What is there for casuals?

[Echo of Soul]

well according to this thread if you schedule a date you are essentially married

If you have set date nights then you're right, it's pretty serious and not really that casual anymore.

[Revamp Man]

If you have set date nights then you're right, it's pretty serious and not really that casual anymore.

never said date nights i said
schedule A date
one date
literally the bare minimum unless you randomly show up at someones place

[KSM899]

I am a very casual player, and the only thing that I don't do is mythic raid and dungeons, so I consider everything else a casual friendly stuff.

[Loveliest]

The same thing casuals have had for 18 years. Raids/dungeons/pvp.

Casual =/= bad
Casual =/= solo player

The mostly accepted definition of casual IS that they don't do the 3 major endgame things: raid, m+, pvp.

That being said, what do they do in SL? What did they do in BFA?
So in general I guess: level chars, pet battles, achis, xmog, mount farming, rep farming, crafting (new craft trees and all). This expansion "big feature" is raising your dragon. You also have experiencing all dragon "covenants". Level a drakthyr.

[T-34]

Something I was wondering recently. Assuming theres no new big features to be announced.... what is there for casual players in Dragonflight? It, as of now, just looks like another WoD-esque: We only care about what hardcore players do. But at least WoD had the Garrison which, while kinda shit, was at least something that all players could take part in.

The same as there has always been.
You can do M+, raids, PvP, collect transmog, do RP, farm herbs.
Casual players can do exactly the same as hardcore players, except going for Hall of Fame and some of the PvP titles.

But if you by any chance by "casual" mean players that are wilfully unwilling to put in an effort to better themselves then those players have banned themselves from playing with normal people. But that is nothing special for WoW. It is so in all aspects of life - nobody wants to do anything with slackers and leeches.

I for one by "casual" mean a player that doesn't play organized in a guild or a fixed M+-group. But that doesn't infer that such a player is unwilling to do his best or is unable to find other people of similar skill, attitude and progression to play with.

[Cthulhu 2020]

You mean the people who complained (at leaste here) that everything connected to these systems is only for the hardcore crowd?

You can do everything you could have done before. The only thing they did take away the endless grind.

Throgast for example was initially to hard so they nerfed it and then it was to easy and no one wanted to play it anymore.

What exactly are casuals doing in this game? Running thorgast or in BfA Isles every day? Doubt it.

You can still hunt achivments, do dailys/WQs, farm transmog and dungeons. Same as before and more than in the old expansions. You can farm gear without raiding or using Mythic+... pet battles if you like those.

See this is the entire problem. Casuals want casual content. Content that is designed for hardcore players and then is either reduced in difficulty or has an "easy mode" put in is NOT casual content. Pet battles are casual content. So is mount collecting. It's any fun and exciting system that is not directly related to player power.

Dragonflight may have a lot of people excited, but if Blizzard once again whiffs it on REAL casual content, and not just hardcore content retuned to be easy, then I doubt things will get much better in Dragonflight.

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But that doesn't infer that such a player is unwilling to do his best or is unable to find other people of similar skill, attitude and progression to play with.

Reading every post in this thread, it's become clear that most people don't know what people want when they say casual content. Casual content is not always (and often isn't) just harder PvE content tuned to be more accessible. It's fun side activities that keep people engaged with the game and playing in the world of the game. Blizzard doesn't need to design complex systems that require intense balancing. Just create fun mini systems that players can enjoy.

[Sondrelk]

See this is the entire problem. Casuals want casual content. Content that is designed for hardcore players and then is either reduced in difficulty or has an "easy mode" put in is NOT casual content. Pet battles are casual content. So is mount collecting. It's any fun and exciting system that is not directly related to player power.

Dragonflight may have a lot of people excited, but if Blizzard once again whiffs it on REAL casual content, and not just hardcore content retuned to be easy, then I doubt things will get much better in Dragonflight.

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Reading every post in this thread, it's become clear that most people don't know what people want when they say casual content. Casual content is not always (and often isn't) just harder PvE content tuned to be more accessible. It's fun side activities that keep people engaged with the game and playing in the world of the game. Blizzard doesn't need to design complex systems that require intense balancing. Just create fun mini systems that players can enjoy.

So in your mind casual content is just all the content now related to player power? That seems quite reductive, especially considering that doing all the Pet Battle content like the dungeons or Timeless isle tournament requires far more time and effort than queueing for random BGs or LFR.

This also puts an arbitrary line on what content was designed to be difficult, and then made easy, and what content scales upwards from a trivial starting point.
Going back to pet battles. Is it fair to assume that the baseline for pet battles is fighting a level 1 rat in SW or Orgrimmar, and that it becomes more difficult from there? Or coudl you make a valid argument that it was designed from the starting point of difficult challenges like Legendary spirits in Pandaria and had a barebones introduction?

What is to say that the baseline of dungeons and raids isnt the most casual of introductions like normal dungeons, or LFR raids, and +20 dungeons, and Mythic raid is just the outlier endpoint for those who really, really engage with the content?

