Florida's attacks on the First Amendment continue with latest propsed bill

[Endus]

True but you can see the ease in doing so. Look at this thread. If you nudge people slightly across what they deem as an unassailable truth they instinctively become defensive and dismissive. Its human nature I would push for a full perspective but moral relativism is never popular.

I would push for a more neutral view of history but that is rarely even proposed sadly.

People bristled when you engaged in bullshit chicanery to deflect away from European responsibility in the slave trade, to accuse African nations of being "barbaric", a label you didn't apply to their equally-slave-oriented European clients.

That's not dealing with "unassailable truths", that's pushing a wildly ethnocentric and prejudiced view of history, yourself.

Again; this thread is about Florida. Where DeSantis' government is trying to force everything to be taught from a white supremacist point of view. Blame him, not his detractors, if you're so concerned about diverse viewpoints.

[Tentim]

People bristled when you engaged in bullshit chicanery to deflect away from European responsibility in the slave trade, to accuse African nations of being "barbaric", a label you didn't apply to their equally-slave-oriented European clients.

That's not dealing with "unassailable truths", that's pushing a wildly ethnocentric and prejudiced view of history, yourself.

Again; this thread is about Florida. Where DeSantis' government is trying to force everything to be taught from a white supremacist point of view. Blame him, not his detractors, if you're so concerned about diverse viewpoints.

Will agree to disagree mostly because if I don't this will become a debate on the slave trade and while I think that is a rich ground for discussion we won't return to the topic at hand.

As for the white supremacist angle I would have to look more into it.

[Edge-]

https://archive.is/iGoWw

When a fourth-grader in Florida was frustrated about having to sit out his afternoon recess, he penciled a word on an outdoor bench: kill. A teacher asked him about it, and he said it was what he wanted God to do to him.

His mother, Marah Marino, guessed he was hurt and angry. “He’s not a mature 10-year-old,” she said.

But soon, a sheriff’s deputy who was working in the school stepped in, using a controversial state law to order an involuntary psychiatric evaluation and confinement for up three days in a mental health facility. Marino, who rushed to the school after getting a call about the incident, was stunned, pleading with the officer and asking to be with her son.

The deputy drove away with the terrified boy, and Marino followed closely behind them in her car, watching her son stare out the back window, sobbing, his hand on the glass.

Every day in Florida, children and adolescents are involuntarily committed for psychiatric assessments under the Baker Act, a 1971 law. In fiscal year 2020-21, involuntary exams happened more than 38,000 times to children under 18 — an average of more than 100 a day and a nearly 80 percent increase in the past decade, according to the most recent data. The law is so deeply enmeshed into the state’s culture that it is widely used as a verb, as in: The 6-year-old was “Baker Acted.”

Some children have been taken away in handcuffs.

Florida’s reliance on forced psych exams is rising amid a national mental health crisis among school-aged children. The percentage of girls who reported depressive symptoms and suicidal thoughts climbed in 2021, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. There are too few clinicians for the expanding need for mental health care. And in Florida, Baker Act intakes hit a high. By contrast, the number for adults dropped, according to a report by the Baker Act Reporting Center at University of South Florida.

While the law is useful for the most serious cases, critics say, it is too often used with kids who have behavioral issues, students with disabilities and those who say something they don’t mean. Children as young as 5 or 6 have been temporarily committed, and opponents contend that some mental health facilities are profit-driven and substandard and fail to keep parents informed about their children.

Supporters say that the longtime Florida law has helped keep people from hurting themselves or others — and that it can force a family to reckon with a child’s need for professional care. When police and others involved are sufficiently trained, the process can work well “as one strategy for intervention,” says Stephen Roggenbaum, chair of the Florida Suicide Prevention Coalition.

Florida is not alone in detaining children this way. But of the six states that keep publicly available data on the practice — including California, Colorado, Connecticut, Virginia and Wisconsin — Florida is an outlier, said David Cohen, a professor at the University of California at Los Angeles who studies the issue. In 2018, the state committed children nearly 16 times more often than Wisconsin, one of the less zealous users of its provision.

“The public has no clue how much involuntary commitment and coercion are going on right now,” Cohen said.

