Classic Plus = Course Correction

[Lolites]

it has not made the dent in private servers they thought it would

this might be shocking revelation for you, but a lot of people play on free private servers bcs they are FREE

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Cata doesn’t capture a large enough audience.

i assume its pulled from the same "source" that tells you classic only population is MASSIVE part of the wow playerbase, of which we dont know the size, not even the total size for both (all 3 actualy now) compared, just the MAU for whole company covering what, half a dozen other games?
how about the fact they were closing and combining realms in classic lately (which are smaller than retail ones to begin with)? or you ignored that as it didnt support your "facts"?

[loras]

Yes, let's put development resources behind an old, superseded iteration of the game instead of developing new improvements for the current and ongoing one.

Let's do that.

Let's just set money on fire.

As the devil's advocate: That is just the "sunken cost fallacy" in action.
An expensive failure may still be best off left abandoned or scuttled.


That said: The game's popularity kept growing until at least WotLK, so that may be a better starting point for these suggested changes, possibly with the implementation of scaling to lvl 60 suggestion.

[Khain]

Don't think Classic+ will happen. They did a season of mastery and it died, out only around 6000 players left on Ironforge. This on its own was pretty much a classic+ attempt and the players didn't like it.

SoM failed because it didn't cater to anyone, It was not what classic+ enthusiasts wanted nor what purists would have liked. Blizzard has the problem to be way to conservative with classic IPs, they need to hit the gas harder both in D2R and Classic. A well done Classic+ would generate a hype possibly bigger than OG classic, so many people would come back for it.

[Mendzia]

SoM failed because it didn't cater to anyone, It was not what classic+ enthusiasts wanted nor what purists would have liked. Blizzard has the problem to be way to conservative with classic IPs, they need to hit the gas harder both in D2R and Classic. A well done Classic+ would generate a hype possibly bigger than OG classic, so many people would come back for it.

SoM died because they made stupid decision pushing it soo early.
If they are not instant-money hungry and wait until WotLK is finished it would have be atleast 10x more popular.
Me and my friends would play it most likely.

[Khain]

SoM died because they made stupid decision pushing it soo early.
If they are not instant-money hungry and wait until WotLK is finished it would have be atleast 10x more popular.
Me and my friends would play it most likely.

It was early indeed, but thats not all. People wanted way more changes than it was presented, and it wasnt really well executed. Why would you go through a harder more sluggish version of mc when you can get rank14 in 6 weeks and tier 0.5 from the get go.

If classic+ are to succeed they need to implement significant balance, itemization and content changes, not just slightly edit vanilla.

[TJ]

SoM died because they made stupid decision pushing it soo early.
If they are not instant-money hungry and wait until WotLK is finished it would have be atleast 10x more popular.
Me and my friends would play it most likely.

Definitely. It would've been interesting to see how popular SOM would be if they waited until mid/post Wrath to release it.

[Cayde69]

this might be shocking revelation for you, but a lot of people play on free private servers bcs they are FREE

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i assume its pulled from the same "source" that tells you classic only population is MASSIVE part of the wow playerbase, of which we dont know the size, not even the total size for both (all 3 actualy now) compared, just the MAU for whole company covering what, half a dozen other games?
how about the fact they were closing and combining realms in classic lately (which are smaller than retail ones to begin with)? or you ignored that as it didnt support your "facts"?

this might be shocking revelation for you, but a lot of people play on free private servers bcs they are FREE

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i assume its pulled from the same "source" that tells you classic only population is MASSIVE part of the wow playerbase, of which we dont know the size, not even the total size for both (all 3 actualy now) compared, just the MAU for whole company covering what, half a dozen other games?
how about the fact they were closing and combining realms in classic lately (which are smaller than retail ones to begin with)? or you ignored that as it didnt support your "facts"?

If you truly want to get informed here I will help you.

I never said we know the actual number I said we can get a pretty good idea about how big it is respective to retail through the data that we do have, and I brought it up for you too.

Also do I really need to explain why they are closing realms on classic and not retail? Do you really need this explained or do you want to think about the differences for maybe just a second or two?

[Relapses]

I’m not saying I do, I’m telling you what the community has said through its actions. If you had some sort of critical thought you’d understand this, but judging by your “counter argument”, critical thought is sort of lost on you

Critical thinking, of course, means taking your unsourced opinion that Cata would be DoA as certifiable fact. Get the fuck over yourself man.

[Cayde69]

Critical thinking, of course, means taking your unsourced opinion that Cata would be DoA as certifiable fact. Get the fuck over yourself man.

I already told you where I gathered that opinion from, if you choose to ignore that then it’s on you.

[BeepBoo]

Sounds horrible lol.
Permanent level cap is retarded. Either power creeps to high or there's no increase in power making running new content pointless.

I don't run new content to get stronger. I run content because it's new and novel, I want to see the story, I enjoy the act of manipulating my character, etc. Reward-based gameplay outside of just "I beat the thing!" is garbage. Why can't PvE players just treat raid bosses or whatever the same way PvP players treat their match opponents (meaning they just get satisfaction from putting something in the ground)?

