1. #2221
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    It's a good bit of visual storytelling. It gets across the forms as being a convenience for them, with an intimidation factor whereas the Aspect and general draconic visages are meant to fit in with those they're watching over to acclimatize. I can see it being a conscious choice as much as an inability on their part to have more recognizable forms.
    I wonder which was supposed to be the design intent.
    Personally I feel the failed aspect angle is far more compelling, and adds a certain visual dimension to them feeling like the rejects.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  2. #2222
    I'm thinking one of the Incarnates will swap sides, or at least give up on the rest. My bet is on Vyranoth.

    She seems chill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Foreign Exchange Ztudent View Post
    As per usual the whole killing of Rasz has continued to have been a poor decision from the Narrative Team. This just solidified it.
    Honestly I don't think so tbh. She was just the disc 1 end boss, not really a character, just something to move along the plot.

    It's all very simple and uncomplicated, which is what WoW needs right now.

  3. #2223
    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    I'm thinking one of the Incarnates will swap sides, or at least give up on the rest. My bet is on Vyranoth.

    She seems
    chill.
    did you have to

    anyway, wouldn't want it just because it reeks of weakness of their cause, and i like reasonably confident enemies more. and we just had a redemption story for a female character on the baddie side last expansion. but this makes your case only more probable.

  4. #2224
    Bloodsail Admiral Foreign Exchange Ztudent's Avatar
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    IDK I feel like this story is as complicated as it gets and it seems like Danuser has put the brakes on and people will copium with the "void stuff".

    Iridikron is definitely just fucking over the other Incarnates at some point once he becomes Galakrond 2.0 though.
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  5. #2225
    Quote Originally Posted by guro-tchai View Post
    did you have to

    anyway, wouldn't want it just because it reeks of weakness of their cause, and i like reasonably confident enemies more. and we just had a redemption story for a female character on the baddie side last expansion. but this makes your case only more probable.
    Alexstrasza already stated that the Incarnates are mostly fighting due to sunk cost fallacy, and that Iridikron is the only one truly commited to fighting. Fyrakk and Vyranoth just want to fly around doing cool dragon shit.
    Their cause is already on shaky ground, what with their only argument being that they want to rule the world and/or give the middle finger to the Titans.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  6. #2226
    Rasz made sense. The youngest of the incarnates and thus the most rash and uncalculable of them all. Like a teenager if you will. Iri even mentions it in the video. It does make sense. Tho I still wonder why she was locked alone, away from the other 3. Hopefully that gets explained at some point.
    I can see Fyrakk being the end boss of this patch. Iridikron will definately be a boss later on. I'm not sure about Vyranoth. Will she also get a separate raid? Maybe a miniraid?But thats not on the roadmap. Maybe she's the last boss of the mega dungeon. Maybe she will swap sides. Lots of options there. Whatever the case, still betting on 10.2 Iridikron and 10.3 Murozond.

  7. #2227
    Quote Originally Posted by Arafal View Post
    They look so cool.
    Especially Vyranoth.
    Icy what you did there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    She looks a little too close to the Winter Queen to me [...]
    Do people really think that? It's a slender female shape with light-blue 'skin', that's where the comparison ends for me.
    Vyranoth's face is way more gaunt, or rather inhumanly triangular, reminding me rather of the Spriggans.

    I'd file it under convergent design.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    I wonder if this is an implication that Tyr made the incarnates, before or after the aspects? Considering they have the power to change form and the Tyr questline has him keeping notes on elemental protodrakes.
    It feels rather like an innate draconic ability, but requiring some mastery, explaining why most proto-drakes we met so far couldn't do it and/or didn't bother since they were hostile anyway.
    You could say that the powerup the Aspects and their flights received helped, but shapeshifting is rather Nature than Order.
    But your duty to Azeroth is not yet complete. More is demanded of you... a price the living cannot pay.

  8. #2228
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Alexstrasza already stated that the Incarnates are mostly fighting due to sunk cost fallacy, and that Iridikron is the only one truly commited to fighting. Fyrakk and Vyranoth just want to fly around doing cool dragon shit.
    could you give me a link? i don't doubt you, i'm just unsubbed.

