to prove her worth every step of the way.

Far better outcome then “hail the queen” scenario.

Forsaken aslo had their “dark” themes reaffirmed, and given “writers assurance” that those will remain intact and not be discarded even though Sylvanas is gone.

And those all are good, on point changes to the plot, made with understanding of the playerbase needs and etc. So Blizz has listened to the forsaken fans “collective unconscious” on forums, read the room, made the plot that moved around every rough edge and produced a compelling scenario that both reinforced race’s core aspects while adding new angle without altering the Forsaken as a whole.

So they are ABLE to do so. They HAVE what it takes to listen, adjust and write smart.

…

Meanwhile Night elves are force fed “vengeance is bad, forgiffness goot” bullshit, their souls are mulched into a seed… that Tyrande will take to Dragon Isles and gods forbid her plant it there! Or sacrifice it “for greater good”.

None of their racial problems were addressed, from impotent military, to horrible “resisting evil is wrong” angle, and “victims shouldnt seek justice”…

Essentially Blizz just doubled down on all the WRONG choices they made in BfA and SL, did not listen to players AT ALL and kept forcing this slop down our throat.

As a cherry on too worgen and Alliance apparently couldnt retake Gilneas and forsaken will “maybe” give it back. One day. Perhaps. If their new Desolate Council is willing. Fucken incredible.

And thats the same team of writers.

By now we can FINALLY conclude that their mistakes come from MALICE not INEPTITUDE. They can write a good story even with bad “premise” and set the stage so even worst “actors” come in naturally and not cause havoc on the plot. But they DONT WANT TO when it comes to Alliance.

[ethriel]

Blizzard hates Night Elves, it's very obvious at this point.
This ongoing horrible and disrespectful treatment despite all the feedback is not in error, it's because they hate that race and don't want to give them any positive development ever

[MikeBogina]

Blizzard hates Night Elves, it's very obvious at this point.
This ongoing horrible and disrespectful treatment despite all the feedback is not in error, it's because they hate that race and don't want to give them any positive development ever

They hate Night Elves, but love Tyrande. It's bothered me for a very long time that night elves as a whole are really just the background race Tyrande, Malfurion and Illidan belong to, then came BFA and the whole lot of them are sacrificed while Tyrande takes care of her lover, but dont you worry dead night elves, you just added some character development to the Night Elf Queen...

A lot of other races have it bad like this too, almost all of the horde races have no identity beyond their racial leader, but the Night Elves have it almost the worst. Because this isn't the first time that Night Elves were sacrificed in the story for Tyrande, she went a butchered all of illidan's Jailers because she can.

[Gaidax]

Drink some water, m8.

You can totally turn the tables on the whole thing in similar fashion.

The dark and edgy Forsaken get an outsider goodie-two-shoes figurehead who is not even "proper" undead let alone "forsaken", being cuddled by everyone. And suddenly everyone there accepted her in a blink of an eye without batting an eyelash and as one of their leaders at that, despite her accursed brother murdering and enslaving them all. And thus all this going completely against what Forsaken were for decades.

Meanwhile Night Elves get a nice wrap up for the whole vengeance ark and get to get back to their roots with a tree and all, as they were for many decades. How nice.


There is no "malice" here, you just don't like this turn of events on one side and like it on the other. It's your subjective feelings on the matter. What you gonna do.

If anything, I, personally think Night Elves got a good and proper wrap-up that allows them to go back to their old cool selves, instead of this whole REEE drama victim RP.

- - - Updated - - -

And that too are my subjective feelings on the matter.

[Chadow]

Vengeance IS bad and is a really good opinion to pass on to future generations.

I personaly was put in hell IRL for 5 years because of "revenge" and i learned my lesson the hard way.

I still struggle today with that little demon inside me telling to go have revenge (aka self righteous justice)...and is a bullshit demon to fight.

REVENGE = BAD

[Every Pwny]

They hate Night Elves, but love Tyrande.

Yeah, they obviously hate the night elves, but I wouldn't say they love Tyrande as a character, they just love using her as a stand in for any kind of night elf story, while entirely ignoring the night elves in general. Just look at the night warrior arc, she literally did nothing, even in 8.1 when she got the power she needed Malfurion's help to fight Nathanos. They love using her and making her look stupid, but I wouldn't say they love Tyrande.

[LordVargK]

Vengeance IS bad and is a really good opinion to pass on to future generations.

