[Spoilers] Under The Fat Goose Inn (D4 general talk)

[Nymrohd]

So I finally got my golem as necro, and I was annoyed trying to fit my basic, core, raise skele, raise golem, decrepify, corpse explosion, and army of the dead on my bar, I didn't want to get rid of any of them.

After some reading I found a few players who actually just....ditched the basic attack. Opting to use Blight as their primary, relying on corpse consuming and passives for essence generation. This has been working WONDERFULLY for me, so I'm wondering:

Anyone else playing necro without using the basic attack? (or any other class that is skipping basic or core skills entirely and finding some success with it?)

Not sure about Necro but plenty of endgame builds for different classes ditch basic attack once they have the right gear I think.

[AcidicSyn]

That's pretty much what I settled on in the open beta. Though I'm still somewhat disappointed that you need to outright put the summoning spells on your bar for them to work at all. Particularly annoying in case of the Golem, where the golem itself is active at all times and even respawns automatically, and the active ability is just an extra buff for it. Feels rather limiting for a class ability. To me it feels like they should be systems that exist on top of the ability system, not outright compete with it. Even throwing the generator out makes the Necromancer build options rather constrained because of that.

The fact that you don't, for example, need corpse explosion on your bar for it to be triggered by blood mist if you have that legendary made it all the more bizarre. So does the fact that the Necromancer summons already have their own dedicated subsystem of sacrificing the summon entirely if you don't want to use one.

Yeah that was a shame, this was the best solution I could find so far but even then its super jarring and there are plenty of situations where you're not doing anything and that doesn't always feel good in the more hectic fights. Not to mention the number of legendaries/aspects that build off basic attacks that I pretty much just ignore now as a result.

I feel like, at least in the case of necro, if there was just one separate key assigned to ultimate, like R or something, it would be a good bandaid, though I agree having the summons on the bar at all feels pretty bad. I'm not a darkness, corpse, blood, OR bone necro, my bar is all summon skills.

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Not sure about Necro but plenty of endgame builds for different classes ditch basic attack once they have the right gear I think.

Thats good to know. Feels better to know at least. I've gotten even better essence generation with some other aspects I've found, so I don't necessarily miss the basic attack? But it does still feel super weird to not need it, like Blizzard dropped the ball rather than it being an intended way to play.

[Nymrohd]

Thats good to know. Feels better to know at least. I've gotten even better essence generation with some other aspects I've found, so I don't necessarily miss the basic attack? But it does still feel super weird to not need it, like Blizzard dropped the ball rather than it being an intended way to play.

Nah, cooldowns and resources are restrictions meant to be overcome by the way you build your character.

[AcidicSyn]

Nah, cooldowns and resources are restrictions meant to be overcome by the way you build your character.

walp, guess i did it right then

[Fallen Angel]

walp, guess i did it right then

CE and other corpse skills building essence are so much better than running a base generator. Hewn flesh and blighted CE will build so many corpses you can essentially spam CE all day once you get going

[Fencers]

OOff. Really feel the need for that "gem bag". This is too much to carry around.

[AcidicSyn]

CE and other corpse skills building essence are so much better than running a base generator. Hewn flesh and blighted CE will build so many corpses you can essentially spam CE all day once you get going

Aye thats what I've been doing. With regular mobs there are so many corpses left over after a fight I can typically spam raise and heal up skeles to full and refill essence super quick

[Nymrohd]

Btw while on Tier 2 and doing the campaign, Side Quests were visible in my map. Why did they stop being visible now that I need them . . .
And I have no way to track which ones I've done so I can just search for the rest . . .

[Fallen Angel]

Aye thats what I've been doing. With regular mobs there are so many corpses left over after a fight I can typically spam raise and heal up skeles to full and refill essence super quick

Even solo bosses CE as a generator is leaps over a basic skill generator.

I’m running Bone Storm, Blighted CE, iron golem #2, corpse reapers, vulnerable cold mages, decrepify and Iron Maiden with shadowblight key passive so I don’t even have a spender.

[Aucald]

Or they could have just yeeted the Soulstones into the Void, where the only thing they'd be able to corrupt was Lilith (and I don't think that'd even be possible). Tyrael should have been able to banish something there given how Inarius banished people there at least three times.

I think the primary assumption there is that the Greater and Lesser Evils can't really be chucked into the Void as a viable long-term solution - either it can't contain them, or they simply can't go there. Otherwise, the whole Soulstone plot of Diablo 1-4 makes no real sense, since if the Void was always a viable alternative then why not put them there as opposed to having mortals safeguard them and so on? Lilith, while powerful, is just a regular demoness - she's the daughter of Mephisto but neither she nor her brother Lucion were accorded the status of Lesser Evil, much less Greater. They're not original aspects of Anu, so it's probably possible to exile them in the Void.

I would imagine the Archangels, too; can't be chucked into the Void as their existence is somehow intrinsic to the Diablo universe as a whole.

[AcidicSyn]

Even solo bosses CE as a generator is leaps over a basic skill generator.

I’m running Bone Storm, Blighted CE, iron golem #2, corpse reapers, vulnerable cold mages, decrepify and Iron Maiden with shadowblight key passive so I don’t even have a spender.

oooo that sounds like a fun build, might have to try that out when I get home tonight.