    Their cause is already on shaky ground, what with their only argument being that they want to rule the world and/or give the middle finger to the Titans.
    that's a pretty strong argument, imo. i'll reiterate: for me, their likeability grows with their conviction.

  9. #2229
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    Alexstrasza already stated that the Incarnates are mostly fighting due to sunk cost fallacy, and that Iridikron is the only one truly commited to fighting. Fyrakk and Vyranoth just want to fly around doing cool dragon shit.
    Their cause is already on shaky ground, what with their only argument being that they want to rule the world and/or give the middle finger to the Titans.
    I think it was Noz that said it. I think it was along the lines of "Fyrakk and Vyra were in it for the ideals, but Iridikron truly embraced the war" or something like it.

  10. #2230
    Quote Originally Posted by guro-tchai View Post
    could you give me a link? i don't doubt you, i'm just unsubbed.


    that's a pretty strong argument, imo. i'll reiterate: for me, their likeability grows with their conviction.
    It mentioned in the post raid cinematic when you return to Alexstrasza with the raid quest. She specifically states that Fyrakk and Vyranoth are commited, but only in the sense that they want to be cool dragons and not servants of the Titans. Iridikron is the one singled out as the one wanting a continuation of the war, and who made bargains with nebulous evil entities in order to keep it going. Not wanting to accept defeat.

    As for their cause I would say that is a separate issue from their conviction. Their cause is pretty weak, but they clearly want to go through with it, with Iridikron being the main driving force behind the war between them and the Aspects.
    Iridikron clearly has a strong conviction, no matter how weak his cause really is. And Fyrakk and Vyranoth are definitely onboard, question just being whether they are so dedicated they are unwilling to accept compromise.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by micwini View Post
    I think it was Noz that said it. I think it was along the lines of "Fyrakk and Vyra were in it for the ideals, but Iridikron truly embraced the war" or something like it.
    Was either him or Alexstrasza, been a while since I saw the cinematic.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  11. #2231
    One of the interviews mentions that Aberrus includes "the chamber where Neltharion communed with the Old Gods", I can see that being the real reason Iridkron is interested. That or the control gauntlet, which has a model in the files and hasn't appeared yet.

  12. #2232
    Quote Originally Posted by Sondrelk View Post
    It mentioned in the post raid cinematic when you return to Alexstrasza with the raid quest. She specifically states that Fyrakk and Vyranoth are commited, but only in the sense that they want to be cool dragons and not servants of the Titans. Iridikron is the one singled out as the one wanting a continuation of the war, and who made bargains with nebulous evil entities in order to keep it going. Not wanting to accept defeat.

    As for their cause I would say that is a separate issue from their conviction. Their cause is pretty weak, but they clearly want to go through with it, with Iridikron being the main driving force behind the war between them and the Aspects.
    Iridikron clearly has a strong conviction, no matter how weak his cause really is. And Fyrakk and Vyranoth are definitely onboard, question just being whether they are so dedicated they are unwilling to accept compromise.
    rewatched it. the key phrase there isn't that he was the driving force behind the war, but rather "they never knew the depths of his depravity". that implies they will find out about his deal with the Void and defect - and that's probably what's going to happen, but it's still dull as shit.
    the other route is them all embracing the Void to preserve their independence from the Order, and even better if it further reframes the narrative of the Order-Void conflict, showing the former as tyrannical and the latter as liberating. Uldaman letters point in that direction, but i still think it's improbable

  13. #2233
    Quote Originally Posted by micwini View Post
    Rasz made sense. The youngest of the incarnates and thus the most rash and uncalculable of them all. Like a teenager if you will. Iri even mentions it in the video. It does make sense. Tho I still wonder why she was locked alone, away from the other 3. Hopefully that gets explained at some point.
    I can see Fyrakk being the end boss of this patch. Iridikron will definately be a boss later on. I'm not sure about Vyranoth. Will she also get a separate raid? Maybe a miniraid?But thats not on the roadmap. Maybe she's the last boss of the mega dungeon. Maybe she will swap sides. Lots of options there. Whatever the case, still betting on 10.2 Iridikron and 10.3 Murozond.
    DF is a 4 raid expansion?

