[Movie/TV/Comic] Marvel Cinematic Universe: A place to talk all things Marvel

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Ya the trade mark fight over the name captain marvel does link them in a way but as you said there is really no connection beyond that and the idea that some one would bring up Shazam and the MCU mean's they likely know little about the situation or are trolling with it.

Not to mention that when Marvel started using the name "Captain Marvel"...the original character had been defunct for over a decade... and they only did it because another company was trying to use the the name recognition of Marvel with their own "Captain Marvel"

https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/...vel-characters

Marvel was a buzzword again, and in 1966, a short-lived company called M.F. Enterprises tried to capitalize with a new character named Captain Marvel—generally considered one of the worst superheroes ever put to paper.

Marvel now needed to stop inferior comics from using its name on their covers, so it obtained the trademark for the Captain Marvel name and went about protecting it by introducing yet another character named Captain Marvel. This new alien version of the hero made his debut shortly after in 1967's Marvel Super-Heroes #12.

The character was born purely for legal reasons. According to comic book veteran Roy Thomas, Stan Lee only created a Captain Marvel at publisher Martin Goodman's insistence: "All I know is the basis of the character came from a resentment over the use of the ‘Captain Marvel’ name."

DC didn't even acquire the original "Captain Marvel" until 1972... 5 years after Marvel had created their own. DC tried to use the name on the covers...and got a cease and desist order for it. And then for the next 50 years or so...they tried to keep "Captain Marvel" as his official name...even though his comics were titled "Shazam". in 2012 they eventually just gave up and officially renamed the character as Shazam.

[Kyphael]

Then you're sure not looking around very hard to investigate.

https://www.insider.com/chris-hemswo...trainer-2022-3
https://www.ranker.com/list/actors-s...onathan-kantor
https://fandomwire.com/i-could-smell...-perfect-look/



He's got a visible six-pack. If you think that's not enough, your standards are completely borked and unhealthy.

Six pack and arms like the line cook at the 3AM shift at the Waffle House.

Let me frame this in a way that'll make sense to you. People have been saying Taylor Lautner would have been a better choice. In the Twilight Movies, the guy easily had a better build than Huerta could achieve.

It's an aesthetic preference. Imagine wanting a superhero and King of Atlantis or Talokan who spends 99% of his life swimming, the best form of cardiovascular exercise, to look at least as ripped as the guy from Twilight. Instead he walks out of the water looking like a marshmallow with a six-pack.

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I'm sorry, performance only counts when it overshadows everyone else? we are now criticizing actors for "check's notes" being team players?

good god...

also

from a quick google, this review specifically mentions praise for Namor in a title as well as body, but a lot of the reviews I have seen praise Namor's portrayal along with the rest of the cast. https://uproxx.com/movies/black-pant...dia-reactions/

this is to add to Endus's response above.

Uh, no? I said he was serviceable, likely performed well, but he didn't blow anyone away. The fact Marvel didn't introduce him in his own feature movie when ANT-MAN got his own movie shows how much faith the powers that be had in this vision of the character.

[Endus]

Six pack and arms like the line cook at the 3AM shift at the Waffle House.

Let me frame this in a way that'll make sense to you. People have been saying Taylor Lautner would have been a better choice. In the Twilight Movies, the guy easily had a better build than Huerta could achieve.

You're acting like I don't understand your argument.

I do.

It's just inherently ridiculous and toxic and in no way reflects healthy body types.

It's an aesthetic preference. Imagine wanting a superhero and King of Atlantis or Talokan who spends 99% of his life swimming, the best form of cardiovascular exercise, to look at least as ripped as the guy from Twilight. Instead he walks out of the water looking like a marshmallow with a six-pack.

Bodybuilders build for mass and appearance, not function. There's a reason strongman competitions aren't populated by Mr. Universe types. They're populated by top athletes like this guy;



And that's for peak strength; a body type pushed towards endurance is going to look wildly different still. Much sleeker, because efficient muscle isn't big muscle.

Claiming that Huerta looks like a "marshmallow" is just so on-its-face ridiculous that it's clear you don't have anything constructive to say. It's just not true. It's just being shitty for being-shitty's sake.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I can't believe theres a multi-page argument about an Tenoch's physicality. People are so fucking petty.

[Endus]

I can't believe theres a multi-page argument about an Tenoch's physicality. People are so fucking petty.

