Blizzard has annoyed a large portion of the playerbase FACT

[odamienskii]

Actually it would be better. Considering according to blizzards last reports their subs are currently up by 50%.

You are in the minority as is everyone who thinks wow is dying

lol.......dude, have you been to oribos lately? have you seen how many of your friends are online?

Subs up 50% my backside!

[Lolites]

Actually it would be better. Considering according to blizzards last reports their subs are currently up by 50%.

well but thats based on actual data not on his feelings so he wont take that seriously

EDIT: he already did what he see in oribos is more accurate that actual data... oh my god that must be guy with the biggest ego i ever seen...

[odamienskii]

cant counter something thats not there...
you shared your opinionsand claim thats FACTS... how can we counter NOTHING?! bcs thats what you use to argue, absolutely nothing...
and you shown ZERO knowledge of game and its history (you had no idea about cata HC, claim they stop sharing data during cata etc...)

dude, you was all over one of my threads saying how ksm is hard and not obtainable by most. your not in the same catagory of player as me dude.

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well but thats based on actual data not on his feelings so he wont take that seriously

oh, when it suits your agenda its actual data is it, noted.

Couldnt possibly be blizzard trying to stop the clear and obvious bleed of subs could it.

[Puxycat]

I can not agree with his style of expressing himself but i agree on %99 of things he means.
Yes there was always a meta but being in the twist of chosing a right covenant to perform good in both pve pvp m+ and raid it is a huge pain in the a**
Imagine being a warrior you must be Venthry to PVP
Must be Kyrian to Tank
Must be NF to DPS m+
And what kind a choice lock is this i want to play the god damn game and peform equal as everyone would.

[Lolites]

dude, you was all over one of my threads saying how ksm is hard and not obtainable by most. your not in the same catagory of player as me dude.

fair point, im probably WAY ABOVE, you seem like LFR warior...
btw, that KSM is not obtained by most people is actual fact provable by available data... unlike yours "facts" based on your asspulled nothings...

[odamienskii]

fair point, im probably WAY ABOVE, you seem like LFR warior...
btw, that KSM is not obtained by most people is actual fact provable by available data... unlike yours "facts" based on your asspulled nothings...

No you actually said something about how you struggled, that was it, taughast layer 8, you said you still hadnt done it like 4 months after the nerf... embarrassing

I mean its fine that there are people that casual that they struggle, im not elitest like that, but to come here and talk like your some kind of demi god.... blizzards spoonfeeding mission fully in play giving every single player the illusion of being good in there own little bracket.

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I can not agree with his style of expressing himself but i agree on %99 of things he means.
Yes there was always a meta but being in the twist of chosing a right covenant to perform good in both pve pvp m+ and raid it is a huge pain in the a**
Imagine being a warrior you must be Venthry to PVP
Must be Kyrian to Tank
Must be NF to DPS m+
And what kind a choice lock is this i want to play the god damn game and peform equal as everyone would.

thats my point, your forced to play specific classes, specific specs and now specific covenents on top of that.

The options in shadowlands are as follows
1) your lucky with balance, congratulations shadowlands is great
2) play something you dont enjoy, be a covenent you dont like
3) suck
4) unsub

incoming "tHESE aRENT fACTS lUL yOU sUCK" comments

Lock is great in pvp btw, if you dont enjoy pvp thats a shame! your simply not viable for the game. see options 2 through to 4 and make your choice.

[Lolites]

No you actually said something about how you struggled, that was it, taughast layer 8, you said you still hadnt done it like 4 months after the nerf... embarrassing

i see you still didnt learn how to read... i said that i cleared it, but that there are people who have not...
i understand for someone with your ego concept of "someone else" is beyond comprehension, but other people do understand that

nevermind, im gonna ignore you, you have nothing but feelings and ego to post as "facts" and when someone tells you (accurately) that you have NOTHING to add to discusion you turn to personal attacks... how you are not permabanned is beyond my understanding

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remember when i made a post about how 50% of the community dislike the game and you tried your best to pick it apart? this was about 4 months ago before the new updated poll.

oh i remember, you said your opinion, ignored everything that was not supporting it, and claimed you are right without any proof whatsoever...
pretty much what you do here, so it seems like you still didnt learn anything... why am i not surprised...

