Diablo Immortal streamer spends $10000.

[Elim Garak]

Ditto.

Who the fuck cares how you do it as long as you do it. It's not this idiotic red vs blue. If fucking Donald Trump makes it happen, I would not mind one bit.

"Anyone who spends money in f2p games will be executed without a trial."

Who cares how you do it.

[NihilSustinet]

And people wonder why MTX is still in games... because of views.

"I spend money so you don't have too" is code for. "I spend some of the money you give me, so give me more money".

the vast majority of whales are not streamers, though.

[Kumorii]

the vast majority of whales are not streamers, though.

you are correct

[Yarathir]

"Anyone who spends money in f2p games will be executed without a trial."

Who cares how you do it.

Are you well?

[Rucati]

Why not? As long as the goal is achieved who cares who did it? Asmon will go from the angle of "think of the children" which is usually effective for both sides. If you go to a casino in Vegas, they will not let someone under 18 use the slot machines, but any kid with an iPhone can go spend money with moms credit card to swipe for lootboxes. There needs to he regulation. In fact, most states have banned gambling so people are forced to fly out to Vegas. Why are videogames exempt from gambling laws?

Well because loot boxes aren't really gambling?

If I go to a casino and spend $200 there's a very very high chance I walk out with nothing. If I buy $200 worth of loot boxes I'm guaranteed to get something for my money.

Is it worth it? No, not really. But some people enjoy it and find it fun, so who cares?

The only people who get hurt by it are people who are unable to control themselves, no reason to regulate anything because of them. If a kid is spending money then that's on the parents, why is mom giving her kid access to a credit card? Why would you even feel sorry for someone that stupid?

Just let people spend their money how they want, and if it allows companies to make fun games for free that's a plus.

[GreenJesus]

"Anyone who spends money in f2p games will be executed without a trial."

Who cares how you do it.

"Please think of Bobby Kotick's yachts!! Wont anyone think of Bobby's yachts??"

[Yarathir]

Well because loot boxes aren't really gambling?

If I go to a casino and spend $200 there's a very very high chance I walk out with nothing. If I buy $200 worth of loot boxes I'm guaranteed to get something for my money.

Is it worth it? No, not really. But some people enjoy it and find it fun, so who cares?

The only people who get hurt by it are people who are unable to control themselves, no reason to regulate anything because of them. If a kid is spending money then that's on the parents, why is mom giving her kid access to a credit card? Why would you even feel sorry for someone that stupid?

Just let people spend their money how they want, and if it allows companies to make fun games for free that's a plus.

So if there was a consolation prize for irl physical gambling, that would make that fine?

[GreenJesus]

So if there was a consolation prize for irl physical gambling, that would make that fine?

"Heres a toy and an otter pop. Thanks for playing slots at our casino."

Whats funny is that casinos often used to offer $2 margaritas and $5 steaks to entice people to come in and try some gambling. My dad told me he used to go to a casino during college to get the dinner deals and cheap drinks.

[Yarathir]

"Heres a toy and an otter pop. Thanks for playing slots at our casino."

Hey, that makes it no longer gambling, because you technically didn't leave with empty hands!

[Cayde69]

Well because loot boxes aren't really gambling?

If I go to a casino and spend $200 there's a very very high chance I walk out with nothing. If I buy $200 worth of loot boxes I'm guaranteed to get something for my money.

Is it worth it? No, not really. But some people enjoy it and find it fun, so who cares?

The only people who get hurt by it are people who are unable to control themselves, no reason to regulate anything because of them. If a kid is spending money then that's on the parents, why is mom giving her kid access to a credit card? Why would you even feel sorry for someone that stupid?

Just let people spend their money how they want, and if it allows companies to make fun games for free that's a plus.

Loot boxes are the definition of gambling. You are spending your money on a chance to get something more valuable.

Getting a piece of trash in a loot box is the equivalent of getting nothing.

This is like saying “well playing blackjack and losing $10000 isn’t really gambling because they gave me free drinks the whole time”

[MoanaLisa]

Why not? As long as the goal is achieved who cares who did it? Asmon will go from the angle of "think of the children" which is usually effective for both sides. If you go to a casino in Vegas, they will not let someone under 18 use the slot machines, but any kid with an iPhone can go spend money with moms credit card to swipe for lootboxes. There needs to he regulation. In fact, most states have banned gambling so people are forced to fly out to Vegas. Why are videogames exempt from gambling laws?

I think this might be mistaken. Most states have various forms of gambling including lottery tickets, native American casinos, pari-mutuel casinos, land-based casinos, riverboat casinos or a casino boat. There are 44 states that offer some form of casino gambling.

