1. #50901
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    I wonder what kind of copium I'll see in response to this.
    Show me the WoW one and we'll see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Lets be honest: These places are horrible, especially when you do more than one relic weapon.
    They are designed around everyone using the consumables but most people can't be arsed. If you use ACT you will see the ridiculously low DPS and the reason why the place takes 40m+ when it could be done in 20.

    While the additional actions can be fun, I hope SE never designs content like that again. It just sucks when you waste so much of your time to people being bad and lazy.

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    To be expected. We are in a pre expansion content drought, even diehard fans like my buddies and me largely took a vacation from the game (they basically raidlog right now).
    I don't think it is (except castrum which was overtuned). You can clear it no problem without the powers. It just takes longer.

    The power system is unintuitive though. I don't think there should be charges/uses. You should just unlock the powers and choose 2 active ones.
    That way people would use them more and we wouldn't see "saving for a rainy day".
    Also... they probably went overboard with how many there are and some odd implementations.

    It can be improved, but i really like Bozja/Zednos and i do think the game benefits from having this kind of optional end content. I hope to see more.

  2. #50902
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    ok I'll bite:

    Wow, so it's still at and above shadowbringers release levels?
    That's quite amazing
    I didn't say the game was doing bad, just that "big exodus" lasted all of two months, which is a definition of fad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    Show me the WoW one and we'll see.
    I guess WoW is really living rent-free in your heads if it's the only thing you can talk about in FFXIV thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Looking for Raid.
    They never found one though

  3. #50903
    Quote Originally Posted by RampageBW1 View Post
    I just now watched the Launch Trailer for Shadowbringers, and holy crap, you are right. It even ends with the true nature of both Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

    Square needs to learn the difference between hype and spoilers.
    I have been avoiding any story details and looking at footage of the new zones and dungeons past the fan fest and the job trailer.
    It was really fun going into Shadowbringers and not knowing what to expect until i saw it. I want to try and keep that feeling for Endwalker.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    I didn't say the game was doing bad, just that "big exodus" lasted all of two months, which is a definition of fad.

    I guess WoW is really living rent-free in your heads if it's the only thing you can talk about in FFXIV thread.
    I do play WoW too. Am i not allowed to criticize it? I think i am.

  4. #50904
    Quote Originally Posted by RampageBW1 View Post
    I just now watched the Launch Trailer for Shadowbringers, and holy crap, you are right. It even ends with the true nature of both Zodiark and Hydaelyn.

    Square needs to learn the difference between hype and spoilers.
    I think it's perfect. Yes, outside of Shadowbringers it's a huge spoiler, but compared to the rest of the story it's pretty minor.

  5. #50905
    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    I do play WoW too. Am i not allowed to criticize it? I think i am.
    You can criticize whatever you want. What I have problem with is when you see FFXIV population graph in FFXIV thread and your first reflex is to ask "But what about WoW?". That's just pointless derailing.
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Looking for Raid.
    They never found one though

  6. #50906
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    You can criticize whatever you want. What I have problem with is when you see FFXIV population graph in FFXIV thread and your first reflex is to ask "But what about WoW?". That's just pointless derailing.
    You yourself were talking about the "big exodus". Which is obviously a reference to WoW-players leaving the game.
    So why exactly did you post the FFXIV chart then, when my comment about how well FFXIV does considering it's the end of an expansion cycle (without ever mentioning WoW) is also not what you wanted to talk about?

    What is that "copium" you wanted to hear about? What do FFXIV have to cope with? That not every single player from that "WoW exodus" left for FFXIV and became a permanent resident? Pretty sure there are other games people try out, like New World and stuff like that.
    Pretty sure even FFXIV players try it out until Novemeber.

    But the steamchart has shown me that FFXIV has now more players than ever. And it's not even just the "free trial" version because that's listed as its own game
    Last edited by KrayZ33; 2021-10-16 at 08:15 AM.

  7. #50907
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    You yourself were talking about the "big exodus". Which is obviously a reference to WoW-players leaving the game.
    So why exactly did you post the FFXIV chart then, when my comment about how well FFXIV does considering it's the end of an expansion cycle (without ever mentioning WoW) is also not what you wanted to talk about?

    What is that "copium" you wanted to hear about? What do FFXIV have to cope with? That not every single player from that "WoW exodus" left for FFXIV and became a permanent resident? Pretty sure there are other games people try out, like New World and stuff like that.
    Pretty sure even FFXIV players try it out until Novemeber.

    But the steamchart has shown me that FFXIV has now more players than ever. And it's not even just the "free trial" version because that's listed as its own game
    Is it so hard to read what exactly people are replying to? I'll do it for you this time. Chart was posted in reply to this
    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    Regardless this is because the "copium" users tend to dismiss FF as a fad and that things will go back to business as usual. Which is a high degree of bad perspective.
    The only reason I used the word "copium" is indirect quote, I tend not to use Twitch jargon even on Twitch itself. The chart clearly shows that numbers are down to where they were in June before the big surge of players, so most of bandwagoners apparently left in droves. This was at the start of September, so New World isn't a big factor. I doubt it's affected FFXIV at all, they are on two different ends of MMO spectrum.
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Looking for Raid.
    They never found one though

  8. #50908
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    Is it so hard to read what exactly people are replying to? I'll do it for you this time. Chart was posted in reply to this

    The only reason I used the word "copium" is indirect quote, I tend not to use Twitch jargon even on Twitch itself. The chart clearly shows that numbers are down to where they were in June before the big surge of players, so most of bandwagoners apparently left in droves. This was at the start of September, so New World isn't a big factor. I doubt it's affected FFXIV at all, they are on two different ends of MMO spectrum.

