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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Democratic Party's entire policy tends to be "Hey, we aren't Republicans!" Like that is really anything other than the base line I expect.
    It’s an easy to thing to sell. That doesn’t mean they’ll sit on their ass.

    For example Biden’s Inflation act or Michigan rolling back the GOP’s policies.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Are you proud that you're making your nation dumber? https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2023...d-pornographic
    Is this some Fox News hit?

    Insane LIBERALS making America DUMBER >>Link Here<< (switching the parties)

    You're missing a comment on the actual subject of my post (the one you quoted and replied to), and one or two sentences establishing the relevance of this new topic. Also, posts of the type "Take this, fascist/[insert fav epithet here] *LINK*" serve only to inflame partisan differences and introduce the appearance of letting hyperlinks do your discussing on your behalf. Link-posting sans relevant personal commentary are only useful if it's a direct factual assertation, like if User41430 said "No high school principal has ever been fired in Florida on a nude statue parental advisory miscommunication!"
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Is this some Fox News hit?

    Insane LIBERALS making America DUMBER >>Link Here<< (switching the parties)

    You're missing a comment on the actual subject of my post (the one you quoted and replied to), and one or two sentences establishing the relevance of this new topic. Also, posts of the type "Take this, fascist/[insert fav epithet here] *LINK*" serve only to inflame partisan differences and introduce the appearance of letting hyperlinks do your discussing on your behalf. Link-posting sans relevant personal commentary are only useful if it's a direct factual assertation, like if User41430 said "No high school principal has ever been fired in Florida on a nude statue parental advisory miscommunication!"
    He says as if bigots like him are worth the breath.

  4. #64
    I think Disney actions spoke louder than words. Wise move. Words sometime could come back to haunt you.

    Disney did not call out De Santis. Nor did it fight the state's takeover of Reedy Creek. Primarily because it had no impact to their bottom line. No sane Florida governor will try to sabotage Disney outright. Data from Orlando Tourism Board speaks for itself.

    A 2019 study found Disney dominates the Central Florida tourism industry, according to Oxford Economics, and produced:

    • $75.2 billion annual economic impact for Central Florida (about 6% of FL GDP in 2022).
    • 463,000 jobs.
    • $5.8 billion in additional state tax revenue.


    The sales tax collected just on the 58 million Disney World tickets sold in 2018 was $409 million. That’s more than what the state will spend this year on school construction and maintenance or the entire Department of Elder Affairs budget.

    Instead of giving a speech and becoming even more of a right-wing-media talking point, Bob Iger showed his employees where Disney stands through actions.
    Last edited by Rasulis; 2023-03-25 at 11:40 PM.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    Instead of giving a speech and becoming even more of a right-wing-media talking point, Bob Iger showed his employees where Disney stands through actions.
    Oh? They still donating to Republican politicians?

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    Oh? They still donating to Republican politicians?
    Companies have donated to Republicans due to their "Corporate friendly" image. That image goes right out the fucking window though if you cross them. *Looks at Disney*

  7. #67
    The Lightbringer Pannonian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Is this some Fox News hit?

    Insane LIBERALS making America DUMBER >>Link Here<< (switching the parties)

    You're missing a comment on the actual subject of my post (the one you quoted and replied to), and one or two sentences establishing the relevance of this new topic. Also, posts of the type "Take this, fascist/[insert fav epithet here] *LINK*" serve only to inflame partisan differences and introduce the appearance of letting hyperlinks do your discussing on your behalf. Link-posting sans relevant personal commentary are only useful if it's a direct factual assertation, like if User41430 said "No high school principal has ever been fired in Florida on a nude statue parental advisory miscommunication!"
    Welcome to the real world, where your consequences have actions. This shit is what you're voting and advertising for. Exactly this shit? No, but you're carrying their water. You're supporting their culture war bullshit, so this is on you too.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Welcome to the real world, where your consequences have actions. This shit is what you're voting and advertising for. Exactly this shit? No, but you're carrying their water. You're supporting their culture war bullshit, so this is on you too.
    No, the real world works by voting to let conservatives destroy the world, then blaming everyone else for not fixing the aftermath fast enough.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Pannonian View Post
    Welcome to the real world, where your consequences have actions. This shit is what you're voting and advertising for. Exactly this shit? No, but you're carrying their water. You're supporting their culture war bullshit, so this is on you too.
    When Fox News opinion hosts frame a news story as progressivism run amuck, and blame that shit on all progressives and especially Democratic politicians and lefty culture wars, you shouldn’t use it as an instruction manual. 1. “Are you proud you’re making your nation dumber” and 2. because this thing is bullshit and you support bullshit and it’s the same bullshit and you’re therefore responsible. It’s pretty thin gruel.

