Blizzard's Thoughts on the WoW Token in Wrath Classic, WoW Hotfixes - May 24, 2023

[vizzle]

How do you know they aren't though? If they're closing almost two million accounts a year surely that means they're doing... something, right? All those bots that you see may in fact be getting banned but if there's a process there then the botters have a financial incentive to use the accounts for as much as they while they still can. No system is going to have 100% accuracy and if you're entrusting human beings to alone make those judgments surely you can accept that even human beings can make mistakes, right? False positives would become a nightmare and if botters are aware they can appeal then Blizzard is just going to get stuck wading through hundreds and thousands of appeals only to end up right back where they started.

Bud, you've got a real talent for looking at text and not absorbing it. Read my post again so I don't have to type it again. You're kind of exhausting because I already know what kind of poster you are, but I give you the time of day out of good faith, but it's obvious you're not discussing in good faith. You ask questions that have already been answered in the exact posts that you're quoting. It's pathetic and honestly it's the last time I'll give your silly ass a shot.

[Khaza-R]

A lot of text but it sounds easy enough:

"Too much work and not enough profit for our shareholders"

You know, the same line they used for the OW2 PVE axing.

Eh, I do think they were being truthful when they said it wasn't a decision they made lightly. Because once you add something like this, there is no going back.

But I think the actual line had nothing to do with whether the token was justified or necessary in Classic.

It probably came down to something as simple as some higher up manager saying they needed to replace the losses from Classic China's revenue by adding the token.

[rNadom]

Bud, you've got a real talent for looking at text and not absorbing it. Read my post again so I don't have to type it again. You're kind of exhausting because I already know what kind of poster you are, but I give you the time of day out of good faith, but it's obvious you're not discussing in good faith. You ask questions that have already been answered in the exact posts that you're quoting. It's pathetic and honestly it's the last time I'll give your silly ass a shot.

Feels like a common characteristic on the forum.

[Statius]

I'm opposed to any kind of gold buying whatsoever. I don't really care where the gold comes from or who profits from it. All that matters to me is keeping the game world as intact and as non reliant on real world money as possible. And from that perspective this is obviously a terrible decision, as it will, undoubtedly, lead to more gold buying in general and a far greater element of RMT and pay to win in the game than we've seen thus far.

With that said, I can't say I'm terribly surprised by their decision. At least it's not difficult to see why this would come about now. Dragonflight has performed very poorly as compared to previous expansions, patch 10.1 has not brought a lot of people back and now just a few weeks after that, they introduce the token.

But I guess the silver lining is that, at least, we've made it this far without the token being introduced, so that's something. While one can only speculate as to what will come after WotLK, for me, and I suppose a lot of people, WotLK really is the end of the classic era of WoW, so even if I'd rather have done without the token, at least it'll only be available the last 15% of that era. Hell, in this day and age, one has to count their blessings.

[Relapses]

Bud, you've got a real talent for looking at text and not absorbing it. Read my post again so I don't have to type it again. You're kind of exhausting because I already know what kind of poster you are, but I give you the time of day out of good faith, but it's obvious you're not discussing in good faith. You ask questions that have already been answered in the exact posts that you're quoting. It's pathetic and honestly it's the last time I'll give your silly ass a shot.

You didn't answer that question. You just made an assumption that is completely improvable since nobody here works at Blizzard and has any fucking idea how they detect and action bot accounts. You seem to think that "bots exist therefore Blizzard must not be doing anything" is a compelling argument and I'm telling you that the fucking article this topic is discussing seems to directly contradict this notion. This isn't "arguing in bad faith," this is you literally making shit up on the spot and pretending like it's infallible.

Also, please spare me the condescending bullshit about "posters like me." If you dislike what I'm saying just put me back on your block list and move the fuck on with your life. I promise I don't care.

[threads]

lol pretty much every guild i raided with in classic would openly talk about how much gold everyone was buying. knew this would happen eventually. gold never had "value" even pre-wotlk classic. people would just swipe for everything or go to a gdkp and leech other peoples rmt gold.

[apepi1337]

Why do people keep saying cash grab? You think the world is free? Should they just give everyone free gold? Last I checked everyone is trying to make money. Don't like it then go live off the grid and fend for yourself. This term cash grab is such bs. When all you internet trolls don't like something you call it a cash grab. Use an original argument instead of regurgitating this same old rhetoric.

[Grimbolt]

What do you think a ban is? You also didn't read what they said. Bots will stilll continue to pop up even after perma ban. You are naive if you think perma bans are going to stop bots.

I am not talking about just banning bots.

I am advocating for a 1st time offense permaban for the buyers. Giving people 3 days suspension everytime is not a punishment.

They need to adopt a zero tolerance policy.

[Relapses]

I am not talking about just banning bots.

I am advocating for a 1st time offense permaban for the buyers. Giving people 3 days suspension everytime is not a punishment.

There's way too many ways to obfuscate gold buying for this to be a meaningful deterrent. For example, a guy can buy 100k on a website then the seller can tell the player to go into the game and challenge him to a duel. The gold seller can say something like, "I'll give you 100k if you beat me in a duel," in party chat then proceed to lose on purpose. Bam. 100k and plausible deniability that Blizzard can't reasonably action. This is just one of many ways they could circumvent such a rule. (Most of the time it's just the gold seller "accidentally" buying a grey item on the AH for a ridiculous amount.)