[Karreck]

the poll would be worse if all subs voted on it because all the people that didnt vote but unsubbed would obviously vote....bad

While a large portion that still play would still vote.....bad

How do you think that the playerbase might possibly vote more in favour if everyone was considered? its more likely to be worse!

Your opinion does not count as evidence. Unless you can show survey results backed up by sound methodology, you are making assumptions. So no matter how much you believe that if all subs voted the results would be worse, you can not back up that claim. Therefore, it is just your opinion.

[Dorothyjean]

Reading that original thing... I don't think necessarily that this is Blizzard's fault although to a smaller extent it is but I think that the Youtubers, Twitch streamers and the general population in WoW that are complaining about all of this stuff...

Just want to bitch and moan. Everyone always talks about the meta and honestly... right now... the Meta is to be either a toxic asshole or to critique every little thing about the game and complain about everything. Almost every WoW video about the game is just someone bitching and moaning and how "Blizzard didn't listen to us" or "all of these systems make me want to quit the game". It's an MMO ... these systems have ALWAYS been in place going back to the OG Ultima Online where there has always been a meta. The only difference now is it's literally being plastered everywhere... Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Youtube, Twitch yada yada yada... and everyone KEEPS CLICKING on the stuff and adding their own bored af examples on how they too can nitpick every single, minute aspect of the WoW game and how it sucks.

Complaining, bitching and moaning is the meta right now and everyone wants a slice of the pie. If you're not bitching and moaning they say "you are part of the problem" and they call you a cuck (Asmongold I believe said that) and "how could you not be complaining"... when it's all these people ever do is bitch and moan about everything because it's a self-perpetuating circle for them because people want to bitch and moan also so they keep clicking on this toxic bullshit.

If the game sucks for you...

QUIT! GO AWAY AND SHUT THE F UP ABOUT IT. No one cares except yourself.

[Puxycat]

Reading that original thing... I don't think necessarily that this is Blizzard's fault although to a smaller extent it is but I think that the Youtubers, Twitch streamers and the general population in WoW that are complaining about all of this stuff...

Just want to bitch and moan. Everyone always talks about the meta and honestly... right now... the Meta is to be either a toxic asshole or to critique every little thing about the game and complain about everything. Almost every WoW video about the game is just someone bitching and moaning and how "Blizzard didn't listen to us" or "all of these systems make me want to quit the game". It's an MMO ... these systems have ALWAYS been in place going back to the OG Ultima Online where there has always been a meta. The only difference now is it's literally being plastered everywhere... Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Youtube, Twitch yada yada yada... and everyone KEEPS CLICKING on the stuff and adding their own bored af examples on how they too can nitpick every single, minute aspect of the WoW game and how it sucks.

Complaining, bitching and moaning is the meta right now and everyone wants a slice of the pie. If you're not bitching and moaning they say "you are part of the problem" and they call you a cuck (Asmongold I believe said that) and "how could you not be complaining"... when it's all these people ever do is bitch and moan about everything because it's a self-perpetuating circle for them because people want to bitch and moan also so they keep clicking on this toxic bullshit.

If the game sucks for you...

QUIT! GO AWAY AND SHUT THE F UP ABOUT IT. No one cares except yourself.

It has nothing to do with the influence of the streamers when you can observe and do the math if you have more then few effective working brain cells that a kyrian warrior is superior to the venthyr when it comes to tanking and right opposite if you go arms kyrian venthyr outperforms you, so it is not just a vibe it is the truth try to understand what he means and how does it make some part of the player base feel.
-Why should i struggle only because i picked venthyr and i am doomed i and i will be rejected by the majority of the people.
-Also it doesn't say on the box of the game that you are supposed to only play with your friends.
-This game is based on random people playing together.
-Also last thing if forums are not to "whine and to bitch" what are they for?

