Voting matters; except for when it doesn't?

[Fugus]

@Cthulhu 2020

Still waiting for you to answer the last two questions I gave, so i will repeat them.

1) Debbie Shutlz, she was hated and seen as corrupt by a good portion of Clinton's base, correct?
I don't care about if you think it is earned or not or your feelings, just if her base saw Shultz as corrupt.

2) When Mrs. Shutlz was forced to step down from the DNC, did Clinton admit her into her campaign?
Again, I don't care about your feelings on if you think she did or did not deserve it. Did Clinton do this?

[Malkiah]

Sounds like you live in a gerrymandered state where they put all the dems in your district so republicans win everywhere else.

no, colorado is just interestingly weird in that 3 of the 4 major urban centers comprise about 85% of the people living in the state, and those 4 urban centers are hugely and overwhelmingly democratic leaning.
most other counties (though not all) in the state are rural bumfuck jesus freak territory - these are the people who elected lauren boebert ffs.

it's really not about gerrymandering, in fact i do believe CO has recently redrawn things a bit to be *more fair* to republicans.
it's just about demographics and population density.

[Endus]

And, as has been stated by several people, that isn't always the case. Things change. Everyone else could also decide their vote doesn't matter, and absolutely change the result of a vote to something they'll not like. Representatives can, and do, change. Some are not as inherently more electable than others (whether because they didn't spend enough money, or other matters). Remember Stacey Abrams, and how people thought she was an easy win? Yeah, didn't happen, did it? In the end, your vote always matters.

This thread is just a very small amount of secretly embarrassed people trying to justify their past choices. Something some of them will seemingly do for the rest of their lives.

The root cause of why that attitude is so wrong is that it's so focused on what one single vote can accomplish.

But elections aren't ever decided by one single vote. They're decided by the combination of everyone's votes. Your vote might not change the outcome, but that doesn't mean it didn't matter. People conflate those two, and it's a false framing, every time.

[Cthulhu 2020]

The "Killary" list that they used during Bill Clinton's presidency got retconned to be about her in 2016. It was very frustrating to see what I thought were rational people fall for that bullshit AGAIN.

It's both sad and hilarious watching people trying to justify their hatred against her. I love how the biggest issue thus far aired out in this thread is Shultz, someone who actively supported Clinton over Bernie. There was plenty of excuses from the cosplay socialists before Shultz though, and honestly this forum is the one place where I've seen one person hang onto that one particular excuse for so long. Every other cosplay socialist elsewhere is back to whining about shaky Epstein connections.

Many women have lost the right to bodily autonomy, and many have died from it. Children are being gunned down in schools, shopping malls, churches, on the streets. The minimum wage is still 7.25. But hey, at least we got to stick it to that Killary Klinton!

[jeezusisacasual]

It's both sad and hilarious watching people trying to justify their hatred against her. I love how the biggest issue thus far aired out in this thread is Shultz, someone who actively supported Clinton over Bernie. There was plenty of excuses from the cosplay socialists before Shultz though, and honestly this forum is the one place where I've seen one person hang onto that one particular excuse for so long. Every other cosplay socialist elsewhere is back to whining about shaky Epstein connections.

Many women have lost the right to bodily autonomy, and many have died from it. Children are being gunned down in schools, shopping malls, churches, on the streets. The minimum wage is still 7.25. But hey, at least we got to stick it to that Killary Klinton!

Then they should have had the foresight to not put forth such a trash candidate. Blaming the people who refused to vote for her after years of Neoliberalism is kind of shortsighted, am i pissed that Brexit happened in my home country? Of course but i understand why that happened due to the left hand waving off people and talking down to them which in fact does not get people to vote along with you and instead get them to vote against you out of spite.

Where is the same outrage at the political establishment that allowed that wound to fester? Where is the outright hatred towards the democratic leadership? But instead you are mad at someone who only spends maybe at best 2 hours a month looking at the political outlook and blaming them which again does not win you allies. I feel for those people but from where i am standing in a far better place it sucks for you folks. Hell here in Kent i sat home during the Brexit BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO GIVE ME SOMETHING TO VOTE FOR not vote against.

[masterhorus8]

Then they should have had the foresight to not put forth such a trash candidate. Blaming the people who refused to vote for her after years of Neoliberalism is kind of shortsighted, am i pissed that Brexit happened in my home country? Of course but i understand why that happened due to the left hand waving off people and talking down to them which in fact does not get people to vote along with you and instead get them to vote against you out of spite.

