Oh Blizzard, how you have fallen (Diablo Immortal).

[Delever]

What do you mean? Why would that not work together?

You cannot be this dense... also you were not called a sociopath for liking the game.
You were called a sociopath for having little to no empathy towards people you consider "lesser" than you like the "dumb" people that have addictions or get baited by predatory practices.

EDIT: It fucking pisses me off to even have to reply to that because you know damn well that was the reason and you re intentionally playing dumb by addressing the threads main topic.

[Battlebeard]

You cannot be this dense... also you were not called a sociopath for liking the game.
You were called a sociopath for having little to no empathy towards people you consider "lesser" than you like the "dumb" people that have addictions or get baited by predatory practices.

EDIT: It fucking pisses me off to even have to reply to that because you know damn well that was the reason and you re intentionally playing dumb by addressing the threads main topic.

If you have empathy for every single person, then you can never run ANY form of business, cause hey, someone might suffer or get offended. If you take everyones feelings into account you will get nowhere on the market, and your business will very soon fall appart.

A huge part of this thread has been about Blizzard being bad guys, even the thread is "how you have fallen", and I simply disagree they have done anything wrong here. There are people who say Blizzard are bad, I say they are good, but I don't go around calling the anti-Blizzard people names, do I? I never called you or anyone else a sociopath or worse, I am open to a discussion, a proper debate.

At this point I felt I made many points why they don't do anything wrong, much related to me defending a free market and economical freedom (to spend your money on whatever you want) as well as the important of self discipline and that is everyones own responsibility to educate oneself to not fall for these schemes.

But in return I get very few arguments why freedom is bad, or why self discipline or responsibility is bad. Why? Cause I think that deep down, most of you agree that freedom and having discipline is a good thing, but at this point many people are so stubborn they instead turn to personal attacks.

I know admitting defeat is hard, but you learn this early on if you attend any sort of debate club or class, that whoever turn personal in a debate has already lost it, and at this point I feel people are only turning personal in lack of arguments.

[Delever]

If you have empathy for every single person, then you can never run ANY form of business, cause hey, someone might suffer or get offended. If you take everyones feelings into account you will get nowhere on the market, and your business will very soon fall appart.

A huge part of this thread has been about Blizzard being bad guys, even the thread is "how you have fallen", and I simply disagree they have done anything wrong here. There are people who say Blizzard are bad, I say they are good, but I don't go around calling the anti-Blizzard people names, do I? I never called you or anyone else a sociopath or worse, I am open to a discussion, a proper debate.

At this point I felt I made many points why they don't do anything wrong, much related to me defending a free market and economical freedom (to spend your money on whatever you want) as well as the important of self discipline and that is everyones own responsibility to educate oneself to not fall for these schemes.

But in return I get very few arguments why freedom is bad, or why self discipline or responsibility is bad. Why? Cause I think that deep down, most of you agree that freedom and having discipline is a good thing, but at this point many people are so stubborn they instead turn to personal attacks.

I know admitting defeat is hard, but you learn this early on if you attend any sort of debate club or class, that whoever turn personal in a debate has already lost it, and at this point I feel people are only turning personal in lack of arguments.

Man I love how you try to play smart with your last paragraph. Congratulations on your debate club experience.

You of course cannot have empathy for every single person in order to run a business and business owners walk on corpses more often than not. Their monetization practices make sense from a profit standpoint. Nobody said they don't. They also make sense from a company standpoint. In the face of profit why would they care if they are exploiting dumb people or people with unnecessary amounts of money. It is once again a case where the 1% of the world dictates how 99% of the rest of the world will function due to having most of the worlds wealth. If 1% of the playerbase can fund the game more than the rest of the 99% why would blizzard care about the needs of the 99%?

In short, we come to the conclusion that what blizzard is doing is logical from a company standpoint and not a lot of people are debating that.

The question here is why YOU as an INDIVIDUAL who has absolutely jack shit to gain from the greedy practices of a company aimed at a crowd that is not even you defend this shit??? It is not in your interest and more monetary gain for the company will evidently not lead to a better gaming experience as time has shown plenty of times. The only thing it leads to is actually lowering the quality of a game until they figure out how low the bar can go before even the whales say ENOUGH.

