Poll: Does Charity work and has it ever worked?

Thread: Charity.

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  1. #1
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Charity.



    Another topic and Poll I submit for discussion CHARITY!


    I think at sometime in our lives we all give or have donated in some way or another, others sometimes even make it part of an annual thing. So I was inspired to ask a questions.

    Threat Poll Question;

    Does Charity work and has it ever worked to solve any major problems?

    Meaning in your life and your experience through the years what cause or group have you given to that actually accomplished what it set out to do.

    What are some of your favorite Charities:
    My personal favorites are United Way.
    My Church and the Salvation Army.



    Personally I have to say, I am not so sure anymore, it seems more like the charities I've always known since I have been alive haven't really eradicated whatever problem they were meant to cure.

    I realize that isn't always the reality and making things better not worse is the immediate goal. But I am not sure it actually solves (Past tense) any specific problem, the problems yesterday only seems to have been amplified.

    Now days most charity seems like a business but surprisingly Go Fund Me seems to be the most effective in this day and age.
    Milli Vanilli, Bigger than Elvis

  2. #2
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    It is definitely true that plenty of charities are shitty either in that most of their funds don't actually go towards helping people, or in that their approach is questionable. That's why it's a good idea to look into that causes and organisations that you are considering supporting. Sites like charitynavigator.org can show you how a particular charity spends its money responsibility or whether it's just going back into marketing or worse to pad some higher up's pocket. A little bit of research can tell you whether a charity's mission is actually going to create sustainable improvement to their targeted community or is creating a dangerous reliance that will crash once they no longer support.

    That said, charities absolutely can do good, but if your metric for whether they "work" is whether they solve the issue they are created for, you're looking at things completely wrong. While there certainly are nonprofits that are created to address a very specific thing with a clearly defined end goal, most don't function that way. Take one of my favourite charities, MSF: I don't think anyone could sincerely argue that the ngo hasn't done a world of good in many places and for many issues. They didn't "solve" war or illness and in fact those things may be increasing overall in the world, but that isn't a reasonable goal and that isn't what they aim to do. For what they are intended to do: yes, they absolutely "work." Most charities have practical goals of improvements to the lives of the specific community or group they are targeting.

    It's also worth noting that supporting a charity doesn't necessarily just mean throwing money at them. You can donate your time, too.

    As I mentioned, MSF is probably my favourite but I also support a couple other nonprofits for issues I care about/think are important either monetarily or with actual in-person volunteering.


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  3. #3
    Herald of the Titans enigma77's Avatar
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    Do charities work? Uh yeah? They give money to the needy.

    Unless you're talking about corrupt people, who I think are breaking the law by defrauding you.

  4. #4
    I rather local observable charities myself I am always skeptical that the middle men dont take all the money in larger organizations

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post
    Personally I have to say, I am not so sure anymore, it seems more like the charities I've always known since I have been alive haven't really eradicated whatever problem they were meant to cure.
    i kind of think that might be the start of the problem - charities aren't meant to cure anything, they're a desperate scramble by empathetic people to react to a systemic problem that is embedded within the fabric of human civilization.

    if you look at it as purely an input/output equation, the human race has reached a point where the incoming resources generated by the species vastly outpaces the resources needed to be able to be distributed to every single human being alive and provide them with a safe comfortable living for their entire existence.
    (and by 'resources' i mean both tangible like food and fuels as well as intangible like profit and economic activity)

    as of right now, the only reason that every single human being alive on this planet isn't having a stable 1st world life is because we've chosen not to.
    the resources are available, it's not like we can't produce enough food in the world to feed everyone, it's not like we can't produce enough wood and fiberglass and labor costs to build everyone a house and give everyone running water and electricity... we just decided as a species "nah, don't wanna."

    everything that charities work against are things that are features of civilization, not bugs.
    poverty and homelessness is allowed to exist because it's a gun to the head of the working class that says "this could be you at a snap of our fingers. don't ask for too much. don't complain too loud. don't think too hard about the fact that over 90% of your life on this planet is spent making someone else money. if you get too uppity we'll take away your job and you'll be a bum on the street like these other bums"

    disease is allowed to exist untreated because there's no way to make giving everyone access to medical care profitable to private companies, so we just shrug and let people die and be sick and miserable and left untreated because we can't effectively monetize the process of curing them.

    charities are there so that 'the people' can scramble to try to address problems that society (ie, government) should fix but doesn't.
    nothing that charities work for could ever really be solved, it's not a straight path from A. there's a problem, to B. the problem is solved - charity is an endless, infinite money suck that just devours what little excess the poor-but-sympathetic can mange to scrape together in order to either give something to the even less fortunate for one day or one meal, or to funnel that meager excess to the hands of the rich.

