Blizzard finally understood the value of casual players having more access to gear.

[arkanon]

thing is if BOTH sides had that issue unlocking would not help at all... it only helps if one side have that problem and one does not...

But that's entirely incorrect. Combining the numbers of the two factions benefit both sides. What you said makes no sense at all.

[Ragu4]

It's funny how a few years ago I scoffed at casual play, but now I find myself doing pet battles and very slowly doing the post launch content. I did H CN and quit, so I'm just playing the game very casually till WOTLK Classic, which I know from playing it OG was a pretty easy expansion raid-wise, and plan on doing mostly 10 man only. My career will not allow me to do WoW hard-core anymore.

I will say that I'm glad I still find monk fun. I may continue it into DF. I normally main swap each xpac, but I like Hybrid characters and monk just feels good to play.

[Gurahk]

hours don't determine wether you're casual or not. effort does.

Both contribute.

[Nzx]

This is the dumbest shit I’ve heard. Spoken like someone whose never managed a raid.

Honestly what the fuck are you people talking about? Raid leaders and perhaps guild officers occasionally have to do a bit more than 6 hours a week to get through Mythic. Every other monkey in the group just turns up and pushes buttons for 3 hours a night.

It's commitment and failure that most of you are afraid of. You're absolutely terrified that if you commit a few hours a week to something, you'll be forced to discover that you're actually just straight up not very good, and you'll no longer have the excuse of "not being a tryhard nerd loser" to hide behind. It's genuinely fucking pathetic how many of you would rather everyone be the same colour gray than have someone else who puts in more effort than you get to stand out.

[Th3Scourge]

Valor should always be uncapped. There is no logical reason why it should be capped. It is not fun to have to hold off on spending any valor whatsoever lest you spend it on the wrong thing and have to wait another 3 weeks to max rank something else

[imoncrack]

got carried through a ten on a warrior no issues jump on my hunter with way less gear and did the carrying as a casual player of retail in a dead guild i was happy

[MoanaLisa]

I do miss the days of flex (before being renamed Normal) when you could take a bunch of casual family/friend non-raiders and guide them through quite comfortably. That hasnt been the case for a long, long time, unless its actually a full carry.

It was while this was happening that I finally even stopped trying to raid. I loved the original implementation of Flex. I do not love what it has become.

[arkanon]

It was while this was happening that I finally even stopped trying to raid. I loved the original implementation of Flex. I do not love what it has become.

Honestly, when i stepped out of mythic and tried to rekindle my love of the more casual difficulties, i found them extremely frustrating and noticed a huge difference in difficulty. Flex was my favorite feature in a long, LONG time, because i could finally share my love of raiding with those who previously had found it too demanding. That is gone now, imo.

[Flaks]

Honestly what the fuck are you people talking about? Raid leaders and perhaps guild officers occasionally have to do a bit more than 6 hours a week to get through Mythic. Every other monkey in the group just turns up and pushes buttons for 3 hours a night.

It's commitment and failure that most of you are afraid of. You're absolutely terrified that if you commit a few hours a week to something, you'll be forced to discover that you're actually just straight up not very good, and you'll no longer have the excuse of "not being a tryhard nerd loser" to hide behind. It's genuinely fucking pathetic how many of you would rather everyone be the same colour gray than have someone else who puts in more effort than you get to stand out.

Oh definitely commitment and failure. Has nothing to do with how just being able to step foot in this dream world of 3 hour raid nights twice a week you'd have to have put in hundreds upon hundreds if not thousands of hours to get up to a competitive level even more so if you joined up late. No, it's the casuals taking away all your fun by asking for gear at a semi competent level let alone competitive.

[Guanciale]

I'd like to give credit to developers for finally getting in sync with casual player base. Couple things (among other) that stands out.

• Tier set forge
• Uncapped valor S4

These and other few good changes indicates that Blizzard finally understands that removing previously existing briers is a good thing. What can casual player do with more gear?

• Stay subscribed.
• Go do solo older content.
• Join mythic plus groups.
• Engage in activities that has power limits (brawlers guild, etc)
• Have more motivation in general to engage in current content including raiding.