You have nothing to gain as an individual from simping for the disgusting monetization practices of a company even if you can afford them. Being able to understand that their actions are logical does not make their actions good nor does it make you an intellectual for realizing why they re doing it. Being able to afford them is not the issue at hand here. Being exploited in your damn face and shrugging it off because it does not affect you specifically is where your lack of empathy comes in.

YOU are an individual, not a fucking company. And I would expect empathy from an individual instead of bending over.

[Battlebeard]

Man I love how you try to play smart with your last paragraph. Congratulations on your debate club experience.

You of course cannot have empathy for every single person in order to run a business and business owners walk on corpses more often than not. Their monetization practices make sense from a profit standpoint. Nobody said they don't. They also make sense from a company standpoint. In the face of profit why would they care if they are exploiting dumb people or people with unnecessary amounts of money. It is once again a case where the 1% of the world dictates how 99% of the rest of the world will function due to having most of the worlds wealth. If 1% of the playerbase can fund the game more than the rest of the 99% why would blizzard care about the needs of the 99%?

In short, we come to the conclusion that what blizzard is doing is logical from a company standpoint and not a lot of people are debating that.

The question here is why YOU as an INDIVIDUAL who has absolutely jack shit to gain from the greedy practices of a company aimed at a crowd that is not even you defend this shit??? It is not in your interest and more monetary gain for the company will evidently not lead to a better gaming experience as time has shown plenty of times. The only thing it leads to is actually lowering the quality of a game until they figure out how low the bar can go before even the whales say ENOUGH.

You have nothing to gain as an individual from simping for the disgusting monetization practices of a company even if you can afford them. Being able to understand that their actions are logical does not make their actions good nor does it make you an intellectual for realizing why they re doing it. Being able to afford them is not the issue at hand here. Being exploited in your damn face and shrugging it off because it does not affect you specifically is where your lack of empathy comes in.

YOU are an individual, not a fucking company. And I would expect empathy from an individual instead of bending over.

Cause while I am a gamer, I am also a right-wing capitalist who value entrepreneurship and freedom more than I value good games. It comes down to values in life and what's really important.

Companies make countries work, they make the world work, they provide what we need and give billions of people jobs all over the world. If you start messing too much with companies powers and rights, only negative things will follow.

So of course I can defend Blizzard even though I don't work for them. Companies are far more important than any of us. Face it, 99% of us are nobodies, we aren't rich or powerful or famous. We don't really contribute to the world more than paying taxes and buying stuff occasionally. While these mega companies are needed for the progression of the world, they are needed to give people jobs so we can keep food on the table.

[Delever]

Cause while I am a gamer, I am also a right-wing capitalist who value entrepreneurship and freedom more than I value good games. It comes down to values in life and what's really important.

Companies make countries work, they make the world work, they provide what we need and give billions of people jobs all over the world. If you start messing too much with companies powers and rights, only negative things will follow.

So of course I can defend Blizzard even though I don't work for them. Companies are far more important than any of us. Face it, 99% of us are nobodies, we aren't rich or powerful or famous. We don't really contribute to the world more than paying taxes and buying stuff occasionally. While these mega companies are needed for the progression of the world, they are needed to give people jobs so we can keep food on the table.

Holy shit.... it is actually inconceivable to me that in the crisis that the world is facing right now there still exist people with these views. What a time to be alive.

[SilverLion]

Cause while I am a gamer, I am also a right-wing capitalist who value entrepreneurship and freedom more than I value good games. It comes down to values in life and what's really important.

Companies make countries work, they make the world work, they provide what we need and give billions of people jobs all over the world. If you start messing too much with companies powers and rights, only negative things will follow.

So of course I can defend Blizzard even though I don't work for them. Companies are far more important than any of us. Face it, 99% of us are nobodies, we aren't rich or powerful or famous. We don't really contribute to the world more than paying taxes and buying stuff occasionally. While these mega companies are needed for the progression of the world, they are needed to give people jobs so we can keep food on the table.

Quoting for posterity, because slurping that capitalism D cartoonishly is next level insanity.

[Battlebeard]

Holy shit.... it is actually inconceivable to me that in the crisis that the world is facing right now there still exist people with these views. What a time to be alive.

I can promise you, there are tons and tons of people all over the world that are right wing like me, it's not like we are a minority. I'd say most successful businessmen (or businesswomen) think like me.

And what crisis? You think the video game industry is in a crisis? Did you know that the video game industry is actually larger than the movie AND music industry COMBINED. Would hardly call that a crisis.

