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  1. #481
    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    ESL and dyslexia does not account for the constant ellipses (...), that's what I meant by typing like a teenager.

    You did not even respond to my points about how the Darkshore storyline does not stack up with the Darrowshire storyline regarding thematic merit, as I've said just because the stories feature undead or 'bad shit happening' does not make them equivalent. The mood whiplash of BFA's storylines completely shuts down any merit it may have earned with its darker story beats, as I've written.

    I've looked at the gnoll art gallery, and even the Reforged update is more true to form than Dragonflight's take which is saying a lot.

    You whine about a lil' banter, but go on these weird attempts at psychoanalysis, if you'd like me to stop with the banter then cease with that.
    the usage of multiple ellipses: https://grammar.yourdictionary.com/p...-ellipses.html
    Many uses for it in conversation speech like this.
    Many more link you can find.

    And i did response. I said: yes some stuff does not translate 1 to 1. But some stuff does. And are we not talking about the darkness of the story? or do you want 1 vs 1 comparisons. Like say:
    - both attacked by the undead
    - both are places ghost and memory's remain
    - defenders of both that have been turned and or corrupted against their will be the enemy ( undead) forces
    - enough spirits to visit. And there are no quests yet. But it ever becomes a normal zone again. There will be. In the past there where quest for death people.

    And again, it was to point out dark stuff still happens. And they have not gone light on the darkstuff ( or cartoony )

    Gnoll: what... are you for real... if you put W3 ( not reforged) next to DF. its closer then w3 ( not RF) then WoW "vanilla". Hell even the expressions are different. Gnolls in pre WoW ( warcraft) media where more portrait as dangerous, laughing hyena's. Orginal WoW they look more like angry dogs.

    Thats not whining about a little banter. Banter is not needed in a discussion. And its only proof you are trying to derail the discussion. And not doing any psychoanalysis on you. Thats just basic seeing something and reacting to it.

    But again, back to the thread. I have proven time and time again. That WoW is still dark. Maybe not as dark as your remember or want it to be. But its still dark. And funny you side step other points of mine. Things you can not proof/argeu with :P.

  2. #482
    Quote Originally Posted by baskev View Post
    the usage of multiple ellipses: https://grammar.yourdictionary.com/p...-ellipses.html
    Many uses for it in conversation speech like this.
    Many more link you can find.

    And i did response. I said: yes some stuff does not translate 1 to 1. But some stuff does. And are we not talking about the darkness of the story? or do you want 1 vs 1 comparisons. Like say:
    - both attacked by the undead
    - both are places ghost and memory's remain
    - defenders of both that have been turned and or corrupted against their will be the enemy ( undead) forces
    - enough spirits to visit. And there are no quests yet. But it ever becomes a normal zone again. There will be. In the past there where quest for death people.

    And again, it was to point out dark stuff still happens. And they have not gone light on the darkstuff ( or cartoony )

    Gnoll: what... are you for real... if you put W3 ( not reforged) next to DF. its closer then w3 ( not RF) then WoW "vanilla". Hell even the expressions are different. Gnolls in pre WoW ( warcraft) media where more portrait as dangerous, laughing hyena's. Orginal WoW they look more like angry dogs.

    Thats not whining about a little banter. Banter is not needed in a discussion. And its only proof you are trying to derail the discussion. And not doing any psychoanalysis on you. Thats just basic seeing something and reacting to it.

    But again, back to the thread. I have proven time and time again. That WoW is still dark. Maybe not as dark as your remember or want it to be. But its still dark. And funny you side step other points of mine. Things you can not proof/argeu with :P.
    Not to the main point regarding mood whiplash. You've simply added onto a quite literal comparison, but the tonal inconsistency renders what would be dark elements moot.

    And no, your use of ellipses was overboard, but at least you toned it down.

  3. #483
    Mechagnome Seiken3's Avatar
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    Yup. Way too family friendly. Corporate wants blizzard to reach more and more audiences, that they're moving away from what kept their initial targeted audience engaged, saying "well they're addicted anyway", and we get more and more... diverse content. Don't get me wrong, it's great they want to be inclusive in their game, but they're long forgotten that a game can't be for everyone, as controversal it might sound. I kinda look at blizzard being a snake wanting to eat a large prey(playerbase). At first, it opens its jaw a little bit, taking some of the prey in, but by the sheer size of the playerbase, its unhinged its jaw so much its not able to pull it back together, and its basically paralyzed for any further progress and the playerbase is in its jaw going "is this it?" :P Okay, perhaps a bad metaphore, but I hope you see what I was going for.

