1. #45301
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    You can hit 385+ by never touching a raid or M+ easy, it's all about doing the proper things in the proper order, and helps if you come in when both Warfronts are up and it's a timewalking week.

    You can get over 385 in less then 2 weeks with a bit of luck, not even that much.
    But a normal raider would be over 385 as well, without heavily relying on luck, thus working as intended. Because a normal raider is also likely doing all of those things plus average wf/tf drops/coins from normal raiding.

    Not only that, your example requires the stars basically aligning lol, not what I'd consider a "bit of luck".

    Quote Originally Posted by RohanV View Post
    Actually, I have a horde-side alt that I made just to see the story, and it's about i385, which is very close to a normal raider. I've only done one LFR with it (the one the Horde quest requires) and I didn't get any gear. LFR is actually a downgrade. I agree with your first two examples, but Blizzard has been very aggressive with catch-up mechanics, and it's kind of obsoleted normal mode gear-wise.
    And like I said above, a normal raider would be above i385 from raiding normal, let alone all the other stuff a non-raider would do. That's my whole point. WF/TF and other catchup mechanics does indeed blur the line, but with 100% certainty I can say on average, the ilvl curves make sense. There will always be outliers, but the curves fit logically and functionally whether we like them or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCookieGod View Post
    Just swinging by to say hi. Heroic/mythic raider who never does m+ because I despise it. So there goes that theory. =p
    You didn't even do your weekly 10 most weeks? Like literally never or just one a week and done? Maybe I shouldn't have said never, but it was obviously hyperbole, but an overwhelming majority of heroic raiders likely do SOME M+.

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    It was really bad going into Uldir actually, and that was before catchup. I went in with entirely 340 and quite a few 350 pieces and basically nothing in normal was an upgrade.

    However the guild we ran was mostly casual level and we carried a lot of people so.... it was a lot of no upgrade weeks while people spent hours figuring out simple mechanics... was not fun.

    Miss when you used to go in with blues and things were actually upgrades in normal.
    Intro raids always suffer from this issue, we could argue about it being good or bad, but I'm inclined to agree so no need here. Now your comment about missing going in with blues and finding upgrades. That's fair criticism.

    But let me ask you this - in older days raids were sequential. I.e. couldn't go to Dazar'alor without clearing Uldir first. Much like in ARR where you couldn't go to SCoB without first clearing CoB. Do you believe this design to be better in general over the design both WoW and FF14 have shifted to (raids being completely isolated and compensated via catch up mechanics)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    You're not going to have a clear ilevel delineation between the different tiers/ types of players, that's all I'm saying.
    Clear is subjective and I think the crux of our inability to see eye to eye. I know with 95%+ certainty who is what kind of raider strictly by ilvl when recruiting for M+ or pug raids. If I see someone well above me I know they're Mythic. If I see someone around me (I'm one of the lowest ilvl in the guild) I know they're heroic, and sure enough a quick review of their gear shows me to be correct. To me, that's clear, but maybe to others, if it's not a hardcoded ilvl difference (a la FF14, old WoW) it's not clear. That make sense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    Maybe it's a Region thing then. Since WoW has been full of absolute mouthbreathers for years for me. Yet at least the mouthbreathers I've come across in FFXIV have been at least nice People.
    What region are you in? FF14 is on average a MUCH nicer community. You'll never hear me say otherwise, but it's also creepily hypocritical and people come off as fake nice far more often than I'm comfortable with.

    Sidebar, one of my WoW buddies (he's our guilds main healer, and a phenomenal player) is playing BRD right now leveling up and really enjoying FF14 (he's a weeb so he likes the aesthetic of FF14 much more than WoW). We did Sastasha last night for the first time and I was healing (hint, I don't ever heal).

