After playing Wrath I’m reminded why they pruned abilities

[Recovery]

MoP had some of the best class design in the game ever, and they ruined it when they started pruning in WoD.

I can agree with this.. When they went to "spec fantasy" rather than "class fantasy" they kinda screwed the game up.

[Perudo]

Got a few screenshots of my UI:s back in Wrath.
Now I cannot say that my way of keybinding is/was good, but it worked for the casual level I was playing then. (I have changed how I do my keybinds a lot since then)

Elemental shaman

Demology Warlock


Cannot say that I remember having problems with not enough keybinds for my skills. But then again I was not using loads of macros and such back then.

[Cracked]

And here I am, appreciating how many tools my character has and hating how streamlined it is on retail.

[Amunine]

I agree with Mend, if you've leveled the class personally or have played it in the past whether on Retail Wrath (and actually remember what you used) or on a Private Server you learn what you need to keybind and what not to. In terms of simple keybinding and buttons 20-30 is really realistic for the average player.

For example, me personally I have mousewheel up, down, modified with shift, crtl, and alt, alt mw push. That alone is 9 bindings, nothing crazy but i have general same feeling abilities tied to those, like Shift MWD is my movement increase ability like Dash, Sprint, etc. Alt MWD being my 'charge', feral charge, charge, shadowstep, etc. that makes keybinds easier cause there's always just an easy default for those kind of spells.

There's definitely a lot of situational abilities that you don't need keybound, for druid there's Hibernate(for pve no need to keybind), Soothe Animal, cower, Nature's Grasp to name a few. My experience is mainly pve, so obviously something like Nature's Grasp will probably be keybound if you PvP.

If you're like me and use a healing addon like VuhDo or Healbot i don't really need keybinds for heals, I do keybind my major ones still with a mouseover macro in case I DC while I am healing.

[Ateo]

Oh no my mmo doesn't play like an arpg, the sky is falling and life is too complex after I boosted characters and have no clue how to play them. *Eye roll*

[Pokeylope]

Get a Razer Naga mmo mouse, it has 12 side buttons, the moust wheel is a button when pushed in, as well as two buttons when tilted to the right or left. Two buttons below mouse wheel.
I literally use my mouse buttons, also mouse buttons + shift or control, doubles your buttons without really changing them. Then I use v/Shift-v and r/shift-r, maybe you just don't like mmos, because I use all those buttons in retail and have since Cata(where i decided to stop using a keyboard and clicking my spells lol, still would beat non clickers, got really good at clicking lmao XD)

[fatgunn]

At a certain point some stuff just doesn't need to be keybound.

I generally only run 20 keybinds for combat. On retail I additionally have a few keybinds for opie menus of out of combat stuff. I main lock so its stuff like soulwell, breath, demons, etc. On classic I've just been putting a lot of that kind of thing on an extra bar. I dont pvp and Im not the most amazing player in the world but this has been sufficient.


RET



PROT

[M1r4g3]

Whos forcing you to bind all of your abilities, especially the ones you almost never use or don't require speed?

[Hctaz]

This is the correct take.

It is definitely the correct take.

I know from my own personal experience.

I leveled with my wife in Classic and TBC. Warrior Hunter combination.

Played her Hunter occasionally throughout the levels, and I used to remember what all her keybinds did. Came back in TBC and it was like... Holy hell there were 40 billion abilities.

Not only that, but during the Classic pre patch with the 50% exp buff, I leveled a ton of characters from 1-70 but I also boosted one shaman to 70.

All of the characters I leveled from 1-70 felt ezpz to play. I knew where everything was and what everything did. That shaman? I spent hours setting that dude up and I'm still questioning whether or not I'm missing relevant buttons LOL

[Djuntas]

I use 1-7 + QEF.

The rest i click.

Playing Warlock.


I’ll never understand how people can click Shift+F and Stuff like that, Does it not confuse you where the bind or what ability has what bind?

Instead of just clicking?

I played sort of like you back in the 05-08 days. A bit of clicking and keybinding. It was not until mid-wrath I fully keybinded everything. Trust me, you get used to it, and it makes a HUGE difference. Its not as big as say an RTS...Erhm side note, if you never played like Starcraft 2 or age of empires etc, if you dont keybind in such games you cant even compete vs the AI....Night an day, but its also a huge help in other games.

[kranur]

What new player wants to join a game to be bad?

There will be no agreement on this thread. OP is talking about how complexity is intimidating and off-putting to a lot of people on a casual MMO like wow. Others are arguing they hate people who like easier things (while playing one of the easier MMOs) and it's not bad once you put on 100hours of leveling. Which means the game is weird for new players. Y'all are going to keep posting across each other. Hell, people in this thread say extra keys are vital and useless.

Well, of course it's intimidating if the person doesn't take the time to try things out and think for a second in what sort of situations they may be useful.
What he did was boost a char and complain that it has too many spells that he's not willing to practice on how to use them.
A new player doesn't necessarily want to be bad, but as per OP, he doesn't want to get good either.

But it's fine, it's why classic is a thing in the first place.

