[Megathread] Final Fantasy XIV

[Strangebrew]

Because for many it is wether you like it or not! I love how you completely disregarded the rest of the post btw... Patch 3.1 brought new content and 3.15 further incentivized the already available content for a lot of people

Let's also ignore that 3.15 added a whole new sidequest chain next the relic weapon.

To be fair for those that don't have a 210 it is :P even without the optimal secondary stats 1 weapon damage is equal to 30 of your main stat for more classes so it's better by default! Also much like the prev relic you lol be able to fully edit it at some point making it bis

I meant as an upgrade from Alex savage gear, which it isn't.
There is literally nothing forcing you to do the relic weapon to get the best weapon right now, hell for some jobs, the weapon is worse than the savage weapon.

Yes, it will get better as more steps get's released, but so will the gear outside of it aswell, all of this in the air.
We don't know what the next steps will be, how the upgraded weapons will be, what ilevel they are, what gear the new savage raids will drop.


It will become BiS by the end of the quest propably, but that is hardly relevant to the complaints about the second step right now.

[Deleted]

I love how you completely disregarded the rest of the post btw...

Because I don't understand how me trying to beat A4S is relevant?
Like yeah, I have fun trying that - and now?

Patch 3.1 brought new content and 3.15 further incentivized the already available content for a lot of people

And for a lot of people it didn't because the grind is too much and they don't try to even start.
Why exactly that much? You have 8+ classes maxxed if you are a frequent player, you could spent months doing relic quests even if they halved it or made it 1/3. It's still not fun but well, people would at least not unsub directly because the carrot is actually closer once again.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Yeah that's actually pretty idiotic. I agree.
But I don't see how people got 80x unidientified items within 36 hours.

Unless they truly did hardcore china-man farm the crap out of Alexander. (I've read somewhere that a run takes a good group around 5 minutes?)

Just did FATEs in western Coerthas to test the drop rate of the crystals:
3x Ice Crystal in 45minutes + half a level for my lil' 53 Scholar. Not too shabby. Definitely helps if you have alts to level and don't do FATEs in vain if no crystal drops.

As for the prices of the crafting crap:
Started out at 2Mil per Item on my server and are down to 800K now.

That's what made FATE grinding easy for me. I was doing multiple things at once. Getting levels on alt classes, leveling chocobo, getting GC seals and the crystals.

[Deleted]

Because I don't understand how me trying to beat A4S is relevant?
Like yeah, I have fun trying that - and now?

And it would probably take you till the next patch to clear it and considering you ve willingly chosen to disregard everything else that the game offers it should keep you busy till 3.2 which will add more of that. And let's say the relic was able to be done in a week. Then what?

[Strangebrew]

Because I don't understand how me trying to beat A4S is relevant?
Like yeah, I have fun trying that - and now?

So essentially it boils down to you complaining about not getting enough content in a mini-patch?

[Deleted]

So essentially it boils down to you complaining about not getting enough content in a mini-patch?

Probably, ya - and something I was looking forward to getting smashed by doing (a *ton* of) things worthy of me and alot of people unsubbing.

And it would probably take you till the next patch to clear it and considering you ve willingly chosen to disregard everything else that the game offers it should keep you busy till 3.2 which will add more of that. And let's say the relic was able to be done in a week. Then what?

Then I'd have done something in the game that is outside of my raiding times by doing sidequests/fates whenever I'm seriously bored.
More frequent players would be able to set up their other classes for the next step too. etc. etc.

[Strangebrew]

Probably, ya - and something I was looking forward to getting smashed by doing things worthy of me and alot of people unsubbing.

i dont know what you expected after vanilla relic weapon, but okay.
If you are going to unsub over not getting enough content in a mini-patch, content that was simply delayed a little, that's on you.
I find it completely idiotic, but whatever.

I will get the relic weapon as i go, i get poetics and laws just by doing every day activity in the game, if you don't care about the ilevel on the weapon, i really do not see why you can't do the same.