[Relapses]

I already told you where I gathered that opinion from, if you choose to ignore that then it’s on you.

And once again, the audience for private realms is different than what is playing on Blizzard's version of Classic. You cannot possibly extrapolate that because private Cata realms aren't popular that Blizzard's version of Cata wouldn't be.

[Cayde69]

And once again, the audience for private realms is different than what is playing on Blizzard's version of Classic. You cannot possibly extrapolate that because private Cata realms aren't popular that Blizzard's version of Cata wouldn't be.

I most certainly can when it’s paired with a ton of people on forums constantly saying that cata is terrible and that wow classic should be a trilogy and that you never ever see anyone hyped or talking about cata. If anything they would skip it and go to mop because that at least had some sort of audience.

Also I love how you’re saying “you can’t possibly get that information from looking at the private server community” considering we are talking about a version of the game that was specifically made because of the private server community LOL.

If a community that specifically loves the older versions of wow. A community that has been held in contact for over a decade now, that has tried to open up cata servers idk how many times just for it to die the day it opens up. Yeah let’s not look at that at all for a hint. Yup. Smart thinking on your part

[Relapses]

I most certainly can when it’s paired with a ton of people on forums constantly saying that cata is terrible and that wow classic should be a trilogy and that you never ever see anyone hyped or talking about cata. If anything they would skip it and go to mop because that at least had some sort of audience.

Also I love how you’re saying “you can’t possibly get that information from looking at the private server community” considering we are talking about a version of the game that was specifically made because of the private server community LOL.

If a community that specifically loves the older versions of wow. A community that has been held in contact for over a decade now, that has tried to open up cata servers idk how many times just for it to die the day it opens up. Yeah let’s not look at that at all for a hint. Yup. Smart thinking on your part

You seem to be under the impression that private server players are the only real Classic fans. They're not. It's only on forums like this where you meet delusional Classic WoW fans who think their opinions are the center of the known universe and refuse to even entertain the possibility that reality might be slightly different.

Also, it's actually fucking hilarious that you think Blizzard would just be like, "Oh yeah, we're skipping Cata progression servers and doing MoP instead because, uh, some angry WoW fans on the internet think it sucks."

[Unholyground]

Once the wow token is inevitably removed from the game that will course correct much of the problems that exist today. If anyone thinks Microsoft's going to keep the token they're sadly mistaken as it steps on potential future gamepass subs. The future is quite easy to predict.

Much of the games design problems are actually them designing around the token as much as people don't want to see it.

[Relapses]

Once the wow token is inevitably removed from the game that will course correct much of the problems that exist today. If anyone thinks Microsoft's going to keep the token they're sadly mistaken as it steps on potential future gamepass subs. The future is quite easy to predict.

Much of the games design problems are actually them designing around the token as much as people don't want to see it.

Your position has nothing to do with Classic or the OP's topic. It seems like you just wanted to share with the world (yet again) your incredibly unique opinion that the WoW token is, in fact, bad.

Cool.

[Cayde69]

You seem to be under the impression that private server players are the only real Classic fans. They're not. It's only on forums like this where you meet delusional Classic WoW fans who think their opinions are the center of the known universe and refuse to even entertain the possibility that reality might be slightly different.

Also, it's actually fucking hilarious that you think Blizzard would just be like, "Oh yeah, we're skipping Cata progression servers and doing MoP instead because, uh, some angry WoW fans on the internet think it sucks."

Now you’re strawmanning lol nice. Just admit what you said was stupid and let’s skip these weird games shall we? Thanks

[Unholyground]

Your position has nothing to do with Classic or the OP's topic. It seems like you just wanted to share with the world (yet again) your incredibly unique opinion that the WoW token is, in fact, bad.

Cool.

It is bad and it promotes a certain type of game play that most would find unacceptable in any normal setting. It actually makes the game less fun for others and in many different ways that bleeds over into everything else that's WoW/b.net related. Everybody's always looking at the tiny picture not the overarking big picture and implications of what has been done.

[kendro1200]

Let's just set money on fire.

To be fair, they did that with the last two retail expansions.

From a business point of view, Classic did save WoW from a death spiral. However, Classic runs into the same issue with every Activision Blizzard product. No live service product gets the support it needs to maintain momentum after release, nor does it get proportional return investment based on its revenue production. If WoW ever received return investments over the last 14 years, it would have never run into the issues we have today. Instead the trend has always been make it do what it already did, or do less, on a tighter budget.

Classic+ would be a smart product to create.
Good Retail content would be a smart product to create and support.

None of that will ever happen though, because Blizzard is run by people who only care about increasing their share values every quarter. There has been zero interest in actually selling good games for over a decade at this point. At best you get a transparent cash grab strangling a good game's design.

[Biomega]

To be fair, they did that with the last two retail expansions.

This confuses me greatly.

What, exactly, are you trying to say with this statement?

"They had failures in the past, so it's okay to have another failure"?

I'm not saying I disagree that BFA and SL weren't good either critically or commercially, but why is their failure an argument FOR doing another bad thing?

[kieraTM]

What even is this post? I am confused