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  1. #1
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    Why is twinking still a thing in 2023?

    Blame me for not checking before trying it, but hit lvl 30 on my new retail character, figured I'd fire up a battleground for a break from questing. Turns out, twinking is still just as bad in retail as it ever was back in the day.

    But why? Didn't they make a big deal about the PvP gear grind being less of an issue in Dragonflight? So why not apply that back down to lower levels? Why can you queue in and quite literally get one shot by a single ability from someone with good gear?

    With gear and level mattering so much (why not just give everyone the same stats, plus or minus like 10% for a small amount of variability based on gear and level?), why even unlock PvP activities before 70? It's a miserable experience, even for someone going into it with some knowledge of how the modes work and how PvP works. I can't imagine how fucking awful it is for someone that doesn't have prior experience with it.

    At least I know now to just pretend PvP doesn't exist until I get up to 70. But it just seems damned wasteful to have a whole ass section of the game effectively walled off like that...

  2. #2
    Basically because people pay the same sub fee as you and therefore can do whatever the fuck they want in the game?

  3. #3
    1. People like to stomp folks...They know it Blizzard knows it low level BGs are a mess but leveling is so quick that it almost doesn't matter
    2. They tried separating people who turn off XP from the general population, turns out they don't like fighting other twinks so they eased it years ago a lot of them have an unspoken agreement not to grief yall TOO hard
    3. Sorry?

  4. #4
    They gave up with a "good enough". They couldn't find an optimal, workable solution to keep twinks from ruining other people's lives, because a lot of the reason people make twinks is precisely in order to ruin other people's lives.

    But it's such a small, such a niche part of the game that they just went fuck it, let them. The randos will move out of those brackets so quickly it won't be a recurring problem, and almost nobody will actually quit the game over this. So no real reason to invest big time and money into coming up with a solution for a problem that barely affects anyone.

    Yeah it sucks for the people it DOES affect, and I feel your pain... but there's practical things to consider in massive worlds like this, and you can't fix everything.

  5. #5
    Probably because it's a fun thing to do.

    Some people aspire to do something perfect, even if it isn't that meaningful(it could be for them though), it's a form of a hobby.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sentynel View Post
    Basically because people pay the same sub fee as you and therefore can do whatever the fuck they want in the game?
    Sure, so do RMT botters. "They pay the same sub" isn't a very good argument.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterymask View Post
    1. People like to stomp folks...They know it Blizzard knows it low level BGs are a mess but leveling is so quick that it almost doesn't matter
    2. They tried separating people who turn off XP from the general population, turns out they don't like fighting other twinks so they eased it years ago a lot of them have an unspoken agreement not to grief yall TOO hard
    3. Sorry?
    I feel like #2 is proof that they should've just done away with it, then. Treat it the same as they do at level cap - gear has an influence on stats but it's not an advantage to the extent that a twink can literally one-shot players in questing gear. A lot of the justifications for twinking in the old days was that they wanted "to have good games," but if they were still claiming that and then complained that they didn't have fun fighting other people on an even level... kind of shows they were lying through their teeth huh?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    Yeah it sucks for the people it DOES affect, and I feel your pain... but there's practical things to consider in massive worlds like this, and you can't fix everything.
    That's the thing though, it's a pretty horrible introduction to PvP for people who haven't played WoW before or haven't played for over a decade. They've made so many efforts throughout the game to make leveling "play what you want", with how all areas scale to your level, Chromie Time to play "old" content, etc. Leaving PvP untouched seems like a huge oversight to me.

    More than that, the process of leveling is supposed to introduce and reinforce basic concepts of your class so that you don't arrive at the level cap completely ignorant of how it works. Similarly, while dungeons are not remotely challenging, you still get used to the idea of aggro, of healing, how to use your buttons, etc.

    PvP *should* operate on the same principles. But you can't learn anything if you're fighting vs a twink or a twink attacks you because they'll have too much stats advantage for it to be remotely similar to a fair fight. So people will end up at 70 with no fucking clue what they're doing in PvP, which means they'll join BGs or whatever to try and learn and basically be complete dead weight to that team.

    That just seems like really, *really* bad design.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    That just seems like really, *really* bad design.
    In the time it took you to write this unreadable novel, you could've gone from level 30 to level 60 and not had to worry about it anymore

  8. #8
    correct me if im wrong but arent twink queues a thing? like you only face ppl with XP turned on. Beside im pretty sure heirlooms made twinking less relevant. i think youre just getting beat cuz everyone is 9 levels higher than you with better gear even if you are scaled to 39

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by LedZeppelin View Post
    correct me if im wrong but arent twink queues a thing? like you only face ppl with XP turned on. Beside im pretty sure heirlooms made twinking less relevant. i think youre just getting beat cuz everyone is 9 levels higher than you with better gear even if you are scaled to 39
    they reverted that change around Legion because well no one used it because twinks didn't actually like fighting other twinks they liked being the kid with a magnifying glass on an anthill

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nzx View Post
    In the time it took you to write this unreadable novel, you could've gone from level 30 to level 60 and not had to worry about it anymore
    Do you feel better now?