[Fallen Angel]

oooo that sounds like a fun build, might have to try that out when I get home tonight.

https://fextralife.com/diablo-4-mini...ld-blightlord/

It’s a pretty wicked minion build in a world of sacrificing them. Most of the damage is still yours, but your minions are still strong and distracting

[marulol]

I have found the butcher three times in the last 4 hours of playing when the first 20 hours I didn't see him once.

[Mehrunes]

Yeah that was a shame, this was the best solution I could find so far but even then its super jarring and there are plenty of situations where you're not doing anything and that doesn't always feel good in the more hectic fights. Not to mention the number of legendaries/aspects that build off basic attacks that I pretty much just ignore now as a result.

I feel like, at least in the case of necro, if there was just one separate key assigned to ultimate, like R or something, it would be a good bandaid, though I agree having the summons on the bar at all feels pretty bad. I'm not a darkness, corpse, blood, OR bone necro, my bar is all summon skills.

The ultimate change is precisely the same solution to this I was thinking about during the beta.

Btw while on Tier 2 and doing the campaign, Side Quests were visible in my map. Why did they stop being visible now that I need them . . .
And I have no way to track which ones I've done so I can just search for the rest . . .

Some side quests are only visible when you're in their vicinity. I think the sub-area of the given zone that gets highlighted on mouse-over. Maybe even closer than that.

I think the primary assumption there is that the Greater and Lesser Evils can't really be chucked into the Void as a viable long-term solution - either it can't contain them, or they simply can't go there. Otherwise, the whole Soulstone plot of Diablo 1-4 makes no real sense, since if the Void was always a viable alternative then why not put them there as opposed to having mortals safeguard them and so on? Lilith, while powerful, is just a regular demoness - she's the daughter of Mephisto but neither she nor her brother Lucion were accorded the status of Lesser Evil, much less Greater. They're not original aspects of Anu, so it's probably possible to exile them in the Void.

I would imagine the Archangels, too; can't be chucked into the Void as their existence is somehow intrinsic to the Diablo universe as a whole.

That is a possibility. On the other hand pretty much nothing pertaining to Sanctuary's history portrays the angels as good judges of anything.

[Kumorii]

Btw while on Tier 2 and doing the campaign, Side Quests were visible in my map. Why did they stop being visible now that I need them . . .
And I have no way to track which ones I've done so I can just search for the rest . . .

You have to be in that sub-region for it to show up on the minimap. Probably because the regions aren't loaded fully when you are not in them. The map is, but no objects are loaded. Noticeable when joining a Helltide, especially during prime time now after real release.
They should put the quest markers as a separate thing instead of being to the object in the zone.

I do wish that they add a "missions complete" done as well.
If you only missing a few, it's probably a quest being from drops. Looting corpses, herbs, ore veins and killing enemies can all drop a quest. Problem is you don't know which zones has one.

the 100% completion goal is missing some QoL features for sure.

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https://fextralife.com/diablo-4-mini...ld-blightlord/

It’s a pretty wicked minion build in a world of sacrificing them. Most of the damage is still yours, but your minions are still strong and distracting

Tried a similar one recently... I have issues with the CE blight effect is incredibly dense so pooping 1 or 2 and then I can't see shit anymore.
Gonna check if there's an option I can use to change that, but kinda ruins enjoyment when you see nothing.

[Fallen Angel]

Tried a similar one recently... I have issues with the CE blight effect is incredibly dense so pooping 1 or 2 and then I can't see shit anymore.
Gonna check if there's an option I can use to change that, but kinda ruins enjoyment when you see nothing.

I agree. I haven’t really done anything where it being there is make or break, but it could be detrimental in limited death NM or HC runs

[Fencers]

D4 is such a fascinating mix of over-design and spare design. It's probably the ultimate expression of Blizzard's linear design philosophy.

100% they made this game in a vacuum. These devs only played their own game. I wouldn't believe anyone involved with the design of the game had a strong opinion of like Marvel Heroes or Fate.

This is navel-gazing game design in a certain sense.

[Tojara]

OOff. Really feel the need for that "gem bag". This is too much to carry around.

I'd be fine with carrying them around if they were actually worth something. As it stands its automatically 7 (maybe 6) slots, that can't be sold for anything and once you hit 70 you can upgrade them to the last rank. My tip is to just acquire ~50 flawless (second highest) and then never pick them up again. That should be more than enough to convert them to any royals you need.

[Fencers]

I'd be fine with carrying them around if they were actually worth something. As it stands its automatically 7 (maybe 6) slots, that can't be sold for anything and once you hit 70 you can upgrade them to the last rank. My tip is to just acquire ~50 flawless (second highest) and then never pick them up again. That should be more than enough to convert them to any royals you need.

Hm. Not a half-bad idea. Admittedly, I pick them up partially on impulse. Though I do transfer the gems to my other characters. Your suggestion is pretty good nonetheless.

[Gaidax]

OOff. Really feel the need for that "gem bag". This is too much to carry around.

This is my top tilt with the game right now.

Why it's not a thing is beyond me.

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And yes you don't need to pick every one of them and eventually you will have more than you can use, but it would be nice to not to deal with this shit to begin with.