[Deleted]

Let's also ignore that 3.15 added a whole new sidequest chain next the relic weapon.

tbh 'A whole new sidequest chain' makes it sound a bit more grand than it is really

*goes back to lurking*

[Strangebrew]

tbh 'A whole new sidequest chain' makes it sound a bit more grand than it is really

*goes back to lurking*

It's a new sidequest nontheless, it seems to me people expected almost a full patch worth of content in a mini-patch.
I'll admit saying "whole" was stretching it a bit though.

[Deleted]

Probably, ya - and something I was looking forward to getting smashed by doing (a *ton* of) things worthy of me and alot of people unsubbing.



Then I'd have done something in the game that is outside of my raiding times by doing sidequests/fates whenever I'm seriously bored.
More frequent players would be able to set up their other classes for the next step too. etc. etc.

I see nothing stopping you from doing that currently

[Deleted]

It's a new sidequest nontheless, it seems to me people expected almost a full patch worth of content in a mini-patch.

Think they expected something actually doable rather than having to spend millions of gil and 3 months worth of time into a single weapon. People are saying this is an alternative for people who don't want to do savage but I highly doubt this is scaled correctly if that's the case.

[Strangebrew]

Think they expected something actually doable rather than having to spend millions of gil and 3 months worth of time into a single weapon. People are saying this is an alternative for people who don't want to do savage but I highly doubt this is scaled correctly if that's the case.

But it is doable, wether you want to put that much energy into it or not is completely up to you.
There is zero reason to go full autist mode on it unless you absolutely fucking want it.
People saw "800 Alex runs" and started panicking, while completely disregarding there is other ways to get the items, or poetics and laws, it's just getting silly.

I already said the step is too steep for being just the second step, i agree with that.
But the amount and the type of complaints i see about it is just getting stupid.

[Deleted]

Think they expected something actually doable rather than having to spend millions of gil and 3 months worth of time into a single weapon. People are saying this is an alternative for people who don't want to do savage but I highly doubt this is scaled correctly if that's the case.

It will barely take a month puting normal effort into it seriously EVERYTHING YOU DO GIVES YOU THE STUFF

[Granyala]

Soooo I really don't like being that guy but I lol go ahead and be the asshole again here. Why do you people play MMOs?

Can only speak for myself her:
I have no problem with a grind. I do have a problem when a rather rigid patch cycle puts pressure on me to finish the grind ASAP because if I don't the items becomes useless/outdated before I can get it in the first place.

Imho the grind for the relic should be cut in half. That would allow even casual players to obtain it in 1.5 months instead of 3, so they have 1.5 months before 3.2 hits (assuming it hits in 3 months) and brings along a higher item level that renders the relic obsolete.

Reward should be in sync with effort. If I put in A LOT of effort, be it skill wise or time wise, I expect the reward to last a while.
Putting hamster wheel after hamster wheel never allowing people to rest and enjoy the fruits of their labor burns people out.

That's why I don't OCD about capping eso every week (3.2 will invalidate the gear anyway, except for the looks) and that is why I won't OCD the relic (because I know I'll never get it in time anyway for it to be useful).

Also there is a threshold before a person gets sick of content. In WoW that was around the 4-6 months mark for me. After 4-6 months of raiding the same thing every week I was ready for a change of scenery. 4 applied in the perma progress times with them darn difficulty levels that burned me out VERY quickly, 6 was back in the day when content clear meant "we did good, everything dead, lets take the next Monday off".

[Deleted]

will barely take a month puting normal effort into it seriously EVERYTHING YOU DO GIVES YOU THE STUFF

But it's all things these people don't want to do, ahhhhhhhh.
Why even invest time into something you don't *want* to do.
And you have to do them every day if you want it done in a month....it'll probably take alot longer too.

Doing Beast tribes + Alex1-4 + Daily Hunts + Roulette takes me 2h+ and probably gets me around ~1 Token if I add everything together (didn't do the math, feels like alot less tbh.) And in my case, I had no fun (maybe a little during the roulette) during these 2 hours..... feels like farming crafting mats in vanilla/bc all over again. (at least crafting mats was something I *needed* to raid)
This 7 days a week 31 days/month. No.... please not

[Granyala]

But it's all things these people don't want to do, ahhhhhhhh.
Why even invest time into something you don't *want* to do.

