solving a complex problem

[chansmadish]

i like challenges involving limited resources in video games. one challenge ive found is that if you have an account with no skips or toys unlocked and are limited to a level 1 character as the highest you can level (on a fresh battle.net, so no mounts either) its next to impossible to get to legion's dalaran to unlock the lost mail toy.

does anyone know how to do this challenge without the help of a mage?

[zyx]

The Lost Mail quest starting from this quest? https://www.wowhead.com/quest=41411/lost-mail
Given that it has a level requirement of 10 - Yes. It would be impossible to get the toy rewards lol

[MrLachyG]

i like challenges involving limited resources in video games. one challenge ive found is that if you have an account with no skips or toys unlocked and are limited to a level 1 character as the highest you can level (on a fresh battle.net, so no mounts either) its next to impossible to get to legion's dalaran to unlock the lost mail toy.

does anyone know how to do this challenge without the help of a mage?

so you want to try and get things that you can only get at a later level at level 1? yeah, that's not gonna happen. seems like a bit of a weird challenge, since most things you need to be a certain level to use/equip. but in short, no you cannot get to legion dalaran at level 1 without the assistance of a mage

[Goat7]

you may have a problem, seek help

[WowIsDead64]

you may have a problem, seek help

No, when there is nothing to do in game, you start to invent activities for yourself. And it's perfectly ok. Even more. Devs should encourage players to do it instead of discouraging via "You can play intended way only" faulty design. I have similar problem. I wanted to collect all heirlooms, but miss last 3 ones. One from Brawlers' Guild, that is totally unavailable now and no one knows, when it will be available. One from quest, that is available once in half a year only and I missed it by just 1-2 weeks. And one is available at 70lvl only.

[Lochton]

No, when there is nothing to do in game, you start to invent activities for yourself. And it's perfectly ok. Even more. Devs should encourage players to do it instead of discouraging via "You can play intended way only" faulty design. I have similar problem. I wanted to collect all heirlooms, but miss last 3 ones. One from Brawlers' Guild, that is totally unavailable now and no one knows, when it will be available. One from quest, that is available once in half a year only and I missed it by just 1-2 weeks. And one is available at 70lvl only.

You have had so much chance with Brawler's, you'll just have to wait till the next one, which is confirmed to come back, the half a year quest one? Which is that? As well, the lvl 70 unlock one?

[WowIsDead64]

You have had so much chance with Brawler's, you'll just have to wait till the next one, which is confirmed to come back, the half a year quest one? Which is that? As well, the lvl 70 unlock one?

That's why I constantly talk about FOMO. You don't need this thing right now, but you can never know, if you won't need it in a future. It's so bad, when content isn't designed for players, who join game late. Yeah, it was my fault, that I ignored Brawler's Guild when it was current or returned back in BFA. But some players start to play this game for the first time TODAY. And they aren't to be blamed for it.

[Lochton]

That's why I constantly talk about FOMO. You don't need this thing right now, but you can never know, if you won't need it in a future. It's so bad, when content isn't designed for players, who join game late. Yeah, it was my fault, that I ignored Brawler's Guild when it was current or returned back in BFA. But some players start to play this game for the first time TODAY. And they aren't to be blamed for it.

Tough in the end. FOMO is a personal issue that needs to be treated. As for games, some things just go away, and shouldn't come back without a reason for them to come back. I hate and loathe that some demand things to always be around, or to be re-added just because, no, needs to be a reason. As for people missing their chance to get something that is known to return, that is on them to be around once again.

[WowIsDead64]

Tough in the end. FOMO is a personal issue that needs to be treated. As for games, some things just go away, and shouldn't come back without a reason for them to come back. I hate and loathe that some demand things to always be around, or to be re-added just because, no, needs to be a reason. As for people missing their chance to get something that is known to return, that is on them to be around once again.

Two things are wrong. FOMO is the same "personal issue", as drinking, smoking and drugs. This game is built around FOMO. Other games try to keep their whole content relevant, while in Wow content is designed around constant obsoleting. Players just do, what game encourages them to do. Second - that static playerbase concept. Such concept implies, that any player could obtain reward, when it was current. But there are new players, that couldn't play old content. And it's unfair for them, that they can't obtain reward just because they weren't there at right time. Being unable to catch up - is exact definition of FOMO.