    Catering to the casual player, disrupts the hardcore player. Catering to the hardcore player, disrupts the casual player. I firmly believe they can still do both, but with the elements added in dragonflight, they've almost completely REMOVED the "war" in "warcraft".

    A prime example I like to pull out in these terms; back in BFA there was a quest where you were going to match 2 dinosaurs by setting up a picnic for them. Yes, already now it sounds too family friendly. Anyways, you're tasked to do this and that, gathering flowers, food and whatnot just to set it up. At the end, you are killing a big named mob and taking his head to be presented as a tribute or lunch or whatever that these two dinosaurs could enjoy together.(You were questing for the male dino, wanting to impress the female dino). So, ending the quest, you spawn A BASKET containing the head on the picnic cloth for them both to enjoy. It was at that time, seeing a basket to shroud a head and adding a cuteness over it all, I was able to open my eyes and see the family friendly game this game have become. I'm not saying that the game can't have cute quests like this, but holy heck, in spirit - this type of mentality was *everywhere* in terms of quests and lore.

    Shortly put: They could just call their game AdventureCraft at this point as what made warcraft WARcraft, is long lost with WC1, 2, 3, 3TfT and WoWVanilla-MoP. I was almost going to include WoW, but I feel like the overall aestetic of that expansion is just so.. bland. Apart from the time travelling, it's a great world and POTENTIAL for amazing lore, but the familyfriendlywashness made it bland. Also, there were other elements that made that xpac very little enjoyable.


    On a closing note; It's ironically how an MMO is encouraged to be as such. These days, one can do most content pretty much alone. ALONE! I'm not wizard or master of video games, but a MASSIVE MULTIPLAYER OPEN-RPG should encourage the MULTIPLAYER part. Cataclysm did promote it a great deal with guild perks and guild levels, making people want to get both tighter with their guilds, but I've read so many stories about people finding friends in-game that they met in cata, that it's baffling to me how they're catering to solo-players in the levels that they are. Sure, not every MMO must tie everything up to the multiplayer aspect, but these days, there's 10% of things needing the multiplayer aspect, and 90% allowing you to be entirely on your own(I consider matchmaking system to be solo-content as you're independent on other players to engage in said activities. Ofc LFR and the likes are multiplayer content, but it doesn't make you feel a part of a community, leaving you pretty much solo in the end.)

    So yes, WoW is too family friendly. It removed the War in Warcraft, and catered too much to the casual player. While I get it; more players means more money, you will soon experience an exodus of players because you spread the butter too thin. It may be a hard pill to swallow, but it's actually fine to say; "This game is not for everyone". Blizzard is living in denial and want to cater to everyone(Ironically, while failing to listen to the community)

  4. #484
    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    Not to the main point regarding mood whiplash. You've simply added onto a quite literal comparison, but the tonal inconsistency renders what would be dark elements moot.

    And no, your use of ellipses was overboard, but at least you toned it down.
    The main point of the thread is: has wow gotten qoute to qoute family friendly.

    Your point is it was no longer dark and gritty. I have shown dark stuff, that would not be family friendly. And its still be wtf did just happen kind of stuff.

    And the comparison still stands. You posted it about darrowshire. that it has not been dark like that. And darkshore does not compare. Darkshore was pretty bad. You even had the moral qoundry in ashenvale to kill or not. But if you want a more recent quests that deals in dark stuff like Mankrik's Wife. Dregging up the corpse of jaina's brother. Reviving it and then torture/brainwash him? Or how the priest in teldrassil held the portals open until they died? yeah nothing dark story there...being burned alive...

    oohh and i missed something about the ellipses usage. Did i ever say my ellipses usage was about my dyslexia?...sigh...

    Thought you where attacking my grammar and usage of ellipses.

    But again, i think we disagree on the all of it.
    Like the example i have given before.
    You say wow is like going from diablo 2 ( dark and gritty), to diablo 3 ( cartoon vill)
    i say ( with proof to counter you) that its going from diablo 2 to diablo 4.

    And i think many people. Have a vision of the world. Or thing like WoW ( or movie) and force their narrative of point of view on it. A women hero, then its woke.
    nothing corpses everywhere, then its weak.
    Think the perspective of many people have changed. While a group of us do no think it has. I have given my proof. and my opinion.

