Log-in queues and raiding - a problem?

[Facefive]

It is funny how all the comments are about what I can do to solve the problem, when the question was how the queue will affect raiding and keeping guilds together.
Not only is everybody jumping to blizzard's defense, neither is actually answering the topic.

As others have said, this is an odd mindset.

Because Blizzard cannot do shit about it, so rather than play the blame game and shift responsibility to whomsoever is causing the problem [...] you should consider who's capable of solving the problem.

Tell me who is? I know you are going to say that I am myself, but once again this is a very onesided kind of view.

[Relapses]

Of course it is a hardware solution. Here are two things they can do despite actively saying they can't:
1. Add layers and have them run on different hardware then make the database sync.
2. Refactor the code.

Especially the first solution is very costly. Very costly. Thus Blizzard obviously says there is no way.
I wish I could see it as easy as you do but it is just so frustrating.

Man, if only Blizzard could hire you to give them this sagely advice about how to manage their servers. I'm sure that guy who said that there's no technological solution was just lying because it costs too much. Btw, since we're on the subject -- where, again, can I download more RAM?

[God Save The King]

Is this like telling somebody to download more RAM?

A Blizzard employee told us in no uncertain terms that a technological solution doesn't exist and that if you want to avoid queues you need to take a FCM to one of the less-populated realms.

As someone in IT with a lot of experience with servers (specifically continuous connections like what a game would need) there is a technological cap on simultaneous connections.

Games like CoD get around this by either having a player act as host or having loads of miniature servers that can host a dozen or two clients at once. Most multiplayer games are generally small scale, max I've really seen outside MMOs is 100 for games like Fortnight.

To keep latency low, continuous games need to update somewhere around 20-50 times a second depending on the game. WoW is towards the lower end from what I can tell. Each additional connection doesn't grow linearly either because you need to process each player's actions and interactions and send that to everyone else. So when you cap at like 10k connections adding another 100 players would likely take more hardware than adding several new servers.

You also can't outhardware the problem either. At a certain point there's no more hardware to add to a single instance. I've seen the populations on queued realms and it is absolutely impressive Blizzard server engineers can maintain those numbers without issues.

There are solutions that are possible, but they're expensive and time consuming and might not work for Blizzard server architecture. I'm also not an expert in MMO game servers specifically so there may be lther limitations I'm unaware of.

[chiddie]

Like I said, I don't think this is something the playerbase should fix for Blizz. Could I set up a remote access? Sure. Do I want to? Not really. Can I guess the correct queue time from work? Absolutely not. Can I make sure I don't log off again, because I didn't make it home in time? Also a no.

How hard can it be for a multimillion dollar company to expand server capacities? I don't think it is a matter of money, but a matter of will.

Dude it’s not a hardware issue.

It’s a game code issue.

You can run Windows XP on a 32 core 128GB RAM PC but it won’t handle things it wasn’t coded to handle.

[hulkgor]

Gotta love the tech savvy users here.

Some of you should head to the Star Citizen thread and help them out with the server meshing \ concurrent users problem they're having.

[Dadwen]

Seems a number of people on the official forums have suggested they'd be willing to transfer if they had a free move later (or transfer back *temp transfer till the queues died down) if the server they ended up dying, number of them are worried about ending up on a server (like a number of the BC ones) that either died off or the faction dying out on the side they ended up on (been there myself could not even put a 5 man together on the horde side with the issues going up still till July *friend that was still playing on it up till then). Fact is people 0 faith in blizzard on helping them when if it does die out, short of selling them a transfer for money to get back to a healthy server, Someone posted a twitter of Brian back in Apr talking about dead factions on some servers and all anyone ever got from him was "its something we'd like to look at" and basically all they every did, maybe if your faction is less that 10% of the server offer a free transfer off rather than just having the people give up and quit, not like that last small group is really going to matter in the long run if they stick around or get moved off.

