Crisis in UK, Can Tories Save Liz Truss?

[Kronik85]

They chose a new PM that is a human meat popsicle that is somehow dumber then Boris Johnson, Brexit is the disaster everyone predicted it would be and there is a global energy crisis leading to massive inflation.

Do you legit think this was the 'best' option they had?

Truss is there to take the heat and get thrown into the dumpster, the same way Boris was there to take the heat from 'getting brexit done'.

Which group we talking about here? The Parliamentary Party? Well they narrowed it down to Liz and Sunak over everyone who was in interested (which was basically every Tory to have held a cabinet post).

Then the Tory membership chose Truss over Sunak because she appealed to their particular brand of awful more than Sunak did.

I think you must be alluding to the former (the Parliamentary Party) and if you are then saying that nobody wanted the job so Liz got it is factually wrong, they all went for it.

Personally I wouldn't say any of the potential options were the best option for the country, I think it's pretty plain that Sunak would of been a better choice than Liz but it doesn't really matter because none of us get a say now, the only people that do are the 160k Tory Party members who get a vote on it.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah, because when Labour fucked it that strategy worked so well that they've been out of power for 12 years and it has taken a Tory implosion for them and the country to believe that they can win the next election.

Gordon Brown was single handedly responsible for the 2008 financial crash . I mean fair play it's not like Liz and Kwarteng caused the multifaceted set of global emergencies we currently face but it's not as if Dave and George parachuted in and unfucked it either, their particular choices led us to the slowest recovery in the G7 and then eventually Brexit.

Let's not be throwing undue credit around.

- - - Updated - - -

Tory logic would have had Trump win.
Tories: Let's fuck it up so bad, the next person will spend YEARS trying to unfuck it, we can blame them for it still being bad come election and we can be elected.

Shit take, nuff said. No Government is deliberately trying to fuck over the country so the next guy has to unfuck it. They just naturally get there when they are allowed to indulge in their worst excesses. Hence Liz and Kwarteng's tax cuts, its economic vandalism justified by the fact they have always wanted to do it, not because there is an economic need to. Ideologues suck. But hey, you get the government you deserve in a democracy.

[Huehuecoyotl]

It's pretty simple. The UK is currently being run by the comedy double act of Dunning and Kruger. The pair of them aren't smart enough to appreciate how stupid they are. And we're all going to pay the price for it.

[Pann]

She's delusional!

I'm waiting to see what she says tomorrow morning but if she continues with this line into the Tory conference it will simply be a question of whether the party removes her or voters do it for them and remove her and the party. I will be surprised if she lasts past Christmas.

[jonnysensible]

i put a £5 on her not lasting till the end of the year at 41.0 now its 7.0 and offering me a 25quid cashout. Can't believe im saying this but i believe the tories will do the right thing...and bin her. Party comes first even tho they are fucked either way, people finally sussing that they are cunts.

[The Stormbringer]

A lovely little piece for those not entirely following the current shit show in the UK:

[Huehuecoyotl]

i put a £5 on her not lasting till the end of the year at 41.0 now its 7.0 and offering me a 25quid cashout. Can't believe im saying this but i believe the tories will do the right thing...and bin her. Party comes first even tho they are fucked either way, people finally sussing that they are cunts.

You could be right. But for the Tories the "right thing" represents what is best for their party sponsors, and for the continued grasp on the levers of power to further the aims of those sponsors. They'll let a bit of personal greed creep in from time to time, but that's never allowed to work against their primary aim.

So don't be fooled if they do ditch Liz. They haven't suddenly grown consciences, or decided to be on the side of the ordinary voter. They've just realised that keeping her could lose them control of the country. And that would be why they acted. And if they don't act, it's because their sponsors are happy enough personally with what's happening in the country. Probably depends on what proportion of them are making money out of the chaos (beyond the ones that are going to benefit hugely from all the tax cuts).

Even the Tories being wiped out won't solve this problem, of course. They'll just fire their money at another party to carry on doing the same thing under a new brand. UK politics is like US politics in this sense, a depressing sequence of events demanded by big money at the expense of the rest of us.