Where is the same outrage at the political establishment that allowed that wound to fester? Where is the outright hatred towards the democratic leadership? But instead you are mad at someone who only spends maybe at best 2 hours a month looking at the political outlook and blaming them which again does not win you allies. I feel for those people but from where i am standing in a far better place it sucks for you folks. Hell here in Kent i sat home during the Brexit BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO GIVE ME SOMETHING TO VOTE FOR not vote against.

The outrage towards the democratic process/leadership is in the other threads about all of the other shit going down and people were told to make a thread specifically for this one. So chillax.

[Fugus]

Guessing @Cthulhu 2020 is refusing to answer questions again because he doesn't like the answer.

He is confirming that his views are full of crap in the process.

[jeezusisacasual]

The outrage towards the democratic process/leadership is in the other threads about all of the other shit going down and people were told to make a thread specifically for this one. So chillax.

That is a common thing tho blaming traditional democratic voters for Trump when in fact its either Trump or the Democrats who act as if people should be fine to eat their shit. If they want to not make the country worse then perhaps put forth a better candidate its not that hard but blaming people for that when in fact it was their leadership is terrible. How else can people force groups to change if they keep on giving them the okay by voting for them.

[Malkiah]

Guessing @Cthulhu 2020 is refusing to answer questions again because he doesn't like the answer.

He is confirming that his views are full of crap in the process.

@Endus, @Cthulhu 2020, and @UnifiedDivide have proven conclusively they don't have answers, and they don't have reasons - they have slogans, and they think those slogans entitles them to belittle others who do not rigidly abide by the letter of those slogans.
it's pathetic, it's morally and intellectually bankrupt, but they've laid their cards on the table and shown beyond any possible doubt that they have no intellectual basis for their claims or their statements, it's all vapid and empty moralistic jingoism.

honestly at this point the thread could be closed, i opened it because someone posted something so colossally stupid that i couldn't stop thinking about it and i desperately wanted somebody to make sense of it, but it turns out there isn't any sense to it and the entirety of their point of view is self indulgent masturbation.

- - - Updated - - -

And, as has been stated by several people, that isn't always the case. Things change. Everyone else could also decide their vote doesn't matter, and absolutely change the result of a vote to something they'll not like.

and everyone could jump off a cliff, so you better do so as well!
that's really what your position comes down to? some bullshit my mother told me when i was 8?

Representatives can, and do, change. Some are not as inherently more electable than others (whether because they didn't spend enough money, or other matters). Remember Stacey Abrams, and how people thought she was an easy win? Yeah, didn't happen, did it? In the end, your vote always matters.

remember diana degette and how she's won every election since 1997 with 70% of the vote?
in the end, your vote doesn't always matter.

This thread is just a very small amount of secretly embarrassed people trying to justify their past choices. Something some of them will seemingly do for the rest of their lives.

i don't know what you and endus and cthulhu have in your life that you have to be embarrassed about, other than your deplorable lack of intellectual engagement with politics, but your shame doesn't have anything to do with this thread.

- - - Updated - - -

Your vote might not change the outcome, but that doesn't mean it didn't matter.

ah more pearls of wisdom from the God Anointed voice of Reality - from his words to the rules by which physics operates, folks.
no no, don't bother asking for an explanation of how exactly that works when it's directly contradicted by observable facts - The Church of Endus is not to questioned, simply to be obeyed.

[unfilteredJW]

Guessing @Cthulhu 2020 is refusing to answer questions again because he doesn't like the answer.

He is confirming that his views are full of crap in the process.

This is head canon.

[Endus]

@Endus, @Cthulhu 2020, and @UnifiedDivide have proven conclusively they don't have answers, and they don't have reasons - they have slogans, and they think those slogans entitles them to belittle others who do not rigidly abide by the letter of those slogans.

If you're just going to openly lie, stop @ing me like this. I'm not bothering to respond because you've demonstrated you're not going to engage in good faith.

[Malkiah]

If you're just going to openly lie, stop @ing me like this. I'm not bothering to respond because you've demonstrated you're not going to engage in good faith.

"if you ask questions about a matter of doctrinal orthodoxy, you are not engaging in good faith"
wow you must be the world's best fucking teacher.

since you clearly don't want to be involved in having to justify your preconceived notions and just want to be spoon-fed your beliefs and then cudgel others into agreeing with you, stop responding to posts by people who actually care about philosophy and intellectual discourse.

ignore this thread since you don't like having to think, it'll be easier on both of us.

[masterhorus8]

"if you ask questions about a matter of doctrinal orthodoxy, you are not engaging in good faith"
wow you must be the world's best fucking teacher.

since you clearly don't want to be involved in having to justify your preconceived notions and just want to be spoon-fed your beliefs and then cudgel others into agreeing with you, stop responding to posts by people who actually care about philosophy and intellectual discourse.

ignore this thread since you don't like having to think, it'll be easier on both of us.