I'll make this point again: Game developers and vendors could reconfigure all of their store packages so that you know specifically what you're getting with your 99 cents - $4.99 and up. No random chances for items.

That's not gambling. That's shopping. There are mobile games that already do exactly this.

Furthermore, a simple clickable popup stating the the customer agrees they are 18 or whatever would take care of their legal responsibility with respect to that.

And no, I don't want anyone in Congress passing laws about what video games can and can't do. Talk about a fucking slippery slope...

[Kumorii]

"Heres a toy and an otter pop. Thanks for playing slots at our casino."

Whats funny is that casinos often used to offer $2 margaritas and $5 steaks to entice people to come in and try some gambling. My dad told me he used to go to a casino during college to get the dinner deals and cheap drinks.

you can just go to a casino and play the slots slowly with tiny amounts and servers will come and just ask what drinks you want. Get it for "free"... it's how me and my friends solved our pre-drinks before going out when we visited.

[Rucati]

So if there was a consolation prize for irl physical gambling, that would make that fine?

As long as it's very obvious what your chances of winning what you want are, then yeah, sure. I mean I think gambling is fine regardless. If someone wants to risk their money in the hope of making more money I don't really see what the problem is.

Loot boxes are the definition of gambling. You are spending your money on a chance to get something more valuable.

Getting a piece of trash in a loot box is the equivalent of getting nothing.

This is like saying “well playing blackjack and losing $10000 isn’t really gambling because they gave me free drinks the whole time”

I mean yeah, basically you're just paying money for entertainment and drinks. You're gambling at blackjack, sure, but at least you're getting something worthwhile. If instead of gambling losing $10000 you only lost $100 and still got free drinks that would be pretty worth it, just play lower stakes.

[Cayde69]

As long as it's very obvious what your chances of winning what you want are, then yeah, sure. I mean I think gambling is fine regardless. If someone wants to risk their money in the hope of making more money I don't really see what the problem is.



I mean yeah, basically you're just paying money for entertainment and drinks. You're gambling at blackjack, sure, but at least you're getting something worthwhile. If instead of gambling losing $10000 you only lost $100 and still got free drinks that would be pretty worth it, just play lower stakes.

But that’s still gambling. That doesn’t make it not gambling

[Rucati]

But that’s still gambling. That doesn’t make it not gambling

The blackjack part is gambling, sure, but blackjack isn't really comparable to boxes.

If I spend $100 on blackjack I could walk away with $1000 or with $0. If I spend $100 on loot boxes I am 100% guaranteed to receive pixels that have no value.

Spending money on pixels is not gambling.

There's an argument that could be made for CSGO lootboxes being gambling since they do have real world value, but for a game like Diablo Immortal it really just isn't gambling. You know that you're spending money on pixels, the fact that you don't know which pixels you'll get doesn't matter.

[Goatfish]

Ah but there lies the difference. High-school drop out refers to teenagers aged 15-16-17. They've at least heard of important shit like WW2 in history class. They've learned basic algebra. How to write a 150 word essay. This dude said PRIMARY-school dropout. That means 10-11-12.

It's fascinating to me how people will bring up WW2 as "important shit" when most people really don't know enough about it to bother talking about anything but the most basic and emotional takes. At least in my school we went a lot over how terrible things were and not why these things were happening. We also barely touched on the soviet union and Lenin, and completely ignored Mao. Heck, we even left out a huge swath of the history of slavery. Most of my history classes in high school seemed like they were trying to teach an emotional response to historical events, and having looked into how other countries teach the same events it seems very similar. The public education people get on WW2 varies quite a lot depending on where you learn it.

Being in my 30's now and having done a relatively absurd amount of self-teaching after high school compared to the average person, I'm just recently really getting a grasp on how little history I really know. But people like to talk about these subjects in their 20's as if they are experts, and I don't think that's something we can really change.

Are people really cheering on right wing politicians regulating video games because they can affect real life behaviour?

Did you watch the video? Ted Cruz's initial take on it was a free market Libertarian approach. He didn't really seem interested in the federal government regulating the video game market. Overall I tend to agree even if I find the practice of lootbox's disgusting. I don't think it should be within the scope of the Fed to apply many of the regulations it currently does. It's shocking how some people react when they meet a conservative leaning individual who actually wants a small government, though I guess I shouldn't be shocked when the online discourse is all about how conservatives want to control your life and restrict you from doing anything.