Again. Yeah, I was there. I can be blamed for not doing content, when it was current. And it's major problem with Wow. That's why it's bad for casual players. They prefer to do content at their preferred pace. They don't want to buy content, if they know, that it would be taken away from them before they could complete it. I didn't want to do this content back then, I want to do it now, but I just can't.

[Lochton]

Two things are wrong. FOMO is the same "personal issue", as drinking, smoking and drugs.

The things you compare it with are all things of personal problems that one needs to get help with if they get out of hand.

This game is built around FOMO.

Nope. FOMO wasn't even a highlighted thing when they started, or half way through. FOMO is something that has been tagged within the recent decade, and is now plastered on everything according to their whim, but not things in grocery shops and such.

Other games try to keep their whole content relevant, while in Wow content is designed around constant obsoleting.

Sooo, like what many other games are doing already, and the ones who aren't fixes it by mutilating their content further?

Players just do, what game encourages them to do.

Correct, and the game(s) all encourage you to go exploring, stop chasing the meta, that is other players who are trying to convince people to do that, stop expecting everything, that is other players once more encouraging people to do that. The game puts it flat on the table, this is what you can do, and achieve, and if you have patience and planning, there MIGHT be more somewhere for you - happy adventure.

Second - that static playerbase concept. Such concept implies, that any player could obtain reward, when it was current. But there are new players, that couldn't play old content. And it's unfair for them, that they can't obtain reward just because they weren't there at right time. Being unable to catch up - is exact definition of FOMO.

Sooooo... Shadowmourne is FOMO to you? New players can't get it just like that, and people aren't really bothered with wanting to help with it, but it is still there? No, not everything is meant to be available forever, some items might even reappear now with the Trading Post - or is that FOMO is you miss out on a month by your own choice?

Again. Yeah, I was there. I can be blamed for not doing content, when it was current. And it's major problem with Wow.

Naw, that is a problem with you if you expect something so MINOR to be there for you without you having to put in the work?

That's why it's bad for casual players.

Mate, new players won't know of the three examples you used, for those three examples can be negated by ALL THE OTHER OPTIONS. As for casuals, a term we cannot, and has been discussed so many times now, a term we cannot use for MMORPG players directly as we cannot come to an agreement of what makes a casual anymore? Is it the player who can only play two hours a week? Some Mythic raiders do that, so, are they casuals? Is it the player who doesn't raid but players hours on end? That sounds more hardcore to me.

They prefer to do content at their preferred pace.

Which overall, you can still do in WoW? Unless you are crying about Scarab-Lord, CM gear, Glad Mounts, Curve achievements? If so, then you are a completionist, and you aren't even close to being a casual, and you have put yourself in that situation.

They don't want to buy content, if they know, that it would be taken away from them before they could complete it.

I.. am unsure here? What gets taken away from you as a player once you have obtained it, other than bugged/glitched items?

I didn't want to do this content back then, I want to do it now, but I just can't.

I didn't want to buy a house when the market was crashing, but now I do, but I just can't - does that make it FOMO?

[WowIsDead64]

No. Things like smoking are about exploiting human weaknesses. That's why things like cigarette ads are prohibited. Same with FOMO. May be FOMO isn't prohibited, because it's considered, that it can't cause any harm to one's health. Yeah, may be it's true for things like Black Friday. But not for games. In games encouraging player to play too much in short period of time due to "limited time offer" design - CAN actually cause harm to his health.

And no. FOMO has been used in Wow right from beginning. Simply because this game has been designed around patches/xpacks concept right from it's release. May be it wasn't so obvious till MOP though.

That's why I don't buy DF. If I can't complete it's content while it's still current and would have to do it after it would be obsoleted anyway - then it's better to get it for free with release of new xpack. I'm not so called E-Sportsman, so I just don't want to participate in any form of race to ephemeral goals.

[Ghost of Cow]

FOMO is nothing more than the creation of whiny, spoiled people who cannot handle the idea of not getting everything - and not getting it right now.

