Blizzard would be wasting a huge opportunity not letting Murozond wipe out bad lore

[Mojo03]

Hmm, yes, you're definitely right. The player base will be foaming out every orifice with excitement at the prospect of content that involves going back in time to an alternate universe.



Or especially of revamping the content they loved from the ground up with overhauled graphics.

I'm not sure going back in time is what caused WOD to flop. Probably more likely the garrisons, severe content droughts, half baked content, and significantly less content than any other expac, likely had a much more significant impact on it being remembered so poorly.

I'm not sure revamping Warcraft 3 was unpopular. Probably more likely that they made numerous false promises they outright lied about and didn't deliver on, very buggy launch, drastically changed the art style, missing ladders, profiles, and forcing previous owners of the original Warcraft 3 to switch to the worse new version, and it being basically abandoned by the company shortly after launch, likely had a much more significant impact on that game failing.

Regardless, no these aren't even good examples of what I mean and it's kind of obvious you have little to no creative instincts or imagination. You're closed off and not even trying to understand my idea, so what's the point in continuing the convo.

[Ameonna]

What defines bad lore ? I think for example woltk had the worst lore ? So it would get removed ? Tbc is also a tight contender

YES YES finally someone say it!!!! I mean its so rare, i must say it!

[Itisamuh]

Do you honestly think using nonsense like time travel and alternate dimensions is the ticket to having good consistent lore?

[Shadowferal]

It's a 2.0 reboot idea that could be interesting if done right

I've my own ideas. Ideas that change the lore from the ground on up....independent factions, and an evil alignment I'm considering, different class structures, and...stuff.

[blarp]

Would be great to wipe crapdaria from the game, but the damage has been done since it already lost 40% of the playerbase.
Many of my in game colleagues never returned after that because they felt blizzard lost touch with Warcraft (which they did, up until Legion/BFA, then at end of BFA they lost touch again).

- - - Updated - - -

Hmm, yes, you're definitely right. The player base will be foaming out every orifice with excitement at the prospect of content that involves going back in time to an alternate universe.



Or especially of revamping the content they loved from the ground up with overhauled graphics.

Warlords of Draenor was a travesty in storytelling, gameplay and underdelivered promises.

WC3: Reforged looked like a project made by interns, when what people were expecting was Diablo 2: Resurrected level of quality and "overhaul".

[Ameonna]

I've my own ideas. Ideas that change the lore from the ground on up....independent factions, and an evil alignment I'm considering, different class structures, and...stuff.

Your claims and talk about how you made a wow 2.0 story and stuff are very interesting and all, but now how do you place these "awesomes" idease into the context of a game made by a billion dollars owning company that main goal (as it is the main goal of any companies) is to make money as fast as possible and with the least effort possible if possible? To me you are better off writting a book because at least when you write down in your book that the world exploded the reader can imagine it exploded and you dont have to bother with coding and gameplay issues every choices will bring.

All in all, i think peoples that claims for any wow 2.0 and write down some rewritting of the story for a game like wow are pretty much disconnected from reality.

Would be great to wipe crapdaria from the game, but the damage has been done since it already lost 40% of the playerbase.

Give me a source for your claims please because. Because you sound like claiming things without having any actual sources to supports them.

Many of my in game colleagues

Nevermind so thats your source, your friend list....

[Shadowferal]

All in all, i think peoples that claims for any wow 2.0 and write down some rewritting of the story for a game like wow are pretty much disconnected from reality.

And yet here you are in this particular forum.

[Sinured]

I have the best idea since ideas were thought off.
It is the best: Next XPack our character "wakes up" and we are still fighting against Cthun, that way you can unmake all the bs wow became.
we need Metzen back, dude did lots of coke and had clever ideas.

[Ameonna]

And yet here you are in this particular forum.

I dont really see why the fact that i am reaslistic and want to propose doable things and not complete far fetched/impossible things makes me unable to give my opinion.

What i mean is that, why would you do this? Why would you focus efforts on an illusion? We are talking about doable possibilities not ficitonal world things. Again you would be better of writting down a book.

So far all the idease i would propose would have in mind the fact that WoW is a game that is made by a company and have restrictions due to this, not taking these factors iinto account is folly and/or being delusional.

[Hobbidaggy]

I mean, this forum (or any) is far from monolithic. Just look in the Diablo section where the two big threads are LITERALLY "Diablo 4 is bad" and "Diablo 4 is great".