It's gross. It's literally no different than bitching that a female actor's boobs aren't big enough or shit like that.

[Jotaux]

I refuse to call him Shazam. He will always be Captain Marvel to me.

Also it’s been well documented how much prep actors do for their shirtless scenes. You cannot maintain that for an entire movie. Hugh Jackman was saying he had a migraine for two days leading up to his shirtless scene in Wolverine.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Some time's I forget that comic book guy isn't out of no where but is based off of real comic fans.

[Witchblade77]

Six pack and arms like the line cook at the 3AM shift at the Waffle House.

Let me frame this in a way that'll make sense to you. People have been saying Taylor Lautner would have been a better choice. In the Twilight Movies, the guy easily had a better build than Huerta could achieve.

It's an aesthetic preference. Imagine wanting a superhero and King of Atlantis or Talokan who spends 99% of his life swimming, the best form of cardiovascular exercise, to look at least as ripped as the guy from Twilight. Instead he walks out of the water looking like a marshmallow with a six-pack.

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Uh, no? I said he was serviceable, likely performed well, but he didn't blow anyone away. The fact Marvel didn't introduce him in his own feature movie when ANT-MAN got his own movie shows how much faith the powers that be had in this vision of the character.

I'm sorry... I you seriously bringing up "can't act his way out of a paper bag" Taylor Lautner as a better choice solely because he looks.. SLIGHTLY more like your idealized version of what a guy should look like due to bigger arms that make no sense on a swimmer? really. could you BE any more shallow? not to mention if you look at the actual images, when he is not flexing, he's not actualy anymore shredded than Tenoch, but who cares about those details...

and I'm guessing you haven't actualy looked at any reviews, just like you haven't actualy seen the movie.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Uh, no? I said he was serviceable, likely performed well, but he didn't blow anyone away. The fact Marvel didn't introduce him in his own feature movie when ANT-MAN got his own movie shows how much faith the powers that be had in this vision of the character.

Have you ever watched an MCU film? Do you have any understanding how many characters were introduced in other Superheroes movies?

Spider-Man and Black Panther were both introduced to the MCU in Captain America: Civil War. I guess Disney just had no faith in those characters at all...

[Kyphael]

You're acting like I don't understand your argument.

I do.

It's just inherently ridiculous and toxic and in no way reflects healthy body types.



Bodybuilders build for mass and appearance, not function. There's a reason strongman competitions aren't populated by Mr. Universe types. They're populated by top athletes like this guy;



And that's for peak strength; a body type pushed towards endurance is going to look wildly different still. Much sleeker, because efficient muscle isn't big muscle.

Claiming that Huerta looks like a "marshmallow" is just so on-its-face ridiculous that it's clear you don't have anything constructive to say. It's just not true. It's just being shitty for being-shitty's sake.

Ok, that's disgusting. You're going in an extreme OPPOSITE direction. I know what body-builders look like. I cited one Taylor Lautner with a similar, more shredded, and better physique than Tenoch Huerta, and you link an image of a guy that makes The Rock look like Edward Norton.

Not all muscular physiques are inefficient and clumsy, but since you cited Mr. Universe bodies, I'll bite. Arnold Schwarzenegger had a Mr. Universe body, as did Lou Ferigno, and how did those gentlemen make a name for themselves in Hollywood?

OH, that's right! ACTION MOVIES! Granted when Arnold and Lou were playing The Incredible Hulk, as well as VARIOUS other action roles they no longer had quite the Mr. Universe look, they were still pretty ripped, and could move as well as Tenoch Huerta does in his one role. Arnold didn't look stiff and inefficient in his roles in Predator, Commando, Last Action Hero, and Total Recall to name A FEW, and you know what they had in common? Both had a physique that looks better than the Ice Cream Man.

I don't think this is a hill you want to die on. The dude from behind looks like a marshmallow coming out of the water, there is little to no definition anywhere other than that six pack. Makes me think he just did a thousand push ups a day. Hell, soccer players like Cristiano Ronaldo are more shredded. Taylor Lautner, AGAIN, a fellow actor, looks better.

You don't have to look like the World's Strongest Man to have a defined, comic book look, but you should also look better than that if you're going to spend the entire movie with your shirt off. Just ask for Jason Mamoa's personal trainer.

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Have you ever watched an MCU film? Do you have any understanding how many characters were introduced in other Superheroes movies?