I personaly was put in hell IRL for 5 years because of "revenge" and i learned my lesson the hard way.

I still struggle today with that little demon inside me telling to go have revenge (aka self righteous justice)...and is a bullshit demon to fight.

REVENGE = BAD

Are you roleplaying Uther?

[voidox]

Calia’s involvement was toned down and played in such a way that she appeared to be one begging for acceptance while basically being schooled by “older” forsaken, distrusted and having to prove her worth every step of the way.

she only got schooled by Belmont, everyone else just basically accepted her for no reason at all

and what proving did she even do? sure she was able to get a blight sample using her light powers, but is she the only character who has ever risked their life for their faction? also that's basically all the work she did, after that she just suggested going to Maldraxxus for help.

so was that seriously all she needed to go from not a Forsaken/untrusted -> leading on the Desolate Council? that was somehow her proving she's a Forsaken?

Forsaken aslo had their “dark” themes reaffirmed, and given “writers assurance” that those will remain intact and not be discarded even though Sylvanas is gone.

I mean, it could easily still turn into a situation where the desolate council basically all treat Calia as the main leader (cause she's Danusers new pet character he's forcing so hard) and the Forsaken get whitewashed and changed due to her influence of being a light bulb

So Blizz has listened to the forsaken fans “collective unconscious” on forums, read the room, made the plot that moved around every rough edge and produced a compelling scenario that both reinforced race’s core aspects while adding new angle without altering the Forsaken as a whole.

I mean, did they listen? sure they had Belmont put a voice to one or two of the issues people have with Danuser's new pet character, but then the story just ignores that and makes Calia part of the Desolate Council anyways.

heck, this is probably worse cause this feels like Blizzard saying "ya we hear some of your issues with Calia, but fck that we're making her a leader anyways" :/

so no, the Forsaken quest line was not great even if it was better than the dreaded "Calia solo leader" scenario.

For some reason, a character that is the complete 180 of the Forsaken in every way and has zero knowledge/experience in leadership/undeath/Forsaken/Horde is one of the leaders, just cause she has a surname - Blizzard writing in action once again ladies and gents

so ya, personally both the night elves and the forsaken got shit in this patch, though I'd say the night elves got it worse cause of the usual BS of "justice is vengeance" and how Blizzard made the souls have to be sacrificed for the seed... like wtf?

[Xilurm]

Vengeance IS bad and is a really good opinion to pass on to future generations.

I personaly was put in hell IRL for 5 years because of "revenge" and i learned my lesson the hard way.

I still struggle today with that little demon inside me telling to go have revenge (aka self righteous justice)...and is a bullshit demon to fight.

REVENGE = BAD

Yeah but,Warcraft isn't real life though.

[Addiena]

Yeah but,Warcraft isn't real life though.

Does the lesson change due to it being fiction ?>

No, revenge regardless is wrong.

[Every Pwny]

Yeah but,Warcraft isn't real life though.

In real life people get punished for genocide, genocide is celebrated in wow.

[HansOlo]

Does the lesson change due to it being fiction ?>

No, revenge regardless is wrong.

If you create a game what is ethically correct, then you wouldn't have WoW.

So - yes. Drama is necessarily in a fictional world.

- - - Updated - - -

In real life people get punished for genocide, genocide is celebrated in wow.

Well it depends on who you ask. In fact - I enjoyed the story arc and the provocation it had on the fanbase.

[Enter Name Here]

[...]
a seed… that Tyrande will take to Dragon Isles and gods forbid her plant it there!
[...]

i don't believe it will be planted on the dragon isles. during the quest an npc, i dont remember who, said they know a place and it's been far too long. so maybe a place where a world tree stood once before?

i assume we will bring the seed to the dragon isles to get some aspect-ish blessings from the dragonflights or get a super fertile pot of soil

[VladlTutushkin]

Drink some water, m8.

You can totally turn the tables on the whole thing in similar fashion.

The dark and edgy Forsaken get an outsider goodie-two-shoes figurehead who is not even "proper" undead let alone "forsaken", being cuddled by everyone. And suddenly everyone there accepted her in a blink of an eye without batting an eyelash and as one of their leaders at that, despite her accursed brother murdering and enslaving them all. And thus all this going completely against what Forsaken were for decades.

Meanwhile Night Elves get a nice wrap up for the whole vengeance ark and get to get back to their roots with a tree and all, as they were for many decades. How nice.


