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  1. #21
    The Lightbringer Ardenaso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    I think the Cult of Shadow is sort of defunct at this point, having been more or less subsumed by the Convocation (the Priest Order Hall) as of Legion.
    but the Argent Crusade still exists even after it was absorbed by the Silver Hand 2.0

    speaking of I think they should also have a rep there such as Leonid Bartholomew
    The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!

    I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Well, it does make some sense for the Cult of Shadow - Shadow Priests touch the Void a good deal, and the Old Gods are products of the Void. There's definitely a risk in playing with proverbial fire like that.
    I am still adamantly of the position that making Shadow and Void the same thing was a mistake.

    The Cult of the Shadow's Divine Humanism angle from the RPG bits is nowhere else presented in WoW.
    Twas brillig

  3. #23
    I don't think there'll be one. Maybe in the future after developing some stories, but not in the near future I'd assume.
    Though this reminds me ... weren't there living relatives of the murdered forsaken from the original Desolate Council in Oribos? Like Ol' Emma? Did they ever do anything with them? Or we're just to assume that they never got to talk to them or get closure on their murders.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    I am still adamantly of the position that making Shadow and Void the same thing was a mistake.

    The Cult of the Shadow's Divine Humanism angle from the RPG bits is nowhere else presented in WoW.
    I think the idea of blizz is to make void not the same as evil.
    good things could exist in the plane of the void. Natalie Selin practically tells us that the place in the void where she was is a paradise

  5. #25
    Thanks for making this thread, I've took a deep interest into the priest lore and it pushed me to read quite a lot on the night watchers, cult of forgotten shadows, the nature of shadow and void, etc.
    These reads just remind me that it's really hard leaving old continents behind after an expansion and that I'm pretty sure Blizzard could write a ton of stories that would involve the many denizens and groups that populate their world.
    I'll still hope for an expansion that will update the north of the eastern Kingdoms (Silvermoon-Gilneas-Arathi-Alterac-plaguelands-Tirisfal-etc.)

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    in the past the desolate council had a leader the Prime Governor Vellcinda so we see now we don't have a leader or someone who uses the title. although now lordaeron becomes a republic it should have a president or prime minister who in the forsaken case would be prime governor
    No need for a prime designate, especially for a race built from and so vulnerable to corruption.
    Let them keep eachother in check and rule through unanimity, and if a representative needs to be sent somewhere let that position revolve around the entirety of the council.
    This is a signature of an ailing giant, boundless in pride, wit and strength.
    Yet also as humble as health and humor permit.

    Furthermore, I consider that Carthage Slam must be destroyed.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    I think the idea of blizz is to make void not the same as evil.
    good things could exist in the plane of the void. Natalie Selin practically tells us that the place in the void where she was is a paradise
    Void and Shadow can be distinct AND not evil.
    Twas brillig

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
    Void and Shadow can be distinct AND not evil.
    Like arcane and order or life and nature

  9. #29
    I am Murloc! KOUNTERPARTS's Avatar
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    I think the theme that Blizzard is going with is that, while the cosmic forces themselves are not inherently evil (the wielder of their power is or is not), that each one does have a somewhat fundamental, underlying goal/motive/desire to spread its influence and dominate reality.


    Well, maybe not dominate reality... but be the singular force in control of the entire universe.


    The Void wants to do this by consuming/eating the physical universe (all energy, all magic, all life inside of it) and leave nothing but... well, a void.
    The Light wants to spread its "gospel" and have everything in the physical universe follow the path of the Light. "The Light seeks one path and shuns all others as lies."

    Order, or at least beings of Order, want to go everywhere where this is life and give it structure and governance. Where they go and find life, instead of just letting it be and see what it does on its own, they kind of force organization and purpose upon them.
    Disorder, or at least the demons spawned from the fel, want to kill and sow chaos across the cosmos. It's kind of funny that the only reason why we have a Burning Legion in the first place (not revelation Sargeras' had about the Void Lords) -- and organized faction of demons with a singular purpose -- is because Sargeras is a titan and being of Order. Very scary to see a force of Disorder have a purpose given to them via Order.

    Life and Death seem to be the only forces that kind just want to... exist. I suppose the concept of the "Great Cycle" is to allow things to be born, grow, live, and die. Although that didn't stop Zovaal and all of his shenanigans to enact over millions of years of plans to get his way. I wonder if Life has similar vibes.
    Last edited by KOUNTERPARTS; 2022-06-21 at 10:12 PM.

  10. #30
    I'm convinced that if Zovaal could be this worried about an unknown force that the only plan he could form and accept as a solution was to enslave the whole cosmos then Life could very well go crazy and do the same.

    The key concept is that every force has its flaw and every disciple of this force is a slave to a goal. What would be interesting is to go back to the high fantasy and have ot shown to us through the lens of a mere mortal and what would actually impact us without making it cataclysmic day one

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhlor View Post
    Like arcane and order or life and nature
    I can't tell if you're being facetious but no, not really.

    Frankly I don't think Arcane and Order ever really meshed well and life and nature are basically the same thing.


    Void and Shadow are distinct in my mind because thematically Voidwalkers and the like are distinct from Old god fleshy creations. The emptiness of space is a different kind of psychological horror than the horror of eldritch deities, or the divine-humanism angle shown with the shadow in the RPG and Blizzard doesn't handle any of them well by mingling them.
    Twas brillig

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by KOUNTERPARTS View Post
    I think the theme that Blizzard is going with is that, while the cosmic forces themselves are not inherently evil (the wielder of their power is or is not), that each one does have a somewhat fundamental, underlying goal/motive/desire to spread its influence and dominate reality.


    Well, maybe not dominate reality... but be the singular force in control of the entire universe.


    The Void wants to do this by consuming/eating the physical universe (all energy, all magic, all life inside of it) and leave nothing but... well, a void.
    The Light wants to spread its "gospel" and have everything in the physical universe follow the path of the Light. "The Light seeks one path and shuns all others as lies."

    Order, or at least beings of Order, want to go everywhere where this is life and give it structure and governance. Where they go and find life, instead of just letting it be and see what it does on its own, they kind of force organization and purpose upon them.
    Disorder, or at least the demons spawned from the fel, want to kill and sow chaos across the cosmos. It's kind of funny that the only reason why we have a Burning Legion in the first place (not revelation Sargeras' had about the Void Lords) -- and organized faction of demons with a singular purpose -- is because Sargeras is a titan and being of Order. Very scary to see a force of Disorder have a purpose given to them via Order.

    Life and Death seem to be the only forces that kind just want to... exist. I suppose the concept of the "Great Cycle" is to allow things to be born, grow, live, and die. Although that didn't stop Zovaal and all of his shenanigans to enact over millions of years of plans to get his way. I wonder if Life has similar vibes.
    remember that aggramar created the ancestors of the orcs to fight against the Sporemound, maybe there we see a conflict between nature vs arcane

  13. #33
    The whole idea that the Forsaken is ruled by a council is dumb on its own. I have no idea why Blizzard thought that would be a good take.

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