    I let the tank die twice. Granted I was top DPS in the dungeon LOL. I apologized for each death and owned my mistakes. FYI, whole party were sprouts but me. The tank didn't mind. He laughed it off. My buddy was surprised, he was blown away that no one was mad and we were laughing about it. I was like this is normal for the most part, it will be much more like WoW once you hit end game, but during leveling especially with the sprout icon people don't take stuff that harshly. I told him that owning mistakes is a very quick way to diffuse a hostile situation (not that this was one), but it's why you never hear me make excuses or blame the tank.

    I learned that if you DPS too hard you can legit go OOM. I had no idea. I also learned that sometimes tanks just die from 50% to 0. I don't even know how. It never happens to me LOL. I admit I was practicing skirting the line so I knew some failure was a possibility.
    Last edited by Wrecktangle; 2019-05-31 at 01:20 PM.

  2. #45302
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Heh, looks like multiboxers.
    I've only seen these in the ARR areas of the game, none in Heavensward or in Stormblood. Wonder if the bots just stop at a certain level but then again leveling doesn't really change at any point..

    But in the early game there were times when every other player character I saw had it's name "mumbled"..

    Oh, bots probably spam the deep dungeon when it's available, that's why they never appear at high levels!

  3. #45303
    Scarab Lord Kaelwryn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragothica View Post
    I've only seen these in the ARR areas of the game, none in Heavensward or in Stormblood. Wonder if the bots just stop at a certain level but then again leveling doesn't really change at any point..

    But in the early game there were times when every other player character I saw had it's name "mumbled"..

    Oh, bots probably spam the deep dungeon when it's available, that's why they never appear at high levels!
    Bots, iirc, generally farm Amdapor Keep for gold.

  4. #45304
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Kami Dende View Post
    Maybe it's a Region thing then. Since WoW has been full of absolute mouthbreathers for years for me. Yet at least the mouthbreathers I've come across in FFXIV have been at least nice People.
    Wreck consistently has infinite problems with roulette players and yet not one single other person has even half of his claimed terrible experiences. I don't get it either. I've called him a magnet for it before.

  5. #45305
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    Intro raids always suffer from this issue, we could argue about it being good or bad, but I'm inclined to agree so no need here. Now your comment about missing going in with blues and finding upgrades. That's fair criticism.

    But let me ask you this - in older days raids were sequential. I.e. couldn't go to Dazar'alor without clearing Uldir first. Much like in ARR where you couldn't go to SCoB without first clearing CoB. Do you believe this design to be better in general over the design both WoW and FF14 have shifted to (raids being completely isolated and compensated via catch up mechanics)?
    I honestly kind of prefer the sequential raids, at least from a lore progression stand point. I understand from a purely game play perspective they're not ideal, but the journey of going through the content in the difficulty order it was intended, in the big baddie power order that's introduced just feels more Epic to me. Like you really are organically growing in power and tackling bigger and badder enemies. In today's raid environment, it doesn't really feel that way since you're almost handed the gear necessary to hop into the newer raids quickly without ever having to set foot in the older raid, the lore and story of the previous raids and why you're progressing from one to the other doesn't even matter. It's just game play, which should always be at the forefront, but IMO not at the expense of all else.

    I'd likely feel differently if I hopped into the game really late and then had to hoof it through all the previous raids in order to see the current stuff...that would not be a good feeling either. At least with LFR and the Allied Raid roulette you're still likely to get a group together for it if you really want to see it. The only alternative I could see that wouldn't be too egregious would be, after a certain amount of time, having a dungeon level version of the raid that you could queue for solo that would allow you to progress and unlock the subsequent raids to preserve that epic adventure journey feel. Since you could get the ilevel required to join the newer raid quickly anyway, gear wouldn't be why you'd need to go to the older stuff.

    Clear is subjective and I think the crux of our inability to see eye to eye. I know with 95%+ certainty who is what kind of raider strictly by ilvl when recruiting for M+ or pug raids. If I see someone well above me I know they're Mythic. If I see someone around me (I'm one of the lowest ilvl in the guild) I know they're heroic, and sure enough a quick review of their gear shows me to be correct. To me, that's clear, but maybe to others, if it's not a hardcoded ilvl difference (a la FF14, old WoW) it's not clear. That make sense?
    Yeah, that makes sense. Not denying that a pretty easily identifiable curve still exists, just saying that where certain people fall on the curve at any given time isn't so black and white. Any veteran MMO player would be able to eyeball someone and get a sense of what kind of content they do, especially with meters going, you can quickly tell the difference between a casual player and a more dedicated high end content runner, even when they're the same/ similar ilevel.