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I was exagerating with the 50, most classes get away with ~5 macros that just rotate their abilities and cds...

and from my experience what is 'useful' while leveling is hardly used in an actual raid setting, and so you are left with 3 buttons you push, a couple cd's, and a spellbook full of useless never to be seen abilities. hence why i totally agree that the ability pruning was a great move by blizzard.

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Well that's a bold statement. quite rude on your part to assume i am bad at the game and can't decide which of my 4 out of 50 buttons are to be pressed or stored in my spellbook never to be seen again, until they take them out, at which point i will have to cry because i don't have them anymore, although i never actually used them in actual in game situations o.o

That's what you complained about. What am I to make of it? That you're angry of their existence or just because they taunt you by being there or what?

[mcnally86]

Well, of course it's intimidating if the person doesn't take the time to try things out and think for a second in what sort of situations they may be useful.
What he did was boost a char and complain that it has too many spells that he's not willing to practice on how to use them.
A new player doesn't necessarily want to be bad, but as per OP, he doesn't want to get good either.

But it's fine, it's why classic is a thing in the first place.

I'm not sure op didn't want to get good. He was just pointing out when it takes 40+ hours to catch up with your friends it is intimidating. Might as well switch games as a friend group. Even if you are bad in Natural Selection 2 you can still get some headshots by chance. No way are you going to drop optimal totems to get a compliment in the dungeon party by chance.

[kranur]

I'm not sure op didn't want to get good. He was just pointing out when it takes 40+ hours to catch up with your friends it is intimidating. Might as well switch games as a friend group. Even if you are bad in Natural Selection 2 you can still get some headshots by chance. No way are you going to drop optimal totems to get a compliment in the dungeon party by chance.

Here's the thing. If you're a new player, you don't need to do everything optimal right from the start, you don't need other people complimenting you and you won't be doing hard content that require that anyway. You learn to play well by ... you know ... playing the game lol

[Dalinos]

I use 1-7 + QEF.

The rest i click.

Playing Warlock.


I’ll never understand how people can click Shift+F and Stuff like that, Does it not confuse you where the bind or what ability has what bind?

Instead of just clicking?

I play a Druid, a Guardian Druid, but this applies to all druid specs. Due to our forms, every letter/number is actually 3 things. Humanoid form, cat form, bear form. Or Humanoid form, tree form, moonkin form. The way to remember all this shit is to group up similar abilities. For example:

F in Bear form is Taunt.
Shift + F in Bear form is AOE taunt.
F in Cat form is Dash
Shift + F in Cat form is Stampeding Roar.
F in humanoid form is Combat Res
Shift + F in Humanoid form is unbound.

Ya feel me? Also, Modifier macros mean that I only use 1 keybind slot for 6 abilities. Let's say for example, R. R is keybound on the base bars, on number 12.

R is Swipe in bear form, Shift + R is Thrash.
R is Rip in Cat form, Shift + R is Stealth.
R is Remove Curse/Poison in normal form, Shift + R is Regrowth.

With this way, you can fit 6 abilities, on 1 keybind slot. After that, it's just muscle memory. Then again, as has been said in this thread already, most competitive/serious WoW players know how to blind-type. I mean, I learnt how to blind-type by age 14 or some shit cause I was playing WOW at night in the dark and my mum wanted me to keep lights off.

[Polybius]

Here's the thing. If you're a new player, you don't need to do everything optimal right from the start, you don't need other people complimenting you and you won't be doing hard content that require that anyway. You learn to play well by ... you know ... playing the game lol

That doesn’t work when you’re trying to play with friends in an MMO. It’s better for those friends to help do older content or play alts if they really want to play together.

Or for op to tell their friends to calm their tits. I had some who would pressure to go through a lot of slog but I eventually gave up and just got a story skip. If it’s a friend group the newbie can learn through pressure in endgame*, they won’t be scrutinized by pugs. It’s especially true if it’s not their first MMO or character.

[Tsyplenk]

Sounds like git gud for me.

[garicasha]

Many people took the OP as a complaint which is to be expected, although some got what I was going for such as mcnally86.

The most on topic thing that could be said is imagine if Cataclysm hadn’t changed the recipe and the level cap had moved to 90, each class got a new ability at level 85 and level 90, and everyone had 10 more talent points and at least one more clickable talent.

It’d have been insane:
—The number of abilities for the “busiest” classes would have increased by a minimum of three but likely more.
—Those abilities would likely just have cannibalized other buttons
—81 talent points would have been available
——Weird 40/41 or 30/31/20 hybrid builds would have shown up
——If the signature abilities had been placed lower than 41 points in then fresh toons wouldn’t have received their basic abilities until level 56 or later lol
——The theorycrafting behind it would have gotten so complicated that taking a cookie-cutter spec from online would have been the only way to know if +10% on ability X was better than +6% on ability Y.

There’s just no way they could have continued with adding all these new abilities and 10 more talent points.

To the dude that also bound F to taunt and Shift F to aoe taunt, I get you brother.