[arkanon]

-Also last thing if forums are not to "whine and to bitch" what are they for?

An open discussion, to share thoughts an opinions. This will almost definitely be news to some people, but it is very possible to present an argument, even from a negative point of view, without whining and bitching. One issue is, many (not all) users form arguments using extreme scenarios, highly unlikely to ever actually occur in game but presented as the "norm", often from people who literally dont even own SL and have never played it.

People rely on hyperbole and extreme exaggeration to form arguments, and often rely on situations that boil down to "me and my 2 friends dont like X, therefore everyone hates X, therefore X is bad for the game, and anyone who disagrees is an elitist asshole / casual bad (delete one)". This is why both sides of any argument often come across as whiny or bitchy.

[Varodoc]

An open discussion, to share thoughts an opinions. This will almost definitely be news to some people, but it is very possible to present an argument, even from a negative point of view, without whining and bitching. One issue is, many (not all) users form arguments using extreme scenarios, highly unlikely to ever actually occur in game but presented as the "norm", often from people who literally dont even own SL and have never played it.

People rely on hyperbole and extreme exaggeration to form arguments, and often rely on situations that boil down to "me and my 2 friends dont like X, therefore everyone hates X, therefore X is bad for the game, and anyone who disagrees is an elitist asshole / casual bad (delete one)". This is why both sides of any argument often come across as whiny or bitchy.

You're in a fan forum infamous for being a cess pit of toxic people, most of which have likely been banned from the official forums/social media (hence why they're complaining in a fan forum). You're not going to find an open discussion here.

[arkanon]

You're in a fan forum infamous for being a cess pit of toxic people, most of which have likely been banned from the official forums/social media (hence why they're complaining in a fan forum). You're not going to find an open discussion here.

This is EXACTLY what im talking about - what an absolutely ridiculous post. You have literally nothing to support your claim that "most" users on mmo-c are banned on the official forum, and social media? what are you talking about?

This site is far from infamous, I doubt many people even know it exists anymore, based on the current user numbers Vs peak numbers. This is EXACTLY the sort of extreme hyperbole, and outright lies that cause the trouble in the first place.

[Varodoc]

This is EXACTLY what im talking about - what an absolutely ridiculous post. You have literally nothing to support your claim that "most" users on mmo-c are banned on the official forum, and social media? what are you talking about?

This site is far from infamous, I doubt many people even know it exists anymore, based on the current user numbers Vs peak numbers. This is EXACTLY the sort of extreme hyperbole, and outright lies that cause the trouble in the first place.

Then why are you moaning so much about "the lack of open discussion" if there's nothing wrong with MMO-Champion?

[arkanon]

Then why are you moaning so much about "the lack of open discussion" if there's nothing wrong with MMO-Champion?

Again, proving my point. Please quote where I complained about a lack of open discussion. If you have to rely on such an obvious strawman argument, your argument is not worth anything.

[Dorothyjean]

It has nothing to do with the influence of the streamers when you can observe and do the math if you have more then few effective working brain cells

Thanks for proving my point.

I guess I'm a complete moron for going Necrolord BM Hunter even though I still beat a lot of Night Fae hunters but that makes me dumb right. :P

The whole concept of what you typed out looks interesting but ultimately... why doesn't everyone just reroll Balance Druid if it's Mythic raiding and Aff lock if it's Heroic raiding...

Anything else just means you don't have an effective working brain cause why play anything else but the optimal... well, until 'you' decide that people want to play other things besides Balance druids and Aff locks. So it's up to you where the effective working brain cells starts then...?

[huth]

Again, proving my point. Please quote where I complained about a lack of open discussion. If you have to rely on such an obvious strawman argument, your argument is not worth anything.

It also shows another issue; people keep pretending that the extremes are the only possible options. Varodoc acts like it has to either be an irredeemable cesspool or completely fine, rather than somewhere below perfect but far from the worst the internet has to offer. At least most people here can actually write legible english.