[Delever]

I can promise you, there are tons and tons of people all over the world that are right wing like me, it's not like we are a minority. I'd say most successful businessmen (or businesswomen) think like me.

And what crisis? You think the video game industry is in a crisis? Did you know that the video game industry is actually larger than the movie AND music industry COMBINED. Would hardly call that a crisis.

On the incredibly minor chance that you are not trolling at this point.... I was obviously not referring to the video game industry facing a crisis.

[Battlebeard]

On the incredibly minor chance that you are not trolling at this point.... I was obviously not referring to the video game industry facing a crisis.

So enlighten me, cause so far you just insulted my values and my sincerity, I believe it's relevant to the discussion and that we aren't off topic yet, what crisis are you refering to?

[Delekii]

So enlighten me, cause so far you just insulted my values and my sincerity, I believe it's relevant to the discussion and that we aren't off topic yet, what crisis are you refering to?

Wait . Are you saying we are being unempathetic toward you? Allow me to pull out my tiny violin so I can play for you.

- - - Updated - - -

If you have empathy for every single person, then you can never run ANY form of business, cause hey, someone might suffer or get offended. If you take everyones feelings into account you will get nowhere on the market, and your business will very soon fall appart.

Empathy doesn't require abject rejection of your own needs in order to employ. It just means consideration of the effect on others. It is absolutely possible to be empathetic toward others and run a successful business. It just requires the rejection of profit at all costs and above all considerations.

There are people who say Blizzard are bad, I say they are good, but I don't go around calling the anti-Blizzard people names, do I? I never called you or anyone else a sociopath or worse, I am open to a discussion, a proper debate.

This is like when climate change denialist want to debate, or demand equal representation. Nobody wants to debate facts. People call you a sociopath because the positions you argue are sociopathic.

I know admitting defeat is hard, but you learn this early on if you attend any sort of debate club or class, that whoever turn personal in a debate has already lost it, and at this point I feel people are only turning personal in lack of arguments.

That's because it is entirely personal. The debate on DI ran it's course by page 10, nothing new has been added to the discussion. All it is now is cyclic rehashing of the same bad arguments. You might believe you've made rational coherent arguments, but you haven't. Like I said probably 80 pages ago, you're that guy that everyone on your side cringes at, wishing you weren't.

[Ghost of Cow]

Like I said probably 80 pages ago, you're that guy that everyone on your side cringes at, wishing you weren't.

...sometimes, yeah. ><

[Battlebeard]

Wait . Are you saying we are being unempathetic toward you? Allow me to pull out my tiny violin so I can play for you.

- - - Updated - - -

Empathy doesn't require abject rejection of your own needs in order to employ. It just means consideration of the effect on others. It is absolutely possible to be empathetic toward others and run a successful business. It just requires the rejection of profit at all costs and above all considerations.


This is like when climate change denialist want to debate, or demand equal representation. Nobody wants to debate facts. People call you a sociopath because the positions you argue are sociopathic.


That's because it is entirely personal. The debate on DI ran it's course by page 10, nothing new has been added to the discussion. All it is now is cyclic rehashing of the same bad arguments. You might believe you've made rational coherent arguments, but you haven't. Like I said probably 80 pages ago, you're that guy that everyone on your side cringes at, wishing you weren't.

So you say it’s no point to discuss this game anymore? I think it does have a point, this game has been falsely slandered on metacrotic and other places and it’s wrong. People have got completely the wrong idea and this wonderful game has suffered, it’s not fair.

Not surprised you mention climate change, most people here seem left wing and hysterical. ”Oh no climate change will kill us” is really close to ”oh no this kind of mtx will kill the game industry”. I am not denying climate change exist, but we gotta be reasonable about it, we cannot panic and start replacing fossil fuel until the alternativ is cheaper and more efficient. Economy is always gonna be more important than the environment, we need to change our habits but we gotta do it financially smart.

This is relevant cause I see the same panic here. People denounce Blizzard and other companies far too fast, and don’t take into account what their actions would mean should they have the power.

People want to ban Immortal, they want to punish ”greedy” companies, they want gambling gone or even all MTX gone, but if you think about it, what could that mean? Companies would lose millions and thousands of people could lose their jobs and that could have further bad effects like homelessness. Cause the CEO wont suffer anyway, just the little guy. And these companies and their employees generate taxes that are needed for the countries.