  11. #11
    Is it really twinking or just someone going into a bg at lvl 38 or 39 as one of the specs that happens to be poorly balanced at lower levels one shotting someone who might be poorly geared as a level 30? I'm guessing its actually the latter. You should know though that going in at the first few levels of a bracket means you will prob be taking some ass whoopings.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Sure, so do RMT botters. "They pay the same sub" isn't a very good argument.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I feel like #2 is proof that they should've just done away with it, then. Treat it the same as they do at level cap - gear has an influence on stats but it's not an advantage to the extent that a twink can literally one-shot players in questing gear. A lot of the justifications for twinking in the old days was that they wanted "to have good games," but if they were still claiming that and then complained that they didn't have fun fighting other people on an even level... kind of shows they were lying through their teeth huh?

    - - - Updated - - -



    That's the thing though, it's a pretty horrible introduction to PvP for people who haven't played WoW before or haven't played for over a decade. They've made so many efforts throughout the game to make leveling "play what you want", with how all areas scale to your level, Chromie Time to play "old" content, etc. Leaving PvP untouched seems like a huge oversight to me.

    More than that, the process of leveling is supposed to introduce and reinforce basic concepts of your class so that you don't arrive at the level cap completely ignorant of how it works. Similarly, while dungeons are not remotely challenging, you still get used to the idea of aggro, of healing, how to use your buttons, etc.

    PvP *should* operate on the same principles. But you can't learn anything if you're fighting vs a twink or a twink attacks you because they'll have too much stats advantage for it to be remotely similar to a fair fight. So people will end up at 70 with no fucking clue what they're doing in PvP, which means they'll join BGs or whatever to try and learn and basically be complete dead weight to that team.

    That just seems like really, *really* bad design.
    It's leveling and you stand to benefit as much as suffer. Just learn that all things pass. Your self worth isn't reliant on wins and losses in pvp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Except it would only be "textbook" confirmation bias if I fully believed that a third spec was actually coming.

  13. #13
    No one is stopping you from twinking too.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Blame me for not checking before trying it, but hit lvl 30 on my new retail character, figured I'd fire up a battleground for a break from questing. Turns out, twinking is still just as bad in retail as it ever was back in the day.

    But why? Didn't they make a big deal about the PvP gear grind being less of an issue in Dragonflight? So why not apply that back down to lower levels? Why can you queue in and quite literally get one shot by a single ability from someone with good gear?

    With gear and level mattering so much (why not just give everyone the same stats, plus or minus like 10% for a small amount of variability based on gear and level?), why even unlock PvP activities before 70? It's a miserable experience, even for someone going into it with some knowledge of how the modes work and how PvP works. I can't imagine how fucking awful it is for someone that doesn't have prior experience with it.

    At least I know now to just pretend PvP doesn't exist until I get up to 70. But it just seems damned wasteful to have a whole ass section of the game effectively walled off like that...
    They dont care about leveling it takes legit 5-6 hours to hit lvl 60, and then another 4-5 hours to hit cap.

    they assume that everyone who stays at lvl 30 (like you did), turned off their exp, and is grinding the wod/legion raids for gear they can equip at lvl 30 to stomp,

    there is legit a reddit page/forum and countless guides for grinding gear at those levels with Mains groups, to stomp in BGS

    i think the top lvl 30 twink just hit 2.5m Honorable kills as well.
    Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler

    If you are trying to AE tank and a bad dps is attacking the wrong target and dies, we call that justice.

  15. #15
    As evidenced by the near total extinction of twinking when Blizzard made twink only queues (despite their feverish claims that "it's not about stomping lowbies, it's about fighting other twinks"), it's very clear that twinking only exists to stroke the ego of people with a desperate need for accomplishment in their otherwise bland and unfulfilling lives.

    Twinks are sad, pathetic beings, and they're not going to stop as killing defenseless people in an online game is the only thing they ever managed to succeed at

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by ONCHEhap View Post
    As evidenced by the near total extinction of twinking when Blizzard made twink only queues (despite their feverish claims that "it's not about stomping lowbies, it's about fighting other twinks"), it's very clear that twinking only exists to stroke the ego of people with a desperate need for accomplishment in their otherwise bland and unfulfilling lives.

    Twinks are sad, pathetic beings, and they're not going to stop as killing defenseless people in an online game is the only thing they ever managed to succeed at
    Show us on the doll where the bad twink hurt you.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Sure, so do RMT botters. "They pay the same sub" isn't a very good argument.
    RMT botting is against TOS, twinking isn't.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Grinning Serpent View Post
    Do you feel better now?
    I mean... Do you? What are you expecting to get out of this thread? This is not an issue, Blizzard aren't going to pay attention to it, no one else in the thread cares - so I can only assume you wanted to vent here about getting battered by someone who's better than you and you were hoping that you'd get some of the other members of the he-man-wow-haters club to pump you up. I offered you a solution to your problem, one that a lot of people could do with applying in many different fields of life, and you chose to take it poorly.

  19. #19
    Twinking is basically playing a fps, if anything regular battlegrounds being "balanced" are as unnatural as it gets for messing up your positioning. You're forgiven for so many derp moves in this game, you can literally sit within los of a hunter and not die

  20. #20
    because people find it fun /thread

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