[Kronik85]

Liz Truss is so awful the BBC can't even handle her presence as Laura Kuensburg's show this morning keeps black screening during her interview.

- - - Updated - - -

Fucking hell Laura bringing the receipts as Liz keeps dodging that her mini budget caused an immediate spike in the markets lol. I've never seen an interviewer go so far as making her guests look at a graph debunking their position. More of this please...for every politician trying to spin fantasies.

[Pann]

Absolute car crash of an interview. She's completely out of her depth.

- - - Updated - - -

The only straight answer she's given is to blame Kwarteng for 45p rate cut. It's all his fault but she stands by it.

[Kronik85]

Absolute car crash of an interview. She's completely out of her depth.

- - - Updated - - -

The only straight answer she's given is to blame Kwarteng for 45p rate cut. It's all his fault but she stands by it.

I think she survived, that's probably all she was expected to do and she did just that. I don't think we learnt anything aside from the fact that she will stoically front her car crash plans to the media.

[Pann]

Based on Truss' interview there is no doubt in my mind that if she leads the Tory party into the next election they will end up in opposition but I am not sure if they will be the opposition.

They need to ditch her and ditch her now!

[dribbles]

Based on Truss' interview there is no doubt in my mind that if she leads the Tory party into the next election they will end up in opposition but I am not sure if they will be the opposition.

They need to ditch her and ditch her now!

And replace her with who? Pick any current world leader as a model, who is better than her? They are all as bad as each other.

Stick with Liz!

[Pann]

And replace her with who? Pick any current world leader as a model, who is better than her? They are all as bad as each other.

Stick with Liz!

Anyone. Sunak, Tugendhat, Gove, Javid, Cleverly, Wallace, Mordaunt, etc but at this point I'd even take the tub of lard that stood in for Roy Hattersley!

If they stick with Liz they're finished.

[dribbles]

Anyone. Sunak, Tugendhat, Gove, Javid, Cleverly, Wallace, Mordaunt, etc but at this point I'd even take the tub of lard that stood in for Roy Hattersley!

If they stick with Liz they're finished.

I think they will stick with Liz. All those you mention are untested as a potential PM, probably as bad and more of the same so hopefully we never find out, same with Starmer for Labour I'd rather watch cement dry.

Humour me, choose a tried and tested current or recent example from the crop of world leaders that takes your fancy, that you could parachute in to run the UK tomorrow to save us from Liz, who would it be? Biden, Trump, Putin, von der Leyen, Orban, Bolsanaro, Xi Jinping, Kim Jong-un, Boris Johnson back, Corbyn etc etc? Go on give me an example.

Look at who is running the world, they are all terribad and in comparison Liz is not so.

Give Liz a chance!, and I think the Tories will. As we found out when Boris got booted there could be worse...

[Pann]

I think they will stick with Liz. All those you mention are untested as a potential PM, probably as bad and more of the same so hopefully we never find out, same with Starmer for Labour I'd rather watch cement dry.

Humour me, choose a tried and tested current or recent example from the crop of world leaders that takes your fancy, that you could parachute in to run the UK tomorrow to save us from Liz, who would it be? Biden, Trump, Putin, von der Leyen, Orban, Bolsanaro, Xi Jinping, Kim Jong-un, Boris Johnson back, Corbyn etc etc? Go on give me an example.

Look at who is running the world, they are all terribad and in comparison Liz is not so.

Give Liz a chance!, and I think the Tories will. As we found out when Boris got booted there could be worse...

Then they'll be in opposition come next election and you'll be watching cement dry. It's that simple. If they get Sunak in now they have a chance of at least not being annihilated at the next election.

Interesting you mention von der Leyen, at least the Germans noticed how shit she was and promoted her out of the way, we made our version PM!

The fact that there are many poor leaders doesn't excuse that Truss is exceeding poor.

I have given Liz a chance - if you remember a few weeks ago I said any Tory MP who writes a confidence letter should lose the whip - and she has turned out to be worse than I could possibly have imagined.