    Quote Originally Posted by PosPosPos View Post
    No, the real world works by voting to let conservatives destroy the world, then blaming everyone else for not fixing the aftermath fast enough.
    The real world does know that "your side is destroying the world, and my side is left picking up the pieces" is juvenile political blather whose heyday came and passed in the late 1700s, if not earlier.
    Last edited by tehdang; 2023-03-28 at 03:48 PM.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    When Fox News opinion hosts frame a news story as progressivism run amuck, and blame that shit on all progressives and especially Democratic politicians and lefty culture wars, you shouldn’t use it as an instruction manual.
    Not unless said instruction manual is intended to instruct readers on what projection looks like.

    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    1. “Are you proud you’re making your nation dumber” and 2. because this thing is bullshit and you support bullshit and it’s the same bullshit and you’re therefore responsible. It’s pretty thin gruel.
    But it's true right? So much for personal responsibility when you are trying to tell people to not criticize your personal failings instead of fixing them.
    "My successes are my own, but my failures are due to extremist leftist liberals" - Party of Personal Responsibility

    Prediction for the future

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by PosPosPos View Post
    Not unless said instruction manual is intended to instruct readers on what projection looks like.
    "We're giving the same arguments that Fox News opinion hosts say, only when we say it, it's true" is quite the admission from you. I'll take it. Also, what purpose does it serve beyond reminding the reader that you're on the left, and thus blame the right for the country's ills, and don't agree with the right when they blame the left for the country's ills?

    But it's true right? So much for personal responsibility when you are trying to tell people to not criticize your personal failings instead of fixing them.
    It's just a logical fallacy. The user chooses to call this thing bullshit and that thing bullshit and implicitly asserts that it's the same thing, based on both of them being bullshit in his mind. I chose Fox News opinion hosts as an example, because I see them committing the same errors in logic.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  12. #72
    It's cute that it thinks it has a point.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    The real world does know that "your side is destroying the world, and my side is left picking up the pieces" is juvenile political blather whose heyday came and passed in the late 1700s, if not earlier.
    The real world looks at something like deficits and notices that deficits increase while Republicans control the spending and they start decreasing when Dems control spending. For example. I’m sure the rest of the forum can drown you in other facts until you step away from the keyboard for a day and hope we forget your pointless blather.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivanstone View Post
    The real world looks at something like deficits and notices that deficits increase while Republicans control the spending and they start decreasing when Dems control spending. For example. I’m sure the rest of the forum can drown you in other facts until you step away from the keyboard for a day and hope we forget your pointless blather.
    Thank you for providing a contrast with the other user's statement. Spending and debt is certainly a political point you can argue, if you think that's what's destroying the country. Contrast that with "Are you proud that you're making your nation dumber?" and backing that up with a transitive property of bullshit implying responsibility.

    I don't think you're using spending and deficits to prove Leon County Schools school district employment decisions are partly my responsibility. So maybe there's something Florida-related or "Florida lawmakers to discuss takeover of Disney self governing district"-related for the thread to continue on to. I already covered what I wanted to say on the poster's Fox Newsification of assigning blame.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  15. #75
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    The real world does know that "your side is destroying the world, and my side is left picking up the pieces" is juvenile political blather
    I believe the term you meant to say was "death and destruction".

    Your chosen leader said his indictment would lead to death and destruction.

    You have not yet refuted that or even mentioned it. Your silence is taken as acceptance and consent.

    You are promoting violence.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    Thank you for providing a contrast with the other user's statement. Spending and debt is certainly a political point you can argue, if you think that's what's destroying the country. Contrast that with "Are you proud that you're making your nation dumber?" and backing that up with a transitive property of bullshit implying responsibility.

    I don't think you're using spending and deficits to prove Leon County Schools school district employment decisions are partly my responsibility. So maybe there's something Florida-related or "Florida lawmakers to discuss takeover of Disney self governing district"-related for the thread to continue on to. I already covered what I wanted to say on the poster's Fox Newsification of assigning blame.
    You reliably try to defend conservative policies even when they’re insensible. You have a tiny sliver of responsibility here.

    As for DeSantis evil plan to put Disney in their place don’t be too shocked if any of the following have happened:
    1 - Disney has already bought a majority of the Reedy Creek board members. They probably told the bookbanning lady to kick rocks.
    2 - They’ve also replaced most of the Florida Dems with competent people.
    3 - They’re funding all of the legal challenges against DeSantis’s stupid laws.
    4 - They have comprising pictures of DeSantis dick deep in a GaetzGirl, a Darlington High School student and/or a goat. They’re holding them until after he announces his POTUS run.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivanstone View Post
    You reliably try to defend conservative policies even when they’re insensible. You have a tiny sliver of responsibility here.
    I still don't think you have a good argument here. The heart of the left/right policy debate is deep disagreements on what policies would work out to be best for the country. I don't see anything more penetrating in "He bears responsibility because he supports insensible conservative policies" than if you had just stated "I am politically on the left, therefore policies on the right are insensible." Politics isn't reducible to concluding you have the best prescriptions for America, and then assigning responsibility for every ill to your political enemies. If you think I'm wrong on spending policies, or Republicans are wrong on spending policies, it's entirely pointless and indeed trolling to conclude I bear responsibility for firing a Florida principal.

