Weapon Types should feel different.

[Amnaught]

What realistic change do you think could be made to make weapons feel different from each other?

Secondary stat bonuses? Passives for each weapon type? Talents? If it were up to me you could straight up swap yoir entire Mastery passive dependent on what weapon you're weilding.

How I would handle it though:

Each class gets a passive effect for each of their primary weapon types. (Warriors don't need passives for Bows, for example) These are small effects that activate whenever you cast any GCD spell. Different effect depending on whether the spell targets an ally or an enemy.

Example, Paladins:
Polearm (Enemy) Heals you.
Polearm (Ally) Inflicts Holy Damage against the target's attackers.
Sword (Enemy) - Bleed.
Sword (Ally) - Heal-over-time.
Mace (Enemy) Gives you an absorb shield.
Mace (Ally) Gives the target an absorb shield.
Axe (Enemy) Ignores % of armor.
Axe (Ally) Increases the damage of the target's next attack.
Shield: Grants you an absorb shield.
Off-Hand: Inflicts Holy damage to your attackers.

Just make it as effective as a tertiary stat, and tie it to Transmog instead of actual equipped weapon so drops aren't screwed up. ***Something***.

[Lochton]

What realistic change do you think could be made to make weapons feel different from each other?

Secondary stat bonuses? Passives for each weapon type? Talents? If it were up to me you could straight up swap yoir entire Mastery passive dependent on what weapon you're weilding.

How I would handle it though:

Each class gets a passive effect for each of their primary weapon types. (Warriors don't need passives for Bows, for example) These are small effects that activate whenever you cast any GCD spell. Different effect depending on whether the spell targets an ally or an enemy.

Example, Paladins:
Polearm (Enemy) Heals you.
Polearm (Ally) Inflicts Holy Damage against the target's attackers.
Sword (Enemy) - Bleed.
Sword (Ally) - Heal-over-time.
Mace (Enemy) Gives you an absorb shield.
Mace (Ally) Gives the target an absorb shield.
Axe (Enemy) Ignores % of armor.
Axe (Ally) Increases the damage of the target's next attack.
Shield: Grants you an absorb shield.
Off-Hand: Inflicts Holy damage to your attackers.

Just make it as effective as a tertiary stat, and tie it to Transmog instead of actual equipped weapon so drops aren't screwed up. ***Something***.

Sounds needlessly complicated if there would be different parameters pr. class. Why not just stick to the old ideas? A chance to slow your target with a mace weapon, a chance to reduce armor with a polearm, a chance of bleed with swords/daggers, etc.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

? This a very unnecessary and, quite frankly, dull suggestion. A suggestion for something that does not need this kind of suggestion.


Sounds like you are just bored and coming up with... random things for the sake of it.

[Amnaught]

Sounds needlessly complicated if there would be different parameters pr. class. Why not just stick to the old ideas? A chance to slow your target with a mace weapon, a chance to reduce armor with a polearm, a chance of bleed with swords/daggers, etc.

- Because a chance to slow is useless against a raid boss, a chance to stun is overpowered in PVP, and healers need something too.

- - - Updated - - -

? This a very unnecessary and, quite frankly, dull suggestion. A suggestion for something that does not need this kind of suggestion.


Sounds like you are just bored and coming up with... random things for the sake of it.

This is less dull than any of the "x ability does +5% damage" talents.

Why have weapon types at all if theyre all functionally the same? Why isnt everything just "One-Handed, Two-Handed, Off-Handed"?

[Malkiah]

Why have weapon types at all if theyre all functionally the same? Why isnt everything just "One-Handed, Two-Handed, Off-Handed"?

i figure this is rhetorical, but there IS actually an explanation for this.

1. DnD has different weapon types because it uses different dice combination to determine damage because DnD doesn't give a single squirty shit about balance.
2. fantasy RPG games born out of the tradition of DnD (which as of now is basically every fantasy RPG that exists) have different weapon types because DnD had them.

but due to the needs of balance and tuning and consideration for RNG and etc etc etc on and on and on, those different weapon types have homogenized over the years so that no matter which one you happen to get drop for you it's the same output as any other one.

[Phinx]

I'd settle for a more simplified version, if I had to come up with something.