Then don't even bother starting a thread if all you do is not even accept other peoples' responses just because you don't agree with it. It's just trolling at that point.

[Endus]

Then don't even bother starting a thread if all you do is not even accept other peoples' responses just because you don't agree with it. It's just trolling at that point.

He's admitted he started the entire thread just as bait to get me in here so he could make fun of me some more. So yeah.

[Malkiah]

Then don't even bother starting a thread if all you do is not even accept other peoples' responses just because you don't agree with it. It's just trolling at that point.

it's not about agreeing with it or not, it's about having asked a question and gotten nothing but 8 pages of small-brain garbage in response.
the question at the heart of this thread is so simple i answered it for them just for the sake of argument to teach them what an answer looks like, and still none of them can handle the process required to do the bare minimum mental lifting necessary.

either their position is so unjustifiable there is literally no excuse for it, or they're all either stupid or the specific kind of lazy that makes them keep posting here but not bothering to think.

- - - Updated - - -

He's admitted he started the entire thread just as bait to get me in here so he could make fun of me some more. So yeah.

i started this thread because i found your claim ridiculous but interesting and i wanted to have a discussion about it to find out the details of your position, and to check my own assumptions - i thought what you posted was laughably stupid, but hey maybe i was wrong.
turns out i wasn't, it just took a sadly long time to get there since you kept doing the mental equivalent of rubbing the outside of a girl's left labia for 2 minutes and then getting mad if she didn't cum from it.

[Cthulhu 2020]

When someone said that Clinton directly spat upon the socialist wing, I was thinking something far more offense. Not this snowflake stuff that is Shultz's personal emails about her preference for Clinton. IDK man, I just had to roll my eyes at how asinine it all is. How privileged one has to be to take personal emails between two official DNC members about their support of the DNC's primary candidate as a direct insult of themselves. That's MAGA levels of snowflake right there.

That's the thing, I get it, the cosplay socialists felt insulted. Clinton didn't insult them. They just felt insulted. That's all. It's like the MAGA crowd. They can sit there and say Trump was a good businessman because they refused to look at his several decades long history of being an awful, terrible businessman. Just like the cosplay socialists can cry about Schultz's personal emails between colleagues, cry about her, and refuse to look at her track record of progressive policy. It's idiotic down to its core.

There was no insult given, only insult taken.

- - - Updated - - -

@Endus, @Cthulhu 2020, and @UnifiedDivide have proven conclusively they don't have answers,

The only thing that's been proven is you don't like the answers. You were preferring to lead us to some realization that DEMOCRATS BAD, DEMOCRATS MEAN, DEMOCRATS DESTROY AMERICA, DEMOCRATS INSULT BERNIE, when the reality is that you guys can barely call yourself socialists or social democrats. I'm in it for the greater good, to preserve rights and freedoms for the most people. You've literally got a fashie on your side in this thread now, cheering you on against us. That's how far gone you are. The cosplay socialists were crying about Hillary long before the election even happened, and you guys have only further demonstrated that you don't really care about people, you just have some weird fetish vendetta.

[Fugus]

Ah @Cthulhu 2020

You finally got enough strength to answer the questions or are you still trying to shy away from them to spare yourself?

I am actually finding it funny how you dodged answering stuff with non-answers and then the pivots and all. Shows your "tehdang" side really shining through. Want to see if I can drag you to information you don't like like Endus has before with him.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Ah @Cthulhu 2020

You finally got enough strength to answer the questions or are you still trying to shy away from them to spare yourself?

I am actually finding it funny how you dodged answering stuff with non-answers and then the pivots and all. Shows your "tehdang" side really shining through. Want to see if I can drag you to information you don't like like Endus has before with him.

I'm sorry that you felt insulted by Shultz's personal emails.

[Elegiac]

it's not about agreeing with it or not, it's about having asked a question and gotten nothing but 8 pages of small-brain garbage in response. the question at the heart of this thread is so simple i answered it for them just for the sake of argument to teach them what an answer looks like, and still none of them can handle the process required to do the bare minimum mental lifting necessary.

You do realise this is still an admission that you made the thread with absolutely no intention of seriously countenancing any viewpoint that challenges your own, yeah? It's been explained to you that the premise of your question is fundamentally flawed because voting cannot be viewed through an individualist lens, so repeatedly whinging about your district being uncontested doesn't actually support your position.

My question is this: if you feel your position is so unassailable then why are you begging for scraps of validation on MMO-C?

[jonnysensible]

My question is this: if you feel your position is so unassailable then why are you begging for scraps of validation on MMO-C?

most of the nazis got chased off this forum, now someone new needs to play the victim.