Florida, land of the free...for the state to involuntarily commit your child to a mental facility for days without your consent.

There's absolutely validity and utility to his law in extreme circumstances, but it sure seems like authorities in Florida - both school administrative staff and law enforcement, are abusing it

[Benggaul]

I don't really post much anymore ever since my year off, but I really think it's been too long since anyone has just come out and said it:

Fuck Florida.

[Cthulhu 2020]

No but I think not teaching 90% of the history of the slave trade isn't productive either. I never feel comfortable around those wanting to censor the parts of history they are either uncomfortable or embarrassed about.

What's the point of pointing out that there were black slave traders in Africa? Is it a reason to ban the history of african americans IN America and how they've been heavily discriminated against for the entirety of america's history? Is it a reason to not teach the history of America?

There's zero reason that black African slave traders are relevant to US history, other than they existed across an ocean. It's just some conservative talking point to try and distract from the fact that the US has historically treated African Americans terribly, and a distraction from how white America continues to treat African Americans horribly.

But that's all you're good at, isn't it? Distractions and performative political theater.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

No but I think not teaching 90% of the history of the slave trade isn't productive either. I never feel comfortable around those wanting to censor the parts of history they are either uncomfortable or embarrassed about.

Alright, who had "the blacks did it to themselves" on today's Racist Bingo board?

[unfilteredJW]

Alright, who had "the blacks did it to themselves" on today's Racist Bingo board?

Was only a matter of time before said poster went racist again.

[Poopymonster]

Alright, who had "the blacks did it to themselves" on today's Racist Bingo board?

I had "Jews backed the blacks who did it to themselves" on mine.

[jonnysensible]

gonna keep pointing out tentim is from latvia and has never met a black person

[Xyonai]

gonna keep pointing out tentim is from latvia and has never met a black person

His last forum vacation also involved him being smug about the suicide statistics of a certain demographic. Don't give him the time of day lmao.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

gonna keep pointing out tentim is from latvia and has never met a black person

Can we make Latvian Potato jokes at him?

[Edge-]

https://www.indy100.com/politics/flo...w-ron-desantis

So Florida sent undercover investigators to a drag show, "A Drag Queen Christmas", remember the one that Republicans said WAS SO LEWD AND OFFENSIVE AND THE LOCATION MUS LOSE ITS LIQUOR LICENSE?!

Well let's see what the undercover investigators apparently thought -

It reads: “Besides some of the outfits being provocative (bikinis and short shorts), agents did not witness any lewd acts such as exposure of genital organs. The performers did not have physical contact while performing to the rhythm of the music with any patrons.”

So no illegality or lewdness was uncovered by the agents, then, who the outlet also state took pictures of three minors in attendance at the show.

Well damn...are Ron DeSantis and these other Republicans just making this shit up?

Sure sounds like it!

[RampageBW1]

Oh noes, bikini tops and short skirts! Kids probably see far worse outfits at a beach, and no one is (probably) threatening to close those down!

[Breccia]

Well let's see what the undercover investigators apparently thought -

There are 49 Hooters locations in Florida, second only to Texas and almost as much as the next 3 highest states combined.

There are as many Hooters in Fort Lauderdale, or Orlando, or Tampa, as Ohio.

Just, you know, throwing it out there that provocative clothing and no-contact service is going to be difficult to make illegal without some consequences. You'll have to get your moderate quality wings elsewhere.

[Edge-]

Like... on their own? Or in the context of the show, surrounded by others? One of those options is certainly a bit of an issue.

No surprise there was no actual issue found lol Republicans have no truth about them.

No, just grown adults going undercover to an entertainment performance to take pictures of minors. Nothing remotely sketchy about that at all!

In actually that's true. But in the bonkers alternate reality conservatives live in that's basically digital kidnapping or something.

[Captain N]

I'm starting to struggle to keep up with the pretzel twists of the right wing lol How do they not see themselves in the mirror with stuff like this...

Because they don't see themselves as the villain. The whole agents taking pictures thing will get spun into proof that these drag queens are performing in front of children without the context of it requiring a parent or guardian who OKed their presence.

[Edge-]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/pol...ools-rcna76195

Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis′ administration is moving to forbid classroom instruction on sexual orientation and gender identity in all grades, expanding the controversial law critics call “Don’t Say Gay” as the Republican governor continues a focus on cultural issues ahead of his expected presidential run.

