Texas Elementary School Shooting, as many as 22 dead, including Children

[Mihalik]

They've clarified in later posts (particular the one just a few posts up); as long as it's relevant to Uvalde and talking about that and related shootings, specifically, it's not crossing the line. It's trying to derail the discussion AWAY from those shootings into technical definitions and other such bad-faith wharrgarble that should stay relegated to the Gun Control Megathread.

My personal interpretation of their position as posted because, again, as the forum title says, I don't work here any more and haven't in years and have precisely no backdoor knowledge or anything.

Here's the thing. The derailing and getting into the weeds of the technicalities by talking about that one dude in Bumfucktown, Flyoverstate who defended his home from a drugged out meth head or whether a self loading semi automatic high capacity military style rifle is an assault rifle or not is ammosexual derailment tactics 101.

If the mods ACTUALLY WANTED TO COME DOWN ON THAT it would be very very easy to do so. I know we aren't supposed to discuss moderation, but honestly what we are seeing here on a constant loop, is a pro gun voice making some misleading or intentionally baity comment on "nuh uh achtually 'tis not an assault rifle" (everyone fucking knows what the fuck we are all talking about when the words assault rifle are used) then mods rain down the infractions on the dozen idiots like me who keep biting the bait out of sheer fucking emotional exhaustion.

We've been having these same retarded asinine circle jerk arguments for going on 30 years now while more and more people and now small children are being butchered.

"But don't correct the record! That's derailing."

Ok.

- - - Updated - - -

Some progress on Capitol Hill in response to Uvalde:


https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/12/u...fety-deal.html

Details will matter for if this gets passed. It will take a couple of weeks to even draft the policies agreed upon by the bipartisan group. McConnell supportive. Republicans signed onto it include retiring senators and none are up for election this November.

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/15...079171/photo/1

It could get enough support to break a filibuster.

It's a shit plan. It doesn't address fuckall. Is it going to prevent a couple of school shootings? Sure. It will. Will it put a significant dent in gun violence and the ever increasing number of racists, gangbangers, angry ammosexuals going on rampages? No, it fucking won't.

It's the only reason Repugnanicants even signed up for this. It's window dressing. It has more loopholes and caveats than the Sahara has grains of sand.

You know what would actually make a fucking difference?

1. Limiting all magazines on weapons above pistol calibers to 10. Restrict magazine sizes on pistol caliber submachine guns and PDWs to 10. Pistol, actual pistols to 20. No extended magazine bullshit.
2. Ban under harsh penalty the conversion of pistols or rifles into carbines. Ban any conversions like bump stocks and all that other horseshit.
3. The US government, including state governments should no longer purchase firearms or firearm accessories from companies that also sell firearms to the civilian market. If you want that juicy government contract. Well, you're a government contractor now.
4. National gun registry and universal federal background checks. No state opt outs and no exemptions. A complete prohibition of carrying or owning unregistered firearms with actual jail time penalties.

Also, just because I'm a petty shit. All and I mean all civilian owned firearms that aren't some type of special collectible museum piece should be mandatory painted Hello Kitty pink at all times as a requirement for owning them. Bright fucking pink.

They should also really look into the whole tacticool gear bullshit, suppressors, body armor, sights, optics etc. Just to cut off the balls of all the cosplay Delta force loons and the shitheads like the Buffalo shooter how just shrugged off getting his ass shot by a security guard.

[Vankrys]

You all were repeatedly asked to take Gun Control focused discussion -bans, debates about types/models, etc to the appropriate thread. Continuing to derail a thread about slaughtered children is far from appropriate. If you're unable to stay civil or handle reading comments in this thread, then return when you can post within the guidelines and what was asked of you.

Whether you intended or not, you are repeating republicans talking point.
How dare you talk about gun control when 20 kids are dead, now is not the time, we should be mourning and praying
How dare you politicize the death of those kids, this is "far from appropriate".

People will talk about guns because some people do understand the correlation between guns and gun death. Somehow.

