We don't have any ending

[RahEndymion]

Is that really a good thing though? I'd rather have a very in-depth race that has a thought out culture and social structure and organization you actively see, with people fulfilling all sorts of individual roles and jobs and a wide variety of the aspects of their lives than get four races whose entire development is a couple bullet points.

I would definitely prefer to have fully developed races/cultures with interesting social structures and organization. In an ideal world I would like to have 4-5 cultures per expansion on release. That doesn't have to be separate species of course. As an example, I think there is clear differentiation in 'culture' between Drustvar and Stormsong even though both are Kul'Tiran Humans.

However in Dragonflight, it doesn't feel like we have any truly developed cultures on release. I don't think there has been any notable exposition / world building / culture building for Dragons, Dracthyr or Dragonkin. Maruuk are sorely lacking in the story department and the world building department. Iskara themes are handled much better but even then, there isn't much opportunity to discover much about them or their relationship with other Tuskar etc. Dragonscale Expedition does not interest me at all. Now they do have good content and they do deliver good story beats / reveals etc but they are not a culture. They are the same 'expedition' / generic explorer faction we've had in every xpac since Cata.

What else is there? Djaradin seem like they only exist to be utilized in a later patch and the Black Dragonflight leadership contest doesn't offer much more than 'Kill these guys and fill bar'.

I appreciate that both of those are likely to be developed more in future patches. However, that doesn't mean that it's good story telling / narrative development / world building on release.

As much fun as I am having with DF and as positive as the patch schedule is, it seems a lot like 10.0.05 and 10.0.07 were intended to be part of 10.0.0. Which, to get back to the OP's comments, is probably why there is no 'ending' just yet. The cynic in me says this is incredibly smart delivery that, even if it diminishes the world a little, ticks a lot of community boxes and tees-up the public opinion. I think this is supported by the prevalence of 'but three patches in 6 months' in response to critical feedback on here and other forums.

Either way it's 100% better than it was this time two years ago at the start of SL though.

[Nathanyel]

All that said, it's obvious that these storylines will continue in the major content patches.

This. While I haven't finished either campaign yet, we are basically at the end of the first episode of a miniseries with 3, maybe 4 parts. Literally "End of Act 1".

[AtomR]

All that said, it's obvious that these storylines will continue in the major content patches.

That is always the promise with storylines that aren't developed at the launch of an expansion. But the truth is that they are probably already dedicated into developing the next expansion, and have a smaller team working on the patches of the current ones. Which will leave plot holes unresolved, patch content will only deliver farmable/collectible stuff with the occasional dungeon and/or raid and superficial story beats that aren't related to the main theme of the expansion. Hopefully I'm wrong.


One thing I found confusing when playing through the main campaign and zones is how the story tells us that the land slumbered for 10000years after the dragons left. But now the watcher reignited Tyrhold beacon and the Dragon Isles became discoverable again. So, what about the maruuk and iskaara and all the other creatures that still live in that land? Were they slumbering aswel? Were they left living in a cloud covered land? Why is everything so alive when they were covered in "darkness"? I might need to replay the campaign.

[Feanoro]

I miss MoP...

Why? MoP is where the whole "story gated behind dailies and patches" became really prominent.

[czarek]

I have recently reached renown 24 with dragonscale and the reward was very bad as most of what you are being told directly comes from the book "Dawn of the Aspect".

Most of the campaign story has been bad. I enjoyed the Ysera questline even if you can see from a mile away the primalist coming.

Ysera questline wasn't great but I think that the reason I enjoyed it a bit more than the others is that it was longer and it reached an end.

The other questlines have an artificial pace, you just do random activities until there is nothing left to do for now and you are politely asked to wait for next patch.

Please blizzard, learn to give us an end to these quests so that they feel a bit more satisfying and you don't have to make your npc say garbage like "whoah I've never had so much fun"

I havent expected any fireworks in here. Main story is based on raid cinematics. We just need major patch where the story will continue.

[Eosia]

We are still in 10.0.x patches. This is the beginning of the expansion. Of course there's no "ending". You won't see that until 10.2.x at the earliest as some of the side stuff gets tied up and we move towards the ultimate conclusion of the expansion in 10.3 and beyond. So yes, there are going to be pauses in the story when you hit the max renown at the moment because you're ahead of the release time table for the content.