Spider-Man and Black Panther were both introduced to the MCU in Captain America: Civil War. I guess Disney just had no faith in those characters at all...

You couldn't have cited WORSE examples. Black Panther was originally going to be introduced in a solo movie, but when they realized they couldn't use Spider-man in Civil War, they decided to insert Black Panther in Spider-man's role and introduce him earlier. Then by luck, DURING production of Civil War, Marvel was able to strike the ever-rejoiced deal with Sony to share Spider-man, and literally added Spider-man half-way into the movie. Spider-man was a central figure in the Civil war story, you think they wouldn't have told the story closer to the source if they had Spider-man from the beginning? T'Challa's role was almost awkward in the movie. He was an after-thought to Cap/Iron Man/Zemo/Bucky, so much so he had no part in the final battle. Just pops out of nowhere to monologue to Zemo at the end so we don't forget he was in the movie. Take Black Panther out, and Civil War's story is hardly affected. They literally tell his origin in his own feature movie, which was always the plan.

Spider-man is a household name, I don't even need to address that, do I?

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

You couldn't have cited WORSE examples. Black Panther was originally going to be introduced in a solo movie, but when they realized they couldn't use Spider-man in Civil War, they decided to insert Black Adam in Spider-man's role and introduce him earlier. Then by lock, DURING production of Civil War, Marvel was able to strike the ever-rejoiced deal with Sony, and literally added Spider-man half-way into the movie. Spider-man was a central figure in the Civil war story, you think they wouldn't have told the story closer to the source if they had Spider-man from the beginning? T'Challa's role was almost award in the movie. He was an after-thought to Cap/Iron Man/Zemo/Bucky, so much so he had no part in the final battle. Just pops out of nowhere to monologue to Zemo at the end so we don't forget he was in the movie. Take Black Panther out, and Civil War's story is hardly affected. They literally tell his origin in his own feature movie, which was always the plan.

Spider-man is a household name, I don't even need to address that, do I?

Your point was that "Namor doesn't get a solo movie before Wakanda Forever...therefore Marvel has no faith in him"

I'm just pointing out that many of the major players in the MCU were introduced in other heroes movies. Spider-Man and Black Panther are just two. We can also add Nick Fury, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Loki, Bucky, Falcon, Reed Richards, Etc.

And it's not like Namor has a bit part in WF... he's the main Antagonist.

As for Spider-Man...if Marvel had him from the beginning...they never would have started with Iron Man in the first place. Iron Man would probably have been a character they introduced in a Spider-Man movie.

[Kyphael]

Your point was that "Namor doesn't get a solo movie before Wakanda Forever...therefore Marvel has no faith in him"

I'm just pointing out that many of the major players in the MCU were introduced in other heroes movies. Spider-Man and Black Panther are just two. We can also add Nick Fury, Black Widow, Hawkeye, Loki, Bucky, Falcon, Reed Richards, Etc.

And it's not like Namor has a bit part in WF... he's the main Antagonist.

Namor has always been the plan to be introduced in Black Panther, Ryan Coogler said as much as far back as the first movie, which tells me they don't have much faith in his ability to draw as a solo act, and just capitalized in his comic book role as anti-hero/sometimes adversary to introduce him to the universe at large, then crossover into other projects like Avengers. Too many similarities to Aquaman and such, seems to be their biggest concerns, otherwise, why not give him his own movie when they've given Ant-man one?

Nick Fury is just barely getting a series about him after 14 years. Look how long it took Black Widow to get her own movie, and long after Scarlet Johanson proved to be a household name, and even then, they waited until the character was dead so they could use it as a backdoor origin for Yelena and Red Guardian.

Loki, Bucky, and Falcon got Disney+ series, they're on the same level as She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel, not proven draws but rather Disney+ fluff to add to the greater narrative. We'll see how New World Order goes for Sam as a lead, and that'll be riding off the Captain America IP.

Kevin Feige admitted Reed Richards was pure fan service, not to mention it's an alt-universe version of a character that had already been introduced back to general audiences as far back as the mid 2000's.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Namor has always been the plan to be introduced in Black Panther, Ryan Coogler said as much as far back as the first movie, which tells me they don't have much faith in his ability to draw as a solo act, and just capitalized in his comic book role as anti-hero/sometimes adversary to introduce him to the universe at large, then crossover into other projects like Avengers. Too many similarities to Aquaman and such, seems to be their biggest concerns, otherwise, why not give him his own movie when they've given Ant-man one?.