    Maybe a better way to put it, for me anyway, is ilevel alone isn't enough (though it's a reasonable enough gauge), it's which pieces of gear they have and what kind of ilevel spread they have.

    What region are you in? FF14 is on average a MUCH nicer community. You'll never hear me say otherwise, but it's also creepily hypocritical and people come off as fake nice far more often than I'm comfortable with.
    Long story short, I play on Primal (Excalibur specifically) and see pretty much the same mixture of people in FFXIV as I do in WoW, personality/ disposition wise. The difference is in FFXIV, there's a lot more little spats in dungeons where people get all butthurt and defensive when they get called out for not doing their job. However, if no one says anything, or the one who made the mistake, it NEVER escalates everyone just kind of laughs it off and moves on...unless it's REALLY REALLY egregiously bad. Like that tank only doing Shield Throw you had the pleasure of grouping with.

    I blame that on the fact that meters aren't practically universal in FFXIV, and are technically against the ToS (as you know all too well, lol), so the little shits actually have a leg to stand on in their defense of their behavior at least as far as the game rules are concerned.

    Sidebar, one of my WoW buddies (he's our guilds main healer, and a phenomenal player) is playing BRD right now leveling up and really enjoying FF14 (he's a weeb so he likes the aesthetic of FF14 much more than WoW). We did Sastasha last night for the first time and I was healing (hint, I don't ever heal).

    I let the tank die twice. Granted I was top DPS in the dungeon LOL. I apologized for each death and owned my mistakes. FYI, whole party were sprouts but me. The tank didn't mind. He laughed it off. My buddy was surprised, he was blown away that no one was mad and we were laughing about it. I was like this is normal for the most part, it will be much more like WoW once you hit end game, but during leveling especially with the sprout icon people don't take stuff that harshly. I told him that owning mistakes is a very quick way to diffuse a hostile situation (not that this was one), but it's why you never hear me make excuses or blame the tank.

    I learned that if you DPS too hard you can legit go OOM. I had no idea. I also learned that sometimes tanks just die from 50% to 0. I don't even know how. It never happens to me LOL. I admit I was practicing skirting the line so I knew some failure was a possibility.
    Yeah, pretty much my experience too. As long as no one really says anything "rude" and whoever makes the mistake owns up to it, things go extremely smoothly.

  6. #45306
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    Intro raids always suffer from this issue, we could argue about it being good or bad, but I'm inclined to agree so no need here. Now your comment about missing going in with blues and finding upgrades. That's fair criticism.

    But let me ask you this - in older days raids were sequential. I.e. couldn't go to Dazar'alor without clearing Uldir first. Much like in ARR where you couldn't go to SCoB without first clearing CoB. Do you believe this design to be better in general over the design both WoW and FF14 have shifted to (raids being completely isolated and compensated via catch up mechanics)?
    IDK about sequential, I do kind of like the period between like Wrath and MoP, maybe into WoD, where you didn't just IGNORE older raids. I'm really not a fan of this "seasonal" approach that wow has implemented now, where the old is just negated though.

  7. #45307
    Scarab Lord Kaelwryn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Wreck consistently has infinite problems with roulette players and yet not one single other person has even half of his claimed terrible experiences. I don't get it either. I've called him a magnet for it before.
    Personally I am of the opinion that the two communities aren't that different from each other. You'll find bad players and jerks in both, but I feel like WoW's community is just more open about being a jerk. Idk, I play solo most of the time, and the most I do is lfr in wow and normal/alliance raids in 14.