[Coldfrostzero]

Seems a number of people on the official forums have suggested they'd be willing to transfer if they had a free move later (or transfer back *temp transfer till the queues died down) if the server they ended up dying, number of them are worried about ending up on a server (like a number of the BC ones) that either died off or the faction dying out on the side they ended up on (been there myself could not even put a 5 man together on the horde side with the issues going up still till July *friend that was still playing on it up till then). Fact is people 0 faith in blizzard on helping them when if it does die out, short of selling them a transfer for money to get back to a healthy server, Someone posted a twitter of Brian back in Apr talking about dead factions on some servers and all anyone ever got from him was "its something we'd like to look at" and basically all they every did, maybe if your faction is less that 10% of the server offer a free transfer off rather than just having the people give up and quit, not like that last small group is really going to matter in the long run if they stick around or get moved off.

I've transferred 3 times at my own cost with several characters. Currently on Faeralina. Like the OP I was resistant to doing the remote log in. Monday I left work an hour early and got in about 11 server, bed by 1 server. Tuesday I got home about 2 hours later than I did Monday, put myself into queue and got in after midnight server. 6-7 hour queues.

Wednesday morning before I left for work I set up remote access on my phone, logged in early in the day and just kept myself at the log in screen for 9 hours and logged back in when I got d/ced. Yesterday, I put myself in the queue around my lunch break and was in-game about 30minutes before I left work and just kept myself in the log in screen until I got home. Although, I got d/ced and couldn't get my computer to reconnect, I arrived in time to click the "cancel" to connect and reconnected and got right in.

OP just needs to bite the bullet and remote access or move servers. That or wait for all the people who are going to quit the game or transfer off do so. Weather the storm or don't, but don't sit and suggest things that don't work or literally aren't solutions.

The only thing I can think of that would work would be to create a sub server to each Mega Server that is cross-realm only to it's sister server. So you can transfer to that and still use the AH and group with people in the primary server. Something Blizzard wouldn't do, but might solve some issues if it's technically possible.

[Kralljin]

but once again this is a very onesided kind of view.

It's not, your view is one sided because you don't want to consider solving the problem yourself.

You see it as a You vs. World thing, conclude that you are not wrong and thus someone else has to fix it.

[Enter Name Here]

just make your own group...no wait...server! i definitely meant server!

on a more serious note: it doesnt seem very smart to dump loads of money into a server infrastructure thats only needed for maybe a couple of weeks

[Facefive]

It's not, your view is one sided because you don't want to consider solving the problem yourself.

You see it as a You vs. World thing, conclude that you are not wrong and thus someone else has to fix it.

Oh ok! So saying that Blizzard needs to fix it is one-sided, but saying I need to fix it is not one-sided. Got it
I don't see it as a "me against the world". I see it as: You break it, you buy it.

But everybody keep licking Blizzards boots. Since people are not even trying to respond to the topic this can very well be closed.

[Utrrabbit]

Adding memory doesn't exist? Adding processors or physical partitions doesn't exist? Pretty sure all of the above does exist and can be installed if wanted

You must not know how servers work. Adding more partitions to them is not a thing. The servers are LITERALLY at cap. You can not add anything to them. Processors also will not do a thing.

- - - Updated - - -

Of course it is a hardware solution. Here are two things they can do despite actively saying they can't:
1. Add layers and have them run on different hardware then make the database sync.
2. Refactor the code.

Especially the first solution is very costly. Very costly. Thus Blizzard obviously says there is no way.
I wish I could see it as easy as you do but it is just so frustrating.

Those two things you mentioned LITERALLY are not a thing. Layers do NOT add capacity to servers. Try to know a little of what you talk about before trolling.

[ablib]

But everybody keep licking Blizzards boots. Since people are not even trying to respond to the topic this can very well be closed.

Because the "topic", in your mind, is a pointless one. What will guilds do? They will try and find a solution to a problem they have been given, or quit. That's obvious. So this thread is pointless, since the answer is obvious.

That is a very onesided kind of view. It should be:
I am presented with a problem I didn't cause. Is it my responsibility to solve it?