First off: Aquaman is a Namor ripoff...not the other way around.

Second: Introducing Namor as an antagonist makes perfect sense. He's tried to overthrow the surface world almost as many times as he's helped saved it. The only better places to introduce him than Wakanda Forever would be in a Fantastic Four or a Captain America movie.

Third: Not being introduced in a solo movie is no indication of a lack of faith in the character. If they had no faith in the character...they wouldn't feature him so much in all of the marketing.

Fourth: Reactions to Tenoch's performance as Namor have been extremely positive.

Fifth: One of the reasons Namor hasn't had a solo film is due to complications with film rights...similar to why we haven't gotten a Hulk Sequel.

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/ma...explained-mcu/

In 2014, Marvel Studios chief Kevin Feige told IGN answered "no" when asked whether Universal and Legendary Entertainment could still make Namor. Asked if Marvel Studios could produce a potential Namor movie, Feige said, "Yes, but it's slightly more complicated than that. Let's put it this way – there are entanglements that make it less easy."

"There are older contracts that still involve other parties that mean we need to work things out before we move forward on it," Feige said at the time. "As opposed to Iron Man or any of the Avengers or any of the other Marvel characters where we could just put them in."

By 2018, Feige again told IGN that the Namor rights are "not as clean or clear as the majority of the other characters" who are fully under Marvel's control (like Iron Man, Thor, and Black Panther) or involved with another studio (like Spider-Man at Sony). Later that year, post-Black Panther, Feige confirmed Marvel Studios could use Namor in the MCU — but it was yet to be decided when or where he might surface.

[Kyphael]

First off: Aquaman is a Namor ripoff...not the other way around.

Second: Introducing Namor as an antagonist makes perfect sense. He's tried to overthrow the surface world almost as many times as he's helped saved it. The only better places to introduce him than Wakanda Forever would be in a Fantastic Four or a Captain America movie.

Third: Not being introduced in a solo movie is no indication of a lack of faith in the character. If they had no faith in the character...they wouldn't feature him so much in all of the marketing.

Fourth: Reactions to Tenoch's performance as Namor have been extremely positive.

Fifth: One of the reasons Namor hasn't had a solo film is due to complications with film rights...similar to why we haven't gotten a Hulk Sequel.

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/ma...explained-mcu/

First off: Aquaman is a Namor ripoff...not the other way around.

Second: Introducing Namor as an antagonist makes perfect sense. He's tried to overthrow the surface world almost as many times as he's helped saved it. The only better places to introduce him than Wakanda Forever would be in a Fantastic Four or a Captain America movie.

Third: Not being introduced in a solo movie is no indication of a lack of faith in the character.

Fourth: Reactions to Tenoch's performance as Namor have been extremely positive.

Fifth: One of the reasons Namor hasn't had a solo film is due to complications with film rights...similar to why we haven't gotten a Hulk Sequel.

https://comicbook.com/movies/news/ma...explained-mcu/

I know Namor came first, but Aquaman became more popular pretty quickly, and Marvel and Kevin Feige know that, not to mention he beat him to the big screen, otherwise we'd be getting a Namor from Atlantis.

I'll oblige that, Namor is best in antagonistic roles. Aquaman is too, he's been used similarly in the comics, albeit not as much, and it didn't keep WB from giving him his own movie, because of his popularity.

I guess we'll see whether we get a Namor movie in the next few years, won't we? There's nothing wrong with not getting a solo movie, Namor can just float around other movies, it works best for his character anyway. It was an observation to re-enforce my argument that Huerta's portrayal, while serviceable as part of a shared universe, he won't be a leading man, which works perfectly.

I heard of the film rights. The article also notes in 2018, Marvel can now use Namor, and they went with introducing him in Black Panther. Even if they can't release a solo Namor movie, which is unconfirmed, they don't need to. Audiences aren't clamoring for a Namor solo movie (anymore) considering how polarizing reactions to his re-interpretation have been.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I'll oblige that, Namor is best in antagonistic roles. Aquaman is too, he's been used similarly in the comics, albeit not as much, and it didn't keep WB from giving him his own movie, because of his popularity.

So, with you admitting that Namor works best as an antagonist... what about using him as an antagonist means marvel has no faith in the character?