Then don't do it?
It's not as if the relic is mandatory.
We all knew it was going to be a long ass grind as almost all of the 2.x steps were insane grinds too.

500x Garuda for 5 item levels, anyone?
Merciless myth farming (weekly limit) for Animus books?
Absurdly low % dungeon drops?
ATMA 1.0?

[Wrecktangle]

Soooo I really don't like being that guy but I lol go ahead and be the asshole again here. Why do you people play MMOs? Like seriously why? You don't like grinding, you don't like farming, you don't like long term character progression you don't find anything interesting after the 10th time you be done it and you want the potentially best weapon in the game to be a login reward because you pay your 15 bucks a month.

Dude, WHAT are you going on about? You speak in absolutes and that is your issue with understanding where KrayZee is coming from. We don't mind grinding (I say we because I agree with him), what we do mind is NON-REWARDING, NON-ENGAGING GRINDING. Note that very little content in this game is engaging or rewarding. There is no such thing as long-term character progression in this game (your gear is instantly invalidated every single patch). You're either raiding savage, or your gear is 100% trivial other than the graphic. What do you need i210 gear for if all you do is run dungeons that are tuned for i145? Your stats are almost completely useless in contributing to your character power as it's 100% mandated by the gear assigned (aka ilvl assigned) to you based on the patch.

The grinds exist so the game can last. There is no other virtual way of doing that other than pumping out content faster and I can assure you 3 month content gaps are the closest you ll ever get as getting content fast. Its just impossible to push it out faster.
It needs to last to keep you occupied with something.

There needs to be exploration, danger, immersion, and character growth. My character never grows in strength other than the ilvl assigned to her. The relic is literally just another bland ass stat stick when they could have taken the opportunity to make it worthwhile and fun and differentiating. It's not about pushing out content faster, it's about making more engaging and fun content. The grind should be based on you, not your character. it should be to make yourself a better, more helpful, and knowledgeable player. This game does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to foster this belief.

But you dont do the same thing over and over.....
They have literaly made it so that almost every single thing you currently do in the game rewards you toward the relic.
How fast you do it is up to you. Would you rather it be gated like WoW?
Like seriously, hunts give you currency, dungeons give you currency, raids give you currency, fates give you currency, maps give you currency, reps give you currency and crafts help you.
What more is there that you d want?

Again, you fail to comprehend our POV. It is doing the same thing over. You have 2 options. Do it the most efficient way, or do it casually. If you choose to do it the most efficient way, you're in for a painful grind, no debating that.

Should you choose a more casual approach, you're stuck doing let's see:

1) Fates: Not challenging. No meaningful rewards, you literally hit a few mobs, afk run/fly to next one and do the same and hope other people kill it for you.

2) Dungeons: Again no challenge, no meaningful rewards, just AFK AOE all the mobs. Oh and we've ran every single dungeon in this game FAR too many times.

3) Alex: Nope no thanks. I ran that shit straight for 5 weeks accruing all my tokens to get my i190 set. Just to get into a savage static. I don't NEED or want to run it much more. I don't need to run it for 2 more months either. It needs to be a once in a while thing.

4) Savage: If you're not on a cutting edge server, you're chances of actually killing A3S and higher is pretty low. Finding 7 other nerds who can play the game at a level that isn't trained, taught, or fostered on anything other than a raiding server is an exercise in pure futility. There's only so long you can grind wipes before morale gives out, because after the 500th pull, the fight really just isn't fun or interesting anymore.

Yeah i agree with this, you get poetics and laws from nearly everything you do in the game, are people rushing the quest to become the world first or something?
Seems to me that people are complaining about it because they cant finish it in a week.

It was never meant to be a better weapon than a savage, but an alternative to people who dont raid savage.
The only grind is if you are in a rush to finish the weapon or if it's your main focus.

I'll agree the step is a little too steep for just being the second step in the entire questline, but the amount of complaints it's getting is just silly, people are acting like it's a equivalent to legendary weapons in WoW, it's not.