There is no "malice" here, you just don't like this turn of events on one side and like it on the other. It's your subjective feelings on the matter. What you gonna do.

If anything, I, personally think Night Elves got a good and proper wrap-up that allows them to go back to their old cool selves, instead of this whole REEE drama victim RP.

- - - Updated - - -

And that too are my subjective feelings on the matter.

No, its factually wrong. And i am not even going to settle for “opinions”, you just plain wrong on this one.

Forsaken were VERY distrustful of Calia, and even when she went to Maldraxxus and got her “you are also an undead” badge she was only VERY begrudgingly given a seat at the table of 4, where 2 dont trust her AT ALL and one just dosent care.

She was reduced from a possible “queen” to a 1/4 th of a Desolate Council who has no trust and has to adapt to others, instead of adapting them. So she has almost no effect on forsaken culture and politics. She just there to “provide moral support” to all kinds of undead nelfs and etc, the shit Blizz dredged all over BfA.

And night elfs got zero wrap up. Tree was never an issue. Ever. Being perpetual losers, helpless victims and retards was the issue. This was not addressed. Helpless morons just got (maybe) a new treehouse. Its not progress its degradation, not even stagnation.

Them winning a fight in Ashenvale and plot about securing their land from Horde’s advances that what was needed, not another damn tree.

- - - Updated - - -

Vengeance IS bad and is a really good opinion to pass on to future generations.

I personaly was put in hell IRL for 5 years because of "revenge" and i learned my lesson the hard way.

I still struggle today with that little demon inside me telling to go have revenge (aka self righteous justice)...and is a bullshit demon to fight.

REVENGE = BAD

On a personal level. Nations cant afford being “bigger men”, especially when they are in mortal danger.

[Gaidax]

No, its factually wrong. And i am not even going to settle for “opinions”, you just plain wrong on this one.

Forsaken were VERY distrustful of Calia, and even when she went to Maldraxxus and got her “you are also an undead” badge she was only VERY begrudgingly given a seat at the table of 4, where 2 dont trust her AT ALL and one just dosent care.

She was reduced from a possible “queen” to a 1/4 th of a Desolate Council who has no trust and has to adapt to others, instead of adapting them. So she has almost no effect on forsaken culture and politics. She just there to “provide moral support” to all kinds of undead nelfs and etc, the shit Blizz dredged all over BfA.

Bruh... They literally gave her keys to the kingdom for no reason at all. It does not matter if it's 1/4 or not. "Deeply distrustful" - "Gets a ruling position in the very shortlist Forsaken council", pick one.

She interacted with Forsaken like whole bloody 3 times before that, omegalul and her chief achievement is being ganked by Sylv personally.

That's like juicy meme here.

- - - Updated - - -

And for the record - I don't mind Calia one bit. I think she's a good addition to Forsaken to maybe put them on the less edgelord and more nation building path.

But it's hilarious to think that this outsider that practically did little to nothing for Forsaken is suddenly given such honors. If we'd go the actual proper way to do it - she'd get the spot an expansion down the road the least after she'd prove herself an asset to the people. A journey not unlike one Anduin went through for many years.

[VladlTutushkin]

Bruh... They literally gave her keys to the kingdom for no reason at all. It does not matter if it's 1/4 or not. "Deeply distrustful" - "Gets a ruling position in the very shortlist Forsaken council", pick one.

She interacted with Forsaken like whole bloody 3 times before that, omegalul and her chief achievement is being ganked by Sylv personally.

That's like juicy meme here.

- - - Updated - - -

And for the record - I don't mind Calia one bit. I think she's a good addition to Forsaken to maybe put them on the less edgelord and more nation building path.

But it's hilarious to think that this outsider that practically did little to nothing for Forsaken is suddenly given such honors. If we'd go the actual proper way to do it - she'd get the spot an expansion down the road the least after she'd prove herself an asset to the people. A journey not unlike one Anduin went through for many years.

Anduin is hardly an “asset” to Alliance. More like a sanctimonious tumour. Also a dead weight. And a claptrap.

[Dancaris]

Or at least more malicious than stupid.

Lately thanks to some forum posters (local and official) i noticed some rather… “interesting” plot developments.