And because power rocks, player can finally do whatever they want with it. It feels good to be powerful rather than memeing around like a scrub.

Feels good getting the power of level of someone who worked for it, yet you didn't work for it. You want to lollygag around and get showered with gear. Your framing exposes how entitled your view is.

[HansOlo]

I'd like to give credit to developers for finally getting in sync with casual player base. Couple things (among other) that stands out.

• Tier set forge
• Uncapped valor S4

These and other few good changes indicates that Blizzard finally understands that removing previously existing briers is a good thing. What can casual player do with more gear?

• Stay subscribed.
• Go do solo older content.
• Join mythic plus groups.
• Engage in activities that has power limits (brawlers guild, etc)
• Have more motivation in general to engage in current content including raiding.

And because power rocks, player can finally do whatever they want with it. It feels good to be powerful rather than memeing around like a scrub.

Disagreed. Casuals are not interesting in these. If they are - then they are not casuals.

What you are saying is that the recent changes did good. Stop using casuals as some argument.

[Echo of Soul]

Honestly, when i stepped out of mythic and tried to rekindle my love of the more casual difficulties, i found them extremely frustrating and noticed a huge difference in difficulty. Flex was my favorite feature in a long, LONG time, because i could finally share my love of raiding with those who previously had found it too demanding. That is gone now, imo.

Because they kinda didn't keep flex. They took out the flex technology and put it into normal and heroic and then added an even harder difficulty on top of them.

Flex, normal and heroic was great. Normal, heroic and mythic wasn't.

[HansOlo]

Honestly what the fuck are you people talking about? Raid leaders and perhaps guild officers occasionally have to do a bit more than 6 hours a week to get through Mythic. Every other monkey in the group just turns up and pushes buttons for 3 hours a night.

It's commitment and failure that most of you are afraid of. You're absolutely terrified that if you commit a few hours a week to something, you'll be forced to discover that you're actually just straight up not very good, and you'll no longer have the excuse of "not being a tryhard nerd loser" to hide behind. It's genuinely fucking pathetic how many of you would rather everyone be the same colour gray than have someone else who puts in more effort than you get to stand out.

Agreed.

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Oh definitely commitment and failure. Has nothing to do with how just being able to step foot in this dream world of 3 hour raid nights twice a week you'd have to have put in hundreds upon hundreds if not thousands of hours to get up to a competitive level even more so if you joined up late. No, it's the casuals taking away all your fun by asking for gear at a semi competent level let alone competitive.

Yeah - but you HAVE TO PUT THOUSANDS OF HOURS in another other game as well. Raiding is the most fundamental area of the game, where people should and will compete for a spot.

What you do think this is? People are genuninly investing thier freetime, because they like the challenge and they figured out how time/effort works(no matter how much they have of it). And they want be rewarded for the hard work.

And then we have you...

[arkanon]

Because they kinda didn't keep flex. They took out the flex technology and put it into normal and heroic and then added an even harder difficulty on top of them.

Flex, normal and heroic was great. Normal, heroic and mythic wasn't.

But.....they did. When flex was introduced, it was LFR, Flex, Normal (10 & 25) and Heroic (10 & 25). It was after this they made the name changes to LFR, Normal, Heroic, and Mythic. Thats obviously also when the flex tech expanded to Heroic (previously normal) and Mythic (previously Heroic) was tightened to 20man. The difficulty change was not immediate. It was BFA that saw the first real jump in difficulty for heroic/normal.

They didnt add ANOTHER difficulty on top, they renamed heroic to mythic and changed it (eventually) to 20man. Mythic isnt the new difficulty, FLEX is (was)

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I run 1-8 dungeons a week (1- maybe 5 hours a week) inconsistently over the course of a season. I ended season 3 in the top 1-2% of Io or some shit close enough.

It's an excuse the retards tell themselves to make them feel better. That "dad" is just trash at the game. The end.

1 dungeon takes you 1 hour? And you are attacking other players skill level? Yikes.