I guess we'll see whether we get a Namor movie in the next few years, won't we? There's nothing wrong with not getting a solo movie, Namor can just float around other movies, it works best for his character anyway. It was an observation to re-enforce my argument that Huerta's portrayal, while serviceable as part of a shared universe, he won't be a leading man, which works perfectly.

Your "observation" was that they must not have any faith in him as a solo character. Leave your goalposts where they started.

I heard of the film rights. The article also notes in 2018, Marvel can now use Namor, and they went with introducing him in Black Panther. Even if they can't release a oslo Namor movie, which is unconfirmed, they don't need to. Audiences aren't clamoring for a Namor solo movie (anymore) considering how polarizing reactions to his re-interpretation have been.

read it again:

By 2018, Feige again told IGN that the Namor rights are "not as clean or clear as the majority of the other characters"

To me, that indicates that they still have an issue with using Namor in a stand-alone film. Probably the same situation they have with Hulk... Disney owns the character rights, Universal owns the distribution rights. Meaning that, while Universal can't make a Namor movie...Disney can't either...unless they give Universal the option to distribute.

What "polarizing reactions" are you talking about? Huerta's performance as Namor has been almost universally praised.

[MrLachyG]

I think the biggest failure was that they didn't make it clear enough that Gorr and more specifically the Necrosword are supposed to be a parody, not a serious villain. Bale plays it perfectly, but they needed some more ribbing from the heroes. The Necrosword is the edgiest edgelord (pun intended, probably by the writers too) ever, all "I AM DARKNESS AND FURY. WHILE YOU ENJOYED LIFE I STUDIED THE SWORD" wankery. It's the ultimate avatar of every anime emo kid who bought a katana and wears a trench coat and trilby everywhere. Gorr's a pretty decent guy and clearly a bit of a dork (see the scene where he's telling stories to the kids; he's ridiculous). And his motive is SO dumb it has to be the Necrosword's influence. You don't go from "my God was a bit of a dick" to "MURDER ALL GODS" because you've got a valid point of view. Once that interpretation slams into place, everything about Gorr is pretty fuckin' funny and it fits a lot better with the rest of the material. I fully agree they made it a hard leap because the heroes take him way too seriously. Especially when Thor "wins" in the finale by basically saying "go on, end the world then, idiot. I'll be over here hanging out with my actual girlfriend." And that snaps Gorr out of it, since the Necrosword's gone, and realizes he's been a complete ponce. It's not even hard for him, because that was all the stupid Necrosword.

If Thor and co had mocked Gorr a bit for being such a tryhard drama tool, it would've played better, IMO.

you know what would've made the movie a lot better? had Gorr attacked the temple where Zeus and the others were hiding out

[Kyphael]

Nah, dude, you've just got monumentally distorted standards.

Also, go see the movie so you can actually form your own opinion on it, rather than forming a rather bloated opinion based on nothing but "hearsay."

Oh get off your high horse. If you can't debate in good faith, I don't know why you even bother.

I plan to, I haven't yet to avoid the packed theaters. I never wrote the movie off as terrible on hearsay. I critiqued the man's physique for a role that is 100% shirtless when we have seen other actors who clearly put more time in at the GYM for similar roles.

[Syegfryed]

Oh get off your high horse. If you can't debate in good faith, I don't know why you even bother.

I plan to, I haven't yet to avoid the packed theaters. I never wrote the movie off as terrible on hearsay. I critiqued the man's physique for a role that is 100% shirtless when we have seen other actors who clearly put more time in at the GYM for similar roles.

Some people here in this sub go to anyone else throat if you dislike anything, could be slightest thing, and try to say how you are wrong for it, you can actually count the faces, its the same trough many threads

Apparently, you can't dislike an actor physique about a role, how dare you

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Some people here in this sub go to anyone else throat if you dislike anything, could be slightest thing, and try to say how you are wrong for it, you can actually count the faces, its the same trough many threads

Apparently, you can't dislike an actor physique about a role, how dare you

That's the thing about expressing opinions. Other people may not agree with your opinion...and they have just as much right to express their opinion as you do.

[Syegfryed]

That's the thing about expressing opinions. Other people may not agree with your opinion...and they have just as much right to express their opinion as you do.

Saying other opinions is wrong, or how he should not dislike something, or saying its invalid to dislike something because bs is bogus, Literally arguing for the ske of argue.