What is there for casuals?

[Skildar]

His conclusion is coming from the hard data that they have. He's wasn't saying that on a whim, he was saying it because the data compelled him to. You are just objecting because you don't like that what he's saying is undeniably true.

oh my bad now I understand... you don't want to discuss it and you don't want people saying anything contradictory... ok then have a nice day

[Tyris Flare]

Ah, yes, more 12 year old quote cherry-picking from a guy who has said many other things and probably changed his mind countless times in the time since, especially now that he's working on one of the most successful games of all time (which is highly competitive and notoriously toxic, yet makes bank)

People really don't need to launder their opinions this way. Just stay what you want and be honest!

-I want the game to be easier so I can complete all the content. Great!
-I want the game to be harder so I can feel good about defeating content other people can't. Great!

That's really all we need! All the quote farming and abstract design talk is just people trying to validate their own opinions ex post facto. We don't need to pretend there is objectivity where none exists.

[Raisei]

Something I was wondering recently. Assuming theres no new big features to be announced.... what is there for casual players in Dragonflight? It, as of now, just looks like another WoD-esque: We only care about what hardcore players do. But at least WoD had the Garrison which, while kinda shit, was at least something that all players could take part in.

As several people have asked before (and you ignored it) I ask what is stopping you from doing the content everybody else is doing?

Let me guess: When you say "casual" what you actually mean is content that does not require you to

a) join groups, because eeewww, why does this MMO have to have other people around?

b) learn more then the absolute basics of your class, because that would be effort and effort is something only them filthy "hardcore" players can afford to invest in this hobby.

But of course this "casual" content rewards at least the same level of gear as Heroic raiding, because how is it fair that them dirty "hardcore" players get things I do not get!!

This is just another thread of a person misapropriating the term "casual" to hide the fact that they are too lazy and to anti-social to do the content that this game is all about.

Luckily for you we have many options, SWTOR (which is basically a single-player game for a few years) and FF (which after all is the greatest game in the universe of all times and into the future, no matter if you are "casual" or "hardcore") will be happy to take you in.

So we can skip changing this one MMO into something it never has been and never wanted to be: A single-player game.

Of course you may believe that WoW will die without you, but don't worry, the filthy "hardcore" players will keep it alive.

[potis]

oh my bad now I understand... you don't want to discuss it and you don't want people saying anything contradictory... ok then have a nice day

What he said is that they tried multiple things over the years, without being specific, but generally everyone that played the game knows what those things are (removal of cockblocking things for guilds (attunements), (hard modes and achievements) and eventually progressive buff (ICC), 10man/25man split raiding etc, and other things which semi-worked cause raid participation in ICC went up a lot (freebie gear works), and then plummeted with their attempt with Cataclysm cause it wasnt that people went up in skill, they were overgearing things and following what the others were doing semi-successfully.

Eventually they hit gold mine with LFR, where raid participation in its introduction and MoP, hit up to 60% of max level players, which was massive statistic for them, thats when they decided to stop trying and the game switched to even more segregated gameplay with MoP and eventually WoD and the rest.

I still dont understand how you have people screaming they want to go back to the days where they required 300 days of daily for badges to get the same item averagely, they get in 1 month in current WoW

[Osmeric]

oh my bad now I understand... you don't want to discuss it and you don't want people saying anything contradictory... ok then have a nice day

I've discussed it. Unfortunately, the discussion involves pointing out how comprehensively ridiculous you are being. That's a "you" problem, not a "me" problem.

[dragonflight10]

Let's face it - Housing would actually be great for Casuals (and not only for them). By the way, the devs are in favor of housing, yet Blizz is simply to greedy to make the necessary resources available.

Because they know casuals will play housing for 1-2 months then complain about X thing and quit.
The sort of casuals you are referring typically keep asking for stuff cus they have this weird fantasy in their head and they believe what they want = this needs to be in the game, idk how can they be grown functioning people and think that way lol

[A Chozo]

Curious what you actually want as "we need moar casual content"? Crafting is getting a massive overhaul to the point that it's basically its own endgame, you still have all the old raids to solo and all the new mounts and transmogs to farm for. What else do you need?

