New patch notes are out, you cannot get Gladiator in 1v1 Rated Solo Shuffle - WHY?

[sensei-]

Yeah but it's equally random for everyone so if anything, solo ranked will be a better measurement for personal skill than constructed because you can't be carried or boosted.

Well said. I believe solo shuffle and spin offs from it will be the future of WoW PvP in Dragonflight and expansions beyond that.

It’s a good innovation. They need to continue on the path for PvE also. Once all obstacles for playing (forming groups and dealing with politics) are removed the game is better off.

[Celement]

They removed glad from 2s because its just rock paper scissors.

But in shuffle u play all the time with randoms, so you can go for meta comp like in 2s. And if u wanna say "but class x is so strong in 3s, he can carry so much" i dont see the Point, in organitied pvp these class can carry the same, or look at rbgs, where rogue/boomys can carry a game.

Doesn't it have the same issue as twos on a large scale were getting good comps streaks you higher easily?

[Makorus]

PvP does not need rewards to be enjoyable.

Cool.

Tell that to the OP.

[sensei-]

Doesn't it have the same issue as twos on a large scale were getting good comps streaks you higher easily?

WTF is this argument? In solo you have to do 6 rounds and play with everyone. In rated 3v3 you roll the FOTM comp and enjoy an unjustified advantage for the entire season and get glad.

[Eazy]

Nah, you are the one in the wrong here. Dismissing skill required in solo shuffle because it's random is just a wrong assumption. Both constructed and random rated arena will require skill, just different kind of skill. In constructed need better coordination and communication, in solo you need to be better at reading your teammates without talking to them.

Not really. There's a difference between playing with random and playing with organized groups.

As I said - it's a FACT that some classes have better synergy with others than rest(see the TOP Arena comps).
Shuffle is RANDOM, which make it more unfair, giving people higher or lower chance of actually getting a good comp.

Also as I wrote above you're playing with totally RANDOM people, who will be less or more willing to actually win that match. Even after one or two loses they can start to troll or give up games. It would be totally out of control.

Shuffle isn't as much skill based as it is luck based.

[Ryzeth]

Mobas are played with randoms and yet high level players coordinate pretty well in solo q (not every game, but often enough). Similar concept. Calling it luck based is weird, meta exists to an even worse degree in them and yet people climb just fine without playing meta stuff.

Play 20 or 30 games, and you'll be calibrated well enough at whatever rank you belong at. Alas that fact is hard for many to grasp; they much prefer to blame the system than admit they just aren't that good.

[Mysterymask]

Mobas are played with randoms and yet high level players coordinate pretty well in solo q (not every game, but often enough). Similar concept. Calling it luck based is weird, meta exists to an even worse degree in them and yet people climb just fine without playing meta stuff.

Play 20 or 30 games, and you'll be calibrated well enough at whatever rank you belong at. Alas that fact is hard for many to grasp; they much prefer to blame the system than admit they just aren't that good.

Difference between a MOBA and an MMO. Moba is closer to a fighting game you can choose your counter, if your main isn't meta you just pick another character, if your team is short a healer you can just pick a healer. You can't do that in solo shuffle (at least not easily)

[melzas]

Not really. There's a difference between playing with random and playing with organized groups.

As I said - it's a FACT that some classes have better synergy with others than rest(see the TOP Arena comps).
Shuffle is RANDOM, which make it more unfair, giving people higher or lower chance of actually getting a good comp.

Also as I wrote above you're playing with totally RANDOM people, who will be less or more willing to actually win that match. Even after one or two loses they can start to troll or give up games. It would be totally out of control.

Shuffle isn't as much skill based as it is luck based.

Nah, wrong again. You are giving waaay too much credit to the whole synergy thing, sure some comps might be better than others but I can't think of a class that is particularly worse than everything else in this regard. Not to mention that if this becomes a problem in rated solo shuffle then they might as well set different reward cutoffs based on your spec (like if say, enhancement shamans have on average worse win ratio than other specs, then in solo shuffle they get rival on 1700 and duelist on 2000 for example).

