Really? This is the way to force people play this class?

[Zmagoslav]

If you feel forced to play a class based on the fact that it's the only class that got a legendary in a mid-expansion tier... then i can't help but feel sorry for you.

[Gondule]

Class exclusive legendaries aren’t new, also considering this new Legendary Proc also buffs other players who don’t have it. This is a win-win.

[Thirtyrock]

Class exclusive legendaries aren’t new, also considering this new Legendary Proc also buffs other players who don’t have it. This is a win-win.

To be fair - it’s been a long time since we’ve had only one class eligible for a legendary. The last 3 expansions everyone had access to some sort of legendary at some point during the expansion. And if you didn’t have that legendary you were crippled. Players who have gotten used to that might feel left out and that’s understandable.

Also, small groups don’t necessarily have access to an evoker and might feel they now have to recruit one or reroll to get the benefits. That never feels good.

I’m not saying these are deal breakers or reasons not to have the legendary. They’re just real considerations that we should at least be aware of. My raid has an evoker and our raid leader mentioned tonight that, if we got the recipe to drop, he’d want us to chip in to get the legendary built because it would make a difference to our progression. This is something people are considering.

[Mysterymask]

Also, small groups don’t necessarily have access to an evoker and might feel they now have to recruit one or reroll to get the benefits. That never feels good.

Kinda feel Augmentation spec might be the bigger reason than the legendary but that's just me

[Thirtyrock]

Kinda feel Augmentation spec might be the bigger reason than the legendary but that's just me

I think it’s both. Augmentation has the opportunity to really change the game. I’m cautiously optimistic.

[arkanon]

Heroic guild means you don't do Mythic at all. For example my guild is heroic only and de don't even try for Mythic because we have quite a few carries and we know they can't deal with it. Once we kill the end boss hc, we're done and take a break from raiding.
Any guild that goes to mythic after hc ends, even like 3 bosses, still counts as Mythic guild. It means they'll push in mythic until the end of the tier, since that is their objective.

You contradict yourself. You say a heroic guild means they only do heroic, but then immediately call your own guild a heroic ONLY guild. If you genuinely believed what you are saying, you would have just said "im in a heroic guild" but you didnt, you said heroic ONLY. If doing a mythic boss makes you a mythic raiding guild, im a base jumper because i jump off the bottom stair every day when i leave my house. Also means every world first mythic guild isnt actually a mythic guild, because they also do heroic.

- - - Updated - - -

Ok, sure. That's how we advertise, so that's how I say it. I don't tie my ego into it We're definitely on the higher end of the overall pool, given how many raids struggle even to get AOTC, but we're also definitely not at the top end.

Please note, I am not taking you as attacking me. I'd probably be good enough to be in a mythic progression guild (or so I tell myself), but we only raid 1 night a week and that's all I can devote, so I take what I can get. Finding a real mythic progression guild that only raids 1 night a week is pretty much impossible.

Regardless, I don't know about whether Evokers are competitive at the highest end content. I know I see them a lot in the content I do.

Yup, no personal attack on my end at all - After stepping out of mythic raiding i finished up the end of my wow playing time playing heroic and even normal with friends and family guild, and had a blast. But you are surely acutely aware of the number of guilds that shoot themselves in the foot by grossly exaggerating their raiding pedigree by overselling themselves as "semi hardcore raiding guild pushing into mythic" when in reality, they are a de-funked, semi disbanded normal/heroic guild that killed the first mythic boss on the previous tier well into the next patch.

I remember throwing an alt into some "semi hardcore mythic prog guild" in SoO - just wanted to do some "casual" mythic prog later in the tier after being done with mains and main alts - once i joined i was told the first raid would be in 3 days. They had 8 players. Even with some friends helping, they struggled........in FLEX (which at the time was insanely simple and easy)

[SausageBiscuits]

Let's face it, a dracthyr mostly is a complete mess, we got it since release. Weak heals in comparison to others, 3-button dps rotation e.t.c But it wasn't relevant since DF seemed so nice without farming, legendaries, animas, azerites, covenants. Outstanding talents and more.
BUT now, when someone realised no1 playing this uhm class, they made class exclusive Legendary? So no one with the same conditions could even have a chance in competition with it? That...idn) up to you guys to discuss

Lol no. There are TONS of people playing Evoker, they are literally everywhere in the game.

[Thirtyrock]

Yup, no personal attack on my end at all - After stepping out of mythic raiding i finished up the end of my wow playing time playing heroic and even normal with friends and family guild, and had a blast. But you are surely acutely aware of the number of guilds that shoot themselves in the foot by grossly exaggerating their raiding pedigree by overselling themselves as "semi hardcore raiding guild pushing into mythic" when in reality, they are a de-funked, semi disbanded normal/heroic guild that killed the first mythic boss on the previous tier well into the next patch.