When people say "casual content" they mean that the game's overall difficulty and organizational ceiling must be reduced to the levels of Heroic Dungeons, so that all available content becomes "Casual" content. The existence of forms of content that they don't partake create the illusion that the casuals don't have enough stuff to do.

They do. It's just that the game extends in other directions, and that's irritating for some. They want the game tailored exclusively for them.

[Xummy]

Casual players say this game is made for the hardcore.
Hardcore players say this game is made for the casuals.
This is what happens when you try to please everyone. You end up pleasing no one. Which is where this game is currently

[Echo of Soul]

a) join groups, because eeewww, why does this MMO have to have other people around?

When you play the game casually, an hour here or there when you happen to have some free time joining groups may not even be an option because of gatekeeping. If you have two hours to play you may not want to spend 50% of that time idle looking for a group either.

[dragonflight10]

As several people have asked before (and you ignored it) I ask what is stopping you from doing the content everybody else is doing?

Let me guess: When you say "casual" what you actually mean is content that does not require you to

a) join groups, because eeewww, why does this MMO have to have other people around?

b) learn more then the absolute basics of your class, because that would be effort and effort is something only them filthy "hardcore" players can afford to invest in this hobby.

But of course this "casual" content rewards at least the same level of gear as Heroic raiding, because how is it fair that them dirty "hardcore" players get things I do not get!!

This is just another thread of a person misapropriating the term "casual" to hide the fact that they are too lazy and to anti-social to do the content that this game is all about.

Luckily for you we have many options, SWTOR (which is basically a single-player game for a few years) and FF (which after all is the greatest game in the universe of all times and into the future, no matter if you are "casual" or "hardcore") will be happy to take you in.

So we can skip changing this one MMO into something it never has been and never wanted to be: A single-player game.

Of course you may believe that WoW will die without you, but don't worry, the filthy "hardcore" players will keep it alive.

This comment is GOLD, those lazy and anti-social people who keep suggesting that the game should cater to them are so annoying and delusional.

[Lathspell]

When you play the game casually, an hour here or there when you happen to have some free time joining groups may not even be an option because of gatekeeping. If you have two hours to play you may not want to spend 50% of that time idle looking for a group either.

Atleast for m+ groups usually form in a few minutes though. Haven't tried pug raiding though.

[Nymrohd]

Casual is a weird term.

If we are talking about people who prefer non-instanced content, the answer is obvious. Crafting will be your focus in Dragonflight. I would like to assume that it will go well beyond gathering but also include grinding mobs and completing any number of world events.

If we are talking casuals as in people who play few hours and prefer non-organized play, M+ is still there and will now feel reasonably different every season with the dungeon rotation.

[flan1337]

Casuals should rejoice Dragonflight doesnt havent pointless expansion only systems.

The one thing I hated about BfA and SL is if you ever join late into the expansion, you basically had to watch YouTube videos just to understand what you need to do. Maybe this isn't the case for everyone, but I completely forgot that torgast even existed (and hated doing it).

[ellieg]

When you play the game casually, an hour here or there when you happen to have some free time joining groups may not even be an option because of gatekeeping. If you have two hours to play you may not want to spend 50% of that time idle looking for a group either.

Why not spend 10% of the time forming the group instead?

[nvaelz]

World content in SL outside of farming achievements, cosmetics etc. = Swipe bears in korthia and aoe loot.
World content in Classic wow = alot more than swiping bears.

Literally Oribos as a hub you don't even wanna leave cuz every zone is lame. Best zone is the maw and it's depressive.

WTB good world content. Maybe if there wasn't personal loot and just a bunch of premade groups aoe grinding rare spawns it could be good.

And if you're gearing - why even bother doing any world content or any dungeons, just afk in pvp until u can do m+/pvp

Literally worst gearing system, just afk in Oribos and do some bgs. WHICH is fine btw it's great that we can gear like this but literally no on tier world content gear since idk when. Man these crit trinkets in BFA was fun to maybe get one in titanforge that never happened but atleast it was some impossible dream to get like a 70% efficiency loot from world content lol just for the fun, but Blizzard don't want us to have fun they want us to be meta slaves.