    I will also say that I feel like in general, when it comes to like answering questions, people are more polite in 14. In WoW, most of the time when I see someone ask for help in general chat, you're usually mocked, told to google it or (rarely in my experience) actually get helpful advice. In 14, most people are usually happy to be like 'oh you do x, y and z'.

    All in all, I haven't had that many bad experiences in either game but if I had to say which one I had more in it would be WoW. People are imo more aggressive and more intolerant of things they don't approve of. Whereas I don't really see that as much in 14, and whether that's a good or bad thing is...not something I will argue but I feel like 14 lets a lot more shit slide by.

  8. #45308
    The Insane Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Wreck consistently has infinite problems with roulette players and yet not one single other person has even half of his claimed terrible experiences. I don't get it either. I've called him a magnet for it before.
    Haha, maybe he just pays way too much attention to what others do and is easily triggered?
    I mean I get many a player that are sub par but since it is close to never a problem regarding actual completion of the content I just shrug it off and chuckle accordingly.

    Then again, I would never do ex or savage with randoms for that very reason. I never did random raid in WoW too because when you start wiping due to incompetence is when the fun stops.

  9. #45309
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Haha, maybe he just pays way too much attention to what others do and is easily triggered?
    I mean I get many a player that are sub par but since it is close to never a problem regarding actual completion of the content I just shrug it off and chuckle accordingly.

    Then again, I would never do ex or savage with randoms for that very reason. I never did random raid in WoW too because when you start wiping due to incompetence is when the fun stops.
    They only time I personally have Roulette issues ALWAYS seems to be The Vault and ALWAYS seems to be with undergeared tanks.... don't know why that in particular.

  10. #45310
    EDIT: - also to anyone who wants to play, I'm on Behemoth (Primal), main a 70 PLD, and will gladly run stuff or help out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Wreck consistently has infinite problems with roulette players and yet not one single other person has even half of his claimed terrible experiences. I don't get it either. I've called him a magnet for it before.
    Nah not a magnet, and for evidence that it isn't just me feel free to read: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ry.-Let-s-vent.

    But in all seriousness, it's not infinite, but it does happen. Your average player just simply isn't as aware as I am, and for the ones who are good enough, what % actually care enough to look? At this point you're talking about a subset of a subset, which is why it seems rare when really it's pretty common.

    I think I've only ever detailed maybe 6-7 events over the course of 6 years, hardly "infinite"

    Quote Originally Posted by Katchii View Post
    I honestly kind of prefer the sequential raids, at least from a lore progression stand point. I understand from a purely game play perspective they're not ideal, but the journey of going through the content in the difficulty order it was intended
    There's merits and challenges to both approaches. I can't say for sure which I prefer. I remember recruiting for raiders back in CoB days was fucking aids trying to find, but I do remember enjoying the experience of sequential raids:

    • A player who is the job you need
    • A player who is as skilled as you need
    • A player who is progressed and doesn't need to be caught up
    • A player who is on your realm, or would be willing to transfer

    This was back when you didn't have xrealm raiding. It really was fucking terrible. With xrealm allowed now, I wonder if going back would still be painful.

    Long story short, I play on Primal (Excalibur specifically) and see pretty much the same mixture of people in FFXIV as I do in WoW, personality/ disposition wise.
    LMK when you start playing again. I'll tank for you. I'm on Behemoth (Primal). I think you might be on my friends list, or at the least I remember we grouped once.

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    IDK about sequential, I do kind of like the period between like Wrath and MoP, maybe into WoD, where you didn't just IGNORE older raids. I'm really not a fan of this "seasonal" approach that wow has implemented now, where the old is just negated though.
    Fair enough, I was simply curious. How do you feel about FF14's current seasonal approach? Do you like it better than ARR's sequential? A new raid invalidates the old one immediately. Many other forms of content almost immediately negates others too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelwryn View Post
    I will also say that I feel like in general, when it comes to like answering questions, people are more polite in 14. In WoW, most of the time when I see someone ask for help in general chat, you're usually mocked, told to google it or (rarely in my experience) actually get helpful advice. In 14, most people are usually happy to be like 'oh you do x, y and z'.
    Just be very careful, while I can't recall any examples in WoW (positive or negative), I can absolutely recall numerous examples in FF14 where people have given downright false information, or at best outdated/no longer accurate. It happens at what I would consider an alarming rate.