Yes! In the adult world, we are ALL faced with problems we didn't create, and we should take it upon ourselves to resolve. Problems arise from family members, pets, co-workers, clients at work, strangers I interact with outside of work, etc... Some people whine like a baby when presented with these problems, and others (successful people), ask themselves, ok, how can we solve this?

Also, as someone who works in the tech field for the past almost 20 years, and gets paid 6 figures for my expertise, when Aggrend said there isn't a technological solution to the problem (throw more hardware at it idea), it made perfect sense. There really isn't. It's not so much as a hardware issue, but a database one. I'm sure as the years go on, the game will continue to get more efficient, just as it already has over the the past 18 years, but for now -- there really isn't a tech solution to our problems.

[schwank05]

Come on over to Windseeker, we have a very healthy population and nearly perfectly balanced Realm. We are always recruiting hit me up in Game Krylon.

[xenogear3]

Set up remote access from your phone and log in a few hours before you get home?

If everyone is doing that, the queue time will only increase.

[Facefive]

Yes! In the adult world, we are ALL faced with problems we didn't create, and we should take it upon ourselves to resolve. Problems arise from family members, pets, co-workers, clients at work, strangers I interact with outside of work, etc... Some people whine like a baby when presented with these problems, and others (successful people), ask themselves, ok, how can we solve this?

Hello Mr. successful 6-figures guy. Listen to this homie. The "adult world" where you pretend to live in is filled with expectations laid upon people by people who are being dicks by creating problems they are not willing to solve. It is far from common sense to solve other peoples' problems. It is what society has become. Of course people adapt to situations, but if they pay for a service they can't fully use, it is most definitely NOT their business to deal with it. It's the companies business. Can't believe you don't understand this, when you are making 6 figures.

[ablib]

Hello Mr. successful 6-figures guy. Listen to this homie. The "adult world" where you pretend to live in is filled with expectations laid upon people by people who are being dicks by creating problems they are not willing to solve. It is far from common sense to solve other peoples' problems. It is what society has become. Of course people adapt to situations, but if they pay for a service they can't fully use, it is most definitely NOT their business to deal with it. It's the companies business. Can't believe you don't understand this, when you are making 6 figures.

I should have known it was pointless trying to make something clear to someone with your level of intellect.

Have fun hating life. Enjoy being pissed off.

[Elbob]

If someone tore down the complete left side wall of your house - in your neighborhood, where you grew up and made friendships.
Would you rather:
1. Deal with it
2. Move to another neighborhood, where you don't know anyone and can't talk to your family ever again
3. Travel until your wall has been magically fixed by someone

or 4: have the guy who tore down the wall repair the problem?

It is quite simply. I am not saying I don't know the solutions, that would be hideous to say. I am saying, if I didn't commit the crime I shouldn't be held accountable.

Except this isnt your house, its blizzard's house. You are complaining that the front door is too small for you to fit through. Thats your problem....

So find another house to go visit, or figure out how to fit through the door. There is no crime here and you aren't being actively punished by blizzard you are punishing yourself

[ONCHEhap]

It is funny how all the comments are about what I can do to solve the problem, when the question was how the queue will affect raiding and keeping guilds together.
Not only is everybody jumping to blizzard's defense, neither is actually answering the topic.

Nah, it's just that we can't really do much about it here on MMO-C. Obviously it's an issue on Blizzard's side(regardless of whether or not it's fixable), but we can't help you with that.

Best we can do is provide temporary solutions to the problem on your end

[Maell]

You were asking if they could instead of asking if they should.

Even if you could have no limit on how many players could join a server at a given moment, in a couple of weeks, in a couple of weeks the numbers will revert back to what is now server cap.

Why wasting throwing resources at a problem that will solve itself?

[Drudi]

Dude it’s not a hardware issue.

It’s a game code issue.

You can run Windows XP on a 32 core 128GB RAM PC but it won’t handle things it wasn’t coded to handle.

And they had what, 13 years to fix it?

The only issue here is greed. They are just too greedy to actually do something.