1. #68281
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Ress sickness change:

    good. a bigger material penalty (the durability loss) and less time penalty, since doing any combat with ress sickness is useless having to spirit ress just meant you would afk for 10 minutes waiting out the timer.
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  2. #68282
    The Insane Raetary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    But you can do literally the same with perso loot right now? No ones forcing people to roll out stuff if they already got a "better" item on life server, lol.
    No, you can't.
    As there is no item to roll for in personal loot.

    Personal loot exists to automate item distribution, so the group doesn't have to deal with that fallout.
    An item drops, someone gets it, and its theirs.
    What they do with it is their decision.

    Group loot actively involves the group in the item distribution, it asks everyone to roll on an item and then picks the highest roll.
    The problem with that is the people involved, as often times you get a person that needs an item at the expense of everyone else in the group.


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  3. #68283
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Exactly this. Overall, you'll even mathematically have a slightly better chance to acquire loot with Group Loot, unless literally over 50% of people you play with are absolute dicks who won't trade loot they don't need slash pass on it.
    And tbh if that's the case, you probably have more issues even killing bosses due to randoms causing a wipe, whether through inattentiveness of malicious trolling.
    Not necessarily, even dicks often have the capacity to cooperate with others when it fits their needs. They want to kill the boss as much as anyone else in the party, but as soon as the boss is down they just automatically roll need on everything because 'the lulz'. And then you have people who roll need on downgrades because they look pretty, they have lore value, and so on. There are plenty of scenarios where drama can arise after successfully clearing the raid and each scenario has happened like 10,000 times each. You can tell a problem's serious when Blizz gets off their lazy bottoms to address it directly.



    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Toxicity in Classic is hardly surprising, though. Especially the pug pool will be full of those players that left the live game due to "objectively bad things" such as new story beats and "wokeness".
    Thinking WoW's storytelling has been shit for a while qualifies you as toxic? In that case, judging by how well SL's story has been received by its playerbase retail will be just as toxic as classic is, if not more.

  4. #68284
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Thinking WoW's storytelling has been shit for a while qualifies you as toxic? In that case, judging by how well SL's story has been received by its playerbase retail will be just as toxic as classic is, if not more.
    Thats not what he said though, notice how he said "Objectively bad things" If anything these toxic people probably aren't able to even explain why things are "Objectively bad" At best "Its bad" is a likely response.
    Last edited by Aeluron Lightsong; 2022-09-29 at 03:47 PM.
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  5. #68285
    Quote Originally Posted by Caiphon View Post
    Not necessarily, even dicks often have the capacity to cooperate with others when it fits their needs. They want to kill the boss as much as anyone else in the party, but as soon as the boss is down they just automatically roll need on everything because 'the lulz'.
    Yeah but one boss is not the entire raid. Unless the troll is the raid leader or friends with them, they'll soon be gone from the group.
    Isn't that the social aspect that people want to bring back?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Thats not what he said though, notice how he said "Objectively bad things" If anything these toxic people probably aren't able to even explain why things are "Objectively bad" At best "Its bad" is a likely response.
    Yes, that's what I meant. You can dislike anything, no one can refute your opinion, but there exists a subconscious need to feel "right" for not liking something, so if you don't bother to accept you simply don't like something (anymore) then it has to be "objectively bad" - not the actual words used, but that's the implication.
    But I admit this is kinda getting off-topic, willing to drop this.
    Last edited by Nathanyel; 2022-09-29 at 03:58 PM. Reason: rephrased to not blame this subconscious fallacy on just a certain group
    But your duty to Azeroth is not yet complete. More is demanded of you... a price the living cannot pay.

  6. #68286
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Ress sickness change:

    Good change. Personally I never understood why res sickness was ever a thing on PvE servers in the first place. The penalty should always just been gold.

  7. #68287
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Yeah but one boss is not the entire raid. Unless the troll is the raid leader or friends with them, they'll soon be gone from the group.
    Isn't that the social aspect that people want to bring back?
    I mean loot drama is a form of social interaction but I'm not sure if it's one people want back... when I was raiding Naxx we had people who would tag along the group just fine until Kel'thuzad then ninja loot those sweet weapons for example. Then there are cases where someone rolling need goes relatively unnoticed because they fail the roll, until eventually they get something they shouldn't etc. There's a certain immersion factor in group loot that I cannot deny but I personally don't think it's worth the potential frustration.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nathanyel View Post
    Yes, that's what I meant. You can dislike anything, no one can refute your opinion, but there exists a subconscious need to feel "right" for not liking something, so if you don't bother to accept you simply don't like something (anymore) then it has to be "objectively bad" - not the actual words used, but that's the implication.
    But I admit this is kinda getting off-topic, willing to drop this.
    While I do think there is such a thing as objectively bad storytelling you're right, this probably isn't the thread to discuss it.

