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    Russian Missile crosses in Poland killing 2 people: Article 5 might be drafted?

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...s/10704659002/
    The Defense Department is investigating reports that Russian missiles crossed into NATO member Poland, killing two people.

    The Associated Press reported the strikes Tuesday, citing a senior U.S. intelligence official. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitive nature of the situation, AP said.

    Pentagon Press Secretary Air Force Brig. Gen. Pat Ryder declined to comment in detail about the reports, saying the Defense Department is investigating the matter and trying to get more information

    Polish government spokesman Piotr Mueller did not immediately confirm the information but said top leaders were holding an emergency meeting because of a "crisis situation."
    Could this cause article 5 to be drafted?

    For those who don't know what article 5 is:
    https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_110496.htm
    The United States, Canada, Greenland, Iceland, Norway, UK [and its allies], France, Germany, Spain, Romania, Italy, Greece, Turkey, and a few more would come to the defense of Poland.

    Article 5 has not been invoked since 9/11
    Last edited by TheramoreIsTheBomb; 2022-11-15 at 08:38 PM.
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  2. #2
    Herald of the Titans enigma77's Avatar
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    hopefully, it's time to finish this and wipe out the Russian beasts in Ukraine
    Last edited by enigma77; 2022-11-15 at 08:49 PM.

  3. #3
    Over 9000! Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheramoreIsTheBomb View Post
    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...s/10704659002/


    Could this cause article 5 to be drafted?

    For those who don't know what article 5 is:
    https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_110496.htm
    The United States, Canada, Greenland, Iceland, Norway, UK [and its allies], France, Germany, Spain, Romania, Italy, Greece, Turkey, and a few more would come to the defense of Poland.

    Article 5 has not been invoked since 9/11
    No, Article 5 will not be invoked.


    Do you and YUPPIE coordinate your absurd DOOM threads?


    If you told me that you two hand out all night at Denny's drinking a bunch of bad coffee. While wish casting various orgrish scenarios. I'd believe it.
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    No, Article 5 will not be invoked.


    Do you and YUPPIE coordinate your absurd DOOM threads?


    If you told me that you two hand out all night at Denny's drinking a bunch of bad coffee. While wish casting various orgrish scenarios. I'd believe it.
    Don't forget Kokolums. We'll get that 2nd civil war any day now...

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    No, Article 5 will not be invoked.


    Do you and YUPPIE coordinate your absurd DOOM threads?


    If you told me that you two hand out all night at Denny's drinking a bunch of bad coffee. While wish casting various orgrish scenarios. I'd believe it.
    The Pentagon reported an hour ago that they -will- defend every inch of NATO territory. This is about defense and honor not about warmongering and doomsaying.
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by TheramoreIsTheBomb View Post
    The Pentagon reported an hour ago that they -will- defend every inch of NATO territory. This is about defense and honor not about warmongering and doomsaying.
    And I'm sure they will. If NATO territory is at risk of invasion.

    A missile going off target is not a declaration of war nor the prelude to invasion. It's worthy of response, but worthy of war? No, not at all.

    Are you signing up to join the NATO military in case they do decide to join the fight?

  7. #7
    the grave concern here is NATO may respond with an action that panics Russia to the point where they actually decide to nuke. We've put a lot of emotional pressure on Russia. A lot of wars in history have started because of a mistake or misunderstanding and then one side panicked and went to war.
    TO FIX WOW:1. smaller server sizes & server-only LFG awarding satchels, so elite players help others. 2. "helper builds" with loom powers - talent trees so elite players cast buffs on low level players XP gain, HP/mana, regen, damage, etc. 3. "helper ilvl" scoring how much you help others. 4. observer games like in SC to watch/chat (like twitch but with MORE DETAILS & inside the wow UI) 5. guild leagues to compete with rival guilds for progression (with observer mode).6. jackpot world mobs.