Maces deal more damage to plate, Polearms deal more damage to chainmail, Axes more damage to unarmored enemies, etc.

Naturally this would come with an armor revamp as well, which I'd advocate even more strongly for than for weapon changes. Does the type of armor you wear actually matter in this game anymore, outside of PvP maybe?

[Val the Moofia Boss]

What realistic change do you think could be made to make weapons feel different from each other?

Each weapon has different abilities, like in Guild Wars 2. A ranger in GW2 has 5 different abilities depending on whether they are wielding a greatsword, or a sword and an axe, or dual axes, or a longbow, or a shortbow, and so on.

Another idea would be that different weapon types are effective against different monsters. For example, light weapons like one handed swords would be able to hit fast monsters like wolves, who would otherwise have a high evasion rate against heavier weapons like maces or greatswords. Perhaps an enemyt is armored and is initially resistant to light weapons, requiring a heavy weapon like a two handed mace to shatter the armor before he becomes vulnerable to all other weapon types. Perhaps flying enemies fly far enough off the ground that melee users can't reach them and thus must swap to a bow or throwing weapons or magic or do something to yank them down to the ground. Etc.

[Athorha]

I miss when weapons had different speeds. Wouldn't mind polearms having an extra yard of range or two as well. Could go a step further and make bows faster, crossbows slower, guns less damage spread etc. I think old warrior/rogue talents should've stayed but its too late to revert back to that system imo.

Keep abilities normalized however, yeah auto attacks are fairly minor now, but even their animations (like polearms) could use some variability. Who knows, maybe a ret with crusading strikes would like a fast sword, whereas an arms warrior with 40% crit breakpoint chooses the 4 second mace versus the 3.8 second axe with a haste build, because the rotation "flows better"

[Biomega]

WoW isn't really that kind of a game.

This would be more suited to a single-player game where you can experiment freely without it having performance repercussions for other people.

[Zendhal The Black]

Naturally this would come with an armor revamp as well, which I'd advocate even more strongly for than for weapon changes. Does the type of armor you wear actually matter in this game anymore, outside of PvP maybe?

I remember back in Vanilla/TBC you really felt the impact of armor.

As warrior you felt the difference getting a crit with mortal strike against Rogue or mage, seeing half of their healthbar disappear vs "crit" on a full brutal glad holy paladin (that felt like you hit a M1 Abrams tank with a sledgehammer)

That feeling is long gone now and that's a shame.

Also different primary stats giving you multiple "effects" should be a thing again for example:

STR - gives you AP (more for plate wearers), parry and block rating
AGI - gives you AP (more for mail/leather wearers), physical crit, dodge and speed
INT - Gives you SP (more for damage dealers), spell crit, magic resistance
STAM - gives you HP, Versatility, Health regen, Leech and armor
SPIRIT - gives you SP (more for healers), mastery, mana regen, magic resistance

[arkanon]

What realistic change do you think could be made to make weapons feel different from each other?

Secondary stat bonuses? Passives for each weapon type? Talents? If it were up to me you could straight up swap yoir entire Mastery passive dependent on what weapon you're weilding.

How I would handle it though:

Each class gets a passive effect for each of their primary weapon types. (Warriors don't need passives for Bows, for example) These are small effects that activate whenever you cast any GCD spell. Different effect depending on whether the spell targets an ally or an enemy.

Example, Paladins:
Polearm (Enemy) Heals you.
Polearm (Ally) Inflicts Holy Damage against the target's attackers.
Sword (Enemy) - Bleed.
Sword (Ally) - Heal-over-time.
Mace (Enemy) Gives you an absorb shield.
Mace (Ally) Gives the target an absorb shield.
Axe (Enemy) Ignores % of armor.
Axe (Ally) Increases the damage of the target's next attack.
Shield: Grants you an absorb shield.
Off-Hand: Inflicts Holy damage to your attackers.

Just make it as effective as a tertiary stat, and tie it to Transmog instead of actual equipped weapon so drops aren't screwed up. ***Something***.

I have been playing a LOT of Valheim lately, and one thing i enjoy about the combat there is each weapon feels and behaves VERY differently. Its also a VERY different game, in particular in regards to combat. But i love that the great axe is a slow swing, but has huge cleave potential. The 1h axe is very quick, but deals less damage and less aoe in a smaller arc.