This

There needs to come a point in time where people who think “the game is bad” need to stop playing and move on. Come back at a later expansion but don’t stay playing and keep complaining.

Saying “I want the game to be completely rewritten using timeline magics” is just stupid because you are essentially saying I want the same characters but I want a completely different story using them….just go and find a new game or something to enjoy instead

[Shadowferal]

What i mean is that, why would you do this? Why would you focus efforts on an illusion?

Because that's all there's left.

We are talking about doable possibilities not ficitonal world things.

Fiction is indeed the game itself.

Again you would be better of writting down a book.

It's certainly a consideration. Rewrite it all, change every word reflective of anything WoW related and pass the manuscript to an agent.

So far all the idease i would propose would have in mind the fact that WoW is a game that is made by a company and have restrictions due to this, not taking these factors iinto account is folly and/or being delusional.

"the moral of this story is always remember the bottom line." ...if it worked well with Disney...NElf needs to forget their "Holocaust" and sing "let it go..."

Your ideas seem antithetical to the older game...so...you're more aligned with the current state of the game.

[Ameonna]

This

There needs to come a point in time where people who think “the game is bad” need to stop playing and move on. Come back at a later expansion but don’t stay playing and keep complaining.

Saying “I want the game to be completely rewritten using timeline magics” is just stupid because you are essentially saying I want the same characters but I want a completely different story using them….just go and find a new game or something to enjoy instead

Yes, actually, the relationship people have with WoW is pretty much the same one they would have with an ex, they leave the game saying they will never come back to it, but they always check up on it only to confort themselves in the fact they did the right choice of leaving it...at some point people should move on if they dont like whats done anymore.

Because that's all there's left.

Come on, dont make me cry dude >< so depressing! Maybe its time for you to find another universe or i dont know, this feels very destructive point of view.

Fiction is indeed the game itself.

In a way it is no longer a fiction, because it stopped being limited solly by the bonderies of the mind...actually, it never went only limited by this since it always was shaped and meant to be different than what the devs wanted, the fact is, warcraft 1 was not even meant to exist in the first place, the main reason why warcraft exist is because Blizzard did not get the copyrights to makes a warhammer game, and now i am making you understand that the very essence of warcraft universe exist because of a matter of money, laws and pretty much none fictional reasons, the moment these things are a factor then you cant ignore them.

It's certainly a consideration. Rewrite it all, change every word reflective of anything WoW related and pass the manuscript to an agent.

I dont think thats legal...

Your ideas seem antithetical to the older game...so...you're more aligned with the current state of the game.

Its not about being antithetical or not, it is about being able to give idease that are possible to do in a world when the game is what it is, which is an MMO that is 20y old now, made for money. The only way lore can be fixed and simply when wow will be dead and/or be public domain licence which will allow people to do whatever they wish with it.

Again, i dont like running after chimeras, and dream selling is not good either, what you are doing is just this, you sell dreams to peoples and what does it bring? More frustration.

[blarp]

Give me a source for your claims please because. Because you sound like claiming things without having any actual sources to supports them.
Nevermind so thats your source, your friend list....

Source is official blizzard reported numbers, which was reported on this website back when they were still doing it.

My friends list was an annecdotal example (that many other people shared during that expansion), of OG Warcraft players who had also played the RTSes, and who felt like Blizzard had lost touch by that time with the core Warcraft theme, and were diverging on pointless threads, themes and memes.

It is no secret that the expansion's new zone had the weakest lore ever written, its only redeeming features being the purge of Dalaran, SOO with Garrosh's arc and the Klaxxi.

[Ameonna]

Source is official blizzard reported numbers, which was reported on this website back when they were still doing it.

My friends list was an annecdotal example (that many other people shared during that expansion), of OG Warcraft players who had also played the RTSes, and who felt like Blizzard had lost touch by that time with the core Warcraft theme, and were diverging on pointless threads, themes and memes.

It is no secret that the expansion's new zone had the weakest lore ever written, its only redeeming features being the purge of Dalaran, SOO with Garrosh's arc and the Klaxxi.

Too bad that this source is.....10y old? lmao

And IF you think that the lose of subs that happenned at the start of Cata have anything to do with the lore, then think again because wolk lore was an insult.

I really think that peoples should get educated on war3, you say that you and them played the RTS then i have no idea how you could have liked wolk considering this expacs disrected war3 like 5000 times...