    So if you are directly and only answering to Swnem you shouldn't use phrases like (while quoting him, mind you)
    "I guess WoW is really living rent-free in your heads if it's the only thing you can talk about in FFXIV thread. "
    Implying like he speaks for everyone and that FFXIV players have to cope with anything.
    Obviously people think your intentions are different then.
    Last edited by KrayZ33; 2021-10-16 at 08:50 AM.

  9. #50909
    The Insane Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    I don't think there should be charges/uses.
    Agreed. Most people can't be arsed to farm for that nonsense, so they simply don't use it, since the stuff is clearable w/o it.
    The powers do make a rather insane difference though. Easily x2 the output, if not more if used correctly.

  10. #50910
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    So if you are directly and only answering to Swnem you shouldn't use phrases like (while quoting him, mind you)

    Implying like he speaks for everyone and that FFXIV players have to cope with anything.
    Obviously people think your intentions are different then.
    No, it was about people who can't say anything good about the game without mentioning WoW, which is a fair share of recent joiners to this subforum and the game in general. This "us vs them" mentality and rabid defense, as if FFXIV is a sieged castle and every dissenter is an enemy agent who deserves to be thrown of the walls, is a regular part of r/ffxiv and other circlejerks, but this subforum was mostly above it.
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Looking for Raid.
    They never found one though

  11. #50911
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    I didn't say the game was doing bad, just that "big exodus" lasted all of two months, which is a definition of fad.
    This only makes sense if you assume they checked it out and went back to WoW. What evidence is there of that? Unless their homecoming to WoW was to just listen to the menu music, I don't see it. So the "exodus" remains, they just didn't all land in and stay in FF14. Some might be playing NW, others may have just given up on MMOs, or dispersed to others.

  12. #50912
    Quote Originally Posted by BiggestNoob View Post
    SGE is overpowered based on the tooltips (and general mechanics), which is unlikely to be fixed before the first savage tier, so everyone is going to be SGE/AST.

    SE is horribly opaque when it comes to game development. All of this could be on a PTR right now for people to test out (not just creators and journalists, who are all being given gifts for some reason) and get feedback/iterate on, and instead it's going to be crunch mode to get every issue fixed within a month, which will be an utter failure, causing a meta to form that's going to persist for the next year in the mentality of the playerbase.

    For a company that's homogenized so much to try and seek extreme balance, this is a Blizzard/Hazzikostas level move.
    But if theres a ptr then the content will be already known and for a story based mmo that a big no
    Quote Originally Posted by TrollHunter3000 View Post
    How the fuck is this trolling?

    Discussing moderation is against the rules. Infracted.

  13. #50913
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormdash View Post
    This only makes sense if you assume they checked it out and went back to WoW. What evidence is there of that? Unless their homecoming to WoW was to just listen to the menu music, I don't see it. So the "exodus" remains, they just didn't all land in and stay in FF14. Some might be playing NW, others may have just given up on MMOs, or dispersed to others.
    There's also "The Great Filter!"

    Relating to my own experience the first time i dipped my toes into the game (around 8.3 in wow)... It was overall a positive experience. But it wasnt a captivating experience. I got through the initial starter area quest line, visited the other cities, looked at a few houses, popped to the gold saucer... figured, this game has some fun aspects to it, but its incredibly overwhelming.

    Relating to my second attempt (from feb 2021 onwards): I could see the flaws a bit more clearly in that early game experience. The big ones might be: a) the poor pacing of class abilities. My rogue really felt this. b) the very wordy quest dialogue. c) The sheer amount of teleporting to objectives. d) (related to c), the time you spend not actively playing the game, but watching it. Oh, bonus e) the LITERAL pain in the ass just trying to set up your account (especially if you've tried the game before and want to carry on but forgot some feature of your identification (username/password etc)). I was almost crying in frustration whilst trying to give squeex my money.

    Anyways, the early game is the first impression. And i reckon its somewhere between those two standpoints for most players (either incredibly overwhelming or incredibly passive). And unfortunately until they do something about it, thats every new players introduction to the game... and no amount of 'I PROMISE!!! PLEASE STICK WITH IT!!! IT GETS SO MUCH BETTER!!!" is going to change someone's mind. If you get over it, the game delivers in spades. But it's hard to believe that more than 50% make it past that point (id be more inclined to believe x<30% if im honest).