    This isn't some political game where you write the rules, which go a little like "I get to decide who is 50.1% wrong on each political issue, and these accumulate as points in a column, and whoever I decide is majority-wrong I then am empowered to dole out blame on any issue I choose." The country and political opinions are far too diverse for that. It also amounts to an endorsement of the Guilt by Association Fallacy: I don't have to consider the causes or history or aspects to this issue, I just have to associate the speaker with bad policies on different subjects!

    For DeSantis and Florida, I think Disney does just fine with a less cozy governing district situation, and engages in the same lobbying and advertising that it's done in the past.
    "I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by tehdang View Post
    I still don't think you have a good argument here. The heart of the left/right policy debate is deep disagreements on what policies would work out to be best for the country. I don't see anything more penetrating in "He bears responsibility because he supports insensible conservative policies" than if you had just stated "I am politically on the left, therefore policies on the right are insensible." Politics isn't reducible to concluding you have the best prescriptions for America, and then assigning responsibility for every ill to your political enemies. If you think I'm wrong on spending policies, or Republicans are wrong on spending policies, it's entirely pointless and indeed trolling to conclude I bear responsibility for firing a Florida principal.
    I used the word “tiny” for a reason. Charlie Baker isn’t directly responsible for Ron DeSantis policies but bears some responsibility because he’s still part of the GOP political apparatus that got DeSantic elected. Fox News bears more responsibility for giving DeSantis free air time. You are still part of the giant political machine that drives the GOP. Your tiny cog is replaceable and/or dispensable but nevertheless your humble actions might change the mind of someone with more ability or at least add to the chorus.

    There used to be more conservatives here. They either got banned because they were unable to hold their tongues on something easy like not sending death threats or bowed out because Trump lost.

    Furthermore, I’m not against conservative policy because it’s conservative or because I’m a left winger. It’s because conservative policy is often factually wrong. Sometimes it’s propped up by clowns.

    I respect Charlie Baker because he did the hard work of getting elected in an electorate that is mostly against his political party.

    I don’t respect Ron DeSantis because he’s a fucking clown. He pissed off the single biggest business in the state over a political stunt. Said business was also heavy donor to his party. He also couldn’t be bothered to check if his plan was even feasible before executing it.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivanstone View Post
    1 - Disney has already bought a majority of the Reedy Creek board members. They probably told the bookbanning lady to kick rocks.
    There is no need for Disney to bribe the board members. Their authority is limited to assessing taxes and fees to the landowners and lessees within the district, and issuing revenue bonds. That's why Disney did not bother fighting the board takeover by the State.

  20. #80
    This is getting funnier and funnier

    DeSantis' board says Disney stripped them of power

    Gov. Ron DeSantis’ handpicked board overseeing Disney World’s government services is gearing up for a potential legal battle over a 30-year development agreement they say effectively renders them powerless to manage the entertainment giant’s future growth in Central Florida.

    Ahead of an expected state takeover, the Walt Disney Co. quietly pushed through the pact and restrictive covenants that would tie the hands of future board members for decades, according to a legal presentation by the district’s lawyers Wednesday.

    The Central Florida Tourism Oversight District’s new Board of Supervisors voted to bring in outside legal firepower to examine the agreement, including a conservative Washington, D.C., law firm that has defended several of DeSantis’ culture war priorities.

    “We’re going to have to deal with it and correct it,” board member Brian Aungst Jr. said. “It’s a subversion of the will of the voters and the Legislature and the governor. It completely circumvents the authority of this board to govern.”

    Disney defended the agreements.

    “All agreements signed between Disney and the district were appropriate and were discussed and approved in open, noticed public forums in compliance with Florida’s Government in the Sunshine law,” an unsigned company statement read.

    DeSantis’ office could not immediately be reached for comment.

    The previous board, which was known as the Reedy Creek Improvement District and controlled by Disney, approved the agreement on Feb. 8, the day before the Florida House voted to put the governor in charge.

    Board members held a public meeting that day but spent little time discussing the document before unanimously approving it in a brief meeting.

    The agreement allows Disney to build projects at the highest density and the right to sell or assign those development rights to other district landowners without the board having any say, according to the presentation by the district’s new special legal counsel.

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