Go be a pepega esport tryhard and compete to push da ratings XD

I don't even know why I bother. I don't even care about world content. I'll enjoy afking in Oribos until DF arrives and I'll quest and get softcapped gear and then maybe gear the once per week vault activity or if it sucks I might quit and come back 3 months later and get full gear anyway and not care about their new "10% more power" system they try to impose on players to be addicted and play every week or farm exalted for or whatever.

So boring seasonal garbage content world designed around token sales and competitive pve/pvp.

"How do we squeeze as much money out of players as possible" 0 respect and content is designed around it in the most lame ways. It's quite easy farming gold in SL but it's designed to be OMEGA boring so the entire world is boring lol. Why ? TOKEN SALES.

Thanks Blizzard for making your world so boring so we will buy more tokens. Thanks for making the legendary system so fun and exciting so we want to deck out our chars with your tokengear. Thanks for making all viable content a gold boosting service = token sales.

Difference between retail and classic wow is that in the "before time" the knowledge in how to milk people out of their money has changed.

Used to be = create a good product. Now it's = have a good product and make deceptive design choices to get as much profits as possible.

Remember the times b4 micro transactions? XD Oh man, games companies would design a good game and they would sell it and make money. It's easier now and I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND the sentiment of wanting micro transactions in your game i think they're great but honestly if it's gonna literally ruin the games it's not worth it it's unbalanced.

it was worse in early/mid SL when a legendary cost like 1 token and then Blizzard "hotfixed" the issue like 4 months later lol, like how they add cosmic flux to the vendor after a certain set of time to create illusory content buffs.

HILARIOUS cuz it's all about the MONEY MILK MACHINE lol, damn I hate the shareholders behind Blizzard so much it's amazing, go drive your yachts of the face of the earth.

[Echo of Soul]

Why not spend 10% of the time forming the group instead?

Because gatekeeping doesn't allow for it to happen that fast. If you can only play for a couple of hours per week you're not going to have a rio score that anyone will accept so finding a group for the dungeon you want to run can literally take hours.

[ellieg]

Because gatekeeping doesn't allow for it to happen that fast. If you can only play for a couple of hours per week you're not going to have a rio score that anyone will accept so finding a group for the dungeon you want to run can literally take hours.

I'm saying start the group instead of trying to join one.

[Ealyssa]

joining groups may not even be an option because of gatekeeping.

That's only an issue when you want to be carried by random people you don't know in content you don't have the level to access by yourself.
You can't do a +21 without knowing the dungeons, with 238 ilvl and 783 score.

That's not gatekeeping tho, that's the NBA telling you you can't just come and play basketball with them. You can totally play basketball as much as you want in your freetime, but be realistic to the level you're playing. When you stop comparing yourself to others you'll be way happier. Play to have fun, to tackle things you didn't do before. No need to just aim for max content everytime.

You also don't HAVE TO group with randoms even with a low gametime. Plenty of social guilds will take you and happily play with you when you're online.

[Echo of Soul]

I'm saying start the group instead of trying to join one.

How? If the key I have is not for the dungeon I want to run it's literally impossible, I have to join someone elses group.

[ellieg]

How? If the key I have is not for the dungeon I want to run it's literally impossible, I have to join someone elses group.

You run that key, then get a new one. Try to do it faster and you'll build score. Itll be another completed run that also looks good on your profile. Youll get a new higher key that will also give you score. You may also get loot that increases ur ilvl. Youll get valor to increase your ilvl. Youll get vault progress to increase your ilvl.

A couple hours per week means 2+ keys a week. Just keep grinding your own key whenever you can play and you'll build rio. Itll take longer than if you could target the exact keys you want/need but that's part of pugging / being casual / having limited play time.

And don't tell me its not possible because my own ksm achieves I get every season state that it is.