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  1. #421
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    I just think (again, my opinion) that too many people in the WoW community are jumping straight to pessimistic thinking due to WoW’s recent “history” (I.e. Shadowlands/BFA (even though I personally found positives in both)).

    People are right to be concerned but having little to no optimism at all? At that point, go touch some grass because WoW is NOT the game for you.
    The game I've enjoyed for 2 decades isn't for me? Whelp better tell the wife.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by Catastrophy349 View Post
    I just think (again, my opinion) that too many people in the WoW community are jumping straight to pessimistic thinking due to WoW’s recent “history” (I.e. Shadowlands/BFA (even though I personally found positives in both)).

    People are right to be concerned but having little to no optimism at all? At that point, go touch some grass because WoW is NOT the game for you.
    People tire of a game after playing it for years/decades. And instead of just stepping away they hang around desperate for other people to validate their own feelings.

    That is also why the Alpha, or Beta, will satisfy them. The problem isn't with the game itself, if one argument goes away they will just move to something else.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    People tire of a game after playing it for years/decades. And instead of just stepping away they hang around desperate for other people to validate their own feelings.

    That is also why the Alpha, or Beta, will satisfy them. The problem isn't with the game itself, if one argument goes away they will just move to something else.
    I think a lot of it too is people just want the game to stop fucking with them and wasting their time.

    There isn't a good reason why plus 20s can't drop max level gear. Nor is there a good reason for useless time wasting like conduits , renowned, etc to exist.

    Just give us dungeons and raids and collect subs like blizzard used to and leave the cellphone game stuff to moblie gamers.

  4. #424
    Quote Originally Posted by Mojo03 View Post
    It feels like an experiment to see how deep the Stockholm Syndrome goes with their player base by giving less and less and wanting more and more from them.

    It's genuinely disturbing to watch.

    Especially seeing how morally bankrupt they've gotten to with Immortal.
    I think it's closer to just shifting to maximum maintainability. Previously they just spend a certain amount of their budget on gimmik systems no one wanted, maybe (playing devil's advocate here) they will use that budget to improve in areas where it matters, like the overall content. Obviously though they could also just wire transfer that budget straight to bobbies goleden diamond-encrusted parachute. Meanwhile they streamlined their class progression system to the point that it will probably not need changes for the next 6 years. The game could go either way from here, either they splurge on content or they just transfer to official maintenance mode. Either option is in the cards depending on the outcome after the first couple of months of the expansion.
    You are welcome, Metzen. I hope you won't fuck up my underground expansion idea.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmic Janitor View Post
    I think it's closer to just shifting to maximum maintainability. Previously they just spend a certain amount of their budget on gimmik systems no one wanted, maybe (playing devil's advocate here) they will use that budget to improve in areas where it matters, like the overall content. Obviously though they could also just wire transfer that budget straight to bobbies goleden diamond-encrusted parachute. Meanwhile they streamlined their class progression system to the point that it will probably not need changes for the next 6 years. The game could go either way from here, either they splurge on content or they just transfer to official maintenance mode. Either option is in the cards depending on the outcome after the first couple of months of the expansion.
    I honestly think it's just incompetence and them not being able to train staff as quickly as they churn them.

    Either way this marks the first expansion I wont be buying at launch unless something drastically changes.

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    I honestly think it's just incompetence and them not being able to train staff as quickly as they churn them.

    Either way this marks the first expansion I wont be buying at launch unless something drastically changes.
    Actually smart that they bought that other studio! Since it is insanely difficult to hire good people these days

  7. #427
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    The game I've enjoyed for 2 decades isn't for me? Whelp better tell the wife.
    I don’t understand your response. I said that the game may not be for those who are constantly hating on it and pessimistic no matter what is announced.

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    They have fallen a long way since Legion. This is not even an expansion, its more of a patch.

    Outside of a new class and new zones / raids.


    Gonna be a shit show!
    What the hell do you think a new xpac is suppose to be if not this???????????????????????????????????? People are so whiney nowadays. It is a 15yo game be lucky you are still getting content.

  9. #429
    I don't give two shits and a fuck about "features" in a game if the story is absolute shit. Make me care about what's going on and the people involved, take me on a ride. pandaland, wod, and legion did a nice job. the rest? not so much.