[Cæli]

Some people just don't understand the satisfaction you can get when beating a game or completing it it seems; in fact they're probably incapable of doing that. There's different kinds of players, and different kinds of people. Some people care about collecting which isn't unhealthy by itself, but when a developer decides to turn a game into something with unhealthy FOMO, the player didn't expected that because he was accustomed to something else. It forces the player to rethink their objective and makes the game bad from that perspective. Why would achievers play a game they can't beat? I think wow has like 20% of its collectibles that are unavailable now mostly from transmogs (see wowhead & dataofazeroth), that's too much. It used to be possible to beat wow now it's probably impossible, unless they bring back the old world and things like that.

Seeing some people defending FOMO it seems they think that whatever they earned, no one else should get it. Makes me think of the feldrake giveway, entitled people thinking only them deserved that mount.

They could have a point if the reward is an actual achievement such as a mythic mount, a rank 1 title or something like that. The vast majority of the unobtainables required close to no efforts to get and many are removed almost overnight, that's bad game design.

[Nathanyel]

OP didn't say anything about limited availability, just posited an impossible (and even if possible, exceedingly unnecessarily complicated) "challenge".

[Throwme]

the half a year quest one? Which is that?

Spear of Rethu from Archaeology.

But you really should know better than to attempt to discuss with that person. Nothing good comes from it.

[Thirtyrock]

That's why I constantly talk about FOMO. You don't need this thing right now, but you can never know, if you won't need it in a future. It's so bad, when content isn't designed for players, who join game late. Yeah, it was my fault, that I ignored Brawler's Guild when it was current or returned back in BFA. But some players start to play this game for the first time TODAY. And they aren't to be blamed for it.

This is just the way things are. A player who wants to start almost any game 20 years after it was released isn't going to have the same experience as a player who started at/near release.

The only way to prevent this is to create a game that never changes, never evolves, like old nintendo games. Any game that offers updates is going to eventually cause situations where stuff you could do at one time is no longer available. At the VERY best, it will offer so many hours of content (like wow has now) that it could never, realistically, all be completed.

You're asking for something that is self defeating, something that perpetuates the problem you claim to be trying to solve. Basically, every design idea I've seen you propose amounts to "I should be able to complete everything and get all rewards but not have to play all the hours required and not have to buy the expansion and not have to complete hard/high-end content and if not, that's bad design because FOMO"

- - - Updated - - -

i like challenges involving limited resources in video games. one challenge ive found is that if you have an account with no skips or toys unlocked and are limited to a level 1 character as the highest you can level (on a fresh battle.net, so no mounts either) its next to impossible to get to legion's dalaran to unlock the lost mail toy.

does anyone know how to do this challenge without the help of a mage?

Get a lock friend to summon you.

[Beuargh]

No, when there is nothing to do in game, you start to invent activities for yourself. And it's perfectly ok. Even more. Devs should encourage players to do it instead of discouraging via "You can play intended way only" faulty design. I have similar problem. I wanted to collect all heirlooms, but miss last 3 ones. One from Brawlers' Guild, that is totally unavailable now and no one knows, when it will be available. One from quest, that is available once in half a year only and I missed it by just 1-2 weeks. And one is available at 70lvl only.

dude is talking like wow is the only thing to do in his life.... you should rename to "wowsgonnakillme"

[MrLachyG]

Get a lock friend to summon you.

Pointless, can’t do the quest at level 1 anyway

[Thirtyrock]

Pointless, can’t do the quest at level 1 anyway

The whole thing is pointless, but the OP asked for a non-mage way to get to Dal at lvl 1. The only other way that I can think of is to use a Lock summons. Or, I guess, someone to go to Violet Hold and use the stone there.

Doesn't accomplish what the OP wants, but it answers the specific question they asked.

[huth]

The only way to prevent this is to create a game that never changes, never evolves, like old nintendo games.

Nah, even that doesn't help. Playing an (S)NES game today is not the same as playing it back then because the world around it changed. The only constant in the world is change.

People trying to prevent change are only fooling themself into believing that doing so is even possible or desirable. It's not.