Unfortunately I have to agree with your last point.

[Candiman]

How about this one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacinda_Ardern
Seems to be doing a rather decent job I'd say. Funny you only managed to name right wing leaders, dictators ,Jeremy Corbyn(who is not exactly a tested world leader) and Biden who was only elected because the alternative was Trump.

[Edge-]

Biden, Trump, Putin, von der Leyen, Orban, Bolsanaro, Xi Jinping, Kim Jong-un, Boris Johnson back, Corbyn etc etc? Go on give me an example.

Man, do you really think that's the extent of world leadership? The US, the UK, and a bunch of fuckin authoritarian leaders?

[Elegiac]

Man, do you really think that's the extent of world leadership? The US, the UK, and a bunch of fuckin authoritarian leaders?

I'm not sure they do much thinking at all, truth be told. See the following flip-flopping in the space of less than two months:

darling Liz

Mad Liz

Give Liz a chance!

[The Stormbringer]

I don't understand how any Brits still vote for the Tories, since it sounds like they've succesfully driven the country into the ground. People are going to be losing their homes and freezing to death this winter. How? How is anyone still keeping the Tories in power? Is the efficacy of money really that great? All the rich people bankrolling Tories for advertising and who knows what else is convincing enough people to vote against their own interests? When will they learn? Will they learn before it's too late? Is it ALREADY too late?

[Elegiac]

I don't understand how any Brits still vote for the Tories, since it sounds like they've succesfully driven the country into the ground. People are going to be losing their homes and freezing to death this winter. How? How is anyone still keeping the Tories in power? Is the efficacy of money really that great? All the rich people bankrolling Tories for advertising and who knows what else is convincing enough people to vote against their own interests? When will they learn? Will they learn before it's too late? Is it ALREADY too late?

There's a few factors involved, some of which you point out:

- Rich people, and by extension the British media successfully propagandizing right wing nonsense. This has been a trend in most of the Anglosphere since the 1980s and the subsequent emergence of Murdoch's media empire.
- A fucky electoral system. While not as pronounced as somewhere like the US, the UK still suffers from the problem of having single member districts with a FPTP voting system that easily results in spoiler votes. Which also ties into...
- Lack of a concerted opposition. The Conservative Party has the benefit of being, well, conservative and as a result have less of hurdle when it comes to actually having an agenda besides 'stay the course'. By contrast, the opposition get split along a whole host of ideological lines between Labour and a myriad of third parties, to say nothing of the ideological splits within Labour itself between neoliberal Blairites (who don't actually differ from the Tories all that much) and its more left wing elements.
- Brexit. 8 years on and the UK still does not have a concrete idea of what sort of relationship it wants to have with the continent, and as a result the fault lines that emerged during 2016 that disrupted traditional party lines are still extant. This mostly applies to opposition parties since the Tories had the benefit of UKIP becoming defunct and funneling its voters back into the Conservative camp.

Compare the situation in the UK to the most recent election in Australia; the Australian Labor Party did not actually receive a majority of first option votes since opposition to conservative rule was split among third parties and independents, but thanks to its ranked choice voting system they still managed to oust the right wing government. What the UK needs above everything else at this point is actual electoral reform.

[Flarelaine]

I think they will stick with Liz. All those you mention are untested as a potential PM, probably as bad and more of the same so hopefully we never find out, same with Starmer for Labour I'd rather watch cement dry.

Humour me, choose a tried and tested current or recent example from the crop of world leaders that takes your fancy, that you could parachute in to run the UK tomorrow to save us from Liz, who would it be? Biden, Trump, Putin, von der Leyen, Orban, Bolsanaro, Xi Jinping, Kim Jong-un, Boris Johnson back, Corbyn etc etc? Go on give me an example.

Look at who is running the world, they are all terribad and in comparison Liz is not so.

Give Liz a chance!, and I think the Tories will. As we found out when Boris got booted there could be worse...

"I know she's a pile of steaming crap but she's our steaming pile of crap" is not the glowing letter of recommendation that you seem to think it is.