Lord of the Rings TV Series Purchased by Amazon

[Koriani]

So would you say the books are important when there's a show written based on them, or is that totally irrelevant?

I think you basically belong in a different thread from the rest of us. Not having read the books means you have a totally different, and to me uninteresting, perspective.

huh...330 pages and you're the first person to try and make this a reason to gatekeep the forum discussion. How silly.

No, they don't belong in a different thread. In fact, this thread is ABOUT THE TV SHOW - so actually you're interest in book-centric discussion would be what would need to be taken to another thread - IF anyone but you were actually saying that.

But no one else is saying that. So both of you can keep going! (if you feel you must ha)

[Raisei]

huh...330 pages and you're the first person to try and make this a reason to gatekeep the forum discussion. How silly.

No, they don't belong in a different thread. In fact, this thread is ABOUT THE TV SHOW - so actually you're interest in book-centric discussion would be what would need to be taken to another thread - IF anyone but you were actually saying that.

But no one else is saying that. So both of you can keep going! (if you feel you must ha)

I would add to that with saying that reading the books is not even needed to realize how terrible the show is. It helps in understanding the "liberties" that the showrunners took with the lore, but that is only one piece of the mudcake we got.

When I was lately asked what I liked about the show I was actually silent for several seconds, because there is so little good about it, I had to think hard to find something. Especially in a comparison with House of the Dragon, a show that oozes quality in nearly every aspect, Rings appears even worse. You would not believe which of these shows had the higher budget...

[InfiniteCharger]

Again, I never said he resigned around the Amazon announcement. I said it was announced or made public around that time. Hence why the article you linked to has a November date rather than an August date. Did you look at the date of the article you linked? It even has a November date in the link.

https://www.theonering.net/torwp/201...olkien-estate/

Like I said, I posted all these details long before in this thread so you aren't explaining anything I already didn't know. The point was you tried to misrepresent the fact that the announcement came right around the same time as the Amazon series was announced as meaning he was "around", as in supporting and promoting this series, when you have no way of knowing that. It goes against everything he has stood for in the past and gives much more support to the opinion that he resigned and others moved forward with this concept to make money.

[rhorle]

Like I said, I posted all these details long before in this thread so you aren't explaining anything I already didn't know. The point was you tried to misrepresent the fact that the announcement came right around the same time as the Amazon series was announced as meaning he was "around"

No. I said it was announced around the same time as the show and that he resigned in August. I had a separate source that stated he was involved with the deal and it was signed prior to his resignation. You keep ignoring what is posted in order to not admit you were wrong. I haven't misrepresented any of the facts.

[InfiniteCharger]

No. I said it was announced around the same time as the show and that he resigned in August. I had a separate source that stated he was involved with the deal and it was signed prior to his resignation. You keep ignoring what is posted in order to not admit you were wrong. I haven't misrepresented any of the facts.

The link I posted is from the same site that you referenced and it says the exact opposite of what you are claiming.
That was the point. Again, you tried to suggest that this was something was involved in as in "supported" when really you are just guessing.

[rhorle]

The link I posted is from the same site that you referenced and it says the exact opposite of what you are claiming.
That was the point. Again, you tried to suggest that this was something was involved in as in "supported" when really you are just guessing.

It does not. Again, look at the date the article about his resignation was posted. You do know how to tell date and time, right? I'm not guessing about him being involved with the deal. I used another source, a person that was invited to Amazon events and got information first-hand, as evidence of him still being in charge when the deal was signed.

- - - Updated - - -

The nielsen numbers are in. 988 million mins viewed for 10/3 to 10/9. A gain of 22 million minutes from the previous week. It will be interesting to see if it trends up again for the finale and post-season. https://www.nielsen.com/top-ten/#streaming

[Fortress of Arrogance]

I think my inner shit connoisseur just had enough with Rings of Poo s1.
IT was just plain bad.
I mean I've watched the Shitcher s1 and s2(and even the animated atrocity), but at least that is hilariously bad, not just plain bad like RoP.
Enough is enough.

[Biomega]

It's too late though. Series is way too off track already.

I don't even know what they could do at this point to make me come back.

Start over?

They won't salvage it, plain and simple. Just another write-off, like so many others before it.

[CostinR]

I think there's some potential to save it, there's some quality in there even if a lot of that relates to the Dwarves and Sauron. Like after the Sauron reveal I might just go watch all the episodes I missed ( I stopped episode 3, because fuck it was tedious ).

[MCMLXXXII]

Problem with that is the GoT pilot never got aired. Now we have an entire first season to "forget"

[Shadowferal]

Vague rumor that the showrunners are going to be replaced:
https://www.cbr.com/lotr-rings-of-po...lined-season2/
"A minority of LOTR fans adamantly hate The Rings of Power, calling it a bastardization of Tolkien's material" - good to see my viewpoint represented in an article!
It's too late though. Series is way too off track already.

Interesting

Unfortunately, TV fans (and LOTR fans especially) are unforgiving. So, there are rumors that Amazon wants to course-correct for Season 2. Rumors also say that Amazon will do that by removing McKay and Payne from their positions as showrunners. Those rumors first showed up on the 314th episode of the YouTube livestream show Midnight’s Edge in the Morning. While being interviewed, noted film critic and industry insider, Chris Gore, had some strong words for The Rings of Power. He said, “I heard from someone who has a contact at Amazon that – if you wanna know – that effectively, they’re going to be retooling,” he explained. “And [Payne and McKay] are more than likely… they’re not gonna be publicly fired, but their role will be reduced.”

Regardless, The Rings of Power showrunners have set their course and should be allowed to correct it for themselves. They're already looking at Season 1's success and disappointments while getting ready to film Season 2. Payne told Variety, "Certainly, you look at audience response, and you see what characters people love, and what kinds of storytelling move them. I wouldn’t say we're over-correcting for any of it, but we’re certainly listening to people’s responses."