    It's one of those things where I wish the game was clearer about a lot of its features/systems so that it wouldn't perpetuate misinformation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Haha, maybe he just pays way too much attention to what others do and is easily triggered?
    I mean I get many a player that are sub par but since it is close to never a problem regarding actual completion of the content I just shrug it off and chuckle accordingly.

    Then again, I would never do ex or savage with randoms for that very reason. I never did random raid in WoW too because when you start wiping due to incompetence is when the fun stops.
    Nah, definitely not easily triggered. You know this from the shield lob incident. I gave that dude the WHOLE dungeon to turn it around.

    Ironically enough, high end pugs are some of the best experiences I have in FF14. Less common in WoW for me, but they're still there. High End pugging is a really nice place because everyone has the exact same expectations and knows how to judge skill, and communicate and there's no oh Joey's wife is our friend, so we bring her in, despite her being 16th percentile at best.

    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    They only time I personally have Roulette issues ALWAYS seems to be The Vault and ALWAYS seems to be with undergeared tanks.... don't know why that in particular.
    Vault is overtuned compared to the dungeons that come before it, thus the game does a poor job preparing players for it. I personally didn't find it challenging at all when I went through it, but then again I also thought Pharos Sirius was one of the best dungeons in the game and we saw how the community handled that...
    Last edited by Wrecktangle; 2019-05-31 at 05:38 PM.

  11. #45311
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelwryn View Post
    Personally I am of the opinion that the two communities aren't that different from each other. You'll find bad players and jerks in both, but I feel like WoW's community is just more open about being a jerk. Idk, I play solo most of the time, and the most I do is lfr in wow and normal/alliance raids in 14.
    I think the biggest difference is that FFXIV's community is more willing to work through wipes in PuGs. Especially in trials, it's not unusually to wipe a couple of times before everyone understands the fight.

  12. #45312
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    They only time I personally have Roulette issues ALWAYS seems to be The Vault and ALWAYS seems to be with undergeared tanks.... don't know why that in particular.
    For me its a first time, undergeared tank wanting to pull the entire first winding path of bardams mettle. They always think they can do it and only end up wasting time compared to doing two or three pulls.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by RohanV View Post
    I think the biggest difference is that FFXIV's community is more willing to work through wipes in PuGs. Especially in trials, it's not unusually to wipe a couple of times before everyone understands the fight.
    Theres a lot of things i can compare and complain about WoW compared to FFXIV in terms of games design but the playerbase one -and it started around wrath with the dungeon finder and never got better- was the idea of "well we wiped once, time to leave the group, even if it means a debuff". I have never seen that behaviour in any game like WoW. At least in FFXIV's case the sprout icon and a simple "okay who doesnt know this fight?" works wonders but still lately i'll see some people say "i'm new but want to learn, please dont spoil this boss" because this deep into an expansion everyone else knows their role enough that a wipe has to be something like a healer dc or something and thats never a reason to ragequit. Especially if it was a long queue.
    http://theeorzeanfrontier.blogspot.co.uk/ Neckbeard rambling about this weeaboo trash

  13. #45313
    Scarab Lord Kaelwryn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RohanV View Post
    I think the biggest difference is that FFXIV's community is more willing to work through wipes in PuGs. Especially in trials, it's not unusually to wipe a couple of times before everyone understands the fight.
    mhm, I've definitely had a few runs in wow where even after multiple wipes people stayed but I feel like people are a lot quicker to leave after the first or second wipe. 14, usually people stick around but there's still a few people who will dip immediately. As a whole, I think most people are willing to fix kinks or...atleast willing to throw themselves at the problem repeatedly.