As for MoP, you should know that nowadays this expac is regarding a "players mistakes" to have rejected it because of its look. Claiming that Blizzard lost its touche with warcraft because of MoP is clearly not knowing what warcraft is...

[Shadowferal]

I dont think thats legal...

It's legal.
And it's as easy as changing "Tauren" to "Minotaur." (That wouldn't be the word so used, but a descriptor, but I'm sure you get the idea.)

[Ameonna]

It's legal.
And it's as easy as changing "Tauren" to "Minotaur." (That wouldn't be the word so used, but a descriptor, but I'm sure you get the idea.)

No thats not how it work, the minotaur creature is a mythical creature, you have no one that will sue you because you took the concept for yourself, now about taking the whole warcraft universe with exactly the same races, unless you change all the names of the races and entities in your universe, you will have issues wiht the law.

And by the way, if you do copy past warcraft in a similar yet with different names setting, you think people will have a good view of you? I dont think so.

[Nerovar]

I guess i will close up that "bad lore" controversy thing : Writters dont think there is any bad lore. Yes, writters, the old and new ones, never will admit or see the lore made as "bad" one, they see it as "this happenned" any lore, good or bad for them just "happenned" and they dont judge it as good or bad.

So claiming "its bad lore its bad lore writter do bad lore" its like not understanding how writters feels about it.

I don't really care about how the current writing team feels about the work they put out.

I'm saying that if there was a market for people who prefer the Warcraft setting as it used to be without the goofy modern additions then Classic+ would have been the obvious starting point for that (and they obviously didn't do that). Whether that would actually be an improvement with the company being as it is today is another point of contention.

[Ameonna]

I don't really care about how the current writing team feels about the work they put out.

I'm saying that if there was a market for people who prefer the Warcraft setting as it used to be without the goofy modern additions then Classic+ would have been the obvious starting point for that (and they obviously didn't do that). Whether that would actually be an improvement with the company being as it is today is another point of contention.

Well, classic+ was never the point of classic in the frist place, as if you remember, what people wanted with classic was the "no changes" pollicity, and Blizzard did mostly that, as it is the pollicity that cost them the least money to make sicne they just have to put the old version and put no changes.

Now, about the "goofy" addition, i dont really know what you referring to, can you elaborate?

[Nerovar]

Well, classic+ was never the point of classic in the frist place, as if you remember, what people wanted with classic was the "no changes" pollicity, and Blizzard did mostly that, as it is the pollicity that cost them the least money to make sicne they just have to put the old version and put no changes.

I didn't say that Classic+ was the point of Classic. I'm saying that there are players who prefer the old setting and due to the fact that Classic always had a built-in expiration date, it would have been possible to cater to these people by making a Classic+ version of the game with conserative additions that fit the vibe of the old setting while avoiding large-scale retcons (TBC's Eredar), thematic frictions ("World of Spacecrafts", as Chris Metzen put it), plain stupid lore decisions (Blood Elves on the side of the Horde) and killing off every major NPC that ever existed in the setting.

Now, about the "goofy" addition, i dont really know what you referring to, can you elaborate?

Let's just say I prefer the version of Stormwind that doesn't look like a zoo (imagine the smell).

[Ameonna]

I didn't say that Classic+ was the point of Classic. I'm saying that there are players who prefer the old setting and due to the fact that Classic always had a built-in expiration date, it would have been possible to cater to these people by making a Classic+ version of the game with conserative additions that fit the vibe of the old setting while avoiding large-scale retcons (TBC's Eredar), thematic frictions ("World of Spacecrafts", as Chris Metzen put it), plain stupid lore decisions (Blood Elves on the side of the Horde) and killing off every major NPC that ever existed in the setting.

And you really believe that they would be going to do this? Like, you did beleive it to be a thing at some point? Like you think it would be in term of money gain a thing they would have done? You cant just beleive that...

Also the draenai retcon (if you mean the retcon that linked the eredars and the draenai) was actually a good retcon i dont see why you dont like it, would like you to elaborate.

Let's just say I prefer the version of Stormwind that doesn't look like a zoo (imagine the smell).

I am bit confused there, i dont get in what way draenai are goofies or worgen. Besides, when you said goofy additions at first i thought you meant the dumb quest lines that have no points other than being funny like Uldum quest line.....but then i would have told you that the whole un'goro storyline is just a succession of goofy reference to mario and luigi and also zelda...