Master looter back!!!!!

[hulkgor]

I don't think i've ever read so many wrong statements in a single topic in a long while.

Good ol' mmo-champ userbase!

Best part, people didn't even read the original statement and the new form, and its restrictions, so they just spew nonsense. Maybe go read it and actually understand it?

[Coldkil]

pretty sure those people who would be screwed over gear and then kicked out of guild could care a bit...

If you're pugging, and they tell you "hey, you need to join you know, trust me" and you fall for that, you deserve your loot to be stolen.

Also, if your guild does that, it's a shit guild and you should leave.

- - - Updated - - -

So it’s a dictatorship? Good to know!

No, it's just "learn to find likeminded people tonplay the game", something that got lost on the way to here.

Players should just stop treating other ones as expandables.

[Lolites]

If you're pugging, and they tell you "hey, you need to join you know, trust me" and you fall for that, you deserve your loot to be stolen.

Also, if your guild does that, it's a shit guild and you should leave.

"yes you can join our raid guild, with trial period" bam, fools get caught
yes, if you fall for scam you deserve to be stolen from, thats why all those scams irl are completely legal and moral and we dont even try to prevent or punish them, right? RIGHT?
giving people options to screw over others is a bad idea, especialy since it comes with another issues (like loot which NOBODY can even equip is an example) and with VERY little positives...

[Popastique]

So it’s a dictatorship? Good to know!

That was a good laugh, thanks

[Haosmash]

Personally I like master loot ,or group loot better,because with personal loot Ive gotten same item from bosses way too many times and with master loot I have actually finished gearing my character ,not all groups are bad and if you are in guild ML was really great tool to handle loot. PL has too many restrictions and seeing boss not give me weapon for 10294309th time is very annoying. In any case whatever comes,ml or not, I hope expansion itself is good,thats all that we need.

[Relapses]

This is always an interesting subject because the anti-ML players love to frame ML as an "objectively bad design." As if it's somehow objectively a bad thing that some players in some guilds may like to control how loot is distributed from the raid. Like, I get it. People want participation trophies and PL is the fairest way to ensure that people are on a level playing field. And it's probably 100% correct that PuG raiding is much, much better off with PL than it ever was before. But to pretend that the status quo the game operated under for almost two decades is "objectively bad" is, well, a genuinely bad faith argument. There are pros and cons to both systems; Blizzard obviously made a pretty clear choice when they decided to eliminate ML and Group Loot seems like a half measure to kind of give it back. I can see it going two ways from here:

Scenario A: Group Loot returns, players respond well to it and it become the de facto loot paradigm for PuG raiding. At some indeterminate point in the future Blizzard returns ML for guild runs.

Scenario B: Group Loot returns, players turn it into a fuckery mess with all sorts of weird ass loot rules in PuGs and suddenly loot drama skyrockets. Blizzard says fuck it and returns us to forced PL cuz ain't nobody got time for that shit.

My hopes are that it plays out in Scenario A but I can easily see it going the opposite way as well. Either way, I'm glad they decided to at least try something, even if it's a half measure, because a world where Tier exists with forced PL is honestly not a world (of Warcraft) that I'd like to be in.

[Feral Druid ist Op]

Although I agree with the priority, I have no idea what do you mean by "real mythic guild"?

A real Mythic Guild is a guild that is build to clear mythic form the gound up with like minded ppl not one of those feeder guilds that do 3 bosses and call it cuz they are bad and the good players move one.

[psyquest]

Sorry pal. My raid, my rules. You want to raid in the organized environment I have created, that actually kills bosses and isn't a shitshow sorry excuse of a raid? You agree to my rules. You don't want to raid in this organized environment? Your call, don't join. I'm fine either way. But I'll be damned if random trials start telling me how to lead a team and how to distribute loot, when they obviously have 0 experience with either.

I don't understand the link with my post. Could you explain?

[b1gh3x]

This is a bad change and likely a nail in the coffin to pug raids.

[Coldkil]

"yes you can join our raid guild, with trial period" bam, fools get caught
yes, if you fall for scam you deserve to be stolen from, thats why all those scams irl are completely legal and moral and we dont even try to prevent or punish them, right? RIGHT?
giving people options to screw over others is a bad idea, especialy since it comes with another issues (like loot which NOBODY can even equip is an example) and with VERY little positives...

You can always say "no thanks" and search for another less shady guild. Or join groups with personal loot.

[Mendzia]

So it’s a dictatorship? Good to know!

???

"yes you can join our raid guild, with trial period" bam, fools get caught
yes, if you fall for scam you deserve to be stolen from, thats why all those scams irl are completely legal and moral and we dont even try to prevent or punish them, right? RIGHT?
giving people options to screw over others is a bad idea, especialy since it comes with another issues (like loot which NOBODY can even equip is an example) and with VERY little positives...

Stop acting like you are forced to join or PL will be deleted.
You can also cry about Guild Banks becuase when you put something here there is possibility that it will be taken by somebody else.
For 99% people adding ML back to the game would change absolutely nothing.

[Relapses]

This is a bad change and likely a nail in the coffin to pug raids.

...only if players try to enforce weird loot rules. Need-before-greed was a PuG loot paradigm I used in PuGs even when ML was a thing so it isn't really that bad.