[rrayy]

I am not talking about just banning bots.

I am advocating for a 1st time offense permaban for the buyers. Giving people 3 days suspension everytime is not a punishment.

They need to adopt a zero tolerance policy.

That won't change anything. Botting will not stop with perma bans because the ones making a a problem are the ones who will continue to do it. Those 2 or 3 individual players who were doing it to make gold aren't going to make a difference. Also, have fun trying to prove they bought gold too.

[Randris]

They probably should have made that post a week or two ago and had a discussion with the community about adding the token first. Sure it would have been a total shitshow regardless but explaining their thoughts and reasoning for making such a massive decision ahead of time and letting the community know would have been better than just adding it to the game out of nowhere. Blizzard has talked about being better at communication for a long time. They dropped the ball big time here.

[rrayy]

Eh, I do think they were being truthful when they said it wasn't a decision they made lightly. Because once you add something like this, there is no going back.

But I think the actual line had nothing to do with whether the token was justified or necessary in Classic.

It probably came down to something as simple as some higher up manager saying they needed to replace the losses from Classic China's revenue by adding the token.

"Higher Up managers" don't tell the designers how to design their game. I guarantee no such order was ever made.

[vincink]

I disagree with adding WoW Tokens to the game because it still results in inflation. I get it, so, too does RMT. None of this is easy to solve, unfortunately.

[Relapses]

I disagree with adding WoW Tokens to the game because it still results in inflation. I get it, so, too does RMT. None of this is easy to solve, unfortunately.

How does the token result in inflation? It doesn't create gold, it simply trades existing gold in the economy for a service (the subscription).

[Unholyground]

When I read through that all I see is "blah blah blah the board wanted more money" there's literally no other reason to put the wow token in except for them being desperate to make more money.

[panda040]

How does the token result in inflation? It doesn't create gold, it simply trades existing gold in the economy for a service (the subscription).

And don't forget the extra 5 USD daddy blizzard gets locked in the bnet store to boot!

[Relapses]

When I read through that all I see is "blah blah blah the board wanted more money" there's literally no other reason to put the wow token in except for them being desperate to make more money.

Kinda throws your whole fascination with MS getting rid of the token in the bin when Blizzard straight up adds another one, eh?

- - - Updated - - -

And don't forget the extra 5 USD daddy blizzard gets locked in the bnet store to boot!

Okay, and? Did that have anything to do with the post you quoted?

[Kralljin]

...because you're buying a subscription with the WoW token and gold sellers are selling the gold itself.

The WoW Token however replaces the subscription of the one that is buying the token on the Auction house.

Person A purchases WoW Token on the store, they then sell the WoW Token on the Auction house and receive Gold.
Person B purchases the WoW Token on the Auction house, so they pay gold instead of purchasing a sub from Blizzard itself.

Person A effectively purchases game time for themselves (as they need an active subscription to play WoW) *and* Person B, who instead gives ingame gold to Person A.
If you buy WoW Tokens on the auction house, paying a subscription fee is pointless as far as keeping your account active / accessible is concerned.
You could also say that when you're not paying for WoW due to the WoW Token, that someone else is paying for you.

You could also in theory purchase WoW Tokens and redeem for you own game time (not sure if you can actually redeem WoW Token you bought yourself), it's just that you would lose like 7€ per month (or pay Blizzard an extra 7€ for the same service).

They're not 'competing' with gold sellers, they're making them less likely to be used.

...that's what it means to be in a competition in a market sense.

Being a competitor means that the other party is used less likely.

Scripe literally admitted that they bought gold off a RMT site instead of WoW Tokens - which is pretty much a text definition of comparing two competitors.

[panda040]

SO they basically justify it by saying

"it reduces rmt!" so, the negatives still outweigh the reduction in illcit rmt
"people who play alot wont use/need it!" outright lie, of course demand for gold will go up now that it is officially sanctioned by blizzard

I find it telling that not once to do they bring of GDKP runs, one of the main gold sinks and drives up the demand for gold greatly.

Simply put GDKPs are the fastest way to get powerful gear with the least mount of investment. It used to be you had to take a risk of account action through rmt to get the gold to do this, if you didn't farm/carry. Now anyone can start swiping with 0 risk to their account to fund GDKP runs.

The higher demand for gold is going to drive up the cost of everything in wrath, leaving players with the integrity to not buy gold in the dust. RIP

[Gorsameth]

so why they introducing token then if having token or not u still have bots problem? according to them it is to fight bots, yet they already admit it won't?
as one of ppl i quoted here said: if it is just to 'fight bots' why take 5euro/$ profit out of it in ur pocket then? why not sell it for exact price of sub (since it is for sub in first place) and still get gold from it?
It is flat out scamming, they doing that to compensate for losing the massive chineese market, and unlike wrath era where they didn't need china in first place (fun fact, wrath was released in china almost at time of pre-patch cata, and heavily censored too, wow biggest success was pure western with zero china) because i-hate-videogames bobby kodick wasn't still in charge, they need any money source now
Want to prove goodwill and actually trying to solve it? sell token for same price as 1 month sub, that simple and easy

Because by offering a legal alterative you take customers away from the illegal RMT providers. No company is going to win the fight against bots, so Blizzard 'attacks' the customer. Tempt away their customers, lowing profits and thereby resources. You don't stop fighting the bots but you work on making it less and less worth it for them to operate in the first place.