[T-34]

Reading every post in this thread, it's become clear that most people don't know what people want when they say casual content. Casual content is not always (and often isn't) just harder PvE content tuned to be more accessible. It's fun side activities that keep people engaged with the game and playing in the world of the game. Blizzard doesn't need to design complex systems that require intense balancing. Just create fun mini systems that players can enjoy.

If I understand you correctly then by your definition "casual content" equals solo content.
There is some of that in WoW, but at the end of the day WoW is a multiplayer game. That in itself isn't a holy cow, but I think that Blizzard is aware that people aren't willing to pay a fixed sum per month to play a solo game, but that people are willing to pay a fixed sum per month to be able to play with other people.
I'm certain, I have no way to verify my claim, that people that play with other people are being subscribed longer than people that play the game as a solo game.

[Cthulhu 2020]

So in your mind casual content is just all the content now related to player power? That seems quite reductive, especially considering that doing all the Pet Battle content like the dungeons or Timeless isle tournament requires far more time and effort than queueing for random BGs or LFR.

I and many many others see casual content as something that you can log in, do for a bit of time with no prior preparation, and quit whenever you want (within reason).

Pet battles are supremely simple, and even if some of them get "harder", the hardest pet battles can be won in minutes with minimal preparation.

Man it's freaking STRANGE that people have such a visceral reaction AGAINST Blizzard adding casual content. For some odd reason people think that WoW should only ever be about PvP, dungeons and raids? That's fucking wild man. Other MMO's are succeeding with bounteous amounts of content that can just be picked up and played easily.

If I understand you correctly then by your definition "casual content" equals solo content.

Nope. It can be solo, but it can also be group content. But in general, the less people the better. It means less coordination and less time spent. An activity that is fun, engaging, and has an end goal that you can do with your friend is some of the most fun content there is.

I also fail to understand why content cannot be solo. You say that because it's a subscribed MMO that all content must involve other people. Wanna know a secret of the old guard? Back in Everquest, FFXI, etc. the vast majority of content in those games were group only. You couldn't progress or level your character unless you spammed LFG and found a group camping a pack of gnolls.

WoW revolutionized MMOs by making it so that you did not require a group to progress for many things. The mere fact that you could level solo was something unheard of and revolutionary. Being able to play solo is in WoW's DNA. Or at least it WAS. Probably something Blizzard should look into if they're not. Making all content designed only around having to organize groups would be the game's death warrant.

People who think the only content should be raiding + dungeons + PvP are misguided. WoW will continue to deliver that kind of content, and that's not going to change. Arguing against other avenues of fun in an MMO is a quick way to enjoy dead servers.

[Celement]

There will be EIGHT launch dungeons. Stop spreading false information.
4 of them will be open for M+ in season 1, the other 4 in season 2.

I mean that's 4 to me. I might do mythic 0 once but usually I just do questing then 9s to gear then 15s. Its 4 for me and 4 isn't much.

[Dracullus]

I mean that's 4 to me. I might do mythic 0 once but usually I just do questing then 9s to gear then 15s. Its 4 for me and 4 isn't much.

They want to replace every single dungeon in the rotation every season. If season 1 would be 8 new dungeons then only way to achieve that would be 8 old dungeons (or 6 old + 2 new if they release megadungeon early). Sorry, but 4+4 is way better idea.

[Celement]

They want to replace every single dungeon in the rotation every season. If season 1 would be 8 new dungeons then only way to achieve that would be 8 old dungeons (or 6 old + 2 new if they release megadungeon early). Sorry, but 4+4 is way better idea.

It just doesn't feel like enough. If they only want four dungeons they should be aiming for 4 dungeons a patch style. I get it's a leaking ship and they are just desperate to rush it out but 4 dungeons is patch level not expansion level.

[Dracullus]

It just doesn't feel like enough. If they only want four dungeons they should be aiming for 4 dungeons a patch style. I get it's a leaking ship and they are just desperate to rush it out but 4 dungeons is patch level not expansion level.

What the hell are you talking about. They will make 8 dungeons for 10.0. There is nothing desperate or rushed about it. They won't have to tune 4 new dungeons for season 1 M+, but instead same work will have to be done for 4 older dungeons.

[potis]

WoW revolutionized MMOs by making it so that you did not require a group to progress for many things. The mere fact that you could level solo was something unheard of and revolutionary. Being able to play solo is in WoW's DNA. Or at least it WAS. Probably something Blizzard should look into if they're not. Making all content designed only around having to organize groups would be the game's death warrant.

Tell me what solo thing you did that provided you a sense of achievement or a feeling of solo content apart from Mage Tower.

I would really love to hear where this magical solo content is that i have never seen, unless you talk about irrelevant bullshit shit content that you do in 2 hours on Wednesday.

[Daffan]

Is this true though? There are pugs for everything... you get showered in loot. You can get your char heroric raid rdy so fast. It is just that you have to play the game instead of spamming the easiest dungeon available again and again and again and again and again.

Maybe not everyone can get mythic level loot in every spot... so what? Why is it this important to people to take gameplay and gear away from the top end.

If you get that... then what? It is not like you suddenly do more in the game just because you are BiS.

