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  1. #321
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    Well, that depends on what you consider jrpg? Nier Automata is technically a jrpg and it was AMAZING. But yea, when we're talking about the usual jrpgs that everyone knows about, they all have crappy combat.
    Debatable. Certainly after the transition to more action-y combat FF in particular has not been that great. XIII and its ilk as well as XV did not do themselves any favors with trying to be more AARPG in their combat (though it was by no means their only problem). But earlier titles had some banger combat, even in the "modern" era. FFX-2 and FFXII for example have absolutely amazing combat, arguably the best in all of (main-line) FF. But they're not really action games, and the current market seems to gravitate toward that kind of gameplay.

  2. #322
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    Well, that depends on what you consider jrpg? Nier Automata is technically a jrpg and it was AMAZING. But yea, when we're talking about the usual jrpgs that everyone knows about, they all have crappy combat.
    Nier's combat was flashy, but honestly boring. I played on the hardest non 1hko difficulty my first time and enemies and combat were completely trivial at all points in the game. I thoroughly enjoyed the game, and even platinum'd it; but the combat engagement was easily the games weakest point IMO.

    I'm not sure what game I'd put up as my favorite with respect to action combat other than maybe Sekiro. I've always been a huge Tales of fan, but their combat has always been fun, but irrelevant because enemies hardly fight back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Debatable. Certainly after the transition to more action-y combat FF in particular has not been that great. XIII and its ilk as well as XV did not do themselves any favors with trying to be more AARPG in their combat (though it was by no means their only problem). But earlier titles had some banger combat, even in the "modern" era. FFX-2 and FFXII for example have absolutely amazing combat, arguably the best in all of (main-line) FF. But they're not really action games, and the current market seems to gravitate toward that kind of gameplay.
    I hated FF12 combat. FFX and by proxy FFX2 had pretty much the best classic FF combat, but NO WHERE near best turn based combat the genre has seen IMO.

  3. #323
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Debatable. Certainly after the transition to more action-y combat FF in particular has not been that great. XIII and its ilk as well as XV did not do themselves any favors with trying to be more AARPG in their combat (though it was by no means their only problem). But earlier titles had some banger combat, even in the "modern" era. FFX-2 and FFXII for example have absolutely amazing combat, arguably the best in all of (main-line) FF. But they're not really action games, and the current market seems to gravitate toward that kind of gameplay.
    In what fucking universe is XIII action? It's a full menu based ATB combat system. Lightning Returns added some very minor action elements but that was like the 3rd game in the series, the original game and 2 and pure ATB. Never mind you later say XII has amazing combat, I think you just say things without actually playing games.

  4. #324
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    In what fucking universe is XIII action?
    I didn't say that. I said "more action-y".

    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    I think you just say things without actually playing games.
    And I think you just replied without actually reading my post. So...

  5. #325
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post


    - - - Updated - - -

    My pet peeve is that it seems like all of the Eikons are going to be the traditional classics. No originals (except for maybe that one Eikon depicted at the top of the mural at the end, probably the final boss or antagonist or something).
    I think that's Ravana.

  6. #326
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    I didn't say that. I said "more action-y".
    There is nothing "action-y" about it. You can try to wiggle your way out of it but its a pure menu based ATB combat system similar to 4-9 just while hard controlling a single character and using paradigm shift to soft control the others.

    Oh man look at this action-y combat where you can't even move your character and you just select abilities to use in a menu! There is even a transition screen between encountering enemy in the field and the actual battle what an action game it is!
    Last edited by Tech614; 2022-10-22 at 08:16 PM.

  7. #327
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    Nier's combat was flashy, but honestly boring. I played on the hardest non 1hko difficulty my first time and enemies and combat were completely trivial at all points in the game. I thoroughly enjoyed the game, and even platinum'd it; but the combat engagement was easily the games weakest point IMO.

    I'm not sure what game I'd put up as my favorite with respect to action combat other than maybe Sekiro. I've always been a huge Tales of fan, but their combat has always been fun, but irrelevant because enemies hardly fight back.
    You're mixing up combat system with overall interaction in the game with the combat system. Idk how to word that better lol. I thought Nier Automata had a very good combat system, but the game didn't make good use of it, I agree there. If you honestly thought its combat system was boring, then you should think dmc is boring too, they're the same really (and bayonetta).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    I hated FF12 combat. FFX and by proxy FFX2 had pretty much the best classic FF combat, but NO WHERE near best turn based combat the genre has seen IMO.
    Idk about best but I really liked Chrono Cross combat. Unfortunately, it's another game where the combat system doesn't really get maximized because you can just use any ability without knowing what you were doing and still beat the game.

  8. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by blackpink View Post
    You're mixing up combat system with overall interaction in the game with the combat system. Idk how to word that better lol. I thought Nier Automata had a very good combat system, but the game didn't make good use of it, I agree there. If you honestly thought its combat system was boring, then you should think dmc is boring too, they're the same really (and bayonetta).
    what about automata's combat system was good? It had great animations and was definitely responsive, but it was very shallow. Is that what you mean by the game not making good use of it?

    I agree DMC suffers from the same issue.

  9. #329
    I don't get how Kingdom Hearts nailed action combat way back on the PS2 but FF still struggles with it to this day.

