The third Evoker spec should be a ranged tank.

[Ezyah]

There won't be a third spec at least not anytime soon.

Don't get jebaited by wowhead clickbait

[Ielenia]

The boss runs up to you and hits you. Yet, your abilities remain ranged. You remain a ranged tank.

No, you don't. You're a melee tank with ranged abilities. Being ranged implies you can perform your role at range.

[Berkilak]

No, you don't. You're a melee tank with ranged abilities. Being ranged implies you can perform your role at range.

According to you.

According to the developers and the players actually playing the class that can perform all of their functions without being in melee range... they're ranged tanks. Just like a hypothetical Evoker tank could be. Irrespective of how the enemy chooses to attack them.

[Ielenia]

According to you.

According to the definition.

According to the developers and the players actually playing the class that can perform all of their functions without being in melee range... they're ranged tanks.

Which developers and players actually playing a 'ranged tank' in WoW? Other games don't count because they have different mechanics than WoW.

[HatsHatsHats]

At best, an Evoker tank would either be like the Dark Apotheosis Warlock from MoP/WoD or an Enhancement Shaman. The DA Warlock is the closest you're going to get to a ranged caster-tank, but even that is a faux-range, because it would still be fighting in melee range.

The most likely option IMO is an Enhancement Shaman style tank that can reduce the cast/charge time of their abilities via melee attacks. I say this is the most likely due to this being the missing Weryn of the Evoker class;

I like all of this, we should let shamans/warlocks/evokers all tank with new subspecs (though evokers could just get a whole extra spec since they only have two already)

We have to widen the range of classes that can tank for the health of the game and to give people stuff to do!

[draugril]

According to the definition.

According to your personal definition that you arbitrarily contorted into something you can turn into an argument.

Not according to the definition in widespread usage.

[Ielenia]

According to your personal definition that you arbitrarily contorted into something you can turn into an argument.

Not according to the definition in widespread usage.

Right. So you're saying the definition of "ranged" means "melee" in its "widespread usage"? What's next? You're going to reveal to me that the "widespread usage" of the word "tank" now means "healer"?

[Teriz]

I like all of this, we should let shamans/warlocks/evokers all tank with new subspecs (though evokers could just get a whole extra spec since they only have two already)

We have to widen the range of classes that can tank for the health of the game and to give people stuff to do!

I’ll just say that if Evokers get an Enhancement-style tank, Shaman are going to riot.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

And I'm not saying the third spec should be melee kite tanks like DHs are. I'm saying the third spec should be a genuine ranged tank, that can keep aggro from 15-25 yards out without needing to do it hunter/warlock style, so no pets.

How would a ranged tank keep the boss at range without using a pet? Are they keeping the boss back with a knockback forcefield?

You also have an immersion problem where there are half a dozen fighters stabbing the boss, but for some reason the boss is not fixated on them, but instead on some guy in the far back of the room. It doesn't make sense.

I feel like giving the bosses a way to dynamically check if tank is evoker tank and use a ranged ability if tank is evoker tank and outside of y range would solve the issues, especially for melee bosses. Bosses should still walk up to evoker for ability attacks imo

If the boss is just going to walk up to the Evoker to hit him in melee range for abilities, then it's not really a ranged tank anymore.

To tank, you always need something in melee range for the boss to be whacking. The only way that can work for a player at range is if they have a pet who is in melee range of the tank.

I was thinking this, too.

With their earth elemental powers I can easily see dracthyr tanking by essentially summoning a large, stationary earth elemental that keeps aggro on the boss, funnelling their own power into it as shared attacks (IE the dracthyr uses an ability and the elemental performs it, rather than treating it as a pet), and a core part of the gimmick is that the dracthyr is able to instantly reposition the elemental at their current location.

This is a much more sensible idea. Basically a pet tank. The pet could even be manually positioned like vehicle gameplay where you aim turrets.

[ZazuuPriest]

And I'm not saying the third spec should be melee kite tanks like DHs are. I'm saying the third spec should be a genuine ranged tank, that can keep aggro from 15-25 yards out without needing to do it hunter/warlock style, so no pets.

so you want a tank that doesnt have to address ANY tank mechanics. you want a tank that wont be able to change the position of a boss in any meaningful way quickly.

in your fantasy land how would this even work

- - - Updated - - -

The boss runs up to you and hits you. Yet, your abilities remain ranged. You remain a ranged tank.

So a Prot Paladin then?

[Ielenia]

This is a much more sensible idea. Basically a pet tank. The pet could even be manually positioned like vehicle gameplay where you aim turrets.

The one big problem with that idea, though, is... the "tank" is taking zero damage. Not only that, but the "pet tank" is also immune to many of the boss' special abilities if they hit more than one target, since pets are mechanically immune to AoE/cleave attacks.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

The one big problem with that idea, though, is... the "tank" is taking zero damage. Not only that, but the "pet tank" is also immune to many of the boss' special abilities if they hit more than one target, since pets are mechanically immune to AoE/cleave attacks.