  6. #6
    As long as charity is not tax deductible and the charitable organization is audited to some extent to prove it is at least trying to be effective, I have no issue with it. But NGOs that are not accountable to anyone (like churches, many of which behave as charitable organization) are problematic. And deduction of charitable contributions as expenses is tantamount to theft for me; you are essentially claiming you have the right to decide how your taxes are distributed alone instead of allowing the government as a representative of the people to chose.

    If we need charity to solve something locally, then the government is doing a shitty job imo.

  7. #7
    Humanitarian organizations work.
    Charities are always suspect.

  8. #8
    The Lightbringer
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    Depends on the charity, you have some that are clearly corrupt and only like 10% of your donations go to the cause, rest fill the pockets of the people in charge.
    Then you have groups like the Red Cross who do set out to do good but fail miserably for various reasons https://www.propublica.org/article/h...-built-6-homes
    (Article is from 2015 so not sure on what’s the current update)
    Personally I probably won’t donate money to a major organization.
    Last edited by Rustedsaint; 2022-07-21 at 11:58 AM.

  9. #9
    Herald of the Titans
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Humanitarian organizations work.
    Charities are always suspect.
    This.
    There are humanitarian organizations that are funded on a charity basis who get positive results. But Charity itself doesn't work as it is generally a baindaid on systematic problems!
    The charity that does work tends to be the things that focus on fixing said underlying issue!
    - Lars

  10. #10
    Most provide something. It's usually how much thats the question. Most of them fund massive enterprises of wealth and then "provide" enough to keep the hungry kids alive so you still need to keep giving. So they advertise ending hunger but really they keep people hungry enough so the charity needs to continue and they get to continue the "nonprofit" charity.

    Some of course are evil af and some of course are genuine as can be. Most fall somewhere in the middle but certainly are a business. So leaning evil af probably is more common than it should be when it comes to "charity".

  11. #11
    I've always given to charity, I started doing so when I was in my late teens. At the start I donated a small amount to various different organizations, but as I grew older and learned more about it all I dropped certain charities and swapped them for others.

    For example I used to donate to the red cross and doctors without borders, but when I learned more about both organizations I decided to stop donating to the red cross and doubled my donation for the other.

    There are many different problems with charities, obviously fraud is a big one especially among the smaller charities. And certain big charities have problems with how they spend their money (too much goes to marketing/management).

    But the biggest problem in my opinion is the complexity of it, charities have to deal with a lot of different people. In conflict areas where many charities want to go to give aid it's impossible to get a foothold without permission from whomever rules the area, and in conflict areas that's often not one person or group. Which means deals will have to be made to guarantee the relative safety of the volunteers and employees of the charities.

    There have been cases (and probably still are) where groups abuse this system and starve large groups of people in order too attract large charities and then take money or supplies from the charities for them to be allowed to do their work. The charity is now also partly responsible for the people's suffering, which is something nobody wants.

    Which leads to two kind of responses from charities; either they say something along the lines of "we're not responsible for the actions of terrorist and we're just here to help" in which case I'd drop my donations too them, or they try to learn from their mistakes in which case I probably won't stop donating.
    Last edited by P for Pancetta; 2022-07-21 at 12:50 PM.

  12. #12
    Immortal Poopymonster's Avatar
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    I donate when I know where it's going.
    Do you refuse to give help to LGBTQ+ people in need? Fuck off.
    Do you have to be part of your religion to receive help? Fuck right off.
    Do you require adherence to your professed religious dogma for assistance? Fuck all the way off.
    Do you give to people regardless of race/creed/gender/orientation/etc, but based on that they need help? Tell me more.
    I prefer local to large org. More is skimmed off the top when there are more layers of stuffed suits in the office.
    Personally, I donate time at a local soup kitchen. Local grocery store has a "Spend X dollars in groceries get a free turkey or ham" at Thanksgiving, I cash mine in and donate it. Socks or underwear on sale/clearance at a Target, Burlington or Ollie's? Buy a fuckload and donate them. Sale on hygiene products? I pick up an extra to donate. Underwear, socks, tampons/pads are drastically overlooked by people who donate.
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  13. #13
    OP paints a false dichotomy. Charities working seems to be defined as “having solved the problem”.