[HansOlo]

But.....they did. When flex was introduced, it was LFR, Flex, Normal (10 & 25) and Heroic (10 & 25). It was after this they made the name changes to LFR, Normal, Heroic, and Mythic. Thats obviously also when the flex tech expanded to Heroic (previously normal) and Mythic (previously Heroic) was tightened to 20man. The difficulty change was not immediate. It was BFA that saw the first real jump in difficulty for heroic/normal.

They didnt add ANOTHER difficulty on top, they renamed heroic to mythic and changed it (eventually) to 20man. Mythic isnt the new difficulty, FLEX is (was)

You know why they removed FLEX?

They removed it because it was harder to balance the raids. It didn't help you casuals either - quite the opposite - as you would get benched more often, if you didn't have the right class. FLEX was just one big class stacking.

It's good that we have people like you spewing randomness, while defending the casual opinion(somewhat expected).

[Nymrohd]

But.....they did. When flex was introduced, it was LFR, Flex, Normal (10 & 25) and Heroic (10 & 25). It was after this they made the name changes to LFR, Normal, Heroic, and Mythic. Thats obviously also when the flex tech expanded to Heroic (previously normal) and Mythic (previously Heroic) was tightened to 20man. The difficulty change was not immediate. It was BFA that saw the first real jump in difficulty for heroic/normal.

They didnt add ANOTHER difficulty on top, they renamed heroic to mythic and changed it (eventually) to 20man. Mythic isnt the new difficulty, FLEX is (was)

Heroic and Mythic's difficulty are constantly increasing with every single expac and dragging even Normal with them. Heroic now is easily as hard as Heroic was up to MoP.

[Lolites]

Literally don't care if you don't believe it.

a.k.a. "i lie but dont wanna be caught"

Bad=/=casual
Good=/=hardcore

Improve your skill, manage your time and you can casually clear high keys/mythic raid.

spoken like someone without any responsibility or sense of reality whatsoever...

but please enlighten me, i was mythic raiding and runing high keys in bfa, in sl i didnt feel like it so i didnt bother, does that mean im not casual as i though, am i still hardcore despite the fact i havent run single mythic boss or key above 13 or so whole sl? or was i casual before while i cleared mythic raid and high keys and was among 5-10% best of my class on realm (and ocasionaly region) every season? or did my skill magicaly lowered by transfering to sl? or is it that you have no clue what the hell you are talking about?
even someone like you should be able to guess which one im betting is true...

[Trumpcat]

Just follows the same pattern of the final seasons of BfA and Legion.

[arkanon]

You know why they removed FLEX?

They removed it because it was harder to balance the raids. It didn't help you casuals either - quite the opposite - as you would get benched more often, if you didn't have the right class. FLEX was just one big class stacking.

It's good that we have people like you spewing randomness, while defending the casual opinion(somewhat expected).

Ok just a quick fyi - flex was NEVER removed........and i have no idea why you think it was due to "balancing" when normal and heroic both use the tech......you know that, right? They did change how balancing of encounters was done by removing/altering breakpoints and instead working on a combination of breakpoints AND percentages, but...........................Flex was NOT removed, it was EXPANDED.

Nice bait with the "casual like you" stuff too, you do you man, whatever gets you hard.

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Heroic and Mythic's difficulty are constantly increasing with every single expac and dragging even Normal with them. Heroic now is easily as hard as Heroic was up to MoP.

I think the biggest change was with normal/flex - i was stunned when i jumped on an alt with friends and did it, its drastically different to what it was, and i just dont see what the benefit is to ANYONE, including Blizzard.

[Celement]

I expect if and when it comes to that, the corporate overlords fire the current dev team and do a reboot, or sell the game to someone who does that. Admittedly, the most likely outcome is WoW transformed into a gatcha monstrosity.

Game still dies from my perspective. Either from fire or frost death is death. You haven't offered an alternative nor do I expect one. I don't care a wit about the " health" of the game only that its enjoyable to me.

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That doesnt answer the question though - why NOW? This has been a problem for a VERY long time, why make this change now?

2 failed expansions in a row I think. They never really had that happen before. Kinda came close with cata and mop both had bad starts from extremes.

Cata had no easy content mop had to easy. Both fixed it by the second patch though mop did it better.