Poll: What do you think?

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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalinos View Post
    You see a granny coming out of the grocery store, and her old, weak arms drop the grocery bags. Why should you, an able-bodied male help her?

    You see an excited 12yr old kid, setting foot in his first ever Heroic raid. Why should you, a decked-out Mythic raider help him?

    If your answer is "I don't have to, so I won't", then I question the way your parents raised you, if they even raised you at all.
    Your making it out as if Heroic is somehow impossible without being carried. It's not. Nor is it a nessecity for seeing the content in the game. There are two lower difficulties if someone finds the task insourmountable or if someone doesn't yet know the mechanics even thou there are hundreds of guides out there. Climbing a ladder is done one step at the time. And the perosn wont learn to climb ladders if i pick him up and throw him up to the highest step.

    The 12 year old are not some old granny who cannot survive on her own without aid, he is a 12 year old kid with every possibility to jump into a group of people who all are on the same experience and progress throu the raid just like everyone else has.

    My parents didnt carry me throu heroics, i climbed that tree all on my own. As, i suspect, did all these mythic raid grps that sprint hc for echoes.
    None of us really changes over time. We only become more fully what we are.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    Not at all. I want to hear the different arguments from both sides. I might know the possible answers to the question but I don't necessarily know why they feel that way. That's the interesting part
    You already heard the different arguments, which is why you knew there was an argument.

    "Take the time to sit down and talk with your adversaries. You will learn something, and they will learn something from you. When two enemies are talking, they are not fighting. It's when the talking ceases that the ground becomes fertile for violence. So keep the conversation going."
    ~ Daryl Davis

  3. #83
    The Lightbringer Jazzhands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    When it comes to raid progession (no matter what difficulty it is) we have two groups in a simplified version:

    Group 1) People who have progressed.

    Group 2) People who have not progressed yet.

    Naturally Group 2 often would like some help from Group 1.

    Now the questions are:

    Should Group 1 feel obliged to help Group 2 even though it means they would have to spend time reprogressing the content? Or is it fair to want a quick reclear of content which they have already beaten?

    Should people from Group 2 stop expecting help from Group 1 and instead make raid-teams with other people from Group 2 so they can progress together?

    Edit: I realize now that this sounds like a guild scenario, but it’s not meant to be. Group 1 and Group 2 are representations of the player base in general. My bad.
    People shouldn't expect anything from random people, despite being a multiplayer game we aren't here to help others. People are also allowed to play with whoever they want, be that people at their level or not. Are there people in group 1 willing to help group 2? Absolutely, I've done it myself, but I'm not going to help every random person I come across or I'd never get anything done, and most night I don't want to spend 4+ hours in a raid I've cleared 40 times when I could just crubstomp it in 2 by getting people at my level.

    People in group 2 need to just learn to use youtube and guides, it's insane how easy it is to get geared in this game and start pugging.

  4. #84
    Brewmaster Alkizon's Avatar
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    Arrow

    In general, this requires certain restrictions, in our case - closed server "community"(besides without any automation), and so people with progress will be interested in more "accessible and educated" participants for any social perturbation (in case of replacements and movements). And since rest of people will be motivated to get content and progress (and these elements should have the same organization basis) together and have no different way than to listen to those, who are smarter and more experienced, they will be inclined to heed what will be explained to them... how many such topics could be produce?.. After all, it's still simple:
    Quote Originally Posted by Alkizon View Post
    Still just very long period of wrong world/servers/content+progress and mechanisms of social regulation/organization... and nothing more. People just adapt to survive in conditions "imposed" by devs <= this is key/main reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alkizon View Post
    5. About dungeons&requirements also M+/modes (+RNG+g.tokens+t/wf) +(+/+/+/+)+(+/+/+/+)+(+/+/+)+(+)+(+/+/+)
    6. Bad
    world (and not only) scaling +(+)+/+/+/+/+/+/+/+
    7.
    Little about loot policy +(+/+/+)
    8.
    Servers type/org (WM&MMO+changes'soc.psycho.res+auto/subscr) +(+/+/+/+/+)+(+)+(+/+/+/+/+)+(+/+/+/+)
    9.
    Quests/leveling (&levels) +(+/+)+(+)
    10.
    Threat philosophy & badge system & W.Boss mechanics (it's not mine, but I won't do this better) +/+/+
    Age-long, I’m afraid that it’s so long that it has already turned into chronic disease, which "local doctors" prefer not to notice.
    Last edited by Alkizon; 2020-06-03 at 07:11 AM.
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  5. #85
    I've done my progress, I don't want to do it again every week whilst after a few bosses on an alt. If you start late you should form your own progression group.

  6. #86
    This thread is an agenda thread.

    If you are casual and you want to join the world of progression, there are plenty of progression guild looking for raiders. Group 1 is not a closed group, people come and people go. There are plenty of average guild struggling at 8 pm at 18 people waiting and waiting. They will be GLAD to have you, assuming you also show up to raid on their schedule.

    But that is not what you want, isn't it.

    You don't want to be those pathetic 18 people waiting and waiting and waiting. You want the 18 people to finished their raid and carry you, to "help out group 2".

    how about you help them out, "but I don't have time to do progression, I have a life".
    Last edited by gobio; 2020-06-01 at 04:06 AM.

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