    To touch a bit on what dope_danny said, normally i wait until a wipe before saying "ok does anyone need an explanation?" because I know some people want to see the fight the first time themselves and most of the time you can get by with one or two people being new and blind to the fight. For Savage and Extreme Trials, I understand being less forgiving about that but for anything else I'm fine with giving people a chance to see things without explanation first and then if we wipe, go over what needs to be corrected.

  14. #45314
    Quote Originally Posted by dope_danny View Post
    Theres a lot of things i can compare and complain about WoW compared to FFXIV in terms of games design but the playerbase one -and it started around wrath with the dungeon finder and never got better- was the idea of "well we wiped once, time to leave the group, even if it means a debuff". I have never seen that behaviour in any game like WoW. At least in FFXIV's case the sprout icon and a simple "okay who doesnt know this fight?" works wonders but still lately i'll see some people say "i'm new but want to learn, please dont spoil this boss" because this deep into an expansion everyone else knows their role enough that a wipe has to be something like a healer dc or something and thats never a reason to ragequit. Especially if it was a long queue.
    Had a sprout running Neverreap recently and we didn't tell him any of the fights, we just started doing them. On the totems fight, there was a point where they typed ??? but the rest of us were still doing it. We handled an add popping up. Next round, they type "Oh! You gotta get the totems out of that circle right?" and replies were just "Yep!" and "Yeah, if we don't, they turn into that add and gotta kill it." If we had any issues, I'd have explained it up front, but everything seemed super smooth (other than me tanking in some less than stellar spots forgetting tornado paths -- woops) so I hadn't.

    I personally love seeing fights blind and figuring them out. Drives one of our FC members nuts since they want to read up and watch videos on everything before going into any of the content.


    One of my first dungeon runs back after a break in WoW was a 1 wipe and tank dropped, resulting in the group disbanding. It was disheartening to see the "well 1 error = go back in queue for 30+ minutes" situation, but I didn't have any issues after that. Honestly most of my return visit in Legion was pretty pleasant, though I will note that dungeon runs through Party Finder were 100% dead silent more often without even the cordial hellos at the start.


    I've also noticed an uptick in people not realizing MSQ didn't let you skip cut scenes (or that they got more xp than they used to) as they were long lapsed returners. And a lot of new people running dungeons for the first time, or at least first time on that character.
    Last edited by Faroth; 2019-05-31 at 06:47 PM.

  15. #45315
    I know a lot of healers are upset about the job updates, but I am very happy about what they have done for the jobs I main (SMN & RDM). The redesign to Summoner especially looks great.

  16. #45316
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    They only time I personally have Roulette issues ALWAYS seems to be The Vault and ALWAYS seems to be with undergeared tanks.... don't know why that in particular.
    The Vault, I think, is just at that weird gear/ mob transition point in Heavensward where the mobs get a big increase in health and damage and the tanks are expected to be geared well enough to handle it, but the character themselves is still leveling up and doesn't have their full kit or gear yet.

    The dungeon is also a pretty rough one for healers, especially that last boss. Both the tank and healers need to be on point for it to be a successful run.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    There's merits and challenges to both approaches. I can't say for sure which I prefer. I remember recruiting for raiders back in CoB days was fucking aids trying to find, but I do remember enjoying the experience of sequential raids:

    • A player who is the job you need
    • A player who is as skilled as you need
    • A player who is progressed and doesn't need to be caught up
    • A player who is on your realm, or would be willing to transfer

    This was back when you didn't have xrealm raiding. It really was fucking terrible. With xrealm allowed now, I wonder if going back would still be painful.
    Yeah the progression requirement on the sequential raids will be the sticking point. Finding the right person to fill a spot in a lter raid would feel amazing and you'd feel really lucky about it, and the opposite would be true too...having a newbie finding a group willing to back and help them progress through the prequel raids o get to the point where they're actually progressing in current content.

    I think overall, that relationship is a healthy one because it kind of forces the players to work together to help each other out. The current WoW paradigm that feels like the new raid completely eclipses and obsoletes the previous one doesn't really encourage that same community feeling in the same way.