I remember throwing an alt into some "semi hardcore mythic prog guild" in SoO - just wanted to do some "casual" mythic prog later in the tier after being done with mains and main alts - once i joined i was told the first raid would be in 3 days. They had 8 players. Even with some friends helping, they struggled........in FLEX (which at the time was insanely simple and easy)

Yeah, I can see that. We are a casual mythic progression guild. Casual because of schedule and certain other requirements, like M+ isn't mandatory, mythic because our real goal is to get into mythic and see how far we can go. Last tier we struggled for like 6 weeks on Rasz, which crippled our mythic progression. We made some decisions to extend for that entire time instead of do a few reclears, which I think would have cut the 6 weeks to 4. I hope that we go further this tier. We're 5/9 H right now with 2 total nights of raiding. I expect we'll clear Heroic in about 6 total weeks and begin progressing into Mythic at that point.

My only real goal each tier is AOTC. Anything after that is a bonus, but I enjoy raiding enough that I'll keep progressing into Mythic and that's the general feeling of the group. We keep a roster of 25 or so because of our attendance policy, which is 70% plus. We regularly have people out so we have exactly 20 OR we rotate people in for pull attempts during progression.

But, in the end, we're pretty clear when we advertise about who we are. This is my third raid tier with this group and when I joined, they didn't try to oversell. I greatly appreciated that. It took me FOREVER to find a guild that fit my playstyle/availability and this one has done that while also being full of great people.

[Garymorilix]

To be fair - it’s been a long time since we’ve had only one class eligible for a legendary. The last 3 expansions everyone had access to some sort of legendary at some point during the expansion. And if you didn’t have that legendary you were crippled. Players who have gotten used to that might feel left out and that’s understandable.

Also, small groups don’t necessarily have access to an evoker and might feel they now have to recruit one or reroll to get the benefits. That never feels good.

I’m not saying these are deal breakers or reasons not to have the legendary. They’re just real considerations that we should at least be aware of. My raid has an evoker and our raid leader mentioned tonight that, if we got the recipe to drop, he’d want us to chip in to get the legendary built because it would make a difference to our progression. This is something people are considering.

Sylvanas literally dropped a hunter-only legendary. That was 3 tiers ago (or 4 if you count SL S4 as a separate tier).

It's frequent enough for this kind of thing to not call it a 'long time'.
Especially when a single tier can be 6 to 13 months long.

[Kul]

I think you should try devastation Evoker. It is in a great state now. Also there are more than 3 buttons you have to press in order to do good dps. But you can go further than that; the utility in terms of stuns, heals etc that you could use is fantastic. So, the DPS might be low apm but why stop with what detail shows. Use rescue, blossoms etc and you’ll be both busy and have fun.

Or play a fire mage, have the highest apm, complex timings, and still be last on Details.

[Thirtyrock]

Sylvanas literally dropped a hunter-only legendary. That was 3 tiers ago (or 4 if you count SL S4 as a separate tier).

It's frequent enough for this kind of thing to not call it a 'long time'.
Especially when a single tier can be 6 to 13 months long.

You're absolutely correct! I forgot about that. I still think that the Legendaries for Everyone of the last several expansions led to an expectation that there would, in fact, be legendaries for everyone. Personally, I'm glad that's not the case.

I liked legendaries when the whole group was excited about getting one because it made a significant difference to the group's overall performance. I know there were problems with that design, as well, but it's what I, personally, preferred. I was never eligible for Shadowmourne, as a paladin tank, so we funneled all the relevant drops to our DKs, warriors, and Ret pallies. I was excited to see the boost in damage they received.

But I know players felt left out of that system. Ultimately, I think keeping legendaries rare, but making sure to rotate through all classes over time, is the way to go.

[Cynical Asshole]

I still don't care. I'll play Evoker when it's good at casual pvp like warmode, 1v1, and random bgs. As it stands right now, Evoker is dogshit at these things. Maybe the new spec will be better, I don't know.

[Feeline10]

Let's face it, a dracthyr mostly is a complete mess, we got it since release. Weak heals in comparison to others, 3-button dps rotation e.t.c But it wasn't relevant since DF seemed so nice without farming, legendaries, animas, azerites, covenants. Outstanding talents and more.
BUT now, when someone realised no1 playing this uhm class, they made class exclusive Legendary? So no one with the same conditions could even have a chance in competition with it? That...idn) up to you guys to discuss

I would imagine something as large as a legendary would have been in the works well before any of your "feedback" and "statistics" hit the wires.

[Garymorilix]

You're absolutely correct! I forgot about that. I still think that the Legendaries for Everyone of the last several expansions led to an expectation that there would, in fact, be legendaries for everyone. Personally, I'm glad that's not the case.

I liked legendaries when the whole group was excited about getting one because it made a significant difference to the group's overall performance. I know there were problems with that design, as well, but it's what I, personally, preferred. I was never eligible for Shadowmourne, as a paladin tank, so we funneled all the relevant drops to our DKs, warriors, and Ret pallies. I was excited to see the boost in damage they received.