[gondrin]

There's a flea market down the road from me where I can go pick up a high quality compound bow, give em cash, and walk out.

This place also sells guns by the truckload. Not even an exaggeration. Literal Uhauls full of guns in their boxings. You want one? Flash the cash out and you can have it.

Funniest part is that these 2A nutters infamously don't even report these sales on their taxes since it's all in cash. Either that or they dramatically understate what they sold.

"BUT VEHICLES" We've regulated vehicles to hell and back and it requires at least a license and in many states a proper training course.

"BUT 9/11 USED AIRPLANES, BAN AIRPLANES" People seem to forget pre and post 2001 air travel is VASTLY different. PATRIOT Act + TSA plus about a hundred other smaller things that the US did in reaction to 9/11

If we're talking about school safety, of course nobody needs an "assault rifle". But I realize that term is different depending upon who you talk to, but a long barreled gun, usually rifles, with self-reloading capability with the potential for high capacity magazines. Most school shooters stop once they run out of ammo, and as an active assault they can only carry so much extra on their person. We could regulate any number of things that would make children safer. But time and again, 2A nutters prove that they don't care about children. Or at least, their care for children ends when their concern for gun sales begins. But that's being generous. Most of the time people on that side of the political spectrum want to use women as breeding sows, claiming "protecting the babies" but once that baby is out of the womb it gets to live in a world where capitalism means it will never be truly successful and has a high chance to live in poverty, on top of all the other ways in which conservatives give ZERO FUCKS about children out of the womb.

If anyone wants a good laugh go watch how upset people got over 9/11 but then go to the airport and get upset at all of the things they did to prevent another 9/11. You can find all the video evidence you want on YouTube. People literally complained about long lines and searches because it may have made them get to the airport earlier then they liked.

Do not get me wrong here. Unreasonable searches are never a good thing. However, flying is a privilege and you agreed to your luggage, carry-ons and person to being searched by airport security when you bought that plane ticket if you choose to use said plane ticket.

People can get all upset over a tragedy but if said tragedy didn't directly affect them personally(as in someone died that they knew), they cannot be inconvenienced. That is how conservatives think. Only about themselves and no other.

That is the same with this(and every other school shooting). Since it didn't affect them directly, they cannot be inconvenienced even a small bit.

[Gabriel]

Here's the thing. The derailing and getting into the weeds of the technicalities by talking about that one dude in Bumfucktown, Flyoverstate who defended his home from a drugged out meth head or whether a self loading semi automatic high capacity military style rifle is an assault rifle or not is ammosexual derailment tactics 101.

If the mods ACTUALLY WANTED TO COME DOWN ON THAT it would be very very easy to do so. I know we aren't supposed to discuss moderation, but honestly what we are seeing here on a constant loop, is a pro gun voice making some misleading or intentionally baity comment on "nuh uh achtually 'tis not an assault rifle" (everyone fucking knows what the fuck we are all talking about when the words assault rifle are used) then mods rain down the infractions on the dozen idiots like me who keep biting the bait out of sheer fucking emotional exhaustion.

We've been having these same retarded asinine circle jerk arguments for going on 30 years now while more and more people and now small children are being butchered.

"But don't correct the record! That's derailing."

Ok.

- - - Updated - - -



It's a shit plan. It doesn't address fuckall. Is it going to prevent a couple of school shootings? Sure. It will. Will it put a significant dent in gun violence and the ever increasing number of racists, gangbangers, angry ammosexuals going on rampages? No, it fucking won't.

It's the only reason Repugnanicants even signed up for this. It's window dressing. It has more loopholes and caveats than the Sahara has grains of sand.

You know what would actually make a fucking difference?

1. Limiting all magazines on weapons above pistol calibers to 10. Restrict magazine sizes on pistol caliber submachine guns and PDWs to 10. Pistol, actual pistols to 20. No extended magazine bullshit.
2. Ban under harsh penalty the conversion of pistols or rifles into carbines. Ban any conversions like bump stocks and all that other horseshit.
3. The US government, including state governments should no longer purchase firearms or firearm accessories from companies that also sell firearms to the civilian market. If you want that juicy government contract. Well, you're a government contractor now.
4. National gun registry and universal federal background checks. No state opt outs and no exemptions. A complete prohibition of carrying or owning unregistered firearms with actual jail time penalties.