    As you said, they both have pros and cons, but long term I think the sequential raids design feels better, both story/ lore wise and community building/ teamwork.

    LMK when you start playing again. I'll tank for you. I'm on Behemoth (Primal). I think you might be on my friends list, or at the least I remember we grouped once.
    We grouped together in early Stormblood when Extreme Lakshmi was current, because that was the fight we did. Was a good time.

    I have a sub going right now, but rarely sign on. I have all the classes at 70 (except crafting and gathering, blech), have finished up all the main and side story content, have completed the normal raid, Alliance raid, and have no blue "+" quests (except the leve quest in Kugane, which is only for crafters and gatherers anyway) left to be completed. My quest log is empty.

    There's nothing really left that I care to do except the Namazu beast tribe quest just to finish that reputation and subsequent beast tribe story quest...and I'm not particularly worried about that. It will still be around later. Maybe bird or doggo farm, but I'm not all that enthused to grind the shit out of content for RNG drops, though that Kyuubi mount is pretty awesome.

    The only other activity that I could do is grind for tomes to buy level 60 tome gear for Dancer and Gunbreaker, but normal gear will suffice just fine for them since I'll likely be leveling them through HoH and the odd roulette, so that seems pointless.

    I haven't decided which I'll level first, Dancer or Gunbreaker. Gunbreaker looks awesome, but I'm quite intrigued by Dancer and have a feeling a well played Dancer will be in demand for content later on.

    Fair enough, I was simply curious. How do you feel about FF14's current seasonal approach? Do you like it better than ARR's sequential? A new raid invalidates the old one immediately. Many other forms of content almost immediately negates others too.
    While the new raid invalidates the old one as soon as it's released, you still have to complete the previous raid at least once to unlock the new one. I'm fine with that approach.

    As for new dungeons almost completely invalidating the old ones, I think that's pretty dumb given the overall FFXIV approach. If they capped ilevel in the dungeons to a relatively low cap to still make them somewhat challenging while still providing drops that matched the highest ilevel dungeon drops (at least in all the dungeons released at max level, leveling ones are fine as is, though this process could still apply).

    There are some dungeons I've seen only the one time I needed to run it to unlock it for the roulette, and then never again. I spent most of my time in Stormblood leveling alts, so I rarely did the Expert roulette, I just made sure i completed the quests and unlocked everything that dropped in each patch before going back to alt job leveling.

    Just be very careful, while I can't recall any examples in WoW (positive or negative), I can absolutely recall numerous examples in FF14 where people have given downright false information, or at best outdated/no longer accurate. It happens at what I would consider an alarming rate.
    I've seen this in both games. I don't pay that much attention to it as in either game I'm usually out in the world doing stuff so don't see city chat often to be part of where most of this occurs. That said, I think because I honestly see more people actually providing information in chat in FFXIV vs WoW (where a lot of times it's just snarky remarks and not ACTUAL information), I see more misinformation in FFXIV.

    It's one of those things where I wish the game was clearer about a lot of its features/systems so that it wouldn't perpetuate misinformation.
    Totally agreed. I bought a friend of mine the complete edition of FFXIV as a gift and am now helping him through the game, where it's actually possible for me to play with him and help out. He's no stranger to MMOs, having played WoW for years, but there are a LOT of examples where I have to provide clarification or even straight up descriptions and guidance on how certain things in this game work that are not clearly explained...or explained at all.

    I take for granted the weeks right after launch where everyone was figuring stuff out and sharing information that wasn't clear for just basic game features, and the time I've been playing since then where I found a neat trick or shortcut that improves the experience just that little bit more.

    It's mind blowing how many little things there are that distract from truly enjoying the game.

    Nah, definitely not easily triggered. You know this from the shield lob incident. I gave that dude the WHOLE dungeon to turn it around.