I honestly dont know how this could or would be translated into wow, but I would like there to be more variation in weapons. Thats a LOT of specs to sort through each weapon type though. And honestly, no offense at all but I dont personally like your suggestion, its extremely convoluted, just my 2c, at least you put something forward.

[Nymrohd]

i figure this is rhetorical, but there IS actually an explanation for this.

1. DnD has different weapon types because it uses different dice combination to determine damage because DnD doesn't give a single squirty shit about balance.
2. fantasy RPG games born out of the tradition of DnD (which as of now is basically every fantasy RPG that exists) have different weapon types because DnD had them.

but due to the needs of balance and tuning and consideration for RNG and etc etc etc on and on and on, those different weapon types have homogenized over the years so that no matter which one you happen to get drop for you it's the same output as any other one.

It's also because damage type matters plenty and helps build fantasy. It makes sense that killing a skeleton with arrows will just be harder than killing him with a morningstar.

[Malkiah]

It's also because damage type matters plenty and helps build fantasy. It makes sense that killing a skeleton with arrows will just be harder than killing him with a morningstar.

it might make *sense* (to a certain type of person, ignoring for the moment the "sense" in what does or doesn't kill a magically animated skeleton) but it's not *fair* to the game play experience of the person on a class that only shoots arrows and can't use morningstars.

in a game like DnD what makes sense is more important than what's fair, because the former reinforces the shared fantasy and the latter can be determined on the fly.
in an MMO where at a minimum you should be aiming for "any character can accomplish the same thing, they just may do it in different ways" in terms of balance across all your playable characters, what's fair is more important than what makes sense, because there is no shared narrative and the rules are rigidly enforced by a system that is beyond your control.

[Nymrohd]

it might make *sense* (to a certain type of person, ignoring for the moment the "sense" in what does or doesn't kill a magically animated skeleton) but it's not *fair* to the game play experience of the person on a class that only shoots arrows and can't use morningstars.

in a game like DnD what makes sense is more important than what's fair, because the former reinforces the shared fantasy and the latter can be determined on the fly.
in an MMO where at a minimum you should be aiming for "any character can accomplish the same thing, they just may do it in different ways" in terms of balance across all your playable characters, what's fair is more important than what makes sense, because there is no shared narrative and the rules are rigidly enforced by a system that is beyond your control.

Oh I am not advocating for what the OP is suggesting, it's stupid for WoW. But yeah, D&D monsters will have immunities and any player who is not fairly specialized will find that some of their resources are useless against certain opponents; it's part of the game and why it focuses on the group.

[Wangming]

What realistic change do you think could be made to make weapons feel different from each other?

Secondary stat bonuses? Passives for each weapon type? Talents? If it were up to me you could straight up swap yoir entire Mastery passive dependent on what weapon you're weilding.

How I would handle it though:

Each class gets a passive effect for each of their primary weapon types. (Warriors don't need passives for Bows, for example) These are small effects that activate whenever you cast any GCD spell. Different effect depending on whether the spell targets an ally or an enemy.

Example, Paladins:
Polearm (Enemy) Heals you.
Polearm (Ally) Inflicts Holy Damage against the target's attackers.
Sword (Enemy) - Bleed.
Sword (Ally) - Heal-over-time.
Mace (Enemy) Gives you an absorb shield.
Mace (Ally) Gives the target an absorb shield.
Axe (Enemy) Ignores % of armor.
Axe (Ally) Increases the damage of the target's next attack.
Shield: Grants you an absorb shield.
Off-Hand: Inflicts Holy damage to your attackers.

Just make it as effective as a tertiary stat, and tie it to Transmog instead of actual equipped weapon so drops aren't screwed up. ***Something***.

As the others have said, this is needlessly complicated. Plus it doesn't really make much sense either. Personally, I would be happy if heavy two-handed weapons didn't have quick blurrs as weapon attacks. Attacks don't have any weight or impact to them. They should work on that instead.

- - - Updated - - -

I honestly dont know how this could or would be translated into wow,

Haven't played Valheim yet so can't comment on that. The way FFXIV does it is veeeery limiting, but sort of gets the point across. Attack animations tend to be longer and more detailed than in WoW. But what is done during that time is very different. If you are a monk or a ninja you do a lot of rapid attacks during one attack animation. If you are a warrior with a big fuckoff axe, or a dark knight with a greatsword, you do one or two slashes where you practically slam your weapon into the enemy.