Just because hunter and warlock pets are immune to AoE damage does not mean that a pet tank's pet has to be.

[MoFalcon]

I assume you have never tanked. How would you position the boss as a ranged tank?

This , among MANY other things. This is simply impossible in Wow.....just keep kiting the fucking boss around the area.......so stupid!

We are all a little dumber having read what you wrote and actually thinking about it, for even just a couple minutes. The World is a shittier place now that you have put your thoughts to paper...

[Ielenia]

Just because hunter and warlock pets are immune to AoE damage does not mean that a pet tank's pet has to be.

That is, as far as I know, a fundamental characteristic of all pets, not just warlock and hunter pets.

That said, even if that is ignored, we're still left with the fact that the tank is not taking any damage or debuffs from the boss, since the pet is taking everything. Sounds a bit too overpowered. Especially if the pet dies, the player would just bring it back, saving the group a battle-rez.

EDIT: also, as the poster above pointed out, positioning would be a nightmare, especially since you have to be mindful of how your pet is positioned to keep the boss' cleaves from hitting the melee, and it gets harder when the other tank cannot be hit as well. And then, the tank would also have to be mindful of encounter mechanics that affect the ranged, like void zones.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

That is, as far as I know, a fundamental characteristic of all pets, not just warlock and hunter pets.

That said, even if that is ignored, we're still left with the fact that the tank is not taking any damage or debuffs from the boss, since the pet is taking everything. Sounds a bit too overpowered. Especially if the pet dies, the player would just bring it back, saving the group a battle-rez.

The pet could die if the player or healers aren't paying attention, just like other tanks. The pet tank player may not necessarily be able to instantly bring back their pet like hunters or warlocks can.

[MoFalcon]

That is, as far as I know, a fundamental characteristic of all pets, not just warlock and hunter pets.

That said, even if that is ignored, we're still left with the fact that the tank is not taking any damage or debuffs from the boss, since the pet is taking everything. Sounds a bit too overpowered. Especially if the pet dies, the player would just bring it back, saving the group a battle-rez.

EDIT: also, as the poster above pointed out, positioning would be a nightmare, especially since you have to be mindful of how your pet is positioned to keep the boss' cleaves from hitting the melee, and it gets harder when the other tank cannot be hit as well. And then, the tank would also have to be mindful of encounter mechanics that affect the ranged, like void zones.

They could share the damage....shared health pool. Pet lives as long as the player does. Heal the player or the pet? mind meld to control it? lots of possibilities. Just NOT a "ranged" tank. Would have to be a pet.

[Ielenia]

The pet could die if the player or healers aren't paying attention, just like other tanks.

Yes, but that wasn't what was being discussed, though.

The pet tank player may not necessarily be able to instantly bring back their pet like hunters or warlocks can.

Even if the spell takes ten seconds to cast, it's still a battle-rez that is saved for the party/raid, isn't it?

- - - Updated - - -

They could share the damage....shared health pool. Pet lives as long as the player does. Heal the player or the pet? mind meld to control it? lots of possibilities. Just NOT a "ranged" tank. Would have to be a pet.

Then you'd be adding a level of complexity and difficulty that is not only immensely above other tanks-- since they'd have to 'possess' the pet to control it-- and have to worry about the positioning of not just themselves, but their pets, which in WoW are notoriously bad to micro-manage their position-- remember: pets don't strafe, so if you tell it to move away from the boss, it'll turn around and show its back to the boss-- but this idea of shared health can really fuck up the group when there's AoE damage, as the pet would take the AE damage and copy it over to the 'tank', and the 'tank' would take the AE damage and copy it over to the pet, basically causing them to take double-damage from the AE ability.

[Julmara]

yes the totaly will release a non publicy tested spec in just a month

[Teriz]

yes the totaly will release a non publicy tested spec in just a month

The general consensus is that it will be released in 10.1.7.

[MoFalcon]

Then you'd be adding a level of complexity and difficulty that is not only immensely above other tanks-- since they'd have to 'possess' the pet to control it-- and have to worry about the positioning of not just themselves, but their pets, which in WoW are notoriously bad to micro-manage their position-- remember: pets don't strafe, so if you tell it to move away from the boss, it'll turn around and show its back to the boss-- but this idea of shared health can really fuck up the group when there's AoE damage, as the pet would take the AE damage and copy it over to the 'tank', and the 'tank' would take the AE damage and copy it over to the pet, basically causing them to take double-damage from the AE ability.

Just spit balling ideas...Could be as simple as only one of them takes the damage...whichever takes it first. same with healing. heal one of the other. cant double dip damage or healing. Could just be a pet as we know it. doesn't have to be anything else. i'm sure there is a happy medium out there somewhere...