So it's possible we might eventually see a reversal here...

[InfiniteCharger]

No. I said it was announced around the same time as the show and that he resigned in August. I had a separate source that stated he was involved with the deal and it was signed prior to his resignation. You keep ignoring what is posted in order to not admit you were wrong. I haven't misrepresented any of the facts.

The fact is both articles came from the same site and the contradict each other. That is why I posted it. He resigned long before the announcement, which is what I have been saying and your so called "source" contradicts itself in another article saying the exact same thing I am saying. The fact that you refuse to see that this is the point is you simply refusing to admit that maybe those "facts" don't add up. Meaning your suggestion that he was "involved" with this project, as in "supporting" it are not proven at all, just because his retirement was announced close to the date the series was announced.

[rhorle]

The fact is both articles came from the same site and the contradict each other. That is why I posted it. He resigned long before the announcement, which is what I have been saying and your so called "source" contradicts itself in another article saying the exact same thing I am saying.

I have never said that he didn't resign before the public found out about the Amazon deal or his resignation. Again you are inventing an argument that was never stated just so you can avoid admitting you were wrong. My source about him signing the deal before his resignation does not contradict anything. If you are saying exactly that then why are you arguing that I've been wrong? Lmao.

He did not. His "official" retirement was August 31st 2017 and announced a few days after the Rings of Power deal was announced. He was however still in charge when the deal was signed. It was even the estate while Christopher would have been in charge that approached Amazon, and others, to make a pitch for the rights.

"Christopher Tolkien (the Professor’s son) was in charge of the Estate at the time the deal was made in 2017. He passed away three years later in 2020 after production on the show had already begun, and the directorship was passed on to his son, Simon Tolkien."-- https://www.theonering.net/torwp/202...in-the-fandom/

[rogoth]

Jesus wept. My uncle's sister knows a guy that knows a guy!

Personally, I'd keep S1 as is and just go forward with whatever changes from S2. S1 was fine for the majority of people.

and yet every possible metric to measure engagement suggest otherwise, but keep telling yourself that if it makes you happy.

[Celement]

Problem with that is the GoT pilot never got aired. Now we have an entire first season to "forget"

I think they have to just start over... the money has already been spent they are hitched to this trainwreck.

Part of me hopes they dont I want to see just how absurd this gets.

[Ivanstone]

I have watched this show now.

Its good TV. Better than Wheel of Time.

However if I had to choose between a new season of Wynonna Earp and a new season of Rings, Wynonna wins.

PS I'm assuming any changes to the production crew have less to do with alleged fans and much more to do with the show not sufficiently feeding Jeff Bezos's ego. Sorry, Jeffy but GoT season 1 is a lot better.

[Ivanstone]

It had to have been better than wheel of time, it had better source material.

What scares me is the idea that they seem to think they can buy the ip to get casual viewers and just completely ignore the actual fans of the source material. They’ve taken this approach with both RoP and WoT. That’s not how adaptations should work.

I agree that it’s probably fine if you don’t pay attention to the source, but it just feels so bizarre to me. It’s like everyone is watching a movie claiming to based on WW2, and Japan and Germany are merged into one country that is invading the US, and everyone is like “this is great!” and only a few people are like, but, uh, this isn’t how it’s supposed to go!

Rings is based off of incomplete source material that Tolkien never wanted published. Not sure I'd say that's better.

Fans have unrealistic expectations. I remember one alleged fan of GoT hated the show because it didn't have narration explaining all the small details. Adaptations work the same way original material works. Hire capable people and they might deliver the goods. I'll use the Watchmen as an example. The movie had some interesting elements. The opening credits were great. They delivered a lot of back story with great efficiency. Jackie Earl Hailey was fantastic. Unfortunately, Snyder also didn't understand that the Watchmen was a satire, he overemphasized action scenes and a lot of the acting was awful. And some of that awful acting were done by people who were good elsewhere. Seriously go watch Stoker if you want see Matthew Goode do good work.

Changing things is fine. Capable people make good changes, less capable people might accidentally make a good change. An adaptation should make good use of the medium that its being adapted into. One thing people fail to grasp about why Jackson's adaptation is great. He made lots of changes. Its not as faithful as people think. Its a good adaptation because he managed to make things that work as a book while making a very capable commercial product.

[Triceron]

and yet every possible metric to measure engagement suggest otherwise, but keep telling yourself that if it makes you happy.

Measuring engagement that has kept it in the top 10 shows of the season indicates that its a popular show no matter how you cut it.

Just because you personally don't like the show doesn't mean the majority share your sentiments. The dropoff of viewership is still the minority of people who watched the show, and its numbers are still high enough to keep it in the top 10, if not the top 5 shows watched during its release. Of course, it should have been a better show with the amount of money they put into it.

Most people are fine with bullshit TV, that is reality.

Shows like Andor is a much better show yet it can't even get the numbers that Rings of Power had. That's just how it goes.

[Shadowferal]

They've the time to decide whether or not to dump/replace the showrunners.

[Celement]

Measuring engagement that has kept it in the top 10 shows of the season indicates that its a popular show no matter how you cut it.

Just because you personally don't like the show doesn't mean the majority share your sentiments. The dropoff of viewership is still the minority of people who watched the show, and its numbers are still high enough to keep it in the top 10, if not the top 5 shows watched during its release. Of course, it should have been a better show with the amount of money they put into it.

Most people are fine with bullshit TV, that is reality.

Shows like Andor is a much better show yet it can't even get the numbers that Rings of Power had. That's just how it goes.

There is that and most people consider amazon video a freebie for getting prime membership.