The proposal, which would not require legislative approval, is scheduled for a vote next month before the state Board of Education and has been put forth by state Education Department, both of which are led by appointees of the governor.

The rule change would ban lessons on sexual orientation and gender identity from grades 4 to 12, unless required by existing state standards or as part of reproductive health instruction that students can choose not to take. The initial law that DeSantis championed last spring bans those lessons in kindergarten through the third grade. The change was first reported by the Orlando Sentinel.

As a reminder: It was never about "the children", it's always about slowly boiling the frog.

Why does Ron DeSantis and why do Florida Republicans hate the First Amendment so much, and why do they seemingly want to cause pointless harm to LGBTQ+ students? I mean we know it's because these adults are really just protecting their own delicate sensibilities and all, but it's a shame they have to weaponize children and promote functional abuse in the process.

What a bunch of hateful snowflakes.

[Shadowferal]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/pol...ools-rcna76195

What a bunch of hateful snowflakes.

After DeSantis tussle, Disney World will host a major summit on gay rights

----------

The magical kingdom is about to become more so.

[Edge-]

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...ud-1234701402/

Speaking of the desire to expand the "Don't say gay" bill in Florida, what's going on with its initial sponsors and the like?

Former Republican Florida state Rep. Joseph Harding, who sponsored the “Don’t Say Gay” bill, pleaded guilty Tuesday to wire fraud, money laundering, and making false statements in connection with Covid relief fraud, according to a Department of Justice press release.

Harding illegally obtained more than $150,000 in pandemic loans from the Small Business Administration (SBA) by lying on an Economic Injury Disaster Loan for one of his dormant business entities, per the department. Prosecutors stated that the former Florida lawmaker conducted three monetary transactions, each involving more than $10,000 in fraudulently obtained funds: a transfer to his joint bank account, a payment to his credit card, and a transfer into a bank account of a third-party business entity.

Oh, he's no longer serving and actually defrauded taxpayers and the US government for over $100,000. Why isn't he serving, again?

The Republican resigned from the Florida House in December, a day after his indictment was announced by federal prosecutors. A hearing is scheduled for July 25. He faces up to 35 years in prison.

Oh right the whole fraud thing.

- - - Updated - - -

https://newrepublic.com/post/171330/...-breast-cancer

A Florida House of Representatives committee on Wednesday advanced an anti-trans bill that is so broad and so extreme that it could also prevent people from getting treated for breast cancer.

The bill passed the Healthcare Regulation Committee by a vote of 12-5 and now heads to the House for a vote. The measure is one of the cruelest in the country to target transgender and LGBTQ rights and care. It bans gender-affirming care for minors and would force them to medically detransition, or stop receiving treatments such as hormone therapy. But the bill’s vague wording has larger repercussions as well.

The text defines gender clinical interventions as “procedures or therapies that alter internal or external physical traits,” including surgeries that change “primary or secondary sexual characteristics.” During the debate, Democratic Representative Christine Hunschofsky pointed out that this could prevent people from getting treatment for breast cancer, as the overly broad language could apply to mastectomies.

Bill sponsor Randy Fine—who prior to being a Republican representative was a gambling industry executive, not a doctor—was surprised to learn that young people can get breast cancer.

By the same definition, people who need prostatectomies to treat prostate cancer could also be denied treatment. The bill also bans hormone treatments, which could potentially affect care for menopause, stunted growth, and birth control.

In which, again, Republicans vague, broad language in their legislation has potentially widespread consequences because Republicans have long since given up any pretense that they're a functional political party interested in legislating and governing.

This is about the dozenth example in recent months of a proposed bill being so poorly written that its own author truly doesn't understand the consequences of their proposals.

[Shkar]

In which, again, Republicans vague, broad language in their legislation has potentially widespread consequences because Republicans have long since given up any pretense that they're a functional political party interested in legislating and governing.

This is about the dozenth example in recent months of a proposed bill being so poorly written that its own author truly doesn't understand the consequences of their proposals.

I wonder if this could stretch to include testosterone supplements. That's a huge market for the Republican base.