But I know players felt left out of that system. Ultimately, I think keeping legendaries rare, but making sure to rotate through all classes over time, is the way to go.

Evokers are being "promoted" throughout this whole expansion.
Evoker specific weapon drops are now in both raids so far.

It's all good, they will be forgotten and have zero lore relevance once DF ends just like all the other hero classes they added over the years.

[Thirtyrock]

Evokers are being "promoted" throughout this whole expansion.
Evoker specific weapon drops are now in both raids so far.

It's all good, they will be forgotten and have zero lore relevance once DF ends just like all the other hero classes they added over the years.

For sure! 100% agree. I'm just saying that, for players who got used to both getting legendaries and those legendaries being essential to their play, this might feel bad. It's fine, long term, but let's not ignore that player expectations could cause some discomfort.

[Garymorilix]

For sure! 100% agree. I'm just saying that, for players who got used to both getting legendaries and those legendaries being essential to their play, this might feel bad. It's fine, long term, but let's not ignore that player expectations could cause some discomfort.

Legion legendaries and SL crafted legendaries are not in the same ball-park as a random legendary weapon drop from a raid tho.

Those were more like wearable talent points than actual legendaries.
That's why everyone had them.

[Berkilak]

Every other class has dozens of exclusive skins from artifacts.

Evokers can have one.

[Thirtyrock]

Legion legendaries and SL crafted legendaries are not in the same ball-park as a random legendary weapon drop from a raid tho.

Those were more like wearable talent points than actual legendaries.
That's why everyone had them.

I agree with you, from a technical/game design standpoint. But is that how players viewed them? If they viewed them as actual legendaries, then they might feel left out. If they viewed them as extra talents, then they might feel that their class is hampered by not having a new legendary while Evokers do.

I really do agree with you about this. I don't think this is a problem for the game - I honestly would like to see the old type of legendary come back with maybe 1 a tier or someething. Make it truly epic, and spread the love. Give a one hand agi weapon this time, a 1 hand strength weapon that can be used either for tanking or dual wield dps next, give an int staff, then an agi staff, then a one hand int healing weapon and so on and so forth.

I am just trying to engender some empathy. The OP seems to feel left out by not getting a legendary and feeling pressure to switch to Evoker, assuming they are being honest about their feelings/views (always best to take people at their word about their own intentions unless they show themselves to be dishonest - looking at a lot of posters who complain about wanting hard world content but always focus on their ilvl parity over the content they want to see). I don't think responding to the OP or similar players with insults or dismissiveness, like we've seen some in this thread do, is the ideal way to address it. If we can understand where they are coming from and respond with reasons this isn't the thing to fear that they think it is, I think that's a better strategy.

[Garymorilix]

I agree with you, from a technical/game design standpoint. But is that how players viewed them? If they viewed them as actual legendaries, then they might feel left out. If they viewed them as extra talents, then they might feel that their class is hampered by not having a new legendary while Evokers do.

I really do agree with you about this. I don't think this is a problem for the game - I honestly would like to see the old type of legendary come back with maybe 1 a tier or someething. Make it truly epic, and spread the love. Give a one hand agi weapon this time, a 1 hand strength weapon that can be used either for tanking or dual wield dps next, give an int staff, then an agi staff, then a one hand int healing weapon and so on and so forth.

I am just trying to engender some empathy. The OP seems to feel left out by not getting a legendary and feeling pressure to switch to Evoker, assuming they are being honest about their feelings/views (always best to take people at their word about their own intentions unless they show themselves to be dishonest - looking at a lot of posters who complain about wanting hard world content but always focus on their ilvl parity over the content they want to see). I don't think responding to the OP or similar players with insults or dismissiveness, like we've seen some in this thread do, is the ideal way to address it. If we can understand where they are coming from and respond with reasons this isn't the thing to fear that they think it is, I think that's a better strategy.

I think you're generating a problem where there ain't one with this "but how about X players".

This legendary is not gonna re-define the gameplay of Evokers or even do anything groundbreaking.
It's just a bit of extra stats, which while nice, is nothing major that would warrant it to be 'must have'. Especially given the fact that you cannot really farm it due to its supposed very low drop rate. It's just a bit extra fluff for playing the new class of the expac.

Not every argument is worth arguing, mate. Especially not on this forum where people tend to be 4 times as entitled to stuff than the actual active players in-game.

[Thirtyrock]

I think you're generating a problem where there ain't one with this "but how about X players".

This legendary is not gonna re-define the gameplay of Evokers or even do anything groundbreaking.
It's just a bit of extra stats, which while nice, is nothing major that would warrant it to be 'must have'. Especially given the fact that you cannot really farm it due to its supposed very low drop rate. It's just a bit extra fluff for playing the new class of the expac.

Not every argument is worth arguing, mate. Especially not on this forum where people tend to be 4 times as entitled to stuff than the actual active players in-game.

Fair enough, and I might be. We're replying to the only post I've seen complaining about it, so how big is the population that's upset over it, really?