To the dude that bound the abilities that make you go forward faster to Mouse Wheel DOWN I am jokingly serious that your keybinds are an abomination and they should be sent straight to the deepest levels of hell where Marcus Brutus and Caius Cassius can use them to play Escape From Durnholde for all eternity.

[Soisoisoi]

I’ll never understand how people can click Shift+F and Stuff like that, Does it not confuse you where the bind or what ability has what bind?

Instead of just clicking?

No. I have 70 Keybinds*. I know where all my buttons are, I do not need my UI to be shown at all. Muscle memory is a helluva drug. Bind the same type of ability across all your alts and you're good to go. I can log any character without knowing what character is and still use all my mobility/defensives/offensives etc. F = interrupt, shift+F = Focus interrupt. Naga-456 = defensives. 1234 main rotational abilities. 5 = stun, shift+5 = Focus stun. Q = AoE CC. E and R currently covenant abilities. V = Purge/Spellsteal etc, etc. no matter which class I play, the ability I need will be where I need it.

*No, not all my binds are used, especially since pruning was a thing. Mostly for PvP, arena macros and the likes.

[Amnaught]

Boosted an enhance shaman today and it took me over an hour to set up the UI, even though I’m very saavy setting it up now and have leveled a shaman before.

And I’m a little OCD in that I want to put every ability on my bars somewhere, even stuff I know is never getting pressed like Binding Heal on shadow priest. But even if I don’t bind a key to them I know I’ll completely forget about the ability if I don’t occasionally mouse over it.

But looking at just my toons:
Enhance:
—Have to pick (and bind) 20 totems and
——the three options of 4 I can auto-place
—Have to pick the right weapon buff
—Have to pick the right shock
—Have to bind all the heals
—Have to choose and bind all the talents
—Have to bind a half-dozen 3+ minute cooldowns and Shamanistic Rage
—Have to choose glyphs

Shadow (dps isn’t too bad but binding all the heals gets to be a lot)
—3-4 DoTs, Mind Blast, Mind Flay
—The description of shadow form is a page long
—Binding all the heals, flash, greater, renew, shield
—Cure Disease, Dispel Magic, Mass Dispel
—Cooldowns of shadow fiend, dispersion, Hymn of Hope, Symbol of Hope

And my other alt is a pally, and they have even More abilities:
Auras
Hands
Blessings, both manual and greater
Normal DPS abilities
Heals
Raid Cooldowns
Personal Cooldowns

And don’t get me wrong it was/is a lot of fun having all this utility and clever ways to use it is what made classic, classic.

But I can see why the choice was made to prune. New players in 2008-2012ish would have been swamped. And also as the competitive raiding stepped up, each extra ability was another thing to debug and balance.

Crazy idea: Just give us fucking glyph-like slots for talents, and unprune all of this. Seriously. You'd have an easily digestible amount of abilities on your action bars, the different slots could even default to certain stuff based on your spec, then you go to a rested area and swap out any of them.

Here are 50 totems. Pick your favorite 4.

[mcnally86]

No. I have 70 Keybinds*. I know where all my buttons are, I do not need my UI to be shown at all. Muscle memory is a helluva drug. Bind the same type of ability across all your alts and you're good to go. I can log any character without knowing what character is and still use all my mobility/defensives/offensives etc. F = interrupt, shift+F = Focus interrupt. Naga-456 = defensives. 1234 main rotational abilities. 5 = stun, shift+5 = Focus stun. Q = AoE CC. E and R currently covenant abilities. V = Purge/Spellsteal etc, etc. no matter which class I play, the ability I need will be where I need it.

*No, not all my binds are used, especially since pruning was a thing. Mostly for PvP, arena macros and the likes.

Hey, no way. F is also my interupt. I did it first on my rogue because it looked like I was kicking someone in the face. After that I found myself hitting that spot for all my characters. Instead of learning new buttons I just put the new ones there.

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Crazy idea: Just give us fucking glyph-like slots for talents, and unprune all of this. Seriously. You'd have an easily digestible amount of abilities on your action bars, the different slots could even default to certain stuff based on your spec, then you go to a rested area and swap out any of them.

Here are 50 totems. Pick your favorite 4.

Isn't that guild wars 1? That game got nuts with the combos.

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Here's the thing. If you're a new player, you don't need to do everything optimal right from the start, you don't need other people complimenting you and you won't be doing hard content that require that anyway. You learn to play well by ... you know ... playing the game lol

No one wants to be the dopy little brother. What you are describing is a huge turn off to new players.

Granted you were just a grunt in old wow so it was appropriate. All the top MMOs now are huge power fantasies. Hell every single player in FF14 is the chosen ONE. I hear that might be the top MMO full of players who say "mama Square says I'm the MOST handsome boy I the world". So maybe people do like to be the dopy little brother?

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Many people took the OP as a complaint which is to be expected, although some got what I was going for such as mcnally86.

.

People arguing past each other, on my internet?

I got you dude. You just noticed a thing. Some people don't feel important unless they say the saw it first. Or the opposite, they don't see things the same as you so you must be wrong. How dare you imply they have not noticed a thing!

Though I do like how posts alternate between all of the buttons don't matter and no, but I totally used every button!