[Revamp Man]

Group loot returning is great due to the removal of restrictions
My guild will probably use personal loot still as long as we don't have the restrictions that ruined the system.

I can finally help gear tanks and healers immediately again

[MidnyteTV]

Are you deliberately not reading what I'm writing? Or are you simply trolling?

These people would not have killed Jailer Heroic without my leadership. The effect I had on their gaming experience as a player, and as a leader, has caused these men and women to improve and become better players. Do you not owe gratitude your English teacher for teaching you how to read and write proper English? Of course you do. By the same token, these players owe part of their success to MY efforts, MY leadership, MY skills in management and MY time that I devoted, to THEM. THAT is why noone batted an eyelash when I told them I will be the sole Master Looter. That is why when we actually managed to kill Heroic Jailer, I got a ton of whispers thanking me for my leadership and for bringing them to a position to get their first Ahead of the Curve achievement. Because they know, from experience, that I have used my "power" as a raid leader for THEIR betterment as players. And they respect that.

Hell, one of my raiders, a 50 year old goddamn TANK engineer, told me he hasn't had this much fun in WoW for over a decade. And that means something. Maybe not to you, cause you don't know me or my team, but it sure as hell does to me.

And this is why, for my team, the return of Master Looter is only a good thing. I have been raiding for 18 years, since 2004. Hundreds of thousands of epics have entered and left my bags. They know that I will be using my power as Master Looter for ONE sole purpose - increasing the % success chance of the raid as a whole. Just like every decision I've made for the past 4 months we've been raiding Sepulcher.

True fax. Those who disagree are stupid.

- - - Updated - - -

pretty sure those people who would be screwed over gear and then kicked out of guild could care a bit...

- - - Updated - - -



from this attitude alone its almost guaranteed these people would do better with different leader without you and your MASSIVE ego... you without them on the other hand, probably not so much

- - - Updated - - -



actualy, you sound like that...
if captain of any successful team/group would go "its all thanks TO ME" that shows only thing - team is great, captain is narcisist and should be kicked or at least demoted, as team would most likely do better without him in charge

Without leaders like Dalinos, parasites like yourself would never see any content worth a damn. He has an earned ego because he leads people who otherwise couldn't lead a Hogger raid.

[Dalinos]

True fax. Those who disagree are stupid.

- - - Updated - - -



Without leaders like Dalinos, parasites like yourself would never see any content worth a damn. He has an earned ego because he leads people who otherwise couldn't lead a Hogger raid.

Wow. First comment of support in the whole thread. Thanks dude. Appreciated. They nearly managed to convince me that my efforts and my time spent to train my squad was nothing to be proud of.

[XDurionX]

Just one question: Why?

Because people abuse it to the max, why do you even have to ask? That's the only reason people want it back.

[Swnem]

I see you are one of the internet doctors that is able to examine others and make diagnosis basing on their posts...
How about just move on and read posts more carefully before commenting?



Yes.
Your opinion is objective one for sure...

Please do tell us what it solves.
It's something to be abused by top guilds, nothing else. Most of the playerbase is glad to not have to deal with loot management and loot drama.

Actually even being group loot it's extremely bad. Blizz is saying you have to accept you want to hand over the loot whether it's good for you or not or deal with the social consequences and that will be the return of loot drama. Maybe it's just to remind everyone about how much worse it was.

[Icechaosss]

Please do tell us what it solves.
It's something to be abused by top guilds, nothing else. Most of the playerbase is glad to not have to deal with loot management and loot drama.

You really don't speak for most of the playerbase.

PL also is being abused by top guilds. I hold no stake in this race, I really don't care if they keep PL or ML, or even GL, but all of these should be options based on the group.

If you join a group using PL, and you want ML? Leave. If you join a group using ML and you want PL? Leave. It's really not a hard concept.

[Popastique]

Because people abuse it to the max, why do you even have to ask? That's the only reason people want it back.

Nope, not the only reason. Progressing on bosses with proper loot system that allows you to increase the value of certain raiders who have direct impact during certain part of the encounter = huge +. And if lifting personal loot ilvl trade restrictions is a no - this GL addition will do nicely. After all no one is forcing you to use ML or GL if you don't want to.

- - - Updated - - -

If you join a group using PL, and you want ML? Leave. If you join a group using ML and you want PL? Leave. It's really not a hard concept.

^^ This sums it up

[Compher]

GL? I do not care much.
ML? I think it is best type of loot distribution and got its roots in classic RPGs.

I think the problem with master looter is that it can just lead to arguments too easily, example:

278 Weapon drops, both player A and player B need it.

Player A has a 272 weapon that they acquired via farming m+ and getting a drop or upgrading with valor, they run m+ a lot.
Player B has a 265 weapon that they acquired via raiding heroic because they don't like playing m+.

What does the master looter do here? It's a bigger upgrade, and thus helps the team more by giving it to player B.

Player A supposed to be ok with this? Player B got rewarded because they play the game less and don't put in the effort that player A does.

or

Give it to player A because they "deserve" it more. This is worse for the team as the ilvl in one slot increased by 6 when it could have increased by 13 for someone else.