Also, just because I'm a petty shit. All and I mean all civilian owned firearms that aren't some type of special collectible museum piece should be mandatory painted Hello Kitty pink at all times as a requirement for owning them. Bright fucking pink.

They should also really look into the whole tacticool gear bullshit, suppressors, body armor, sights, optics etc. Just to cut off the balls of all the cosplay Delta force loons and the shitheads like the Buffalo shooter how just shrugged off getting his ass shot by a security guard.

I've never understood the fascination of wanting guns to be painted in bright colors or banning suppressors. You have to be an actual idiot if you don't notice a gun without it being neon pink, and suppressors are not magic that makes the user some Splinter Cell Operator. At best they make it so you don't go def without ear protection, and make the gun cumbersome as fuck. If you want to ban or regulate something, ban and regulate compensators.

[Mihalik]

I've never understood the fascination of wanting guns to be painted in bright colors or banning suppressors. You have to be an actual idiot if you don't notice a gun without it being neon pink, and suppressors are not magic that makes the user some Splinter Cell Operator. At best they make it so you don't go def without ear protection, and make the gun cumbersome as fuck. If you want to ban or regulate something, ban and regulate compensators.

For every bright colored gun out there there are 999999 black desert/tacticool morons. It's not about noticing the gun. It's about emasculating those subhuman fucktards who compensate for their tiny dicks that won't get hard with an AR. The same thing about suppressors. Fuck you, wear those giant fugly looking ear protections if you wanna shoot a gun or go deaf.

We need to neuter the "gun culture" in the US, or this issue will never be fixed.

[Linkedblade]

1. Limiting all magazines on weapons above pistol calibers to 10. Restrict magazine sizes on pistol caliber submachine guns and PDWs to 10. Pistol, actual pistols to 20. No extended magazine bullshit.
2. Ban under harsh penalty the conversion of pistols or rifles into carbines. Ban any conversions like bump stocks and all that other horseshit.
3. The US government, including state governments should no longer purchase firearms or firearm accessories from companies that also sell firearms to the civilian market. If you want that juicy government contract. Well, you're a government contractor now.
4. National gun registry and universal federal background checks. No state opt outs and no exemptions. A complete prohibition of carrying or owning unregistered firearms with actual jail time penalties.

Can't go into specifics here, but here's why the above highlights complete ignorance:

1. Caliber is only the maximum width of a bullet, not the length. I.e. cartridges like 5.56x45 and 7.62x39 are smaller caliber than 9x19. It's also been shown times innumerable that magazine capacity does nothing to hinder the amount of time to shoot the same amount of ammo. Pistol caliber SMGs: lolwat, smg's are illegal nationwide. Such things require tax stamps and a host of other things.

2. There's no meaningful difference between carbine and rifle. Bumpstocks aren't conversions.

3. Don't see how that would change anything. Create a separate company and contract out the designs.

4. We have universal background checks. A national gun registry violates the fourth amendment, also shown to always be used to attack law abiding citizens after implemented.

[Gabriel]

For every bright colored gun out there there are 999999 black desert/tacticool morons. It's not about noticing the gun. It's about emasculating those subhuman fucktards who compensate for their tiny dicks that won't get hard with an AR. The same thing about suppressors. Fuck you, wear those giant fugly looking ear protections if you wanna shoot a gun or go deaf.

We need to neuter the "gun culture" in the US, or this issue will never be fixed.

Wearing hearing protection all the time when hunting sure is great.

[Linkedblade]

For every bright colored gun out there there are 999999 black desert/tacticool morons. It's not about noticing the gun. It's about emasculating those subhuman fucktards who compensate for their tiny dicks that won't get hard with an AR. The same thing about suppressors. Fuck you, wear those giant fugly looking ear protections if you wanna shoot a gun or go deaf.