  10. #430
    Quote Originally Posted by Jinpachi View Post
    I don't give two shits and a fuck about "features" in a game if the story is absolute shit. Make me care about what's going on and the people involved, take me on a ride. pandaland, wod, and legion did a nice job. the rest? not so much.
    Mop and wod had to have the worst stories of any of the expansions. The side stories were kind of cool, but that’s true in most expansions anyways.(probably got worse overtime though) legion was pretty good though.
    www.twitch.tv/rtrain

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  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    Bro... my man.

    They are linking ah by region. That mace is being crafted for negative 50s on the ah.

    WoW always has people making items below market value.

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    It feels like a patch loaded with systems I don't want..

    4 relevant dungeons and a raid are not an expansion to me.
    Work orders aren't region wide
    The way the presentation worded it and the blog it will be server based

    Aside from that the region wide ah is just consumables and trade items

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    Quote Originally Posted by pastar View Post
    What the hell do you think a new xpac is suppose to be if not this???????????????????????????????????? People are so whiney nowadays. It is a 15yo game be lucky you are still getting content.
    They don't realize that's all any expansion has

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    Bro... my man.

    They are linking ah by region. That mace is being crafted for negative 50s on the ah.
    Reading must be hard for you. "Auction Houses across all realms on a given region will now share commodity listings (gems, herbs, flasks, consumables, etc.). Items that aren’t commodities –- like armor and weapons –- will continue to be realm-specific."

  13. #433
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    One thing that we've slowly lost over the expansions has been the different storylines between alliance and horde characters. It sounds very much like Dragonflight will be using the same Shadowlands template, so hubs and questlines will 99% again be the same on all alts regardless of faction choice. It's odd that Blizzard supports and to some degree pushes making alts, yet to save work they've gradually merged almost all questlines now into just 1. You can literally do all of SL and will only have a tiny handful of quests that are unique to your faction. In early wow almost every hub and storyline was unique for the faction. It was fun to experience 2 different storylines on alts, even if it wasn't a questline related to conflict between the horde and alliance. I've complained about the loss of faction distinction for a long time but it's unfortunate to see it continue to go the wrong direction. It would keep players playing and coming back for a better alt experience. At the end of the day it's just a lot less content to experience, which hastens how fast players fall off after expansion release. And needless to say that was a big issue in SL.

    It's one thing to make leveling alts quicker and easier with skips. But the only faction experience difference now at level 50+ is which city you have to go back to to visit an AH. And engineers don't even have to do that.

  14. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biglog View Post
    One thing that we've slowly lost over the expansions has been the different storylines between alliance and horde characters. It sounds very much like Dragonflight will be using the same Shadowlands template, so hubs and questlines will 99% again be the same on all alts regardless of faction choice. It's odd that Blizzard supports and to some degree pushes making alts, yet to save work they've gradually merged almost all questlines now into just 1. You can literally do all of SL and will only have a tiny handful of quests that are unique to your faction. In early wow almost every hub and storyline was unique for the faction. It was fun to experience 2 different storylines on alts, even if it wasn't a questline related to conflict between the horde and alliance. I've complained about the loss of faction distinction for a long time but it's unfortunate to see it continue to go the wrong direction. It would keep players playing and coming back for a better alt experience. At the end of the day it's just a lot less content to experience, which hastens how fast players fall off after expansion release. And needless to say that was a big issue in SL.

    It's one thing to make leveling alts quicker and easier with skips. But the only faction experience difference now at level 50+ is which city you have to go back to to visit an AH. And engineers don't even have to do that.
    While I agree with literally everything you just said (I miss the faction identity storylines/towns, too), with cross faction from a gameplay perspective, and more importantly, the Horde and Alliance working together almost entirely for several expansions now, I understand why they don’t bother anymore. Yes, I miss it but what incentive do they have to do it?

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    I am very excited to see how they tell the story of Dragonflight. The zones are linear, created with verticality in mind, and we have Dragonriding. Furthermore, we are literally climbing to the top of the Dragon Isles (final zone) and starting at the base of the isles (first zone). There’s a lot of potential to be had there.

  15. #435
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    The game I've enjoyed for 2 decades isn't for me? Whelp better tell the wife.
    The current version of WOW is not the same game we’ve enjoyed for 2 decades. Virtually every expansion Blizzard attempt to reinvent the wheel and that’s half the problem. If/When they finally release a version the game Player X enjoys, it only lasts for a single expansion (if not a single patch) before they try to reinvent things again.