  14. #2234
    Bloodsail Admiral Foreign Exchange Ztudent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    DF is a 4 raid expansion?
    They are announcing the expansion at Blizzcon.

    We have no confirmation if we're getting a 10.3, so that seems unlikely.


    Again they have been coy about the Roadmap and not showing the 2024 portion. So I think they probably will not have a 10.3 and instead end with 10.2.
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  15. #2235
    It's pretty obvious that all this focus on the secrets behind Neltharion's dark bargain with the Old Gods is set-up for the inevitable resurgence of the Old Gods in the next expansion.

  16. #2236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    One of the interviews mentions that Aberrus includes "the chamber where Neltharion communed with the Old Gods", I can see that being the real reason Iridkron is interested. That or the control gauntlet, which has a model in the files and hasn't appeared yet.

    The Dracythyr gauntlet that Neltharion used in the past will for sure be a plot device in the coming patches. I will be willing to bet that Iridikron or Murozond (once he enters the story) will be aiming for it.


    My person bet it will be Murozond due to Nozdormu's incessant ranting about how the Dracthyr's future is "unwritten" and what they choose for their future will be the deciding factor in it all, blah blah blah. *If* we do get a Nozdormu becoming Murozond in this expansion, him going after the Dracthyr would make perfect sense.

  17. #2237
    Quote Originally Posted by Foreign Exchange Ztudent View Post
    They are announcing the expansion at Blizzcon.

    We have no confirmation if we're getting a 10.3, so that seems unlikely.


    Again they have been coy about the Roadmap and not showing the 2024 portion. So I think they probably will not have a 10.3 and instead end with 10.2.
    When is that going to be? Pretty sure they haven't announced a date yet.

  18. #2238
    Quote Originally Posted by guro-tchai View Post
    did you have to

    anyway, wouldn't want it just because it reeks of weakness of their cause, and i like reasonably confident enemies more. and we just had a redemption story for a female character on the baddie side last expansion. but this makes your case only more probable.
    I do think it's rather necessary tho, I don't think we can end this expansion just by exterminating the Primalists. If they are just bad guys that we defeat and are done with, it really is like any other baddie we have had.

    The best resolution would be for all dragonkind to find some sort of truce if not peace in order to move forward, and for that I think at least one of the Incarnates has to live.

    Doesn't even have to be a redemption story really, but about finding a common ground to avoid mutual annihilation.

  19. #2239
    Quote Originally Posted by MyWholeLifeIsThunder View Post
    I do think it's rather necessary tho, I don't think we can end this expansion just by exterminating the Primalists. If they are just bad guys that we defeat and are done with, it really is like any other baddie we have had.

    The best resolution would be for all dragonkind to find some sort of truce if not peace in order to move forward, and for that I think at least one of the Incarnates has to live.

    Doesn't even have to be a redemption story really, but about finding a common ground to avoid mutual annihilation.
    It would be nice if Fyrakk and Vyranoth live, yeah. Iridikron clearly has baggage and is too far gone, but the other two would be nice to keep around.

  20. #2240
    The Lightbringer Lady Atia's Avatar
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    After a night of sleep, my personal oppinion:

    - Tier sets look mostly good, I really love the Alex and Kaleg cosplays for priest and mage!

    - HD Ashkandi!


    - Whoever was adamant that we wouldn't get any Cata dungeons for M+ - looks like you lost. Can't wait for Troll Dungeons, Deadmines or other nuggets in the future!

    - The new upgrade system looks weirdly convoluted, but maybe it will make more sense in practise. It's also good that they arleady say if people like/dislike, they will keep or remove/change it again.
    Last edited by Lady Atia; 2023-03-09 at 07:51 AM.

    #TEAMGIRAFFE

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