We need to neuter the "gun culture" in the US, or this issue will never be fixed.

You still have to use earing protection with suppressors.

We need to educate people on firearms, that way they know what they are and how to be responsible.

[Gabriel]

You still have to use earing protection with suppressors.

We need to educate people on firearms, that way they know what they are and how to be responsible.

That is not the fucking issue in the US...

[Breccia]

You still have to use earing protection with suppressors.

We need to educate people on firearms, that way they know what they are and how to be responsible.

Since no suppressors were used in the Uvadle mass shooting:

You all were repeatedly asked to take Gun Control focused discussion -bans, debates about types/models, etc to the appropriate thread. Continuing to derail a thread about slaughtered children is far from appropriate. If you're unable to stay civil or handle reading comments in this thread, then return when you can post within the guidelines and what was asked of you.

[Endus]

You still have to use earing protection with suppressors.

We need to educate people on firearms, that way they know what they are and how to be responsible.

1> You're intentionally derailing the thread, to deflect away from the over a dozen murdered children, by going on about technical irrelevancies.

2> Education is absolutely irrelevant and literally impossible to enforce so long as the 2nd Amendment exists. It's a discussion for means by which to allow ownership and licensing, after said ownership is no longer a legal right in the first place and only a privilege which must be earned. So even here, you're admitting that the 2nd Amendment needs to be revoked, and gun ownership needs to be criminalized, with specific exceptions allowed under circumstances that we can discuss after the impending threat is dealt with.

Because the alternative is continuing to sacrifice this bi-weekly blood price to sate the Gun Gods. Uvalde's just the most recent payment. Because that is the topic for discussion, here, not trying to get people to quibble over entirely irrelevant minutiae.

[Milchshake]

Wearing hearing protection all the time when hunting sure is great.

Might be on to something ... the majority of hunting fatalities start with "Well I heard sumthing russlin in da bushes!"

[Linkedblade]

That is not the fucking issue in the US...

Neither are suppressors, but they were mentioned.

- - - Updated - - -

Since no suppressors were used in the Uvadle mass shooting:

Then report the person that mentioned them.

- - - Updated - - -

1> You're intentionally derailing the thread, to deflect away from the over a dozen murdered children, by going on about technical irrelevancies.

2> Education is absolutely irrelevant and literally impossible to enforce so long as the 2nd Amendment exists. It's a discussion for means by which to allow ownership and licensing, after said ownership is no longer a legal right in the first place and only a privilege which must be earned. So even here, you're admitting that the 2nd Amendment needs to be revoked, and gun ownership needs to be criminalized, with specific exceptions allowed under circumstances that we can discuss after the impending threat is dealt with.

Because the alternative is continuing to sacrifice this bi-weekly blood price to sate the Gun Gods. Uvalde's just the most recent payment. Because that is the topic for discussion, here, not trying to get people to quibble over entirely irrelevant minutiae.

I don't even understand how this thread remains open. All you have done is ad hom and nation bash and yet you aren't banned and the thread isn't closed.

[tehdang]

It's a shit plan. It doesn't address fuckall. Is it going to prevent a couple of school shootings? Sure. It will. Will it put a significant dent in gun violence and the ever increasing number of racists, gangbangers, angry ammosexuals going on rampages? No, it fucking won't.

Typical all-or-nothing approach to an evenly divided Senate and narrow majority in House. Bonus for actually calling a plan "shit" that you admit "is going to prevent a couple of school shootings."

It's the only reason Repugnanicants even signed up for this. It's window dressing. It has more loopholes and caveats than the Sahara has grains of sand.

You know what would actually make a fucking difference?