    Personally, less is more. I’m so sick and tired of all the bloat in WOW, so happy to return to simpler times, when I played the game “less” but enjoyed it more. (By less I mean didn’t feel compelled to log in daily for chores, I’ve spent so much of SL un-subbed it’s by far my least played expansion.)

  16. #436
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    If we're honest it's just a rework of already existing systems. And a rework can never be a new feature, it's a modernized basic feature.

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    Exciting features, I guess.
    I feel like "exciting features" means borrowed power to the Devs, which seems to be universally despised by players. Anytime they're doing "addition by subtraction" it's going to look boring, but it doesn't mean it isn't the right thing for the game. Chasing flashy new systems is how we got here in the first place. I'd like for them to just make more. More dungeons so you do them less often and they get less boring. More raids, more world content, etc. I'd also like them to reinvent older content which is something they're doing with M+ dungeons, but I want them to take that further. Like maybe once you hit level 30 you get to do LFR molten core with other people around that level and get some epic gear. Let people experience these raids sort of like how they were when they released. It's a shame we have 17 years of content and 15 of it is just leveling content that you blast through in a couple days.

    Also there are systems like Torghast or Mage Tower or whatever from prior expansions, why not let us do those for achievements or something in future expansions? How hard is it to just scale them up? Like why can't they just say OK we're making an expansion with some new stuff and the old expansion's content is now "evergreened" somehow. Maybe add like a legacy currency that you get or something that can be used to buy profession materials or something I dunno.
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  17. #437
    Quote Originally Posted by Bronsin View Post
    Reading must be hard for you. "Auction Houses across all realms on a given region will now share commodity listings (gems, herbs, flasks, consumables, etc.). Items that aren’t commodities –- like armor and weapons –- will continue to be realm-specific."
    I'm telling you now... if you wanna make gold crafting items you have maybe 3 weeks to do it before work orders are flooded with crafters. That is assuming the raiding guilds just turn don't turn inwards since they will be the only ones with the bops...

  18. #438
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    I'm telling you now... if you wanna make gold crafting items you have maybe 3 weeks to do it before work orders are flooded with crafters. That is assuming the raiding guilds just turn don't turn inwards since they will be the only ones with the bops...
    Those mats won't matter since you just send it in the work order
    Max pointed it out on stream that raid guilds might just contract out crafters or crafting guilds because it takes too much time investment to get the ability to craft at the highest level

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronsin View Post
    Reading must be hard for you. "Auction Houses across all realms on a given region will now share commodity listings (gems, herbs, flasks, consumables, etc.). Items that aren’t commodities –- like armor and weapons –- will continue to be realm-specific."
    It's not even the AH it's the BoP armor using mats and can only be done via work orders which NOBODY has said would be region wide

    I'm trying to understand what is confusing about the work order system

  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Man View Post
    Those mats won't matter since you just send it in the work order
    Max pointed it out on stream that raid guilds might just contract out crafters or crafting guilds because it takes too much time investment to get the ability to craft at the highest level

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    It's not even the AH it's the BoP armor using mats and can only be done via work orders which NOBODY has said would be region wide

    I'm trying to understand what is confusing about the work order system
    I can't see them contracting out anything... why would they? Maybe method would but " takes to much time" is 5mins if you buy the mats.

    People are adding in all these features in their heads that simply are not going to exist. You are going to be as special and unique as every other player that maxed out leggo crafting this expansion.

    The system is just designed to create waste by procing lower quality items from time to time.

  20. #440
    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    Outside of a new class and new zones / raids.
    thats literaly what wrath added and it was peak of wow and is considered one of (if not "the") best expansions in wows history...

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    Quote Originally Posted by pastar View Post
    What the hell do you think a new xpac is suppose to be if not this?
    right?
    i love peoples logic - wrath added just class and zones/raids its considered best, DF adds it its not enough
    "old expansions" were amazing with patches having nothing but raid, hell class changes (todays hotfixes) were considered patch feature in wrath, yet somehow todays patches with new zone and some new features ON TOP OF THE RAID are considered "empty" patches... like...how?
    people are so damn whiny...

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