No people are complaining because they haven't learned from their mistakes. We didn't want ARR Relic again, hell we didn't want ARR again, we wanted growth. We wanted something new. Something more engaging and fun. The relics are 100% similar to WoW legendaries. They both require commitment, time, and some effort, except they DRASTICALLY pale in comparison to the awe factor (speaking from one of the early people to have a Shadowmourne when it was relevant).

exactly what I m talking about....
I mean the weapon is meant for a battle class and pretty much everything you d normaly do on a battle class gives you stuff. It just takes time.
It also made content that has not been relevant in a while relevant again so I see no harm in it

Content could be relevant if it was tuned appropriately and offered meaningful rewards.

Alright so disregard the relic, why again are you not doing savage since you d rather do something challenging instead of grind? Also your comparison to wow is terrible.... Considering I quit wow completely due to exactly what you mentioned how is 1 year of zero content comparable AT ALL to content patches for both casual midcore and hardcore audiences every 3.5 months? The anima weapon patch isn't even a major content patch but an in between thing we got merely 1 month after a major patch

There are a few GLARING flaws in your argument here:

1) Savage is challenging, and arguably too challenging for some. For instance my static couldn't get A3S down. We broke our spirits and hearts out trying to beat it without replacing weak links. We could have raided more, but some of us didn't have a lot of time to commit. Again similar to the grind, there's only so long you can bang your head on a wall before it's no longer enjoyable. It becomes a non-engaging or rewarding grind, AKA BAD.

2) WE DO NOT get content EVERY 3.5 months for all 3 audiences. That's the most inaccurate statement I think I've ever seen made on MMO champion. Hardcore get 4 bosses every 7+ months. Casuals get the same. Midcore get 1-2 bosses every 7 months. Every other patch caters to a different audience, not all of them.

[Deleted]

Then don't do it?
It's not as if the relic is mandatory.
We all knew it was going to be a long ass grind as almost all of the 2.x steps were insane grinds too.

500x Garuda for 5 item levels, anyone?
Merciless myth farming (weekly limit) for Animus books?
Absurdly low % dungeon drops?
ATMA 1.0?

Ya, I'm not doing it - but I'm also complaining about it being a bad design choice.

SE themselves said "if it's not fun, it's bad"
Everyone complained about 2.0 Relics, yet they did the same shit again?! And now everyone is just "what did you expect" - Well, something better. Fuck man, even Yoshi said he doesn't want to do it! - So what is this shit about? It's *bad*.

Look at what you wrote, you are doing it too!

[Katchii]

lol casuals up in this bitch

Oh shut up...

"Casuals" are almost exactly who the fucking weapon is aimed at, since they're not likely to be farming A4S or even Thordan Ex.

The fact that the "casuals" are the ones complaining about this, with more or less relevant feedback, just goes to show how disappointing this is.

Yeah it's not hard, and won't take that much effort. The point is, people have been grinding this same content essentially since Heavensward release. Now, the weapon quest is asking you to continue farming shit you've already farmed 1000x. It's boring, uninspired, unoriginal, and not at all "fun."

[Madruga]

Oh shut up...

"Casuals" are almost exactly who the fucking weapon is aimed at, since they're not likely to be farming A4S or even Thordan Ex.

The fact that the "casuals" are the ones complaining about this, with more or less relevant feedback, just goes to show how disappointing this is.

Yeah it's not hard, and won't take that much effort. The point is, people have been grinding this same content essentially since Heavensward release. Now, the weapon quest is asking you to continue farming shit you've already farmed 1000x. It's boring, uninspired, unoriginal, and not at all "fun."

I believe that, more than the grind iself, it is the timing of the Relic that is hurting a bit.

We just discovered we would be needing to farm Alexander and Tomestones after we have been doing it for quite a while. I was already long done with Alexander, having fully geared two classes using only DF and PF. And after months of doing Alex, the relic comes, and we discover we have to do MORE Alex.

If you look at the long picture, it is not THAT bad of a grind... The FATE part really goes reasonably quick, the crafted items will probably go down in price, and the unidentified can be bought with almost everything you do, even while working in alts... But the fact that you have to go back to places we had just got done is what stings a bit... Heck, I would even prefer to do 200 Coils or CTs than Alex right now.