    Hopefully they get it right with 16.

  10. #330
    Quote Originally Posted by everydaygamer View Post
    I don't get how Kingdom Hearts nailed action combat way back on the PS2 but FF still struggles with it to this day.

    Hopefully they get it right with 16.
    Kingdom Hearts didn't nail anything in the action department whatsoever.

  11. #331
    Do we have a date ?

    Insta buy when it gets on steam.

    Joking, but the trailer is very nice and well as the music (but that is usually the case with the FF).

    I will probably buy it because the story seems interesting and it seems dark as well but it will also depend if the fight mechanics are interesting.

  12. #332
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    what about automata's combat system was good? It had great animations and was definitely responsive, but it was very shallow. Is that what you mean by the game not making good use of it?

    I agree DMC suffers from the same issue.
    The amount of combos you could pull off, the flexibility, and freedom only limited by your own creativity. It was not shallow at all, not sure what you're talking about there.



    Not saying I'm as good as this guy but more so proving that the amount of combos you could pull off is quite a lot. They have tons of videos like this if you've never heard of them.

    What I meant by the game not making good use of the combat system is that none of it was required at all, so most players don't even know this is possible. I myself beat the game on the hardest difficulty just using the basic combo lol, that's pretty bad game design relative to the combat system.

  13. #333
    Quote Originally Posted by Specialka View Post
    Do we have a date ?

    Insta buy when it gets on steam.

    Joking, but the trailer is very nice and well as the music (but that is usually the case with the FF).

    I will probably buy it because the story seems interesting and it seems dark as well but it will also depend if the fight mechanics are interesting.
    XVI is Summer 2023 with VII-R2 in Winter 2023.

    Fixed it for ya
    Last edited by babalou1; 2022-10-23 at 06:39 PM.

  14. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by babalou1 View Post
    VII-R2 in Decemember of 2023
    This is not confirmed at all, just winter. Early march or late feb 2024 is most likely, thats still "winter 2023" not sure why Japan keeps labeling dates like that and baiting westerners to think it must be december lol.

  15. #335
    Quote Originally Posted by Shakzor View Post
    FFXVs problem was definitely not that you only played Noctis. The combat was just boring af and just "mash button" from start to finish. As long as that got WAY better, i don't mind just playing one character.
    Most only play as the "protagonist" in most games anyways (like as Alphen in Tales of Arise or Shulk in Xenoblade).

    Links for 5 Interviews for those interested

    Points like the story not being "defy fate" for once, but rather about ideals and "what is actually right and wrong?" and following the actual live of the protagonist through decades are really interesting. With being rated M, they can also actually touch on subjects a lot more graphic and detailed, rather than having to tone it down or relegate it to background "they talked about it"
    That was a lot of peoples problem with 15. They eventually dropped DLC where you can play as the other characters, added in story DLC for all of them, and even was able to play the antagonist story which turned out to be a prequel. They changed so much long after the game released and added so much more content that it honestly feels like a new game until you get to the depressing ending.

  16. #336
    Watching the newest trailer makes me think they are repeating another modern FF mistake. Making the story way too convoluted. How many kingdoms are there gonna be all vying for power with different political power moves with characters that look and sound the same.

    Can't we just save the world from crystals

  17. #337
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    Watching the newest trailer makes me think they are repeating another modern FF mistake. Making the story way too convoluted.
    Definitely a major turn-off for me. XIII & Co. were bad enough with a mythology that makes the Silmarillion look like a recipe page, but XV really made it painful with world building that feels like getting hit in the face with a silver brick.

    It's like they looked at people's reaction to XII and went "people moaning about politics and historical reference bloat? WE GOT A WINNER HERE, MORE OF THAT!".

  18. #338
    I am Murloc! Maljinwo's Avatar
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    Ivalice-like Politics > killing god with crystal powers
    This world don't give us nothing. It be our lot to suffer... and our duty to fight back.

  19. #339
    Quote Originally Posted by Maljinwo View Post
    Ivalice-like Politics > killing god with crystal powers
    Not when they all look like KPOP bandmembers and the only diversity is "black people in sand kingdom".

    You look at a character roster like FF9 and everyone looks different and its far more easier to tell the kingdoms and actually give life and feeling to them instead of just being a name you forget within two months.

  20. #340
    FF16's setting and visuals look rather boring. Yeah, sure, it has the spectacular one-off Eikon battles, but the rest looks meh. Everyone is a human. Mundane outfits. Boring brown environments. Same issue with FF15 which looked like a drive through Barstow.

    I am currently replaying FF13 right now. You get to travel through a visually interesting fantasy world with the unique environments and crazy fashion. You get to visit the weird outer shell of Cocoon, traverse across a tsunami that was crystalized, stroll through a weird biomechanical forest, and so on.













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    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    You look at a character roster like FF9 and everyone looks different and its far more easier to tell the kingdoms and actually give life and feeling to them instead of just being a name you forget within two months.
    FF9 had great aesthetics. The steampunk/airship city of Lindblum is very memorable, and then you had Burmecia where it was always raining, and that weird kingdom up in the tree tops surrounded by a sandstorm with rivers of sands flowing down the tree.
    Last edited by Val the Moofia Boss; 2022-10-23 at 08:36 PM.

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