Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Xyonai]

Elsewhere, people have been saying that Poland not shooting down the missile shows NATO weakness. But as others have pointed out, it landed only 10km inside the Polish border. Prior to that it was in Ukrainian airspace, which they couldn't shoot at, but when it hit Polish airspace, at the speeds it was travelling, it would have only been in the air for 30 seconds at most. Not enough time to shoot it down given there wasn't an AD unit parked right there.

Which makes me feel like we're about to see NATO Anti-Air defenses start shooting down Russian junk that get too close to NATO borders. When you can't be sure if it's an 'accident' or not, why risk having hostile munitions detour their way into your country?

[YUPPIE]

Which makes me feel like we're about to see NATO Anti-Air defenses start shooting down Russian junk

russia has stated that would be a declaration of war, before. I'm sure no one give a fuck now, but it should be considered.

[Saradain]

russia has stated that would be a declaration of war, before.

Russia is free to take it as such, then. If they wish to abolish their federation, who are we to deny their birthright to change their empire?

[Iphie]

Seems that currently article 4 is the way that Poland is going.

https://liveuamap.com/en/2022/15-nov...nt-andrzejduda

https://twitter.com/prezydentpl/stat...26772390326273

Tweet is in polish.

[Xyonai]

russia has stated that would be a declaration of war, before. I'm sure no one give a fuck now, but it should be considered.

And it should be put into consideration, but only so much to parse how deep the buffer zone should be and if they should shoot down *everything* Russia made that flies too close or just rockets.

Accident or no, letting them get away with this shouldn't be an option.

[Milchshake]

russia has stated that would be a declaration of war, before. I'm sure no one give a fuck now, but it should be considered.

You're just lying on Putin's behalf.

US has already sent missle defense units to Poland. Putin did jack shit.

[YUPPIE]

all in all, regardless of how small-scale the response is, this is inevitably looking like it's going to result in a conflict with NATO and Russia.

[Corvus]

all in all, regardless of how small-scale the response is, this is inevitably looking like it's going to result in a conflict with NATO and Russia.

Nope. Talk is article 4, not article 5.

[Edge-]

all in all, regardless of how small-scale the response is, this is inevitably looking like it's going to result in a conflict with NATO and Russia.

If I didn't know better, I'd think you were excited by this fantasy.

[zealo]

russia has stated that would be a declaration of war, before. I'm sure no one give a fuck now, but it should be considered.

Russia has stated lots of things would be declarations of war before, but what makes this situation different is that Poland would have genuine cause to invoke article 5 here.

If the poles feel like it's time to go into Ukraine with their army and push the Russians out, Russia just handed them a genuine diplomatic cover for doing so.

[Kathranis]

I'm sure it was an accident, and NATO/Poland will probably recognize that, but there's going to have to be a response and some level of escalation, which will in turn have to be answered by Russia.

I'm not familiar enough with the situation to really gauge how Poland will respond. I doubt boots on the ground, but at the very least they're going to start amassing defensively on the border, right? Maybe call for a no-fly zone?

This gives NATO so much latitude. Russia really stepped on their own (already mangled) dick here.

[YUPPIE]

If I didn't know better, I'd think you were excited by this fantasy.

after almost ten months of watching this army of rapists and killers recreating Imperial Japan with an old man lording over them with an aura of invincibility due to nuclear deterance, aren't you at the least a bit curious as to what's going to happen now that he's awakened the sleeping giant in his hubris?

[Edge-]

after almost ten months of watching this army of rapists and killers recreating Imperial Japan with an old man lording over them with an aura of invincibility due to nuclear deterance, aren't you at the least a bit curious as to what's going to happen now that he's awakened the sleeping giant in his hubris?

No, because I deal in reality and not fantasy.

[ghotihook]

after almost ten months of watching this army of rapists and killers recreating Imperial Japan with an old man lording over them with an aura of invincibility due to nuclear deterance, aren't you at the least a bit curious as to what's going to happen now that he's awakened the sleeping giant in his hubris?

Russia isn't a sleeping giant. It's a sleeping pensioner.

[YUPPIE]

I'm not going to give any further input to speculation until NATO formally reveals what their response is.

But Russia today has crossed the line. Just be aware of that everyone.

- - - Updated - - -

Russia isn't a sleeping giant. It's a sleeping pensioner.

NATO is the sleeping giant

[ldev]

More like the West doesn't care, at the end of it. What matters to the west the most is money and political superiority, war is expensive, it is much cheaper to arm the people in Ukraine to fight and die for their interest of weakening russia, all the while owing them for the support in weapons and rebuilding later on.

West never learns to stop not caring. Germany is now finding other sources of gas, etc etc etc.

[ldev]

But Russia today has crossed the line. Just be aware of that everyone.

Lmao, China has final final final warnings, ruzz has final final final warnings, and NATO too has final final final warnings too - another final final final warning coming up with strongly worded press conference.

[Mazza]

There's two big theories being shown on the news here (Belgium) at the moment.

1. It were Russian missiles that went off mark and ended up in Poland.
2. It was an Ukranian Anti Air missile that ended up in Poland.

Just to put this clear, even if it ends up being 2... that would still be Russia's fault as they are the reason Ukraine has to use anti air to begin with.

[Xyonai]

I'm sure it was an accident, and NATO/Poland will probably recognize that, but there's going to have to be a response and some level of escalation, which will in turn have to be answered by Russia.

I'm not familiar enough with the situation to really gauge how Poland will respond. I doubt boots on the ground, but at the very least they're going to start amassing defensively on the border, right? Maybe call for a no-fly zone?

This gives NATO so much latitude. Russia really stepped on their own (already mangled) dick here.

As i said before I'm putting bets on the no fly zone just to deter any future 'accidents'.

Though as far as less official responses go, this might also strain Poland's relationship with Hungary if Orban continues to fuck around with EU and NATO responses to Russia's fuckery.

[Corvus]

There's two big theories being shown on the news here (Belgium) at the moment.

1. It were Russian missiles that went off mark and ended up in Poland.
2. It was an Ukranian Anti Air missile that ended up in Poland.

Just to put this clear, even if it ends up being 2... that would still be Russia's fault as they are the reason Ukraine has to use anti air to begin with.

If it was 2, Ukraine would have owned up already. They gain nothing and lose a lot by covering it up.