People are too emotional and panicky, they don’t realize how important it is fo protect the companies, cause we need them!

[Huehuecoyotl]

Economy is always gonna be more important than the environment, we need to change our habits but we gotta do it financially smart.

Fuck me sideways. So companies making a profit is more important than breathing? Not dying in floods or of heatstroke? We can't do anything to avoid making the world an uninhabitable desert unless we clear it with the head capitalists first?

And to keep vaguely on topic, at least this ludicrous concept being at the heart of your "philosophy" explains why you have no issue with DI. You literally don't care what damage happens to people, or the games industry, as long as Blizzard keep making money out of it. Ouch.

[Battlebeard]

Fuck me sideways. So companies making a profit is more important than breathing? Not dying in floods or of heatstroke? We can't do anything to avoid making the world an uninhabitable desert unless we clear it with the head capitalists first?

And to keep vaguely on topic, at least this ludicrous concept being at the heart of your "philosophy" explains why you have no issue with DI. You literally don't care what damage happens to people, or the games industry, as long as Blizzard keep making money out of it. Ouch.

Climate change will be bad but not for at least 50+ years, we can’t panic now, panic will ruin peoples lives.

Same with this game, we cannot panic and shut down business ideas, the mtx market needs to be properly reviewed by governments and socioeconomical professors and experts, go give a proper logic based solution and that can take many years.

We don’t yet know the longtern effect of lets say Immortal. Short time it might ruin some people who lack discipline, but long time this can lead to many positives, like employment, large tax income from increased revenue etc, Diablo Immortal can end up helping far more people than it ruin, we need to wait and see!

[Hightotemz]

I hope if D4 needs more money then the once off purchase that they create a 6 month subscription or something. I don't have a problem with companies making money but I have a problem with pay to win. Some whales who have bad gaming skills could love this system however this video is worth a watch, released yesterday. Guy spends $100k but now he cant q for battlegrounds because his char is too strong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPfEzKebPoU

[Rendark]

People are too emotional and panicky, they don’t realize how important it is fo protect the companies, cause we need them!

This is the kind of person we are dealing with here. Someone who really thinks companies need to be protected.

It's sad really but i guess some people suck.

[ParanoiD84]

I hope if D4 needs more money then the once off purchase that they create a 6 month subscription or something. I don't have a problem with companies making money but I have a problem with pay to win. Some whales who have bad gaming skills could love this system however this video is worth a watch, released yesterday. Guy spends $100k but now he cant q for battlegrounds because his char is too strong.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPfEzKebPoU

Imagine spending 100k to then be able to play less then the ftp players lmao. Crazy fucking money to spend on a game like immortal though just to kill everyone in bg's but yeah all it takes is a couple whales like him.

And some people say its not ptw he has played 300 games and lost 3 one to dc and two not paying attention, you stand absolutely no chance against whales like him.

[Battlebeard]

This is the kind of person we are dealing with here. Someone who really thinks companies need to be protected.

It's sad really but i guess some people suck.

You sound very spoiled and entitled. Who pays your salary? Who pays your parents salary? Who keeps people employed so they can pay tax and make society work? It's the companies! The world would fall appart completely if you start punishing companies. If you take away their incentive to make money, they will all shrink or disband and people lose their jobs.

[Kumorii]

Yeah, the whole weird tough guy act kinda falls apart when you see their complaints in other threads about raiding being too hard or having too many mounts in the game is literally hell for him because getting them all is too hard.

Just really awkward when people try to put on that level of tough guy façade.

I thought that was kinda funny. Especially since he has this angle of "If you have an addiction you are just weak, just quit lol".
Yet, he demands blizzard stop adding stuff to the collection because he can't stop and has to have 100%.
Think he whined about inventory and bank space in another where he has multiple of certain things and lots of useless "valuables". Indicating a hoarding addiction as well...

pot kettle and all that jazz.

[Ghost of Cow]

Who pays your salary? Who pays your parents salary? Who keeps people employed so they can pay tax and make society work? It's the companies!

And who does the work? Who provides the labor? Who generates that value? Who does the innovating? It's the people!

Companies are great and all, but they're not some kind of separate entities that descended from the heavens. They're just groupings of individuals doing a job and - if they're lucky - reaping the rewards of it together.