    In reality charities usually result in problems being less severe, or contributing a small part on the road to an eventual solution.

    Is there a lot to improve about the way charities are run? Sure. That’s a seperate issue though.

  14. #14
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Does Charity work and has it ever worked to solve any major problems?
    On average I think they work relatively well compared to the government. The government gets more resources and also hasn't permanently solved national hunger or housing issues, cured cancer, prevented species from going extinct, etc. Yet there seems to be a double standard here where people judge charities more harshly for failing to reach their objectives in our lifetime.
    Last edited by PC2; 2022-07-21 at 04:43 PM.

  15. #15
    Elemental Lord TJ's Avatar
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    To subjective imo, as depends on the charity and the organisers of said charity. Corruption can play a big part.

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    Herald of the Titans Tuor's Avatar
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    I normally always make a contribution to the food bank when they asking for supplies at the supermarkets. I also donote to those that need, but i have limits doing so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Humanitarian organizations work.
    Charities are always suspect.
    Couldn't agree more with this statment.

  17. #17
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malkiah View Post
    i kind of think that might be the start of the problem - charities aren't meant to cure anything, they're a desperate scramble by empathetic people to react to a systemic problem that is embedded within the fabric of human civilization.

    if you look at it as purely an input/output equation, the human race has reached a point where the incoming resources generated by the species vastly outpaces the resources needed to be able to be distributed to every single human being alive and provide them with a safe comfortable living for their entire existence.
    (and by 'resources' i mean both tangible like food and fuels as well as intangible like profit and economic activity)

    as of right now, the only reason that every single human being alive on this planet isn't having a stable 1st world life is because we've chosen not to.
    the resources are available, it's not like we can't produce enough food in the world to feed everyone, it's not like we can't produce enough wood and fiberglass and labor costs to build everyone a house and give everyone running water and electricity... we just decided as a species "nah, don't wanna."

    everything that charities work against are things that are features of civilization, not bugs.
    poverty and homelessness is allowed to exist because it's a gun to the head of the working class that says "this could be you at a snap of our fingers. don't ask for too much. don't complain too loud. don't think too hard about the fact that over 90% of your life on this planet is spent making someone else money. if you get too uppity we'll take away your job and you'll be a bum on the street like these other bums"

    disease is allowed to exist untreated because there's no way to make giving everyone access to medical care profitable to private companies, so we just shrug and let people die and be sick and miserable and left untreated because we can't effectively monetize the process of curing them.

    charities are there so that 'the people' can scramble to try to address problems that society (ie, government) should fix but doesn't.
    nothing that charities work for could ever really be solved, it's not a straight path from A. there's a problem, to B. the problem is solved - charity is an endless, infinite money suck that just devours what little excess the poor-but-sympathetic can mange to scrape together in order to either give something to the even less fortunate for one day or one meal, or to funnel that meager excess to the hands of the rich.
    Yeah I get charities aren't supposed to be a cure all, but in many cases charities being set up almost all I can see that are supposed to address it, have done so as the problem has gotten worse.

    I mean all I've seen.

    As for the reason Homelessness is allowed, I don't buy into conspiracy theories, BUT, I do think it's possibly become that way because maybe unconsciously it's accepted.

    Some of the ideas people have on where people should live and how they survive is very much based on magical thinking.



    I think this nails it.
    Milli Vanilli, Bigger than Elvis

  18. #18
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Amadeus View Post


    I think this nails it.
    Seriously? That guy just sounds like a crazy pessimist who hates civilization and progress...

  19. #19
    Void Lord Doctor Amadeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    Seriously? That guy just sounds like a crazy pessimist who hates civilization and progress...
    Well the movie over all is pretty good, but it's mostly from the perspective of a couple of pretentious dudes, but the writing is sound and his statement is ultimately true. Whether you appreciate that or not.
    Milli Vanilli, Bigger than Elvis

  20. #20
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Do charities work?

    No.

    At a societal level, charities do not even come close as a stand in for actually policies to address poverty, lack of healthcare, etc, etc.

    Are charities useless? Also no. They do offer help, especially at a more local and/or individual level. At least, the good charities do. They are worthwhile causes and they do help some things get funding. There is good that comes out of them. But they'll never be a replacement for policy.
    Putin khuliyo

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