    And cross-polinating other threads, but this might relate to the asmongold effect thread. Because if you like watching that streamer, and you SEE it does actually get better, perhaps those players may give the game the same second chance (i gave it) further down the line... so long as they remember their account info the first time they registered... like, seriously, why is it so fekkin bad? (I cheekily ask having lived in japan from 2005-2009 and 2011-2013 and completely understand why its a dumpster fire).
    Last edited by ippollite; 2021-10-16 at 10:49 AM.

  14. #50914
    Quote Originally Posted by BiggestNoob View Post
    SGE is overpowered based on the tooltips (and general mechanics), which is unlikely to be fixed before the first savage tier, so everyone is going to be SGE/AST.

    SE is horribly opaque when it comes to game development. All of this could be on a PTR right now for people to test out (not just creators and journalists, who are all being given gifts for some reason) and get feedback/iterate on, and instead it's going to be crunch mode to get every issue fixed within a month, which will be an utter failure, causing a meta to form that's going to persist for the next year in the mentality of the playerbase.

    For a company that's homogenized so much to try and seek extreme balance, this is a Blizzard/Hazzikostas level move.
    It doesn't matter. Just play what you want. It didn't stop players from playing other tanks in HW when DRK was op aswell.

    I hope PTR never touches this game. The media tour isn't even PTR, it's just for marketing and hype. Square actually knows how to internally test their game.

  15. #50915
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    It doesn't matter. Just play what you want. It didn't stop players from playing other tanks in HW when DRK was op aswell.

    I hope PTR never touches this game. The media tour isn't even PTR, it's just for marketing and hype. Square actually knows how to internally test their game.
    Not to mention every class has a potency buff, the potency calculations are different, and none of it is final.

  16. #50916
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogalicus View Post
    You can criticize whatever you want. What I have problem with is when you see FFXIV population graph in FFXIV thread and your first reflex is to ask "But what about WoW?". That's just pointless derailing.
    No, that is not engaging in pointless debate. That is only the steam version which released not long ago. Most people don't use steam for it as it's a different client. You need a new account for it. What you have a chart of is of Steam users that never played FF before until recently and didn't bother using the official channels. You do not in fact have even an estimate towards the game population.
    Actually, you don't even have an estimate of the PC population. This game is on PS4 and PS5 as well.

    Even looking at your charts, we can see the game had a 40-50% retention rate, which is amazing. But, i am sure you see something else on that.
    Last edited by Swnem; 2021-10-16 at 11:50 AM.

  17. #50917
    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    No, that is not engaging in pointless debate. That is only the steam version which released not long ago. Most people don't use steam for it as it's a different client. You need a new account for it. What you have a chart of is of Steam users that never played FF before until recently and didn't bother using the official channels. You do not in fact have even an estimate towards the game population.
    Actually, you don't even have an estimate of the PC population. This game is on PS4 and PS5 as well.

    Even looking at your charts, we can see the game had a 40-50% retention rate, which is amazing. But, i am sure you see something else on that.
    Steam version was launched in 2014, i'd say that is fairly long ago. Steamcharts is the only thing we have to to make some calculations on people playing the game but it counts concurrency while wow has always came in the form or subs or MAU's.

    Technically speaking, concurrency can drop 50% but not effect subs or MAU's at all so it's something worth keeping in mind. There is a casual relationship with concurrency and total amount of players ofcourse but it's not 1:1 and it constantly shifts depending on multiple factors.

    The best use of it will be to compare ShB launch peak to the upcoming Endwalker launch peak to see how much the game has grown as a rough % as that is when everyone who has an interest in the game plays more or less at the same time. But you still can't make any definitive conclusions about actual amount of subs or MAU's beyond a minimum level.

  18. #50918
    can i ask a really dumb question?
    Why are the warriors of darkness the literal 1.x/2.0 canon? I missed something, right? Its been bugging me since... er... 2.4? Theyre literally the same teleported wols riding chocobos. Im not exclusively memeing. This legit bothers me (currently at the start of 5.5 and dont remotely expect this to be answered in game).
    Last edited by ippollite; 2021-10-16 at 01:19 PM.

  19. #50919
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post
    can i ask a really dumb question?
    Why are the warriors of darkness the literal 1.x/2.0 canon? I missed something, right? Its been bugging me since... er... 2.4? Theyre literally the same teleported wols riding chocobos. Im not exclusively memeing. This legit bothers me (currently at the start of 5.5 and dont remotely expect this to be answered in game).
    Don't confuse the Warriors of Darkness with the characters in the cinematics. The cinematic characters are supposed to represent you, the player (hence why they're the default hyur midlander male). The WoD just looks like that character but that's it. They didn't face Bahamut or anything, or Nidhogg nor were they in Doma like in the cinematics. The canon is your story and everything you see in-game not the xpack promotion cinematics they are just there to promote the xpacks.... and realm reborn

  20. #50920
    Quote Originally Posted by ippollite View Post
    can i ask a really dumb question?
    Why are the warriors of darkness the literal 1.x/2.0 canon? I missed something, right? Its been bugging me since... er... 2.4? Theyre literally the same teleported wols riding chocobos. Im not exclusively memeing. This legit bothers me (currently at the start of 5.5 and dont remotely expect this to be answered in game).
    they are not, each world has the same stuff but with different names, they are us from another world

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