Do you honestly expect Blizzard's time table to be dictated by people who blast through the content and effort gates ahead of most other people? Especially in light of the fact that the idiots above them in ActivisionBlizzard, may Microsoft fire each of them without a golden parachute, decided to rain shit down on the developers by doing multiple pay cuts and abruptly ending Work From Home? If anything, it's going to slow them down because you know talent is already leaving with the attitude that was shown to them and the fact Bungie, Riot, and probably more game companies are taking advantage of that.

[Venziir]

Isn't that the Dracthyr?

I thought dragonkin were specifically the 2 & 4 legged humanoid dragons typical for vanilla-cata?

While I don't so much as dislike the identity of the Dracthyr, I don't find their story particularly compelling. They don't seem to really have an individual culture. You have the sundered flame faction which sort of have their own cultural identity as a draconoid Twilight equivalent but the 'Dractyr' are sort of disparate. Pandaren had their own established culture (in universe) when the player arrives while Dracthyr are somewhat unawares and function more like a class than a race/culture in the story.

I think that's the biggest flaw of the premise. They should have let the Dracthyr be conscious for the 10k years and spawn their own isolated culture, with their own architecture. Make it so the Dracthyr inherited a city they didn't understand from the departure of the dragons and built on top. Sort of like Teotihuacán to the Aztecs or the pyramids of Giza to Cleopatra. That gives them the opportunity/excuse to give them their own traditions, stylistic choices and setting.

I don't think it's good enough thematically to market the expansion as 'the lost dragon isles from 10k years ago' and do literally nothing to build on that premise. Narratively, they just throw in a Titan construct / copy paste some Storm Peaks style Titan architecture and go 'see lol super old' which doesn't do the concept justice.

My bad, thought you’d written Dracthyr

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The Maruuk have a campaign, it's just that you pretty much finish it while levelling through Ohn'aran plains...

Just like how all the other factions then?

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That is always the promise with storylines that aren't developed at the launch of an expansion. But the truth is that they are probably already dedicated into developing the next expansion, and have a smaller team working on the patches of the current ones. Which will leave plot holes unresolved, patch content will only deliver farmable/collectible stuff with the occasional dungeon and/or raid and superficial story beats that aren't related to the main theme of the expansion. Hopefully I'm wrong.


One thing I found confusing when playing through the main campaign and zones is how the story tells us that the land slumbered for 10000years after the dragons left. But now the watcher reignited Tyrhold beacon and the Dragon Isles became discoverable again. So, what about the maruuk and iskaara and all the other creatures that still live in that land? Were they slumbering aswel? Were they left living in a cloud covered land? Why is everything so alive when they were covered in "darkness"? I might need to replay the campaign.

The centaurs, tuskarrs, gnolls and furbolg were all awake

[Skildar]

I've been quite judgemental on the campaign because I'm always expecting something on the level of suramar (where the story was progressing and at the same time they were building the world, showcasing what it means to be a nightborne) or the 5.1 reputations. With these, you wanted to get your hands on the next chapter for good reasons.

In Dragonflight we've had some solid world building in the Azur span, but in the other zones not so much (except maybe a few black dragon quests). And if none of the zones are visually impressive, Azur span is the only one were I was happy to wander around trying to find a new questline to achieve.

10.0.7 is on the horizon and apparently with it a new serie of quests. I'm not expecting much but would really like for blizzard to realize that a big part of Shadowlands failure is the fact that none of the campaign chapters were particularly enjoyable to the point where you were eagerly awaiting the next one.

[Nathanyel]

My bad, thought you’d written Dracthyr

Nono, the person you initially quoted meant the Dracthyr but wrote Dragonkin, then the other person quoting you completely missed that and wrote some paragraphs about Dragonkin.

[Combatbutler]

I would definitely prefer to have fully developed races/cultures with interesting social structures and organization. In an ideal world I would like to have 4-5 cultures per expansion on release. That doesn't have to be separate species of course. As an example, I think there is clear differentiation in 'culture' between Drustvar and Stormsong even though both are Kul'Tiran Humans.