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    Over 9000! Milchshake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calfredd View Post
    Don't forget Kokolums. We'll get that 2nd civil war any day now...
    TO all the people that thought we were joking....
    Government Affiliated Snark

  9. #9
    Tragic, but no, the warmongers will continue to be disappointed with blue balls.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    And I'm sure they will. If NATO territory is at risk of invasion.

    A missile going off target is not a declaration of war nor the prelude to invasion. It's worthy of response, but worthy of war? No, not at all.
    This is correct. Let's look at the text of Article 5:
    The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

    Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .
    This indicates that Americans and Europeans should treat the deaths of our Polish allies as being as serious as the deaths of our own countrymen. We've committed to that and we should stand by it. So, then what? This is not a commitment to immediately engage in total war, but a commitment to treat the matter as having occurred within all of our borders.

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    Herald of the Titans D Luniz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    This is correct. Let's look at the text of Article 5:

    This indicates that Americans and Europeans should treat the deaths of our Polish allies as being as serious as the deaths of our own countrymen. We've committed to that and we should stand by it. So, then what? This is not a commitment to immediately engage in total war, but a commitment to treat the matter as having occurred within all of our borders.
    if Article 5 was that easily invoked, then it would have been used after Russia shot down that airliner
    "Law and Order", lots of places have had that, Russia, North Korea, Saddam's Iraq.
    Laws can be made to enforce order of cruelty and brutality.
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    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Ain't no one about to push article 5 over something that could be explained away as a mistake even if both sides confirmed it wasn't through back channels.


    I think people confuse media narratives with how things actually unfold in real life.


    Its not worth it to to go to WW3 over a one off situation. Hell it would take several or something that was already preluded.

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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    Its not worth it to to go to WW3 over a one off situation. Hell it would take several or something that was already preluded.
    It is very unlikely, yeah, but stranger things have happened. We've had wars over soccer, pigs - and an ear.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    the grave concern here is NATO may respond with an action that panics Russia to the point where they actually decide to nuke. We've put a lot of emotional pressure on Russia. A lot of wars in history have started because of a mistake or misunderstanding and then one side panicked and went to war.
    And of course when Russia retaliates by nuking the US's Eastern Seaboard the resulting chaos will finally kick off Civil War 2: Electric Boogaloo.
    “The biggest communication problem is we do not listen to understand. We listen to reply,” Stephen Covey.

  15. #15
    Over 9000! Santti's Avatar
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    I feel this thread is rather redundant, as it's being discussed in the big thread already. But whatever...

    No, it won't happen. There will probably be some repercussions, like expelling of diplomats (assuming they haven't already done that), harsher sanction, more aid for Ukraine, that kind of thing.
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    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    the grave concern here is NATO may respond with an action that panics Russia to the point where they actually decide to nuke.
    Stuff that noise. NATO response would be to aggression from Russia. NATO response would not be provoking action, as Russia was already planning said action, hence the aggression.

    Absolute steaming nonsense.

    There isn't gonna be an Article 5 response over this, but Poland's gonna be entitled (with NATO backing) to potentially return fire or demand admissions of error and payment for damages done by Russia.

    But pretending that responding to Russian aggression would somehow be the provocation that escalated things? Just naked Russia bootlicking bullshit. Straight up tongue-bathing the dictator.


  17. #17
    Im thinking a return strike on the base that the missile came from is a definite possibility.

  18. #18
    Scarab Lord MCMLXXXII's Avatar
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    This should be in the Ukraine thread.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Kokolums View Post
    the grave concern here is NATO may respond with an action that panics Russia to the point where they actually decide to nuke. We've put a lot of emotional pressure on Russia. A lot of wars in history have started because of a mistake or misunderstanding and then one side panicked and went to war.
    Pffhahahahahahaha. russia should be so lucky they get away from all this with emoootional daaamage.
    Last edited by Gabriel; 2022-11-16 at 07:02 AM.

  20. #20
    This is just another incident in the ongoing war and does not deserve its own thread.

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