  5. #485
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seiken3 View Post
    Shortly put: They could just call their game AdventureCraft at this point as what made warcraft WARcraft, is long lost with WC1, 2, 3, 3TfT and WoWVanilla-MoP. I was almost going to include WoW, but I feel like the overall aestetic of that expansion is just so.. bland. Apart from the time travelling, it's a great world and POTENTIAL for amazing lore, but the familyfriendlywashness made it bland. Also, there were other elements that made that xpac very little enjoyable.

    So yes, WoW is too family friendly. It removed the War in Warcraft, and catered too much to the casual player. While I get it; more players means more money, you will soon experience an exodus of players because you spread the butter too thin. It may be a hard pill to swallow, but it's actually fine to say; "This game is not for everyone". Blizzard is living in denial and want to cater to everyone(Ironically, while failing to listen to the community)
    I think just calling it 'World of Azeroth' would fit better
    I don't play WoW anymore smh.

  6. #486
    Overall... yeah it most definetly got lighter.

    Wow always had a... light hearted side. Gnomes, Goblins etc. Even the whole radiation problem of the gnomes was riddled with jokes.
    But it also had a really serious side to it when you went deeper into the story or read the actual quest texts.

    Everything regarding undead was really dark. Human Seedling for example. Undercity was basically a big butcher.
    or the reliquiary of souls...

    DF on the other hand... always skirts around that stuff. Did Razageth really do anything until we killed her? She fought a bit with dragons while floating in the air and sounding like a menace.
    I don't think she even killed anyone personally.
    We get a few nondescript fight scenes of her forces with ours and... a dead bird. If anyone was killed i don't remeber it honestly.

    The black dragons are mostly bickering back and forth.

    Overall it does fell a good deal lighter. But is has been this way for quite some time honestly. Not really a new development. I think Wotlk was the last time wow really was dark.

    Also: Idgaf about the war in warcraft. It is just a name not a description of the game. The Current expansions title should be taken as the current tone of the game. If the next expansion is called "Death death death" then... it would be weird if it is only fun and games like DF now.

    Also also: I really like DF despite it being a bit to... not serious for me.

    Edit: I guess drakthyr story is tragic in some ways. But i cannot take anything serious they are doing... the model is just... too weird for me.

  7. #487
    Quote Originally Posted by Seiken3 View Post
    Shortly put: They could just call their game AdventureCraft at this point as what made warcraft WARcraft, is long lost with WC1, 2, 3, 3TfT and WoWVanilla-MoP.
    A fitting name.
    They should also add "for children ages 4-8."

    Quote Originally Posted by LemonDemonGirl View Post
    I think just calling it 'World of Azeroth' would fit better
    This Azeroth has been pushed too hard lately. They used to fight for the factions, or for their cities... now they fight for the whole world? Is this Starcraft? Did people in medieval times ever yell: "for Earth!"? It just sounds weird...too large scale for a mostly grounded fantasy setting. Characters should fight for territory, beliefs, disputes, not for the whole galaxy.

  8. #488
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seiken3 View Post
    A prime example I like to pull out in these terms; back in BFA there was a quest where you were going to match 2 dinosaurs by setting up a picnic for them. Yes, already now it sounds too family friendly. Anyways, you're tasked to do this and that, gathering flowers, food and whatnot just to set it up. At the end, you are killing a big named mob and taking his head to be presented as a tribute or lunch or whatever that these two dinosaurs could enjoy together.(You were questing for the male dino, wanting to impress the female dino). So, ending the quest, you spawn A BASKET containing the head on the picnic cloth for them both to enjoy. It was at that time, seeing a basket to shroud a head and adding a cuteness over it all, I was able to open my eyes and see the family friendly game this game have become. I'm not saying that the game can't have cute quests like this, but holy heck, in spirit - this type of mentality was *everywhere* in terms of quests and lore.
    Bro really just spoke about a quest where we murder something, decapitate it, then serve its bloody severed head in a basket to dinosaurs, and decided that this was "too family friendly"
    Can't make this shit up.
    we really at the point where if every quest is not "commit mass genocide, slaughter these innocent men women and children, butcher these people, and burn these lands" that the game is too family friendly.

    I mean yeah, watching Baine smash centaur into piles of bloody pulp, tear them limb from limb with his bare hands, and decimate an entire encampment of people, after being blatantly racist for half an hour, family friendly right?
    Last edited by FelPlague; 2023-03-30 at 02:01 PM.
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  9. #489
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Bro really just spoke about a quest where we murder something, decapitate it, then serve its bloody severed head in a basket to dinosaurs, and decided that this was "too family friendly" Can't make this shit up.
    Well, you do make that sound...endearing.