1. Limiting all magazines on weapons above pistol calibers to 10. Restrict magazine sizes on pistol caliber submachine guns and PDWs to 10. Pistol, actual pistols to 20. No extended magazine bullshit.
2. Ban under harsh penalty the conversion of pistols or rifles into carbines. Ban any conversions like bump stocks and all that other horseshit.
3. The US government, including state governments should no longer purchase firearms or firearm accessories from companies that also sell firearms to the civilian market. If you want that juicy government contract. Well, you're a government contractor now.
4. National gun registry and universal federal background checks. No state opt outs and no exemptions. A complete prohibition of carrying or owning unregistered firearms with actual jail time penalties.

Blatantly unconstitutional pipe dreams, pretty much down to every number. But I'm not going to get into the fifth time discussing gun minutiae like magazine size, conversions, bump stocks.

Also, just because I'm a petty shit. All and I mean all civilian owned firearms that aren't some type of special collectible museum piece should be mandatory painted Hello Kitty pink at all times as a requirement for owning them. Bright fucking pink.

They should also really look into the whole tacticool gear bullshit, suppressors, body armor, sights, optics etc. Just to cut off the balls of all the cosplay Delta force loons and the shitheads like the Buffalo shooter how just shrugged off getting his ass shot by a security guard.

You wanna blow a wad of money on tacticool gear bullshit? Go knock yourself out. It's a free country. His dress up is my video game hobby. Both waste money from people considering themselves moral betters. I lived through the "violent video games cause gun violence like Columbine" era. I know exactly where I want to put preening moralizers about my hobby, any and all cosplay, and whatever bullshit happens in the next decade.

Whether you intended or not, you are repeating republicans talking point.
How dare you talk about gun control when 20 kids are dead, now is not the time, we should be mourning and praying
How dare you politicize the death of those kids, this is "far from appropriate".

People will talk about guns because some people do understand the correlation between guns and gun death. Somehow.

I think that "discussion" the mod referred to is pretty non-partisan in its shittiness. Regardless, they put up a thread where all the misinformed people can blare out their ignorance on gun control law and weapon velocities and hunting permits. People can indeed make the connection between dead kids and failures at gun control over there. I've seen it.

[Mihalik]

Typical all-or-nothing approach to an evenly divided Senate and narrow majority in House. Bonus for actually calling a plan "shit" that you admit "is going to prevent a couple of school shootings."

Blatantly unconstitutional pipe dreams, pretty much down to every number. But I'm not going to get into the fifth time discussing gun minutiae like magazine size, conversions, bump stocks.

"-We can't do anything that would make a difference, because The Gods of Guns have dictated in the Holy Second Amendment that people should have the right to butcher innocent people and children in their schools, homes, work places, at the store, at a concert etc. The Gods demand their blood tribute."

That's you.

You wanna blow a wad of money on tacticool gear bullshit? Go knock yourself out. It's a free country. His dress up is my video game hobby. Both waste money from people considering themselves moral betters. I lived through the "violent video games cause gun violence like Columbine" era. I know exactly where I want to put preening moralizers about my hobby, any and all cosplay, and whatever bullshit happens in the next decade.

Cosplay gear doesn't require specialized ammunition to overcome when a Naruto cosplayer decides to go on a rampage. SEE THE DIFFERENCE?

I think that "discussion" the mod referred to is pretty non-partisan in its shittiness. Regardless, they put up a thread where all the misinformed people can blare out their ignorance on gun control law and weapon velocities and hunting permits. People can indeed make the connection between dead kids and failures at gun control over there. I've seen it.

"YOU AREN'T USING MY SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE AMMOSEXUAL TERMINOLOGY TO TALK ABOUT MUH GUNZ! YOU IGNORANT! WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!"

That's you again. Nobody.gives.a.fuck.about.your.special.snowflake.ammosexual.terminology. We are not in your cult. We don't want to be in your fucked up human sacrifice cult. We want your cult to stop murdering people.

Get it?

[Edge-]

https://www.chron.com/news/houston-t...s-17238529.php

And now Q-anon nutters are waiting for JFK in Dallas - not JFK Jr. but JFK, remember the one that had his skull blown off in a car on camera?