And the whole "someone might troll" thing is the same as literally every MMR based competitive PvP game so it's a non issue. If someone trolls regularly then he will end up in low MMR bracket with other trolls, noobs and people with crap internet connection. You might occasionally have a bad luck but this applies to everyone playing the mode. On high enough rating you won't see any trolls at all.

Not to mention that some classes/specs being worse in solo shuffle because they have less "good comps" is no different that in current 3v3 where some classes aren't considered meta and have it way harder to find a team...

Oh and let's not forget that in constructed 3s you can ask your 2800 xp friends to play with you or just pay for a boost. That surely requires a lot of "skill", right? Meanwhile in rated solo shuffle boosts are not possible so it's all about you actually.

I still think glad title and mount should stay in constructed though, otherwise nobody will play it. The player pool is already abysmal, with glad xp players all over the ladder because casuals don't even play 3s anymore.

[wushootaki]

Okay? Doesn't change that it was literally an afterthought? I don't care whether people enjoyed it or not, I am not making any statements on that.

What's your point.

Organized PvP might've been an afterthought - things like battlegrounds but PvP was in the game from day one. Blizzard even paid attention to it before battlegrounds existed, with dishonorable kills being added to the game 2 whole patches before the first organized battleground --- as an effort to dissuade people from camping towns and griefing quest hubs.

The game was always designed with player vs. player in mind, as far as open world content went. It was there from day 1, and continued to be balanced with things like addition of diminishing returns being addressed in patch 1.4 --- again, a whole 3 patches prior to organized PvP existing (battlegrounds).

There were also things like Tarren Mill vs. Southshore, which was an unofficial contest of who controlled Hillsbrad Foothills for questing. In fact, this was so iconic, that Blizzard made an official battleground version of the fight that gets brought back for the yearly anniversary.

[Eazy]

Nah, wrong again.

Nah, that's just a fact.

You are giving waaay too much credit to the whole synergy thing, sure some comps might be better than others but I can't think of a class that is particularly worse than everything else in this regard. Not to mention that if this becomes a problem in rated solo shuffle then they might as well set different reward cutoffs based on your spec (like if say, enhancement shamans have on average worse win ratio than other specs, then in solo shuffle they get rival on 1700 and duelist on 2000 for example).

It may be too much credit, but the unfairness still stands. Saing that it would've been most skilled-based arena is just straight wrong.

And the whole "someone might troll" thing is the same as literally every MMR based competitive PvP game so it's a non issue. If someone trolls regularly then he will end up in low MMR bracket with other trolls, noobs and people with crap internet connection. You might occasionally have a bad luck but this applies to everyone playing the mode. On high enough rating you won't see any trolls at all.

No. The LFG tool already proved that playing with randoms isn't as good as playing with people who you know for some time.
Statistically it's higher probable to see a "troll" in the random group than in your own. That's obvious.

Not to mention that some classes/specs being worse in solo shuffle because they have less "good comps" is no different that in current 3v3 where some classes aren't considered meta and have it way harder to find a team...

There's a difference between playing a "worse class" but with viable comp than playing a "good class" with "non-viable comp".

Oh and let's not forget that in constructed 3s you can ask your 2800 xp friends to play with you or just pay for a boost. That surely requires a lot of "skill", right? Meanwhile in rated solo shuffle boosts are not possible so it's all about you actually.

People were doing pre-mades since they added PvP.
Some people are losing on purpose so they could have lower rating.
While in organized groups such a thing won't probably happen, it can occur in shuffle.

I still think glad title and mount should stay in constructed though, otherwise nobody will play it. The player pool is already abysmal, with glad xp players all over the ladder because casuals don't even play 3s anymore.

I also think that.

[Schwert]

I think keeping glad mount/title behind constructed 3v3 instead of solo shuffle is to protect the mode from dying out completely.

It's pretty much on life support already. Takes forever to get a queue past 2100 MMR in 3s right now on NA. Have a friend whose been trying to get his wins for the drake this season and there's nights he just logs off because he can't get 3 people his CR right now.
And this was before WoTLK Classic. Last I checked he was 30ish/50 and let his sub lapse until the hype dies down.

I personally haven't bothered this season.