  10. #490
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Well, you do make that sound...endearing.
    Yeah it really was, I miss those days of my childhood. Do you remember in pokemon when team rocket killed pikachu, cut off his head, then served it to ash in a basket? I sure do! Man those family friendly tv shows, so wacky!
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    My ideas are objectively good

  11. #491
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    This Azeroth has been pushed too hard lately. They used to fight for the factions, or for their cities... now they fight for the whole world? Is this Starcraft? Did people in medieval times ever yell: "for Earth!"? It just sounds weird...too large scale for a mostly grounded fantasy setting. Characters should fight for territory, beliefs, disputes, not for the whole galaxy.
    The problem here is that the story keeps getting bigger and the threats need to follow, else it feels kind of a letdown.
    We have killed elemental lords, dragons, old gods, and that was just Vanilla.
    BC had us magically whisked away to a broken planet somewhere in the stars killing demon lords and such.
    It went from 'bandits in Elwynn Forest' to 'potentially world-ending threats' pretty quickly, if you ask me.

    They did try toning it down a little in BFA and make it more about the faction war, and it was kind of a shitshow.
    Not that SL was any better for less of a focus on the faction war, mind you, but that's kind of the state of the writing team nowadays.
    With these threats snowballing, it would be strange if the next expansion's big bad is the grandson of Van Cleef or whatever; it would feel very small and, quite frankly, not even worth our time, being the champions of the planet who have traveled the stars and even the afterlife to preserve it and all that jazz.

    WoW suffers from the same thing that afflicts many long-running shows in that the first couple of "seasons" were plotted out, with a dedicated team passionately focused on them, then around season 4 or so, they were greenlit for more and had a timebox to do it in, and they really didn't have much framed out, so it's felt like a hastily slapped together run of season after season where you can see they had a semblance of an idea, but it never really rounded out well.
    Now that we are on season 10, WoW is in much of the same state as like Walking Dead for example, where it's jumped the shark so long ago, and the characters that were fleshed out that people cared about are gone, your one or two maguffins were still mucking about even though it flew in the face of logic and reason, and ultimately the story has gotten so weird and random with the most bland BBEGs that I don't know if it can ever recover.
    But, as long as it rakes in the money, it will soldier on.

  12. #492
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VinceVega View Post
    I think Wotlk was the last time wow really was dark.
    BFA seems to be easily as dark as wrath Mabye even dwrker.

    starting with a genocide, sylvanas gassing her own troops with chemical weapons, civilians pinned to walls by spears in front of there kids, witches turning people into pigs and butchering them, grafting animal and mutilated body parts onto the dead, blood trolls kid napping civilians for blood sacrifices, killing city sized Loa to drain there body’s of blood leaving a huge rotting corpse, a metric ton of mind control/enslavement, people forcibly being turned into faceless ones, people being raised from the dead against there will, ect.

    Really it uses like every dark bit of wrath and adds some new ones.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    This Azeroth has been pushed too hard lately. They used to fight for the factions, or for their cities... now they fight for the whole world? Is this Starcraft? Did people in medieval times ever yell: "for Earth!"? It just sounds weird...too large scale for a mostly grounded fantasy setting. Characters should fight for territory, beliefs, disputes, not for the whole galaxy.
    they have been fighting for the whole world since WC3 when the legion would have destroyed every thing I’d they won, same with c'thun in classic, the legion again in tbc, the lich king in wrath, obviously deathwing in cata, ect.

    Fighting for the world and even teaming up with enemies to do so has pretty much always been a core part of wow.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  13. #493
    Quote Originally Posted by Jujudrood View Post
    The problem here is that the story keeps getting bigger and the threats need to follow, else it feels kind of a letdown.
    We have killed elemental lords, dragons, old gods, and that was just Vanilla.
    BC had us magically whisked away to a broken planet somewhere in the stars killing demon lords and such.
    It went from 'bandits in Elwynn Forest' to 'potentially world-ending threats' pretty quickly, if you ask me.

    They did try toning it down a little in BFA and make it more about the faction war, and it was kind of a shitshow.
    Not that SL was any better for less of a focus on the faction war, mind you, but that's kind of the state of the writing team nowadays.
    With these threats snowballing, it would be strange if the next expansion's big bad is the grandson of Van Cleef or whatever; it would feel very small and, quite frankly, not even worth our time, being the champions of the planet who have traveled the stars and even the afterlife to preserve it and all that jazz.