To be fair there isn't a single actual developed culture in the entirety of wow, it is all just pretty much superficial fluff.

[Nymrohd]

Nono, the person you initially quoted meant the Dracthyr but wrote Dragonkin, then the other person quoting you completely missed that and wrote some paragraphs about Dragonkin.

I was talking about the dragonkin. They are the main race of NPCs in Dragonflight. They are everywhere, in every zone. They are the dragon culture that actually sustained all those buildings while the dragons were gone (and seemingly slowly retreated to Valdrakken, leaving lesser outposts to ruin?). We somewhat explore what this did to their society in Thaldrazsus with plenty of them joining the Primalists but there are so many gaps on how they functioned for so many years. Beginning with how they where created, how they sustain their population, who led them for all these years, how did they not fragment between those who kept waiting for the dragons and those who almost immediately seem to have joined the Primalists etc.

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To be fair there isn't a single actual developed culture in the entirety of wow, it is all just pretty much superficial fluff.

I think Kul Tirans are pretty well developed. You know the history of the four houses, how they function, where they live, you have a good grasp of their religion and their economy.

[Combatbutler]

I think Kul Tirans are pretty well developed. You know the history of the four houses, how they function, where they live, you have a good grasp of their religion and their economy.

The houses aren't that fleshed out, they are your run of the mill standard noble house, we have a glimpse into their current iterations, yet not so much into the real history of the regions and their traditions, when are Kul'tirans considered adult? When do they get married, how common are arranged marriages? Can the common folk rise above their station, are peaseants taught to read? What is the typical diet of the people living in the regions, how far if at all does the average kul'tiran travel, who are their main trading partners etc.

[Frozenbeef]

Dragonflight has story? I'd say it has even less than shadowlands and that's saying something.

[Nymrohd]

The houses aren't that fleshed out, they are your run of the mill standard noble house, we have a glimpse into their current iterations, yet not so much into the real history of the regions and their traditions, when are Kul'tirans considered adult? When do they get married, how common are arranged marriages? Can the common folk rise above their station, are peaseants taught to read? What is the typical diet of the people living in the regions, how far if at all does the average kul'tiran travel, who are their main trading partners etc.

We have a decent amount of information on at least Proudmore and Waycrest. We know there is social mobility at least through the military given Lucille knights her new inquisitors. As for what they eat, we do have the cooking skill plus more specific information (e.g. Drustvar raising a lot of pigs). By warcraft standards, I don't think we've had any other place developed as well in as short a time.

[Combatbutler]

By warcraft standards, I don't think we've had any other place developed as well in as short a time.

Warcraft standards are dogshit and should not be a bar to judge any story.

[Skildar]

Dragonflight has story? I'd say it has even less than shadowlands and that's saying something.

Tuskarrs are the most developed faction/story of the Expansion launch and that's saying something

Shadowlands has a lot of history but the story of the expansion is garbage. Dragonflight has almost no history so it better have an interesting story to offer...

[Calfredd]

We have a decent amount of information on at least Proudmore and Waycrest. We know there is social mobility at least through the military given Lucille knights her new inquisitors. As for what they eat, we do have the cooking skill plus more specific information (e.g. Drustvar raising a lot of pigs). By warcraft standards, I don't think we've had any other place developed as well in as short a time.

Drustvar deals with ores and pigs, Tiragarde Sound houses the capital as well as hunting camps to both cull overpopulation and provide meat and furs not to mention fishing throughout the island nation, and Tess straight up tells us that Stormsong is the breadbasket as well as their shipyard hub. We actually get given quite a bit of story and background info from the side quests.

[Skildar]

Warcraft standards are dogshit and should not be a bar to judge any story.

No one is going to dispute you on this because they've rarely managed to do crazy good questlines and congratulate themselves and bring out the champagne when they do a stay a while and listen quest.
But there is a value in visual design that a lot of other games completely miss and on that end Blizzard can be very strong. I really despise BfA but Zandalar and Kul'tiras are both well fleshed out visually, I still have a shoot ton of criticism against them visually but both lands feel active and rich of history. And circling back to Dragonflight they've done a very bad job in that expansion...