Granted this is best done in games with action combat. I mean there is few more satisfying feelings in Genshin Impact than hitting a Hilichurl with enough force from your bow that it flies off the watchtower.

[username993720]

Each weapon has different abilities, like in Guild Wars 2. A ranger in GW2 has 5 different abilities depending on whether they are wielding a greatsword, or a sword and an axe, or dual axes, or a longbow, or a shortbow, and so on.

Another idea would be that different weapon types are effective against different monsters. For example, light weapons like one handed swords would be able to hit fast monsters like wolves, who would otherwise have a high evasion rate against heavier weapons like maces or greatswords. Perhaps an enemyt is armored and is initially resistant to light weapons, requiring a heavy weapon like a two handed mace to shatter the armor before he becomes vulnerable to all other weapon types. Perhaps flying enemies fly far enough off the ground that melee users can't reach them and thus must swap to a bow or throwing weapons or magic or do something to yank them down to the ground. Etc.

This.

Guild War class abilities change based on the weapon you wield. There should be more weapon swapping. Like, a Rogue should definitely be able to wield multiple weapons at once, like Daggers, Swords, Crossbow, guns and so on...
Spellcasters should finally use their weapon in their casting animations. Such a waste of a slot.

This is an RPG game, weapons should definitely feel different from each other, like classes do.
For example, silver weapons would do more damage to Worgen, blessed weapons would do more damage to Undead or Demons, a Dragon slaying weapon would do more damage to Dragons, etc.

[Amnaught]

I'd settle for a more simplified version, if I had to come up with something.

Maces deal more damage to plate, Polearms deal more damage to chainmail, Axes more damage to unarmored enemies, etc.

Naturally this would come with an armor revamp as well, which I'd advocate even more strongly for than for weapon changes. Does the type of armor you wear actually matter in this game anymore, outside of PvP maybe?

The reason I don't like this specific option is because of what it would mean for any competitive content. You would definitively need to change weapons to the "best" one for each boss, and PVP would essentially be a game of Rock-Paper-Scissors where people get random unarguable bonuses simply for picking the right armor or weapon.

The examples I gave are more dependent on what synergizes with your own talents, instead of what sybergizes against whatever you're fighting at the moment.

- - - Updated - - -

it might make *sense* (to a certain type of person, ignoring for the moment the "sense" in what does or doesn't kill a magically animated skeleton) but it's not *fair* to the game play experience of the person on a class that only shoots arrows and can't use morningstars.

in a game like DnD what makes sense is more important than what's fair, because the former reinforces the shared fantasy and the latter can be determined on the fly.
in an MMO where at a minimum you should be aiming for "any character can accomplish the same thing, they just may do it in different ways" in terms of balance across all your playable characters, what's fair is more important than what makes sense, because there is no shared narrative and the rules are rigidly enforced by a system that is beyond your control.

But again, this is glancing over the fact that differentiating weapon types doesn't need to be dependent on what type of enemy you're facing.

[Thraenduil]

I'm just really happy that there is people other then me who think item system in WoW needs to be upgraded.

Who cares about blue rare gear when most of dungeon- and raid- gear is epic nowadays?
Who cares about their weapon type as long as their spec can loot it?
Legion is long gone so why are specs still pidgeonholed to their artifact- weapon types?`
Why some specs have only 1-2 realistic weapons they care about and lots of unused weapon proficiences?

[Kehego]

This.

Guild War class abilities change based on the weapon you wield. There should be more weapon swapping. Like, a Rogue should definitely be able to wield multiple weapons at once, like Daggers, Swords, Crossbow, guns and so on...
Spellcasters should finally use their weapon in their casting animations. Such a waste of a slot.

This is an RPG game, weapons should definitely feel different from each other, like classes do.
For example, silver weapons would do more damage to Worgen, blessed weapons would do more damage to Undead or Demons, a Dragon slaying weapon would do more damage to Dragons, etc.

just go play that game then

[Aeluron Lightsong]

No, this seems like its not well thought out at all.