There just really comes a point if it's this bad, it needs to be reworked, and the solo queue stuff is the rework they needed to get people playing, but restricting rewards from it just means there's going to be a stop point - it's an MMO with a heavy collection focus now - and people won't play past it.
I'd have just slapped the solo queue and ranked ladder together into one so it's at least got enough bodies for a proper MMR pyramid, but... meh.

I'll be doing wPvP instead.
Which has rewards this time around.

[UndedoKoleda]

Great news, everyone!

In Dragonflight, we’re continuing our work on the Solo Shuffle game mode by upping the stakes and adding the ability for players to earn (or lose!) rating, similar to our Rated Battlegrounds and Arenas. In this week’s PTR and Beta build, players will be able to participate in the Rated version of Solo Shuffle. Just like in Rated Battlegrounds and Arenas, you’ll be able to earn seasonal rewards and achievements, credit towards Vicious mounts, weekly great vault progress, and Conquest. Solo Shuffle’s rules and 6-round format continue, with the addition of rating changes based off of the amount of rounds each player has won during the match. We’ll be monitoring and adjusting matchmaking throughout beta to facilitate testing.

Unique to this Rated game mode, players will have a rating tracked for each of their character’s specializations. Players will select which of their specialization to queue with, and participate in specialization-based ladders and end of season rewards. Players will also notice that we’ve created a minimum item level feature for Rated Solo Shuffle specifically, but we do not have it currently set to our final value for Season 1 of Dragonflight.

We’re extremely appreciative of all the community feedback we received from our brawl version of Solo Shuffle, please continue to share your thoughts with us in our forums or @WarcraftDevs on twitter. Please keep an eye out for future Play with the Blues events focusing on Solo Shuffle on Beta.

[vian]

PvP is an after thought as it should be. It has never been taken seriously. PvP was introduced in a patch and it should be treated as such.

The one interesting thing about online games, is PvP.

[Toby451]

The one interesting thing about online games, is PvP.

Yeah, thats why all of the PvP based MMOs are all extremely popular and not all smaller niche games.





Ooops





The PvP crowd moved over to shooters and MOBAs....

[vian]

Yeah, thats why all of the PvP based MMOs are all extremely popular and not all smaller niche games.





Ooops





The PvP crowd moved over to shooters and MOBAs....

No, it's because most PvP based games gets flooded with PvE carebears who do nothing but whine, untill the game goes down the PvE route.

[Schwert]

Yeah, thats why all of the PvP based MMOs are all extremely popular and not all smaller niche games.





Ooops





The PvP crowd moved over to shooters and MOBAs....

I've been doing PvP in XIV on and off for the last few months and it's booming there.

[ClownPrincess]

I've been doing PvP in XIV on and off for the last few months and it's booming there.

pvp in ffxiv is god awful compared to wow, though. it's the only thing wow does better but it does it by a fair margin

[UndedoKoleda]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/crimson...players-329208

An equivalent of Rank 1 Gladiator Titles(finishing the season in the top 0.01% of the ladder) was added in the latest PTR- "Crimson Soloist". It does sound kind of underwhelming, compared to the pre-made teams ranked arena ones, tbh(not that I'm going to get either one of them, ever).

Hope they add some variation of the Gladiator Drake as well, preferably somewhat distinguishable from the original(maybe different coloration, or some different body-armor features).

[Lady Atia]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/crimson...players-329208

An equivalent of Rank 1 Gladiator Titles(finishing the season in the top 0.01% of the ladder) was added in the latest PTR- "Crimson Soloist". It does sound kind of underwhelming, compared to the pre-made teams ranked arena ones, tbh(not that I'm going to get either one of them, ever).

Hope they add some variation of the Gladiator Drake as well, preferably somewhat distinguishable from the original(maybe different coloration, or some different body-armor features).

No, pvp already has enough unique fomo stuff, it surely doesn't need another gladiator mount lol. Wouldn't mind to be able to get the normal one via solo shuffle though.

[ulululu]

PvP is an after thought as it should be. It has never been taken seriously. PvP was introduced in a patch and it should be treated as such.

Don't know if you got the news yet but many things were "introduced in a patch" yet make a very big chunk of the gaming experience, lol. Like mythic+ for example, it got introduced in 7.0.3., which was a patch.

It's like you said something just for the sake of being edgy and to sound pretentious without saying anything profound.