Loot progression is there. People just don't actually want to do work for it. And by that i mean play the game.

Badges have always been a boring sytem imho. You run the same dungeon over and over again and you can acutally calculate when you get the piece of gear. At that point they can just send it to you via mail after x-weeks.

Casuals or more appropriate casual-bads which are the majority are constantly creating their own demise.

"The game is too hard/time consuming xyz" so Blizzard gives them 10yrs worth of catchup, welfare, auto complete and zombie mode zergfests in both dungeons and raids, than they just turn around and start screaming about content droughts lol.

The game literally invalidates everything each patch just to make sure that casual-bads don't get left behind, god forbid they have to actually do content to progress, no the alternative to them is much better, spend 1 day clearing LFR then complain that there is no content until next tier which they can just teleport straight too with catchup.

There is plenty of content for casuals:
They can do +2 to +4 keys.
They can run LFR and half of normal.
They can climb all their way up to 1400.
They can collect more mounts and pets.

Hours of fun!

U joke but there are casuals that are actually good

A casual who is good at the game can spend 3 hours and do more content than a bad casual does in 20 hours

It's just the perception is so warped because 98% of them are the bad variant, like Resident Evil

[scubi666stacy]

Honestly? That doesn't sound half bad. If I'm logging in every day, it should be because the game is inherently fun to play, not because of artificial systems that obligate me to do so.

So much this. I am sick and tired of the daily chores we had for so long, even if you can complete them once every 3 days or such.

[Flower Milk]

The profession revamp looks like some nice casual player content OP. And without a bunch of convoluted systems and borrowed power systems, it looks like it will be easier to make and level alts to do more stuff with more professions I'm hoping.

[Somic]

So much this. I am sick and tired of the daily chores we had for so long, even if you can complete them once every 3 days or such.

I know a lot of people in wow hate this idea, much like I use to before I actually tried it, but this is why I love destiny 2’s version of gear progression.

They give you a metric fuck ton of weekly ‘tasks’ that involve literally every single aspect of the game but it’s super super SUPER casual friendly.

To put it into WoW terms let’s say you start off at 230 item level and the max item level is 270.

From 230 to 250 you can get upgrades literally doing anything, you que a dungeon and you get upgrades by like 2-3 levels per piece. You do a bg you get an upgrade 2-3 levels, basically you can do anything you want. Then you hit a minor soft cap and from 250-260 you get it by either doing dailies and weeklies tied to a specific activity. Then at 260 you hit the real soft cap and you only go up by doing weeklies and the progression slows down a bit.

But the thing about it is if you are a super casual player that only likes to do bgs for example, you WILL hit the hard cap of 270. If you are a super hardcore player you can finish all the weeklies on rotation that doesn’t take too long and you’ll hit the cap faster.

I like this because it doesn’t have a raid or die mentality and if you want the gear with the most unique look or unique perks then you can raid. But if you don’t want to do that you can just que bgs all day or que arenas or que random dungeons. The thing that makes this super nice is that as long as you focus on one thing even casually you can transition to any activity in the game and any difficulty of that activity without it forcing you to go through that activities specific grind.

[NineSpine]

I know a lot of people in wow hate this idea, much like I use to before I actually tried it, but this is why I love destiny 2’s version of gear progression.

They give you a metric fuck ton of weekly ‘tasks’ that involve literally every single aspect of the game but it’s super super SUPER casual friendly.

To put it into WoW terms let’s say you start off at 230 item level and the max item level is 270.

From 230 to 250 you can get upgrades literally doing anything, you que a dungeon and you get upgrades by like 2-3 levels per piece. You do a bg you get an upgrade 2-3 levels, basically you can do anything you want. Then you hit a minor soft cap and from 250-260 you get it by either doing dailies and weeklies tied to a specific activity. Then at 260 you hit the real soft cap and you only go up by doing weeklies and the progression slows down a bit.

But the thing about it is if you are a super casual player that only likes to do bgs for example, you WILL hit the hard cap of 270. If you are a super hardcore player you can finish all the weeklies on rotation that doesn’t take too long and you’ll hit the cap faster.

I like this because it doesn’t have a raid or die mentality and if you want the gear with the most unique look or unique perks then you can raid. But if you don’t want to do that you can just que bgs all day or que arenas or que random dungeons. The thing that makes this super nice is that as long as you focus on one thing even casually you can transition to any activity in the game and any difficulty of that activity without it forcing you to go through that activities specific grind.

I’m a big fan of destiny’s system for this, but I also think it doesn’t work as well for wow. The chase for Ilvl is all that matters in wow. In destiny there’s a chase for power level AND for well-rolled gear and new weapons that change your play style up.

I do think wow could learn something from destiny in this regard, but they’d have to modify it.

[zenzaliv]

Something I was wondering recently. Assuming theres no new big features to be announced.... what is there for casual players in Dragonflight? It, as of now, just looks like another WoD-esque: We only care about what hardcore players do. But at least WoD had the Garrison which, while kinda shit, was at least something that all players could take part in.

I'm curious as what your definition of casual player is. Is that measured by the amount of time spent playing or the content they choose to do?