Since i no longer play myself, i have to rely on youtube and forums for lore info, and forsaken fans (Benedikt from US forums and others) were actually optimistic about Lordaeron plot. Calia’s involvement was toned down and played in such a way that she appeared to be one begging for acceptance while basically being schooled by “older” forsaken, distrusted and having to prove her worth every step of the way.

Far better outcome then “hail the queen” scenario.

Forsaken aslo had their “dark” themes reaffirmed, and given “writers assurance” that those will remain intact and not be discarded even though Sylvanas is gone.

And those all are good, on point changes to the plot, made with understanding of the playerbase needs and etc. So Blizz has listened to the forsaken fans “collective unconscious” on forums, read the room, made the plot that moved around every rough edge and produced a compelling scenario that both reinforced race’s core aspects while adding new angle without altering the Forsaken as a whole.

So they are ABLE to do so. They HAVE what it takes to listen, adjust and write smart.

…

Meanwhile Night elves are force fed “vengeance is bad, forgiffness goot” bullshit, their souls are mulched into a seed… that Tyrande will take to Dragon Isles and gods forbid her plant it there! Or sacrifice it “for greater good”.

None of their racial problems were addressed, from impotent military, to horrible “resisting evil is wrong” angle, and “victims shouldnt seek justice”…

Essentially Blizz just doubled down on all the WRONG choices they made in BfA and SL, did not listen to players AT ALL and kept forcing this slop down our throat.

As a cherry on too worgen and Alliance apparently couldnt retake Gilneas and forsaken will “maybe” give it back. One day. Perhaps. If their new Desolate Council is willing. Fucken incredible.

And thats the same team of writers.

By now we can FINALLY conclude that their mistakes come from MALICE not INEPTITUDE. They can write a good story even with bad “premise” and set the stage so even worst “actors” come in naturally and not cause havoc on the plot. But they DONT WANT TO when it comes to Alliance.

And here we go again.
NE story not ended, you have damn seed of world tree, that far more powerful than Hijal one, you have most of souls back, you have all your leaders alive and kicking. Fucking demigods.
And what have Forsaken? Belmont, Velonara and new apotecary leader is fucking nobody with no power at them. Voss is another rogue without anything. No power, no place, nothing special. And Alliance pupet Calia and hero of kul-tiras Derek. Suprise - no real power with them. No abilites, no allies. Just another dead bodies. Can you see that some of them win Malfurion or Tyrande? Or Maiev? Or pack of wild gods in their lands?
They have 1 thing - and it is Plague. And that it.

[hulkgor]

The absurdity of the topics and discussions on mmo-c is really getting extreme, 'uh?

[VladlTutushkin]

And here we go again.
NE story not ended, you have damn seed of world tree, that far more powerful than Hijal one, you have most of souls back, you have all your leaders alive and kicking. Fucking demigods.
And what have Forsaken? Belmont, Velonara and new apotecary leader is fucking nobody with no power at them. Voss is another rogue without anything. No power, no place, nothing special. And Alliance pupet Calia and hero of kul-tiras Derek. Suprise - no real power with them. No abilites, no allies. Just another dead bodies. Can you see that some of them win Malfurion or Tyrande? Or Maiev? Or pack of wild gods in their lands?
They have 1 thing - and it is Plague. And that it.

“OP heroes” who constantly being jobbed to the point where people laugh at them merely being present in the scene.

And… Wild gods specifically didnt helped night elves. They turned away from them for whole Fourth War.

Night elves only have anything remotely worthwhile on paper, in reality they are the weakest race on Azeroth.

- - - Updated - - -

The absurdity of the topics and discussions on mmo-c is really getting extreme, 'uh?

I am waiting for arguments that will disprove it then.

It should be so easy, after all.

The logic i used to make this post is as straight forward as 2 + 2 = 4. If same team can make good plot with difficult “plot points” smoothed and avoided perfectly, but refuses to do so for other faction… Facts speak for themselves.

[s_bushido]

their souls are mulched into a seed

You realize that Night Elf souls being connected with their forests has been a thing since...like...forever, right? What do you think wisps are? It makes sense that they'd regain that connection after Teldrassil was lost by helping grow a new world tree. Instead of just hanging out in Ardenweald to let their kin fend for themselves.

impotent military

They and the Gilneans drove the Forsaken from elven lands when the Alliance largely abandoned them to pursue its own ends during BfA...



But it's cute that you think the writers are beholden to the whims of people such as yourself who clearly never bothered to pay attention to the story in the first place.