    WoW suffers from the same thing that afflicts many long-running shows in that the first couple of "seasons" were plotted out, with a dedicated team passionately focused on them, then around season 4 or so, they were greenlit for more and had a timebox to do it in, and they really didn't have much framed out, so it's felt like a hastily slapped together run of season after season where you can see they had a semblance of an idea, but it never really rounded out well.
    Now that we are on season 10, WoW is in much of the same state as like Walking Dead for example, where it's jumped the shark so long ago, and the characters that were fleshed out that people cared about are gone, your one or two maguffins were still mucking about even though it flew in the face of logic and reason, and ultimately the story has gotten so weird and random with the most bland BBEGs that I don't know if it can ever recover.
    But, as long as it rakes in the money, it will soldier on.
    You went from going to the factory of the afterlives to fighting Dragons.

    External, otherwordly threats are not the issue. It's when demons suddenly started using spaceships instead of portals and you went on a spaceship in space to fight them is when it got weird and out of place. Or the Eternals Ones turning out to be manufactured robots instead of flesh and blood beings.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    they have been fighting for the whole world since WC3 when the legion would have destroyed every thing I’d they won, same with c'thun in classic, the legion again in tbc, the lich king in wrath, obviously deathwing in cata, ect.

    Fighting for the world and even teaming up with enemies to do so has pretty much always been a core part of wow.
    I don't remember them proclaiming: "for azeroth!"
    Fighting against an evil is all fine and dandy, but let's not turn Warcraft into Starcraft and become Warhammer 40k instead of Total War Warhammer.

  14. #494
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    You went from going to the factory of the afterlives to fighting Dragons.

    External, otherwordly threats are not the issue. It's when demons suddenly started using spaceships instead of portals and you went on a spaceship in space to fight them is when it got weird and out of place. Or the Eternals Ones turning out to be manufactured robots instead of flesh and blood beings.



    I don't remember them proclaiming: "for azeroth!"
    Fighting against an evil is all fine and dandy, but let's not turn Warcraft into Starcraft and become Warhammer 40k instead of Total War Warhammer.
    You don't remember in warcraft when they literally joined forces to fight archimonde for azeroth?
    Bro what the fuck you on about, they literally did exactly fucking that.
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  15. #495
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    You don't remember in warcraft when they literally joined forces to fight archimonde for azeroth?
    Bro what the fuck you on about, they literally did exactly fucking that.
    You don't get what i'm saying. Yes, banishing a great evil for the good of the world is what happened. Chanting "for azeroth" all the time since Legion is what bugs me. It's kinda cringy.

  16. #496
    Merely a Setback FelPlague's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    You don't get what i'm saying. Yes, banishing a great evil for the good of the world is what happened. Chanting "for azeroth" all the time since Legion is what bugs me. It's kinda cringy.
    "Since legion" what?
    bro only a COUPLE people have even said that, BFA was literally a faction war AFTER legion, what you on about?
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  17. #497
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username993720 View Post
    I don't remember them proclaiming: "for azeroth!"
    Fighting against an evil is all fine and dandy, but let's not turn Warcraft into Starcraft and become Warhammer 40k instead of Total War Warhammer.
    Do they say those exact words any where? Because WC3 was absolutely "for azeroth" as has been every thing that has followed.

    Also warhammer fantasy what total war is a game of literally has all the none chaos factions other then lizards come together to fight for the planet it self putting old feuds aside so they aren't swept away by the greater threat, Its literally the "for azeroth" your talking about.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  18. #498
    Quote Originally Posted by baskev View Post
    The main point of the thread is: has wow gotten qoute to qoute family friendly.

    Your point is it was no longer dark and gritty. I have shown dark stuff, that would not be family friendly. And its still be wtf did just happen kind of stuff.

    And the comparison still stands. You posted it about darrowshire. that it has not been dark like that. And darkshore does not compare. Darkshore was pretty bad. You even had the moral qoundry in ashenvale to kill or not. But if you want a more recent quests that deals in dark stuff like Mankrik's Wife. Dregging up the corpse of jaina's brother. Reviving it and then torture/brainwash him? Or how the priest in teldrassil held the portals open until they died? yeah nothing dark story there...being burned alive...

    oohh and i missed something about the ellipses usage. Did i ever say my ellipses usage was about my dyslexia?...sigh...

    Thought you where attacking my grammar and usage of ellipses.