“Then [the QAnon member] was like, ‘did you know that Uvalde has been closed for years? It was fake, it was all an act, it was actors and actresses.’ Then two more [QAnon members] came up and were like ‘none of these are real, mass shootings don’t happen,” Gonzalez continued.

Unsurprisingly, like every other mass/school shooting, the Q retards think this isn't just a "false flag", but that the whole thing was made up and that the school has been closed for years and everyone was an actor.

The wrong people are victims of gun violence, if we need to have victims of gun violence (which apparently, we do).

[Endus]

Typical all-or-nothing approach to an evenly divided Senate and narrow majority in House. Bonus for actually calling a plan "shit" that you admit "is going to prevent a couple of school shootings."

The proposed plan is, functionally, "nothing". So it's more like "nothing or nothing, but the latter nothing gets Republicans to smile and nod with you while you ensure nothing can get done for a decade or more because this nothing already got done and should be 'enough'".

Blatantly unconstitutional pipe dreams

Abolishing slavery was "blatantly unconstitutional". So was giving women the vote.

Turns out the Constitution has contained some of the absolute worst things in human history, and inclusion shouldn't be seen as a positive in and of itself by anyone, and that anyone pushing such rhetoric is not engaging in serious discussion.

You wanna blow a wad of money on tacticool gear bullshit? Go knock yourself out. It's a free country. His dress up is my video game hobby. Both waste money from people considering themselves moral betters. I lived through the "violent video games cause gun violence like Columbine" era. I know exactly where I want to put preening moralizers about my hobby, any and all cosplay, and whatever bullshit happens in the next decade.

The problem is that this is indistinguishable from "you want to arm yourself to mass-slaughter dozens of innocent schoolchildren and to resist police response to try and stop you? Go nuts! It's a free country."

Same argument, same actions, just different in the specific intent. Maybe we shouldn't entertain the delusions of certain cosplayers when the same products are the tools of mass murder.

But go on; tell us again why your desire to maintain a personal mass-shooter arsenal in your basement or whatever is more important than the lives of the children offered up as sacrifices in the name of your "freedoms" on a bi-weekly basis. Because that's the modern reality of the 2nd Amendment. Your rights are absolutely drowning in the blood of innocents, and your response is that you don't care and you'd rather see more mass killings than do anything that might limit your "freedoms". When it's those same "freedoms" that empower and enable these attacks.

[jeezusisacasual]

Nothing will change until a segment of the American populace starts to think We instead of Me, the group is more important then the single etc. So why even bother? I personally wish everyone with decency to leave and let the American Taliban continue down the road they so desperately want.

[Breccia]

‘none of these are real, mass shootings don’t happen,”

I hope the Uvadle survivors, teachers, and actually the police too, get the Alex Jones lawyers and ruin these people's lives.

Leaving aside how loathesome the "these are fake" attitude is, like "if I said how I felt I'd take a two-week hiatus" loathesome, the question is...how? In what world can something like this be set up to be a flawless representation of a mass shooting? Texas can't even keep the lights on.

[wunksta]

Texas Police Want Uvalde Bodycam Footage Suppressed Because It Could Expose Law Enforcement ‘Weakness’

The Texas Department of Public Safety has asked the state's Office of the Attorney General to prevent the public release of police body camera footage from the mass shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde in part because, it argues, the footage could be used by other shooters to determine "weaknesses" in police response to crimes.

“Revealing the marked records would provide criminals with invaluable information concerning Department techniques used to investigate and detect activities of suspected criminal elements; how information is assessed and analyzed; how information is shared among partner law enforcement agencies and the lessons learned from the analysis of prior criminal activities,” the department wrote in a letter to the Office of the Attorney General that asked the office to prevent the release of the public records. “Knowing the intelligence and response capabilities of Department personnel and where those employees focus their attention will compromise law enforcement purposes by enabling criminals to anticipate weakness in law enforcement procedures and alter their methods of operation in order to avoid detection and apprehension.”

https://www.vice.com/en/article/jgpe...to-suppress-it