  8. #68288
    Quote Originally Posted by [Apok] View Post
    Group loot is ass.

    The only thing that made personal loot fail was the trading restrictions.
    I mean I like personal loot especially without the restrictions which were 100% the most annoying part of the system

    Group loot is still my preference simply because I am in a guild and the gear comes quick

  9. #68289
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    Personal loot artificially took out a social aspect of the game. Also eliminated a lot of the 'drop excitement' that groups would have. Seeing a fat stack of loot on the boss and doling it out. As much as personal loot "helps", it harms more than it helps. Ideally, there would be a combination of the two where you can see what everybody got and freely trade it amongst eachother.
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Dude A: "lol well if you weren't such a Blizzard Shill™ you'd believe my source!"
    Dude B: ::posts the Webster Dictionary definition of the word 'objective' followed by a 700-word essay about how the WoW community is doomed::
    Quote Originally Posted by ClownPrincess View Post
    shut up idiot

  10. #68290
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    good. a bigger material penalty (the durability loss) and less time penalty, since doing any combat with ress sickness is useless having to spirit ress just meant you would afk for 10 minutes waiting out the timer.
    That's literally their reasoning for the change even. People just took it as "don't play for 10 minutes", which ultimately isn't in Blizzard's interest.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Atia View Post
    No, it's literally the same thing. The only difference is that with perso loot, the game is rolling "need" for anyone who is eligable to get that item. Hence you can end up with an item thats no upgrade for you that you can than either roll out, or just sell or idk put on your bank. At the end of the day, group loot is just as luck dependend as perso loot, as both systems work with a roll. You just don't see the perso loot roll right now :X
    It isn't. With Personal Loot, it's the game making the decision of who gets something. With Group Loot, it's YOU.

  11. #68291
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Aaaaand we are back to BiS lists, loot councils and never ending discussion after boss kill.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  12. #68292
    Quote Originally Posted by Koollan View Post
    Personal loot artificially took out a social aspect of the game. Also eliminated a lot of the 'drop excitement' that groups would have. Seeing a fat stack of loot on the boss and doling it out. As much as personal loot "helps", it harms more than it helps. Ideally, there would be a combination of the two where you can see what everybody got and freely trade it amongst eachother.
    What social aspect? Clicking a button is not a social aspect. Personal Loot is more social than Group on that matter since you actually need to talk to the person that got the drop.

  13. #68293
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Aaaaand we are back to BiS lists, loot councils and never ending discussion after boss kill.
    Yay, more guild breaks and arguments to be had...

    But this time on Discord/Twitch.

  14. #68294
    Over 9000! Lahis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Aaaaand we are back to BiS lists, loot councils and never ending discussion after boss kill.
    That's how it has always been. Last few years just has wasted bunch of loot because we couldn't trade it due to bullshit ilvl requirements.

  15. #68295
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lahis View Post
    That's how it has always been. Last few years just has wasted bunch of loot because we couldn't trade it due to bullshit ilvl requirements.
    "How it has always been" does not mean it was good. I prefer occasional loot wasted than what we are about to get.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmicpreds View Post
    Yay, more guild breaks and arguments to be had...

    But this time on Discord/Twitch.
    TBH if a person leaves/guild breaks because of loot drama, then there was something more going on and shit would probably go down anyway.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2022-09-29 at 04:58 PM.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  16. #68296
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Aaaaand we are back to BiS lists, loot councils and never ending discussion after boss kill.
    Sounds like a shit guild

  17. #68297
    Elemental Lord Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Man View Post
    Sounds like a shit guild
    Ye, only shit guilds form loot councils and tell people to prep their BiS lists for easier loot distribution. And we all know that no decent guild has any type of argument regarding loot when Group Loot is active.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  18. #68298

  19. #68299
    Quote Originally Posted by Bsirk View Post
    Two months! Time to *squee*

  20. #68300
    Well the release date is as spoiled 28/11.

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