    But again, i think we disagree on the all of it.
    Like the example i have given before.
    You say wow is like going from diablo 2 ( dark and gritty), to diablo 3 ( cartoon vill)
    i say ( with proof to counter you) that its going from diablo 2 to diablo 4.

    And i think many people. Have a vision of the world. Or thing like WoW ( or movie) and force their narrative of point of view on it. A women hero, then its woke.
    nothing corpses everywhere, then its weak.
    Think the perspective of many people have changed. While a group of us do no think it has. I have given my proof. and my opinion.
    You still have not acknowledged how the constant mood whiplash undermines any dark or gritty elements in Retail WoW's story which has been my main point, so I'll lay it out in a comprehensive way.

    Here's the thing, if those dark/gritty elements were actually allowed to settle in for players as they once were, then I'd agree more, but they are not. It's done plainly for momentary shock value before something jarringly upbeat is shoved in right after. Darkshore's storyline highlights this issue, it's supposed to follow up on the tragedy of Teldrassil's Burning, then it turns into upbeat schlock with Nathanos getting kicked out being handled like a superhero movie scene. His 'death' scene is even more cringeworthy.

    All you've made is a literal comparison of elements between the stories in Classic and Retail without taking into account how these elements are utilized which is poorly in Retail's case. The point of my first post in this thread was that Classic WoW had a measured amount of grit. I don't care for overly dark/edgy/gritty storytelling, but Classic WoW struck a good balance. Retail does not, as I've illustrated with the problems regarding Darkshore's plot.

    Also for the record I've never played Diablo II, but as for the art aspect: I'd say Retail's is too clean compared with old WoW, such as with the gnoll model. It may be due to low poly count that the old model had that grit, but this added to the appeal and should have been kept in-mind when replacing their models.
    Last edited by Wewlad; 2023-03-31 at 06:47 AM.

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    623
    That'd fit perfectly actually. Especially since it got a very... well, chinese touch to it (since most mobile games from china are world of war, world of battle and so on), and their investors are largely chinese.

  20. #500
    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    You still have not acknowledged how the constant mood whiplash undermines any dark or gritty elements in Retail WoW's story which has been my main point, so I'll lay it out in a comprehensive way.
    I have? blizzard has stated to do some lighter content sometimes because otherwise it would be dark and depressing all the time. Like a pallet cleanser. And i does not undermine it. It makes the next something bad happen. "new" "fresh" or not more of the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    Here's the thing, if those dark/gritty elements were actually allowed to settle in for players as they once were, then I'd agree more, but they are not. It's done plainly for momentary shock value before something jarringly upbeat is shoved in right after. Darkshore's storyline highlights this issue, it's supposed to follow up on the tragedy of Teldrassil's Burning, then it turns into upbeat schlock with Nathanos getting kicked out being handled like a superhero movie scene. His 'death' scene is even more cringeworthy.
    Your opinion. Mine is, its the same. Both are there to tell a story.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    All you've made is a literal comparison of elements between the stories in Classic and Retail without taking into account how these elements are utilized which is poorly in Retail's case. The point of my first post in this thread was that Classic WoW had a measured amount of grit. I don't care for overly dark/edgy/gritty storytelling, but Classic WoW struck a good balance. Retail does not, as I've illustrated with the problems regarding Darkshore's plot.
    You have not, all you do is say something is not so. And then we must believe you.
    Its story telling. I can say everything you say is for shock value. does not make it true though.
    Explain me why those stories you keep talking about are not for shock value ( if i use you system to meassure things). They have just told them they died. And not make the ghost linger.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wewlad View Post
    Also for the record I've never played Diablo II, but as for the art aspect: I'd say Retail's is too clean compared with old WoW, such as with the gnoll model. It may be due to low poly count that the old model had that grit, but this added to the appeal and should have been kept in-mind when replacing their models.
    Diablo was more a example for the standard comments that blizzard has gone to family friendly.

    You call it clean, we call it updated. You are comparing old vs new models. If you look at the base of stuff ( like gnolls per example). they have always been cartoony. Hell 1 of the gnoll pictures from warcraft 3 looks straight loonytunes like. So the asthetic has always been there. And yes the low poly count might have given it a grit. But it might have never been the way they wanted it to look.
    So by this you are saying that they should have changed it to your version of what the games has to be.

    Because if something looks cartoony from the start ( first version in warcraft 3/tcg)
    because of tech it looks a bit more gritty
    but once they have the tech, they make it like retial.

    That would mean in this case. There look has not changed. You just like it looking a otherway.

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