I'm not fully on board with a completely free market approach. We limit what businesses can and can't do all the time, and for good reason. There is an argument that the free market would pressure certain action with or without the regulation, but I tend to think the regulation serves as good basic guidelines and helps prevent bad events from happening whereas the free market is reactional. I tend to care less about what localized regulations are put in place and care more about restricting federal regulation. At least in the USA, our ancestors seemed to bring about a bad habit of looking to the Fed to "solve" issues across a huge country where we have various outlooks on these topics. But idk, the more you really learn about things the more complicated shit gets.

[Delever]

Most people don't even understand probability, not to mention the whole table.


Number of people that share a conclusion is irrelevant to the conclusion's validity.

There's no gambling in Diablo Immortal. And the actual number of people with gambling addition is pretty low - and most of them are not even playing games. Gambled their iPhone and lost.

It's ok to charge whatever in a video game.

I will gladly take the infraction to get out of my chest that if you are not trolling you are the most moronic troglodyte I have ever had the misfortune of encountering in a forum. The fact that more singe celled organisms like you exist in the world greatly saddens me.

[Elim Garak]

I will gladly take the infraction to get out of my chest that if you are not trolling you are the most moronic troglodyte I have ever had the misfortune of encountering in a forum. The fact that more singe celled organisms like you exist in the world greatly saddens me.

I submit to your irrefutable argument.

[Cayde69]

The blackjack part is gambling, sure, but blackjack isn't really comparable to boxes.

If I spend $100 on blackjack I could walk away with $1000 or with $0. If I spend $100 on loot boxes I am 100% guaranteed to receive pixels that have no value.

Spending money on pixels is not gambling.
.

Okay I don’t want to sound too rude here but you’re just wrong. This isn’t a discussion or a debate you’re just wrong.

Whether or not you disagree, those pixels have value. Depending on the game they can sell for a lot of real life money, some quite literally can be directly traded for real money. And even if it didn’t the value it holds is still very much real even if it’s a game that doesn’t trade items.

Think of wow for example, there are mounts out there that sell for tens of thousands of dollars if you sell your account.

Just because you think it’s virtual so it isn’t real so it doesn’t hold value doesn’t make that true. And idc if you disagree you are just straight up wrong.

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I will gladly take the infraction to get out of my chest that if you are not trolling you are the most moronic troglodyte I have ever had the misfortune of encountering in a forum. The fact that more singe celled organisms like you exist in the world greatly saddens me.

I’m just going to ask becasue I will admit I’m completely ignorant to Diablo immortal because I think mobile games are trash anyway, but how exactly does it have gambling?

Not saying it doesn’t, I’ve heard a ton of things about it being pay to win, but what system in it has gambling? Is there a system where you buy things to give you a better drop rate or something?

[Dhrizzle]

Why not? As long as the goal is achieved who cares who did it? Asmon will go from the angle of "think of the children" which is usually effective for both sides. If you go to a casino in Vegas, they will not let someone under 18 use the slot machines, but any kid with an iPhone can go spend money with moms credit card to swipe for lootboxes. There needs to he regulation. In fact, most states have banned gambling so people are forced to fly out to Vegas. Why are videogames exempt from gambling laws?

Ditto.

Who the fuck cares how you do it as long as you do it. It's not this idiotic red vs blue. If fucking Donald Trump makes it happen, I would not mind one bit.

And in that vid Cruz did show knowledge so it's nothing about cheering right wing or shit like that. If fucking Bernie would speak of it with that level of understanding, I'd be all game for that as well.

And absolutely that - making it a "think about the children" thing is the way to do it. The only way to fix this shit is through laws and regulations, any other idiotic proposals like "whelp just don't play durr" don't do shit.

So just to confirm - the government should regulate what content is allowed in video games based on a "think of the children and how they effect their behaviour" argument? Or in other words, Jack Thompson was right?

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I’m just going to ask becasue I will admit I’m completely ignorant to Diablo immortal because I think mobile games are trash anyway, but how exactly does it have gambling?

Not saying it doesn’t, I’ve heard a ton of things about it being pay to win, but what system in it has gambling? Is there a system where you buy things to give you a better drop rate or something?

You spend money and it gives you a thing and that thing can be used at the start of a Rift (instance type thing) so that you get better random loot.

In most places this isn't classed as gambling because there isn't a cash prize (or prize that's readily exchangeable for cash) and it sits somewhere below Pokemon/TCG cards and above any other game with randomised loot.

In Belgium their gambling laws say that the prize can be anything with a perceived value, so if one collection of pixels you can win is "better" than a different collection of pixels you can win they still count it as gambling.