    Ironically enough, high end pugs are some of the best experiences I have in FF14. Less common in WoW for me, but they're still there. High End pugging is a really nice place because everyone has the exact same expectations and knows how to judge skill, and communicate and there's no oh Joey's wife is our friend, so we bring her in, despite her being 16th percentile at best.
    I'll agree here, high end like minded PuGs are very enjoyable. My issue is that by the time I'm usually geared enough to participate and really want to try them out, the new raid or content is out and the good, fun players have moved on and I'm stuck trying to fit in with the dregs who'll accept me. And that is NOT fun.

    It's like traveling. I don't know very many people (translated: zero) who will gush about how much they love the ACTUAL traveling bit: packing, buying plane tickets/booking the trip and dealing with those logistics, getting to the airport, getting on and being on the plane...but pretty much everyone I know will tell you how much they LOVED being at their destination.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fappy View Post
    I know a lot of healers are upset about the job updates, but I am very happy about what they have done for the jobs I main (SMN & RDM). The redesign to Summoner especially looks great.
    Completely agreed. I'm excited for both SMN and RDM, but with how the game play looks for Gunbreaker, I'm still having difficulty choosing what class to level first. I already have accepted the fact that the first few days into the expansion will be dedicated to me leveling both Dancer AND Gunbreaker, if not to 70, at least far enough to get a good grasp on which i'll enjoy more.

  17. #45317
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    Fair enough, I was simply curious. How do you feel about FF14's current seasonal approach? Do you like it better than ARR's sequential? A new raid invalidates the old one immediately. Many other forms of content almost immediately negates others too.
    I really don't see it as as much of a problem with XIV in that XIV handles old content a lot better, in my opinion obviously. Also, yes, if you're caught up you can just move on to the next raid and never look back, but when you first level a new role and don't have a lot of gear or tomestones around you can actually make a case for needing to do older content because you won't have the ilvl to do the newer stuff.

  18. #45318
    Quote Originally Posted by Graeham II View Post
    I wonder if another crossover event will be announced at E3? The Monster Hunter World crossover was announced there last year, after all.
    The nier automata raid is a crossover. It’s already been announced.

  19. #45319
    The Insane Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    They only time I personally have Roulette issues ALWAYS seems to be The Vault and ALWAYS seems to be with undergeared tanks.... don't know why that in particular.
    Well vault is one of the first dungeons where the bosses have pretty heal intensive mechanics.
    So I can see some tanks underestimating it.

    Shouldn't be much of a problem with a competent healer, I healed that @i120 back when I leveled at the start of Heavensward. Dicey but doable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    Ironically enough, high end pugs are some of the best experiences I have in FF14. Less common in WoW for me, but they're still there. High End pugging is a really nice place because everyone has the exact same expectations and knows how to judge skill, and communicate and there's no oh Joey's wife is our friend, so we bring her in, despite her being 16th percentile at best.
    Heh, I'd never make it into one of these. I don't take the game seriously enough for that.
    Good to know they exist though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fappy View Post
    I know a lot of healers are upset about the job updates
    As a WHM I didn't see any changes worth mentioning except rather extreme homogenization (WHM basically gets SCHs Aether flow mechanic as a gimmick including indo and revi).

    "How ... unimaginative." /Zoltun Kulle

  20. #45320
    Quote Originally Posted by Fappy View Post
    I know a lot of healers are upset about the job updates, but I am very happy about what they have done for the jobs I main (SMN & RDM). The redesign to Summoner especially looks great.
    my main heal job is AST and honestly it looks like its gotten dumbed down to get people who weren't playing it to try it to spite those of us who enjoy it as is now, but i get the feeling the healers are going to change again before the years over since we've been down this road with things like the anti movement BRD/MCH period.

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    Just got an email saying they finally charged me for the physical collectors edition and aside from BotW's its the first big pricey special edition for a game i've bought since Wrath of the Lich Kings. Have they actually confirmed how early access works for physical this time? i registered the code for the gremlin pet and xp boost heirloom earrings like two months ago so is that just going to count as adding the license?
    http://theeorzeanfrontier.blogspot.co.uk/ Neckbeard rambling about this weeaboo trash

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